A sub-3 program?

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by anders, Jun 29, 2005.

  1. anders

    anders Guest

    I´ll shove all copyright issues boldly aside and give you a sketch of
    a 10-week program proposed in a Finnish running mag. The weekly
    structure is the usual, two quality sessions and a long run (or no long
    run):


    Week 1 68km/6 days

    Tue 5x 1km 10K pace
    Fri 12km M pace
    Sun 24km LR


    Week 2 73km/5 days

    Tue 10km HM pace
    Fri 5x 3km M pace
    Sun 26km LR


    Week 3 33km/4 days

    Tue 5km 10K pace
    Fri 5km M pace
    Sun 10km


    Week 4 65km/5 days

    Tue 6x 1km 10K pace
    Fri 15km M pace
    Sun 26km LR


    Week 5 79km/5 days

    Tue 12km HM pace
    Fri 5x 3km M pace
    Sun 30km LR


    Week 6 34km/4 days

    Tue 10km
    Fri 5km M pace
    Sun 10km


    Week 7 87km/5 days

    Tue 15km HM pace
    Fri 6x 3km M pace
    Sun 32km LR


    Week 8 43km/4 days

    Tue 8km HM pace
    Fri 2x 3km M pace
    Sun 15km


    Week 9 34km/4 days

    Tue 3x 1km 10K pace
    Fri 8km M pace
    Sun 10km


    Week 10 16km/3 days + marathon

    Wed 5km
    Fri 4x 500m 10K pace
    Sun 42.2km M pace


    (The 10km, 15km and 5km runs are "normal", 4:30min/km+ pace runs, and
    recovery runs of 5-8km make up the mileage together with the WU&CDs.)


    That´s it! A genuinely bold, "Don´t do more than you have to", "Less
    is more" and "The train need to enter inside you" approach to training,
    to say the least! And although I have a tendency to err towards a
    80-mile-week or a 10-hour-week I like to think that this is the
    approach I favour.

    I like the look of the quality sessions, too, and the way they are
    arranged, but the recovery weeks and the taper seem a little bit
    extremististic - sp?!:) - what do you think?


    (The 3:30 and the 4:00 plans follow the same principle; the assumed
    "initial level" for the 3:00 program is given as "about 38:00 for the
    10K and/or 1:25:00 for the HM".)


    Anders

    PS the author is no new kid on the block and he can list among his
    merits "following the program in the book of the coaching guru(1) to
    the letter, including the 48km run three weeks before the marathon" and
    finishing the race in 2:51.



    (1) The guru was no other than...



    ....Jeff Galloway, and the book was "Galloway´s Book on Running",
    1984:)
     
    Tags:


  2. On 2005-06-29, anders <[email protected]> wrote:
    > I´ll shove all copyright issues boldly aside and give you a sketch of
    > a 10-week program proposed in a Finnish running mag. The weekly
    > structure is the usual, two quality sessions and a long run (or no long
    > run):
    >

    [snip]
    > I like the look of the quality sessions, too, and the way they are
    > arranged, but the recovery weeks and the taper seem a little bit
    > extremististic - sp?!:) - what do you think?


    I think you'd need to be really talented to go sub 3 on that program. Mileage
    counts for a lot. I wouldn't run my best 5k on that little volume (and yes,
    I tried lower volume for 5k training and it didn't work very well)

    Whether it works for a given individual, depends on what the optimal training
    load is for that individual. For a relative beginner, it may really be the
    case that they are better off with low mileage. For example, someone who is
    only adapted to 25mpw will be unlikely to make it to the starting line if
    they attempt an 80mpw program, and if they do, they will be severely burnt
    out and overtrained.

    But if you can already comfortably manage 50mpw, I doubt you'll get faster by
    dropping it. I'd suggest that if you must experiment with this idiocy, do do
    off-season -- I'd predict that most of your road race times would go down the
    tube after about 8-10 weeks (after a brief peeking effect lasting maybe 6-8
    weeks).

    > ...Jeff Galloway, and the book was "Galloway´s Book on Running",
    > 1984:)


    The interesting thing is that the achievements that make us consider Galloway
    a "guru" in the first place involved high mileage training.

    Cheers,
    --
    Donovan Rebbechi
    http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/
     
  3. anders

    anders Guest

    Donovan Rebbechi wrote:


    > But if you can already comfortably manage 50mpw, I doubt you'll get faster by
    > dropping it. I'd suggest that if you must experiment with this idiocy, dodo
    > off-season -- I'd predict that most of your road race times would go downthe
    > tube after about 8-10 weeks (after a brief peeking effect lasting maybe 6-8
    > weeks).


    Well, *if* I´ll experiment with it, I think I´ll "pad it up" a bit,
    add a repeat there, a few HM paced km there, but try to keep the bold
    idea of more rest and sharper tapering.

    Besides, once I get at the "initial level", I don´t have to get any
    faster - I´ll just have to be able to run fairly fast for just under
    three hours:)



    > The interesting thing is that the achievements that make us consider Galloway
    > a "guru" in the first place involved high mileage training.


    Quite so - hence the contention that one doesn´t need the 100km+ weeks
    and the long LRs to go sub-3 is both bold and worth considering!

    But it is most probably true that the plan works best or only when one
    is sufficiently talented and/or has a fews years of more conventional
    high mileage training behind one!


    Anders
     
  4. You, and he, are stupid arseholes who need to make everything
    complicated, that way it makes you feel like you're doing something
    complicated that'll benefit you more than just putting one foot in
    front of the other. You aren't.
     
  5. Ed Prochak

    Ed Prochak Guest

    I thought the pattern of that plan looked familiar.
    This is even a little more sparse than typical Galloway.

    ed
     
  6. Anders - do us a favour and try this plan *after* you've got the sub-3
    under your belt!

    Much better to stick to relatively higher mileage. I managed with an
    average of about 55-60 miles in the 3 months before the taper, and a
    maximum of 65. I used the Pfitzinger-Douglas 70 mile max program.

    http://www.runningtimes.com/issues/01julaug/marathon.htm

    You've done the base buidup and are in good shape, so go for it!

    Anthony.
     
  7. anders

    anders Guest

    [email protected] wrote:

    > Anders - do us a favour and try this plan *after* you've got the sub-3
    > under your belt!


    It was more a matter of academic interest and intellectual curiosity in
    a different kind of plan, really. The only personal use I could
    envisage for it was very much as "this, slightly amended, is perhaps
    something I could do, should I want to reward myself with *another*
    marathon three months after the sub-3".



    > Much better to stick to relatively higher mileage. I managed with an
    > average of about 55-60 miles in the 3 months before the taper, and a
    > maximum of 65. I used the Pfitzinger-Douglas 70 mile max program.


    My copy of the book is out on a loan, but believe it or not, I have had
    the outline of your version of it noted down and set aside somewhere:)



    > http://www.runningtimes.com/issues/01julaug/marathon.htm
    > You've done the base buildup and are in good shape, so go for it!


    No excuses, then?:)

    Give me 2-3 weeks to sting together a few short LT runs and to gather
    my nerves and I believe I´ll be bold enough to step right in at "13
    weeks to goal"!


    Anders
     
  8. Anthony

    Anthony Guest

    "anders" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >[email protected] wrote:


    >> Anders - do us a favour and try this plan *after* you've got the sub-3
    >> under your belt!

    >
    >It was more a matter of academic interest and intellectual curiosity in
    >a different kind of plan, really. The only personal use I could
    >envisage for it was very much as "this, slightly amended, is perhaps
    >something I could do, should I want to reward myself with *another*
    >marathon three months after the sub-3".


    I hoped as much...:)

    >> http://www.runningtimes.com/issues/01julaug/marathon.htm
    >> You've done the base buildup and are in good shape, so go for it!

    >
    >No excuses, then?:)


    Hopefully not!

    >Give me 2-3 weeks to sting together a few short LT runs and to gather
    >my nerves and I believe I´ll be bold enough to step right in at "13
    >weeks to goal"!


    Come to Tiberias in January and I'll pace you...;-)

    >Anders


    Anthony.
     
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