alpine RR (brief)

[Kev]

"essendon93" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
>
> I'd been looking forward to this ride for nearly a year, and keen to go
> under 10hrs at least...well that was the plan.
>
> Started off at a steady pace, following a paceline set by one of the
> Anaconda guys, up to the start of Tawonga for the first climb. I
> wanted to keep the HR below 165 if I could, and had to force myself to
> slow down as I looked down to see 180 on the watch. Jaywoo, who
> started 20 mins later, and was high on caffeine had already caught me
> halfway up. Fun decent into Mt Beauty, where I had some tucker and
> topped up the bottles. Took it easy up Falls, with just the 1 passing
> me, and passing plenty. Felt strong going up, but kept it in the
> reserve gear until I saw the first lot of riders speeding down, and
> then I got a rush of blood and kicked it up a gear...ok just one of the
> foolish things I did on the day. Reached the top, just as Jaywoo was
> starting his decent. Drank, ate and got sprayed at Falls, prob up the
> top for about 15 mins, then for the highlight of the day, the decent
> down Falls, in which I had an absolute ball, and once again got carried
> away with the rush of adrenlin. Only got passed by two guys, and passed
> plenty (which wasn't bad for a bloke of my weight, and oh those GP400's
> handle the corners well ), out of the saddle for the little uppy bits
> and powering out of the corners. Swapped turns with another bloke up to
> Mt Beauty....kinda forgetting to keep an eye on my HRM. Hit Tawonga and
> died in the ****, legs where still fresh, but my head was banging, and I
> was starting to get the shivers. Pulled over to cool down at drop my
> HR, which was racing...15 min later it was still above 145, eventually
> managed to get it down to 129, so set off verrrryy slowly...stopping
> another couple of times.......filling up at the springs, now why didn't
> I hear there was ecoli in there???? This may have been one of the
> reasons why I had the runs that night..hmmm. Anyway just rolled down
> the decent into Bright, back in 5hr 30 min. Jumped into the hotel
> room, many thanks to the cleaner for turning the aircon off that I had
> left on and tried to cool down and get the resting HR done
> to a normal level, still debating if I should continue. 50 min later I
> set off for Buffalo, got to the entry gate...stopped for 5 mins, looked
> up at what was confronting me, and decided it just wasn't worth it.
> Thats right I wimped out...**** effort I know, but I just didn't want
> to risk it. Rode back to Bright ****** off at myself.
>
> Hats off to everyone that completed the 200km..a sensational effort.
>
> HR max 183
> HR average (inc rests) 149
> Elaspsed time 7hr 23 min
> Distance 153km
>
>
> --
> essendon93
>
Well done, join the club. I think it shows good judgement.

I did the 130km back to Bright and having seen 41c on the Polar at 11ish I
thought Buffalo was out of the question. I just don't enjoy suffering
dehydration and sunburn. The heat was so bad, my time at Bright was half
an hour behind last years elapsed of 5:03hrs. Previously I had done 8:27
elapsed (Dingo Dell) and knew it was going to be a ride in 40c+, direct
sun, and it would take a minimum of 4 hours with stops. I don't mind a
challenge, but we do this for enjoyment and your health comes first.

Again congrats to those who managed to complete the job, and to those who
should have stopped, I hope you recover well and you get some easy and
enjoyable rides in real soon.

HR max 165
HR Ave 145
Elapsed 5:27 hrs
Distance 129.5km

Cheers

Kev

 

[warrwych]

200km, 42 degress up Buffalo, tag it & bag it.

Details : 9968kcal (est by Polar S720)
202.8km (including ride to Bright from Porepunka in the morning)
av HR : 136
av speed 21.2 (!)
alt gained : 3785m
time : 9.37.30
bidon's emptied over body - lots
bidons drunk - 11
**** stops - 1 (!)
max temp seen : 50 degress (at Bright in the sun at the control point
before Buffalo)

Bonus points to the AUDAX organisers for free icecreams at the top of
Buffalo. Never has an icecream tasted so good! Got to say, AUDAX
organised a very good event - there was loads of motorbikes with water
etc on Buffalo, every 5 mins one would go past - very reasuring. I
think next year I might volunteer to ride a MB and help out, one Alpine
is enough for this lazy sprinter.

Drive home via Yea to Vermont redirected back to Hume by huge bushfire
blocking Melba Hwy. Smoke, Yea town under serious threat ... we have
photos .. amazing ... scary. I hope they're ok.

If anyone's wondering what the chopper was for, a rider had a meltdown
(liquified muscles, renal failure etc) and was airlifted to the Alfred
I think - according the local ambo at Mertleford.

One hot day at the office... glad it's over, I'm going to bed.

Well done to everyone who finished and well done to those who didn't, for having the good sense to know the possible consequences. Yep, one guy airlifted off Buffalo in a very bad way (cousin-in-law was a head ambo for the event). I saw Bleve wizzing down Tawonga Bright side, as I was coming up in a red landcruiser (it's not mine!! forgive me all!! heheh ) to pick up my significant other, overheating in Mt Beauty after a hard ride up Falls. He normally cruises up Falls, but the heat took its toll on the big guy.

Me, I actually decided to have a crack at the 140, after a test ride the day before with the back coming through ok. I stopped a few times up Tawonga to stretch the back and puff some ventolin. Was stoked to get to the top - it was bloody hot even then. Rolled into Mt Beauty and realised that the heat and back were taking a small toll already, but I was feeling ok, but not looking forward to going back over Tawonga.

I hit Tawonga and rolled up it, going through sections I never thought I would without too many hassles, but sweating like the proverbial. 2 stops for the back and one stop to cool down at that gorgeous wonderful magical spring!!! Made it to the top (woohoo! I did it)and loved the descent into Bright, toying with the idea of going on to Buffalo. Alas not to be - 5 km out from Bright my back said "Girl, you have pushed the limit and I ain't going up no more hills!!" So I finished the ride in Bright: 70 km with a ride time of 3.5 hrs, total time of 4 hrs 15 min.

What I learnt about the Alpine - as much as you train for it, it won't fully prepare you for the actual ride. The heat was debilitating and I am not convinced the organisers took the right action re: letting (tired, heat stressed) riders decided for themselves to continue on to Buffalo.

The ride is as much mental as physical, if not more. It's a tough ride, but achievable and anyone who rides any distance for the event deserves all credit.

And it was great to see another Luna on the road

 

[Stomper]

>
> If anyone's wondering what the chopper was for, a rider had a meltdown
> (liquified muscles, renal failure etc) and was airlifted to the Alfred
> I think - according the local ambo at Mertleford.
>

Just found out this poor bugger is one of my mates from Sydney - aka
Flipper

He's recovering physically and mentally in the Royal Melbourne but I
suspect his pride will be the most damaged.

His wife who was down for the trip is providing moral support.


Karl aka Stomper

 

[Bleve]

warrwych wrote:

> What I learnt about the Alpine - as much as you train for it, it won't
> fully prepare you for the actual ride. The heat was debilitating and I
> am not convinced the organisers took the right action re: letting
> (tired, heat stressed) riders decided for themselves to continue on to
> Buffalo.

I'm not sure about that, I think it's up to individuals to decide. At
least on the Alpine there's loads of support if/when things do go pear
shaped. It's a tough call though, and there's a lot of grey around
where the line gets drawn. I think the organisers would have been
justified in cancelling the event though, not that I would have been
happy about it personally, but it would have been a reasonable decision
- even if they just cancelled the buffalo part (which is where it was
really nasty) that may have been a compromise situation. But, as it
was, there wasn't too many people playing dead ant by the road, and
that's probably no worse than a marathon or some other
mass-participation endurance event. It'd be interesting to see the
stats on heat exhaustion in things like marathons etc compared to
endurance rides like the Alpine.

I think a lot of people pulled the pin on the 200 either at Bright, or
not far up (or on the way to!) Buffalo anyway. I'm a big, heavy bloke
with too much insulation and managed to keep my temperature under
control (but, have done a lot of hot weather long distance rides this
summer, so know the signs and what to do to keep temp down).

> The ride is as much mental as physical, if not more. It's a tough ride,
> but achievable and anyone who rides any distance for the event deserves
> all credit.
>
> And it was great to see another Luna on the road

luna ... TIC!

 

[warrwych]

I'm not sure about that, I think it's up to individuals to decide. At
least on the Alpine there's loads of support if/when things do go pear
shaped. It's a tough call though, and there's a lot of grey around
where the line gets drawn. I think the organisers would have been
justified in cancelling the event though, not that I would have been
happy about it personally, but it would have been a reasonable decision
- even if they just cancelled the buffalo part (which is where it was
really nasty) that may have been a compromise situation. But, as it
was, there wasn't too many people playing dead ant by the road, and
that's probably no worse than a marathon or some other
mass-participation endurance event. It'd be interesting to see the
stats on heat exhaustion in things like marathons etc compared to
endurance rides like the Alpine.

I think a lot of people pulled the pin on the 200 either at Bright, or
not far up (or on the way to!) Buffalo anyway. I'm a big, heavy bloke
with too much insulation and managed to keep my temperature under
control (but, have done a lot of hot weather long distance rides this
summer, so know the signs and what to do to keep temp down).

> The ride is as much mental as physical, if not more. It's a tough ride,
> but achievable and anyone who rides any distance for the event deserves
> all credit.
>
> And it was great to see another Luna on the road

luna ... TIC!

Totally agree on only cancelling the Buffalo section - impossible to make a call at 6 am but definately possible at 12 pm or so. My argument is that there were many heat stressed bods incapable of making a truly rational decision by 12 pm about their capacity to do Buffalo. The ambos had a full on day ferrying dead ant bodies up and down Buffalo.

When I drove down Tawonga Gap into Mt Beauty there were people scattered on both sides of the road, literally lying on the ground beside their bikes. There were A LOT of people on the sides of the road cooling down, recovering, regrouping. Anacedotely (spl??) it was similar on Falls Creek. But this was after you had gone thru Bleve.

It is a tricky one, and cancelling the Buffalo section would have p!ssd off many punters, but may have saved some of those from ending up on the end of a drip. Damned if you do, and same if you don't.

 

[Bleve]

warrwych wrote:

> Totally agree on only cancelling the Buffalo section - impossible to
> make a call at 6 am but definately possible at 12 pm or so. My argument
> is that there were many heat stressed bods incapable of making a truly
> rational decision by 12 pm


Is it a rational decision to do the alpine at all?

Seriously, at what point do you draw the line as to when an individual
is capable or otherwise of making their own mind up? That's the trick,
and in extreme cases it's easy to tell, but most of the time? It ends
up being a deeper philosophical issue.

> about their capacity to do Buffalo. The
> ambos had a full on day ferrying dead ant bodies up and down Buffalo.

*nod*

> When I drove down Tawonga Gap into Mt Beauty there were people
> scattered on both sides of the road, literally lying on the ground
> beside their bikes. There were A LOT of people on the sides of the road
> cooling down, recovering, regrouping. Anacedotely (spl??) it was similar
> on Falls Creek. But this was after you had gone thru Bleve.

I'd guess that up Buffalo, every 500m or so there was someone sitting
or lying recovering (or expiring!) when I was descending it.

> It is a tricky one, and cancelling the Buffalo section would have p!ssd
> off many punters, but may have saved some of those from ending up on the
> end of a drip. Damned if you do, and same if you don't.

True, but again, it comes down to balancing personal responsibility
against organisers risk, and that's always a hairy argument

 

[jazmo]

jazmo wrote:
> That's a mammoth effort Bleve!!!
>
> Anna and I said g'day as we saw you up Falls Creek. We were doing the
> 130km ride.

I hope I replied and was polite It's all a bit of a blur, all I can
remember is buffalo!
2km to go .. 1km to go ... 500m ... 250m ... and ... ICECREAM!

Yeah, you were reasonably polite - you said, "keep on trucking".

> We were shagged at the top and spent about 20 mins up there recovering.
>
>
> We got back to the base of Towonga Gap, where someone offered us a lift
> back to Bright - we took the opportunity.
>
> I'm never taking the mountain bike again!

Yeah? I'd have thought an MTB would be fine, all those gears ... you
can just twiddle all the way up the hills.

No way Jose. MTB is 15+ kgs, roadie is like 8 kgs. I'd rather spin a 39x26 and be moving than a small gear on the MTB and going nowhere.

> Saw Jaywoo there at the finish. He looked pretty fresh after his 200
> km. Looking forward to his report.

Bloody climbers

 

[warrwych]

Seriously, at what point do you draw the line as to when an individual
is capable or otherwise of making their own mind up? That's the trick,
and in extreme cases it's easy to tell, but most of the time? It ends
up being a deeper philosophical issue.

> about their capacity to do Buffalo. The
> ambos had a full on day ferrying dead ant bodies up and down Buffalo.

*nod*

> When I drove down Tawonga Gap into Mt Beauty there were people
> scattered on both sides of the road, literally lying on the ground
> beside their bikes. There were A LOT of people on the sides of the road
> cooling down, recovering, regrouping. Anacedotely (spl??) it was similar
> on Falls Creek. But this was after you had gone thru Bleve.

I'd guess that up Buffalo, every 500m or so there was someone sitting
or lying recovering (or expiring!) when I was descending it.

> It is a tricky one, and cancelling the Buffalo section would have p!ssd
> off many punters, but may have saved some of those from ending up on the
> end of a drip. Damned if you do, and same if you don't.

True, but again, it comes down to balancing personal responsibility
against organisers risk, and that's always a hairy argument

A very hairy argument that wax or shaving won't fix It really is one of risk management, and how much (potential & actual) risk the organisers perceive exists (potentially & actually) , and how much (potential and perceived) risk the organisers are willing to carry. So rather than taking away participants' capacity for deciding for themselves (ie philosophical), the problem should be considered as a question: Are we, as organisers, willing to be sued if something goes wrong (after considering what could go wrong)? That's the bottom line for any event organiser. Obviously for the Audax organisers, they were happy with what they perceived as the level of risk. Never an easy decision to make.

 

[Bikesoiler]

didnt have any water from the Springs halfway up did you?
Have heard from others there was reports of eColi there???


Bugger me! 159 maX!!!
i can do that eating ice cream

F"so glad he didnt do AAC"Dutch

I did drink water from the spring & it could have been the cause of my upset tum. I could avoid the spring water if I had a third bottle cage somewhere on the bike. Maybe a Tri style seat mount contraption.

The 159 max was on a steeper bit of the Falls accent. I sat at about 150 BPM for most of the Falls climb. I thought I'd exeed that on Tawonga. On Buffalo I was mostly in the range 135 - 145. I used my 28 tooth rear gear a lot!

 

[TimC]

On 2006-01-23, jazmo (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> Bleve Wrote:
>> jazmo wrote:
>> > I'm never taking the mountain bike again!
>>
>> Yeah? I'd have thought an MTB would be fine, all those gears ... you
>> can just twiddle all the way up the hills.
>
> No way Jose. MTB is 15+ kgs, roadie is like 8 kgs. I'd rather spin a
> 39x26 and be moving than a small gear on the MTB and going nowhere.

Really? I donut know what gears are typical on an MTB, but I can't
see why you would find it easier to push say, (8+70)kg*39/26*27" over
(15+70)kg*32/32*26"

--
TimC
READING MICROSCOPIC DISCLAIMERS ON COUPON MAY CAUSE PAPER CUTS ON EYEBALLS.
-- Disclaimer on Kibo's Pot Pie of Pain

 

[TimC]

On 2006-01-24, warrwych (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> Bleve Wrote:
>> True, but again, it comes down to balancing personal responsibility
>> against organisers risk, and that's always a hairy argument
>
> A very hairy argument that wax or shaving won't fix It really is
> one of risk management, and how much (potential & actual) risk the
> organisers perceive exists (potentially & actually) , and how much
> (potential and perceived) risk the organisers are willing to carry. So
> rather than taking away participants' capacity for deciding for
> themselves (ie philosophical), the problem should be considered as a
> question: Are we, as organisers, willing to be sued if something goes
> wrong (after considering what could go wrong)? That's the bottom line
> for any event organiser. Obviously for the Audax organisers, they were
> happy with what they perceived as the level of risk. Never an easy
> decision to make.

I do like to think that the people who are most likely to sue are
those who are afraid of taking responsibility for their own actions
(modulo making irrational decisions because of heat exhaustion).

And I like to think that those of us who ride bikes, ride them partly
because we are not afraid of taking responsibility for ourselves and
our own safety (modulo said irrational decisions).

So while 4WDers would sue an event organiser if it rained and their
precious vehicle got bogged, cyclists would be less inclined to sue if
they stuffed up in the preperations department.

Unless of course, something silly is done on the organisers part, like
not supplying enough water (and even then, audax, at least in spirit,
is meant to be about being self sufficient as possible, and it could
be argued you should be carrying /all/ your water -- I know this is
not what is done in practice, and for good reason).

--
TimC
cpu time/usefulness ratio too high -- core dumped.

 

[Graeme Dods]

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 02:36:51 GMT, TimC wrote:

> So while 4WDers would sue an event organiser if it rained and their
> precious vehicle got bogged, cyclists would be less inclined to sue if
> they stuffed up in the preperations department.

I don't know, I think I'd be quite happy to get bogged. Any sort of outing,
canoeing, cycling, camping, whatever is so much more fun (at least in
retrospect) if there's a minor epic somewhere along the line.

Graeme

 

[jazmo]

On 2006-01-23, jazmo (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> Bleve Wrote:
>> jazmo wrote:
>> > I'm never taking the mountain bike again!
>>
>> Yeah? I'd have thought an MTB would be fine, all those gears ... you
>> can just twiddle all the way up the hills.
>
> No way Jose. MTB is 15+ kgs, roadie is like 8 kgs. I'd rather spin a
> 39x26 and be moving than a small gear on the MTB and going nowhere.

Really? I donut know what gears are typical on an MTB, but I can't
see why you would find it easier to push say, (8+70)kg*39/26*27" over
(15+70)kg*32/32*26"

--
TimC
READING MICROSCOPIC DISCLAIMERS ON COUPON MAY CAUSE PAPER CUTS ON EYEBALLS.
-- Disclaimer on Kibo's Pot Pie of Pain

I guess for me it's a mental thing when I'm spinning like crazy on the MTB but going nowhere in the stifling heat and thinking how much longer I've got to go on the climb when I could be riding a 39x26 on my 8 kg roadie and getting to the top a lot quicker.

 

[amr_rojas]

I completed the 140km. Felt a tiny bit tired in the legs as I had done
Mt Beauty-Falls Creek on Saturday morn.
Missed the start (7:00) (staying in Mt Beaut - underestimated drive
time), so I started with the 130km people at 7:20.
Had something wrong with my guts up Tawonga - might have been
dehydrated from Saturday's ride?.
Rested at Mt.Beauty for a while : drank at least a biddon.
Up Tawonga again, this time rocketed up, getting power out of the legs
.
Up Buffalo was quite a slow slog. Hot. So hot I had to stop in the
shade at about the 10k (of 25k) mark just to cool down. Didn't want the
heart rate to go past 150s as I knew I would get too hot.
Stopped at the water stop - got a shower - that was a great feeling and
extremely refreshing. Loaded up a bottle of water so I could pour it
over my head. This seemed to be the key to an enjoyable last 5k - and
an ice cream at the top - yummy.
Enjoyed the descent but felt sorry for the people just getting started
at the bottom knowing they had 1.5 hrs+ of hell to go.

Felt even more sorry for the people coming up Tawonga on my drive from
Bright-MtBeauty : I saw the sag bus picking up riders that were lying
on the side of the road, and also saw a lady rider (in her 40s maybe)
that had either been missed by the bus, or had had the guts to say "no
thank you, I will get to Bright by my lonesome".
Of course, I'd like to think it was the latter.

I thought the organisation was tremendous - water, cordial, scrolls,
muffins, rolls, ice cream, watermelon, oranges, jelly tubs (makes you
want to sign up for next year, doesn't it?)

Distance: 142km
Elapsed Time: 6:50
Max HR: 178 bpm
Avg HR: 140 bpm

 

[Random Data]

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 02:21:16 +0000, TimC wrote:

> Really? I donut know what gears are typical on an MTB, but I can't see
> why you would find it easier to push say, (8+70)kg*39/26*27" over
> (15+70)kg*32/32*26"

Most MTB triples are 22-32-44, and a 9sp cluster is either 11-32 or 11-34
(12-34 exists as well, but aren't really desirable). If your MTB weighs
15kg it's either burly or way too heavy. My "XC" bike was under 14kg
before it started its current diet (400g lost so far), and it's got 100mm
of travel at the back.

--
Dave Hughes | [email protected]
There are some things so serious you have to laugh at them. - Niels Bohr

 

[Bleve]

jazmo wrote:
> Bleve Wrote:
> > jazmo wrote:
> > > That's a mammoth effort Bleve!!!
> > >
> > > Anna and I said g'day as we saw you up Falls Creek. We were doing
> > the
> > > 130km ride.
> >
> > I hope I replied and was polite It's all a bit of a blur, all I
> > can
> > remember is buffalo!
> > 2km to go .. 1km to go ... 500m ... 250m ... and ... ICECREAM!
>
> Yeah, you were reasonably polite - you said, "keep on trucking".

That's pretty good! Was I descending at the time? If so, I probably
didn't have time to work out who you were until I'd gone past I saw
a -lot- of people I know on the ride - one very embarrasing incident
when I was descending Falls (bear in mind, I don't actually -see- many
of my coaching clients much except the ones that come to Sprint Skills
or races I go to regularly - it's mostly phone & email), a bloke rides
down with me, chatting, he knows my name, and looks familiar .. so I
ask him where I know him from, and he's one of my clients! heh! *doh*

I think (hope!) he understood!

 

[jazmo]

On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 02:21:16 +0000, TimC wrote:

> Really? I donut know what gears are typical on an MTB, but I can't see
> why you would find it easier to push say, (8+70)kg*39/26*27" over
> (15+70)kg*32/32*26"

Most MTB triples are 22-32-44, and a 9sp cluster is either 11-32 or 11-34
(12-34 exists as well, but aren't really desirable). If your MTB weighs
15kg it's either burly or way too heavy. My "XC" bike was under 14kg
before it started its current diet (400g lost so far), and it's got 100mm
of travel at the back.

--
Dave Hughes | [email protected]
There are some things so serious you have to laugh at them. - Niels Bohr

Weighed by MTB yesterday and it is in fact a bit below 14 kgs - so not as bad as I'd estimated.

 

[jazmo]

jazmo wrote:
> Bleve Wrote:
> > jazmo wrote:
> > > That's a mammoth effort Bleve!!!
> > >
> > > Anna and I said g'day as we saw you up Falls Creek. We were doing
> > the
> > > 130km ride.
> >
> > I hope I replied and was polite It's all a bit of a blur, all I
> > can
> > remember is buffalo!
> > 2km to go .. 1km to go ... 500m ... 250m ... and ... ICECREAM!
>
> Yeah, you were reasonably polite - you said, "keep on trucking".

That's pretty good! Was I descending at the time? If so, I probably
didn't have time to work out who you were until I'd gone past I saw
a -lot- of people I know on the ride - one very embarrasing incident
when I was descending Falls (bear in mind, I don't actually -see- many
of my coaching clients much except the ones that come to Sprint Skills
or races I go to regularly - it's mostly phone & email), a bloke rides
down with me, chatting, he knows my name, and looks familiar .. so I
ask him where I know him from, and he's one of my clients! heh! *doh*

I think (hope!) he understood!

You were actually heading up Falls Creek. It was a few k's before the ticketing booths.

It's amazing what heat and fatigue can do to you.

 

[Parbs]

"jazmo" wrote ...
>
> Weighed by MTB yesterday and it is in fact a bit below 14 kgs - so not
> as bad as I'd estimated.
>
Mine's 10.5 kg - cromo steel frame, no tricky light bits. It doesn't have a triple on the front & only 18 on the back.

Parbs

 

[Random Data]

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 07:29:28 +0000, Parbs wrote:

> Mine's 10.5 kg - cromo steel frame, no tricky light bits. It doesn't have
> a triple on the front & only 18 on the back.

ISTR that my white one weighs a bit more than that, and despite being one
of my bikes, has no tricky light bits. It's also bodged together from
mostly free bits.

The beige weighs considerably more than 10.5kg, and the
yellow one weighs a buttload more than that. Oh, and the other white one
[1] weighs considerably more too.

[1] The commuter, with 700c wheels, but I did 5km of fire trail on it last
week.

--
Dave Hughes | [email protected]
Where there's a flame-thrower, there's a way - Earl Grey