Any Christian cyclist out there?

Discussion in 'The Bike Cafe' started by Chad-GA, Nov 16, 2005.

  1. Brian-NC

    Brian-NC New Member

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    You are exactly right with one exception. It would not seem right if He did not offer the way to Him for all. For God so loved the world(not some) that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in Him should not parrish but have everlasting life.John 3:16

    In Second Peter 3:9 He wishes that none would perish but all (not some) come to repentence. His offer of grace stands for you just as for me. If we cross the Bloodline of Jesus Christ, we are accepted. We walked away from Him first. That is amazing grace that He offered an atonement for our sins, choices and failures.

    Love,
    Brian
    Philip. 3:8-9
     


  2. baj32161

    baj32161 New Member

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    Well many of the opposing posts were not attack in any way, shape or form. I do believe that the original opposition to this thread was the OP's attempt at selling a jersey outside of the Classifieds forum. I do agree that there were some negative replies...even one or two of mine were meant in a tongue in cheek manner. However, when this subject is brought up it always causes a ruckus, and mo matter what the OP's intentions, this will always be the result. There have been more than a few heavy-handed, confrontational replies (read: attacks) from some of the Christians in this thread too......Glass houses my friend.

    Peace,

    Brian
     
  3. baj32161

    baj32161 New Member

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    Okay Brian...you have resorted to backhanded name calling again..MOCKERS...this is okay with me. I am black, I have been called much worse...by many so called Christians.

    I will answer your question...my beliefs are simple. I will die and 3 generations from now noone will no who I was and my "soul" will die with me. My foundation leads me to live my life as a decent human being....honoring my compact to moral law and human decency. So far it has taken me through 44 years of a wonderful life full of love and learning....which I continue to enjoy. Once again...I do not wish for you, or any other person, Christian or otherwise to feel sorry for me or to pray for me. I am happy and this is what I believe. I have never once questioned why you believe what you believe, nor have I used any verse ot text to try to debate you or change your mind. It is enough for me that you do believe what you do, and that is fine. Please do not question why I believe what I do. I have my reasons and they are just as personal and valid to me as yours are to you.

    By the way...Detroit IS in trouble!!!:D

    Peace,

    Brian
     
  4. Brian-NC

    Brian-NC New Member

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    I did not call you a mocker. The Word of God would call me or anyone else that if they denied the need or reason for God sending His Son to pay the penalty for our shortcomings. With your stated beliefs founded upon yourself and your control, although against your wishes, I prayerfully empathize for you. I want you to know, I never want to change your mind. Our minds are temporal and at enmity against God. They will die. Our minds cannot change our heart. God set eternity in the heart of every man(Ecclesiastes 3) When the heart is changed, as only Jesus can, then the mind, life and destiny changes.

    I understand why you beleive what you do, but this I know, as you move closer towards the day of reckoning, I pray that the Holy Spirit reveal Himself in the person of Jesus Christ and your need for Him. That is your only hope.

    Love your friend,
    Brian
     
  5. baj32161

    baj32161 New Member

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    Brian please save this claptrap for someone who needs to hear it, or someone who cares. My hope lies in my own beliefs...not in the "Holy Spirit," and I do not believe in a "Day Of Reckoning!" This is the type of preaching I do not approve of, and a perfect example of someone like you shoving your beliefs down my throat. Why must you be such a sanctimonious rabblerouser? I do not propose to do anything for you that you do not approve of....for one more (and I hope final) time....I respect your wishes and beliefs...PLEASE do me the same courtesy and respect mine:mad:.

    Oh nevermind...you people will never get it...I give up...the soapbox is yours.



    Brian
     
  6. MichaelB

    MichaelB New Member

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    I suppose when we are on this subject I cant help but sound immature because I, like a lot of people, think believing in God is like believing in Santa or the toothfairy but do read on.
    I called you a retard because you thought you were being clever quoting Newton but what he said was not a good argument especially not now considering we are more aware of the fact that there are so many stars they actually block each other out so you cant see them all!

    The thing is you would believe in God even if you had a time machine, went back in time, met the disciples and listened to them telling you how what they wrote in the bible was all made up for a laugh. I'm not saying they would say that they made this stuff up I'm just making a point here.

    You see I know it doesn't matter how well you are able to reason, peform logic, do maths etc... people believe in God because they want to. It isn't just God either people think things were 'meant to be' and that there are things 'we know nothing about out there' especially 'in this life'. People even think life is precious! :eek:

    And how do I know this is what people think? Because I am also a person and I think these things especially when bad things happen and I need something to help me cope with what I am facing - its the way people's brains work. I feel exactly what you feel when you have spiritual experiences and I also know they are very powerful probably more so in some people than in an athiest like me. It isn't god that is doing that though it it is the architecture of our brains the thing which performs all of our logic and thought and to be a non-believer you must ignore it.

    To me that is why I dont believe in God and others do. I could believe in God. I have all the necessary equipment in my head but for whatever reason I dont need to use it unlike believers do.

    I suppose what I am saying is that your view of the universe is formed by your brain which means it could be very inaccurate. I am led to believe there are parts of your brain which are active when you are thinking about spiritual things so you can draw your own conclusions as to how this relates to the existence of gods or whatever. You are aware of my conclusions.

    I can see how this internal brain mechanism and consequent belief could aid the survival of a species of animal who was aware of their being mortal.
     
  7. MichaelB

    MichaelB New Member

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    Honestly comparing science and religion is ridiculous.

    In science we have hypotheses. These are effectively people's opinions. We prove these and they become theories. Theories have proofs which show them to be correct. I suppose the bible or quran... is one big long hypothesis which will not ever become a theory. Maybe when you're dead but I doubt it.

    If you now say how can you prove something beyond doubt then I dont suppose you can but as far as we can gather a scientific theory is absolute otherwise it is a hypothesis. When you close your eyes the universe could disappear but I am confident it doesn't so you should be equally confident in our scientific theories.
     
  8. wheelist

    wheelist New Member

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  9. jrstevens

    jrstevens New Member

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    Here are links to several articles showing the faulty thinking behind Darwin's theory of evolution and the "scientific misconduct" of his successors. I encourage the believers in the thread to acquaint themselves with these papers.

    http://www.discovery.org/scripts/viewDB/index.php?command=view&id=54

    http://www.discovery.org/scripts/viewDB/index.php?command=view&id=200

    http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=8543

    http://www.discovery.org/articleFiles/PDFs/survivalOfTheFakest.pdf

    JS
     
  10. IronDonut

    IronDonut New Member

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    Yes these papers are a very good reason to discount all science and put our trust into magic and the supernatural.



     
  11. Brian-NC

    Brian-NC New Member

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    Magic & Supernatural? You have to be trained not to believe that the earth was created. It is natural to assume and understand it was. It is like showing you my home and telling you, you know, I was standing here one day and an explosion occurred and my home appeared. The sun, being 93 million miles from earth, if placed fractionally closer(less than a mile) would prohibit life on earth, land or sea. That just happened. But that makes no difference anyway, really. Proving that does not make one understand his/her need for God. That again is the ministry of the Holy Spirit. When a life has been changed, a heart has been transplanted, without surgery, a peace that passes all understanding is invoked into the life. You cannot debate it, argue with it, deny it. Others can testify on your behalf. It is undebatable. The problem is that so many try to fix a spiritual problem with a human remedy. It cannot be done, apart from the Holy Spirit. Finding Noah's Ark or Pilates Tomb will not change a life. It is only at the cross and Calvary. The answer is born in the revelation of that need that one requires a Savior to get to God. We all are imperfect and need Jesus Christ to get there. The biggest problem is that pride, which Satan was full of, breeds in the flesh of man, making one think they are "good" and have no need of a God or Savior. They feel that they are a good person and have done nothing wrong to require an atonement for their shortcomings & failures. It is by humility one admits mistakes, shortcomings, faults(sins) and understands their fragile, condemned state before a Holy God. Then and only then, will one find a peace that passes all understanding, answers to their questions and quit debating about issues that are insignificant to their personal eternal destiny.

    You cannot debate changed lives. You cannot debate the truth. People are not truthful with themselves because they are under the control of deception and lies which is manifested by the head of all deception. John 8:44 They are believing exactly what he wants them to believe and leading them to his home. I pray for all who are not only aware of where they are going, but understand the consequences of their choices. God's grace is there for everyone. 2 Peter 3:9
     
  12. IronDonut

    IronDonut New Member

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    You religious people are insane. I'm not trained, I'm just happy to answer, "I don't know." Religious people have to seek to find an answer and purpose to something that really no one knows.

    Could something larger than the universe that we can observe have set the wheels of physics into motion? Sure. Could everything we observe be a giant experiment in a 7th grade science project for our pre-pubecent creator? Sure.

    Were created in the likeness of a creator who sent his son on earth to die for us and just happen to create a religion in the perfect form of a human quasi-governmental policical organization where we are rewarded for following the organizations law and punished for not? Not a friggen chance. Thats all crowd control invented by man to profit man.


     
  13. Felt_Rider

    Felt_Rider Active Member

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    Perhaps you are right about religious people or some religious people, but with most people who live by faith (not religion) do not seek answers because they already feel that they have an answer and that is Christ died on the cross for them, their sins forgiven forever. If they believe this is true they are no longer seeking an answer. They live by faith and not by sight or worldly intellectual thinking. Faith being what you cannot see and not fully understand, but still trust it to be true.
     
  14. Brian-NC

    Brian-NC New Member

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    Religion is defiled by man and corrupted by Satan. It is man's attempt to get to God. Organized, politicized religion has been corrupted but that does not change the personal consequences of our lives and the truth that we must face. It is not in the form of denominations, race or color. God's grace and His Kingdom is not about anyone's power but only that of His Son, Jesus Christ. We can do nothing to get to Him. That is why He sent Him to this earth. The world, religions and all of its corruption will always be imperfect. This earth run by the tyranny of sin and satan(Colossians 1:13) is still in Soverign control by God(Acts 4:24). The only way to overcome Satan is through Jesus Christ and the power of the Holy Spirit. (John 16:33) It will continually get worse as dillusions, false prophets and heresies rise up until Jesus Christ returns. (2 Peter 2:1)- (I John 4:1)

    If men are seeking self glory, self profit, control, they will have to answer for that. Many are and many more will follow.

    True followers of Jesus Christ, speak the truth and hold to the convictions of God's Word with a heart of compassion and desire to be used to set captives free, put Light in darkness, help the helpless and hopeless, seeking no glory whatsoever, control, or reward that is tangible on this earth.
     
  15. jrstevens

    jrstevens New Member

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    Wow! You downloaded and read them all in 7 minutes. I am impressed:rolleyes: . Talk about close minded...

    JS
     
  16. jrstevens

    jrstevens New Member

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    The intent of the posting was not to "win over" unbelievers. It was directed to the believers in this thread to familiarize themselves with the flawed thinking/rationale and in some cases weak scientific arguments of Darwinians and how we can effectively defend our faith.

    JS
     
  17. DiabloScott

    DiabloScott New Member

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    I skimmed through those papers. Mostly they're stawman arguments and distortions intended to make smug creationists chuckle at the folly of science. The Jonathan Wells story about the fake embryos was interesting though - so I did a little Google and found a rebuttal here:

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/wells/haeckel.html

    Notice how much more rigorous it is in presenting all the evidence and pointing out errors, compared to Wells's condescending treatment of anyone who might disagree with him.
     
  18. wheelist

    wheelist New Member

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    What time is he coming, 'cause I've got to pop out to do some shopping this afternoon, and I'd hate to miss such a special visitor. Should I bake some cakes?
     
  19. IronDonut

    IronDonut New Member

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    Loco. You people are loco...

    There very well might be something out there pulling the strings but the popular myths perpetuated by modern religions are created of man and designed to control man. Simply put the oldest form of government and crowd control.

    So when the right wingers claim that modern democracy is founded in religon they are correct. What they fail to admit is that religon was invented as a political mechinism and has nothing whatsoever to do with how or why man was created or what is going to happen to us.

    It's all about the projection of power. On a macro level government can project power globally. They can physically in a very real way project power thousands of miles from the seat of power. They can project power on a micro level as well. You can fuck up in North Carolina and run to Nevada and today they will track your ass and bring you back to North Carolina for punishment.

    Not so 2000 years ago. There was no technology available to project power. So what do you do if you want to control people for profit and fun? Well put together a little guilt based story (Jesus died for our sins) for people that are fairly easy to control and put out the carrot of an eternal life of bliss to cement the deal. For the rabble rousers? Well you have to invent boiling in a pot of rotten eyeballs on the lake of fire to keep them in check. Because actual power can't be projected to control people you have to put all of the same incentives in place to insure they behave in a way that is profitable to you. You do this by inventing these supernatural stories of reward and punishment.

    Finally religious people remind me of New Yorkers. "Oh we have to walk to work..." They are so self important that they think their local issues need to be played out on a national stage. It's a city of 7 million self important drama queens. Same thing with religious people; I'm too special and important to (my mom told me so) to die. Because they can't face the finality of their own existance and the fact that at some point they will cease to exist; they latch on to the belief that while their earthbound life will be short in the 'real' world they will live forever. This really feeds back into the political control mechninism of religion. How will we be able to get people to do stuff that sucks now so that I may profit? (Modern society has evolved 30 year mortgages for this purpose....) Well promise them if they do stuff that sucks now that some day they will be rewarded...

    Don't even get me started into my experiences with the born again....


     
  20. Brian-NC

    Brian-NC New Member

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    Religion is again corrupt. It means NOTHING! It is all about a RELATIONSHIP. A personal relationship between you and God. Politics, Religion and all that conversation is meaningless to your personal destiny. Politics and Government is corrupted beyond repair. That is undebatable. It is wraught with falacies, heresies, personal ambition, power, money and sin. You have to look at it from a personal level. The problem is that everyone wants to look outward instead of looking inward. If you look outward, you are exactly correct, you will see more distress, corruption, lying, cheating, stealing. It is all a lie. You have to remember who's playhouse this is. It is only when you look at Jesus Christ who is perfect and allow Him to look at you personally, is when you see yourself as He sees you. It is then and only then, one sees themselves as a Holy God does and requires repentance for what they have done. That is when an atonement, a Savior is needed to get to God. That is when grace is poured out. It is personal. That is when perfect peace is found. That is when victory is found. That is when the Truth is told and one finds the Truth. No other way.
     
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