Anyone doing Hell of the West?



mogulhead

New Member
Jul 18, 2003
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The Course: CCCC’s version of the Paris-Roubaix Classic on the private roads (No traffic & no centre line rule!) of the AARC. Seniors race on a course featuring a 4.2 km sealed loop and a 7km loop containing a 1.5km 5% climb and a 1km hard packed dirt section.
A Grade 100km – 10 flat laps & 8 hill loop laps
B Grade 85km – 9 flat laps & 7 hill loop laps
C Grade 70km – 7 flat laps & 6 hill loop laps
D Grade 60km – 6 flat laps & 5 hill loop laps
Junior racing on a separate flat 3.2km fully sealed circuit
Wet weather: the roads of the AARC are safe in all weather, and the race will proceed in all but the most extreme conditions. Race day weather updates on 0400 125 425.
Important Notes: For security and safety, access to the complex will be available between 11am and 12.15pm ONLY.
Car drivers must obey all traffic signs within the AARC, wear seat belts and observe the 60kmh speed limit. Park only where indicated by CCCC officials.
No littering tolerated – including competitors!
Detailed directions and maps at www.carnegiecycling.com.au
Further details: [email protected] or 0409 541 136

That 1km of dirt section could become interesting in a bunch if it rains heaps.

Cheers
 
C

Carl Brewer

Guest
On Mon, 30 May 2005 17:53:49 +1000, mogulhead
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>The Course: CCCC’s version of the Paris-Roubaix Classic on the private
>roads (No traffic & no centre line rule!) of the AARC. Seniors race on
>a course featuring a 4.2 km sealed loop and a 7km loop containing a
>1.5km 5% climb and a 1km hard packed dirt section.


For the benefit of the viewers at home, the AARC is the
Anglesea proving grounds I believe. Down on the
west coast of Victoria, close(ish) to Torquay.
 

Hitchy

New Member
Jan 26, 2004
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Carl Brewer said:
On Mon, 30 May 2005 17:53:49 +1000, mogulhead
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>The Course: CCCC’s version of the Paris-Roubaix Classic on the private
>roads (No traffic & no centre line rule!) of the AARC. Seniors race on
>a course featuring a 4.2 km sealed loop and a 7km loop containing a
>1.5km 5% climb and a 1km hard packed dirt section.


For the benefit of the viewers at home, the AARC is the
Anglesea proving grounds I believe. Down on the
west coast of Victoria, close(ish) to Torquay.


You may also need to be a member of one of the clubs specified as being in the 'combine'......I mean seeing as CCCC have put this up against an 'open' & all, that'll be the only way they'll be allowed to run it...although the powers that be at CCCC haven't made this clear in their 'flyers'...check if you're eligble before you lob

Hitchy
 

mogulhead

New Member
Jul 18, 2003
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How do you find out what combine your club is in. I'm with Footscray Cycling Club and they don't have a race scheduled for the weekend so they said on there web site to try this race or the Preston one. I really don't like this new rule and wouldn't mind some one explaining what cyclesport victoria hope to achieve by it.

Cheers
 

Hitchy

New Member
Jan 26, 2004
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mogulhead said:
How do you find out what combine your club is in. I'm with Footscray Cycling Club and they don't have a race scheduled for the weekend so they said on there web site to try this race or the Preston one. I really don't like this new rule and wouldn't mind some one explaining what cyclesport victoria hope to achieve by it.

Cheers


If you do manage to find out what CSV are trying to achieve.....perhaps you could let the rest of us in on it as well!.....you be Ok for this race if you're with Footscray...they are one of the annointed 10 in this weeks 'combine of convenience'

hitchy
 
B

Bleve

Guest
CSV are doing this to force riders to race opens, so that they get the
revinue from entry fees. Probably not productive in the long term.
 
B

Bob

Guest
"Bleve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> CSV are doing this to force riders to race opens, so that they get the
> revinue from entry fees. Probably not productive in the long term.
>


CCCC have a survey on the issue on the website. Currently 91% do not support
it.

Are the clubs doing anything about it?
 
C

Carl Brewer

Guest
On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 10:53:04 +1000, "Bob"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Bleve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]
>> CSV are doing this to force riders to race opens, so that they get the
>> revinue from entry fees. Probably not productive in the long term.
>>

>
>CCCC have a survey on the issue on the website. Currently 91% do not support
>it.
>
>Are the clubs doing anything about it?


I was at a Blackburn coaching meeting two weeks ago, and
we (BBN) are proposing an alternative that can still
provide CSV with revinue but not kill off the smaller
clubs in Victoria - that's the rough idea anyway, so "yes"
 

Shabby

New Member
Mar 13, 2003
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Carl Brewer said:
I was at a Blackburn coaching meeting two weeks ago, and
we (BBN) are proposing an alternative that can still
provide CSV with revinue but not kill off the smaller
clubs in Victoria - that's the rough idea anyway, so "yes"

The revenue argument is **** though. Unless you're racing B grade club/combine you're going to get caned in an Open. So by restricting the places you can race in the early years gives you less opportunity to learn the sport and its complexities. And less riders means less people at Opens in the long run. Less clubs at each club race means that you get crappy racing, with less than 10 people in a grade, or C&D and A&B combined races, which once again is no fun and deters people from the sport. (I don't mind not winning, but if you're dropped 50km from the end, winter road racing is a shitty sport.

The other factor is that anyone who's out of town (ie. country people in Melb, Melb people in country for work) can;t get a race in. Whereas I've raced at Echuca one season, Latrobe Valley another, all becuase that was where the work took me. It's only a small thing, but it kept me racing, which these new rules won't.

I'm not sure what they're trying to achieve, perhaps there was some insurance reason for it?
 
C

Carl Brewer

Guest
On Thu, 2 Jun 2005 09:41:45 +1000, Shabby
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>Carl Brewer Wrote:
>>
>> I was at a Blackburn coaching meeting two weeks ago, and
>> we (BBN) are proposing an alternative that can still
>> provide CSV with revinue but not kill off the smaller
>> clubs in Victoria - that's the rough idea anyway, so "yes"

>
>The revenue argument is **** though. Unless you're racing B grade
>club/combine you're going to get caned in an Open. So by restricting
>the places you can race in the early years gives you less opportunity
>to learn the sport and its complexities. And less riders means less
>people at Opens in the long run. Less clubs at each club race means
>that you get crappy racing, with less than 10 people in a grade, or C&D
>and A&B combined races, which once again is no fun and deters people
>from the sport. (I don't mind not winning, but if you're dropped 50km
>from the end, winter road racing is a shitty sport.


Exactly. It also kills off the smaller clubs who don't have
the numbers to be worth inviting if you can only invite 10
clubs.

>The other factor is that anyone who's out of town (ie. country people
>in Melb, Melb people in country for work) can;t get a race in. Whereas
>I've raced at Echuca one season, Latrobe Valley another, all becuase
>that was where the work took me. It's only a small thing, but it kept
>me racing, which these new rules won't.


Yep.

>I'm not sure what they're trying to achieve, perhaps there was some
>insurance reason for it?


I received the following, I don't think it's confidental, they (CSV)
said they were going to post it on their website :

Club and Combine Racing Winter 2005

May 2005

The Board of CycleSport Victoria have received several emails and
letters concerning the memo released last month in relation to club
and combine racing. We thankyou for your feedback and present this
note to help clarify some points, hopefully to answer some of the
consistent questions which have been raised over the past couple of
weeks.

These regulations have been developed for the Winter road season of
2005 and indeed there will be some alterations made when the focus is
shifted towards the 2005/06 summer season. The ‘club’ criterium format
here in Melbourne as it exists at present needs to be addressed and
the Board will begin to look at this situation over the next couple of
months. In the meantime it welcomes any feedback and suggestions from
clubs and riders on the regulations being put in place and how they
are applied to the summer season, in particular to criterium racing.
We encourage our clubs and members to look at the broader picture and
keep in mind that the sport of cycling, as in the case of any sport,
cannot function without a state body.

Whilst the reasons for implementing this racing policy are not purely
financial and take into account a number of factors, a major income
stream for this organisation is open racing. Victorian Cycling will
this road season witness its best road season for many years with
increased prizemoney, bigger, better tours and an increased number of
opens. The Victorian Road Championship has needed a boost for some
time and in 2005 will now attract $10,000 in prizemoney. CycleSport
Victoria is a self funded, not for profit organisation which runs to a
tight budget. If open racing and the promoters of open racing are not
supported by the clubs and riders then these events are placed in
jeopardy, the end result being that these events would disappear from
our calendar and CSV close its doors.

The limit of ten affiliated clubs does not extend to interstate
riders. Riders from interstate are permitted to ride events here in
Victoria provided that the hosting club has approved their
participation in the event. This would also apply to riders registered
in the ADF (Australian Defence Force) club, because it is affiliated
directly with Cycling Australia.

For the majority of clubs and cyclists this policy will result in very
little change. The Board would encourage clubs hosting combine events
to invite clubs based in their geographic region, not to exclude a
club based on their size. The Board would encourage those clubs to
then pool their resources and manpower. CSV will continue to monitor
the policy and the implementation of it and if there are particular
clubs being greatly inconvenienced, then there will be steps made to
rectify that issue. If a member feels that their racing situation
warrants particular consideration by the Board then they can put their
case forward in writing with each to be addressed on its merits.

CycleSport Victoria Board of Management
 
Shabby wrote:
> Carl Brewer Wrote:
> >
> > I was at a Blackburn coaching meeting two weeks ago, and
> > we (BBN) are proposing an alternative that can still
> > provide CSV with revinue but not kill off the smaller
> > clubs in Victoria - that's the rough idea anyway, so "yes"

>
> The revenue argument is **** though. Unless you're racing B grade
> club/combine you're going to get caned in an Open.


remember some opens are handicaps and some are graded, not all are free
for alls in the one grade. Having said that, I no longer race opens,
as, say I enter the Tour of the Valley in C grade, I see guys and say
"hey, don't you ususally race A grade" and we all know what happens
after that.


[snip]
 
C

Carl Brewer

Guest
On 1 Jun 2005 19:26:43 -0700, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
>Shabby wrote:
>> Carl Brewer Wrote:
>> >
>> > I was at a Blackburn coaching meeting two weeks ago, and
>> > we (BBN) are proposing an alternative that can still
>> > provide CSV with revinue but not kill off the smaller
>> > clubs in Victoria - that's the rough idea anyway, so "yes"

>>
>> The revenue argument is **** though. Unless you're racing B grade
>> club/combine you're going to get caned in an Open.

>
>remember some opens are handicaps and some are graded, not all are free
>for alls in the one grade. Having said that, I no longer race opens,
>as, say I enter the Tour of the Valley in C grade, I see guys and say
>"hey, don't you ususally race A grade" and we all know what happens
>after that.


Sandbaggers .. yes. What we need is a system similar to that which
the yanks use, with a grading system that's centralised and formerlly
managed.