Are Shimano chainrings interchangeable?

[Caleb]

I have a Shimano 600 set on my road bike (vintage 1987) which I would
like to upgrade the cahinrings from the Bio Pace system that was
introduced that year. I would like to change it for a Shimano Ultegra
39T/53T chain rings. Will the 5-hole shimano cetner spacing be the
esame for all of their components?

 

[Ozark Bicycle]

Caleb wrote:
> I have a Shimano 600 set on my road bike (vintage 1987) which I would
> like to upgrade the cahinrings from the Bio Pace system that was
> introduced that year. I would like to change it for a Shimano Ultegra
> 39T/53T chain rings. Will the 5-hole shimano cetner spacing be the
> esame for all of their components?

Your crank has a 130mm BCD (bolt circle diameter). Any chinrings using
that standard, including the ones you're asking about will fit.

 

[[email protected]]

search tech archives to - CRANK SAVER!
'87! been a long time: off course if the 600 is like new then it's like
new - maybe
but the 600 is beatifull. nice. pleasing to look at.
ohm the other tapir - nashbar is selling a complete new unit for $60
brinmging the inpemetrabble question! iza nashbar 2006 alloy the equal
of a '87 shimano alloy?
and remememember - 1.7 times the center to center bolt hole distance
equals the BCD
...--..?

 

[Caleb]

While we are on the subject. I have thought about upgrading the
Shimano 600 down-tube shifters to a handlebar configuration. My 600
system has a 6-speed gear sprocket in the back with 600 SIS (index).
Most of what I see out there today is 7+ gears cassettes. Is there any
Shimano handlebar shifters out there that can be adapted? Maybe the
Ultegra? The background of the proble is that it is difficult to
convert the entire component set, the bigger cassette needs a wider
backstay. I don't want to mess with the width of the backstay because
it can ruin the frame. Any Suggestions?

 

[Ozark Bicycle]

[email protected] wrote:
> search tech archives to - CRANK SAVER!
> '87! been a long time: off course if the 600 is like new then it's like
> new - maybe
> but the 600 is beatifull. nice. pleasing to look at.
> ohm the other tapir - nashbar is selling a complete new unit for $60
> brinmging the inpemetrabble question! iza nashbar 2006 alloy the equal
> of a '87 shimano alloy?
> and remememember - 1.7 times the center to center bolt hole distance
> equals the BCD
> ..--..?


Gene, I have a near NOS Shimano 600 (FC-6207, IIRC). The right side was
mounted on a spindle (years and years ago) but never used, the left arm
is in an unopened Shimano package. Email me if you're interested, I'd
like to see it go somewhere it would be appreciated.

 

[Matt O'Toole]

On Fri, 19 May 2006 11:20:20 -0700, Caleb wrote:

> While we are on the subject. I have thought about upgrading the
> Shimano 600 down-tube shifters to a handlebar configuration. My 600
> system has a 6-speed gear sprocket in the back with 600 SIS (index).
> Most of what I see out there today is 7+ gears cassettes. Is there any
> Shimano handlebar shifters out there that can be adapted? Maybe the
> Ultegra? The background of the proble is that it is difficult to
> convert the entire component set, the bigger cassette needs a wider
> backstay. I don't want to mess with the width of the backstay because
> it can ruin the frame. Any Suggestions?

Try barend shifters, or mounts to convert your downtube shifters to
barends.

IIRC, 7sp shifter will shift a 6sp cassette/freewheel, as the spacing
is the same. So you could use Shimano 7sp shifters, or Campy ones if you
switched to a Campy derailer too.

You could also convert to 7, 8, or 9 speed, without spreading the frame,
by running a wheel with more dish. A lot of people have done this with
no problems. The asymmetric rims available now would help even the
tension.

If your frame is steel there's no reason not to spread it, other than not
having a local mechanic who knows how to do it.

Your situation was common several years ago, as many people were trying to
upgrade their downtube 6sp bikes to STI/Ergo/etc. I wonder if someone has
put together a FAQ.

Matt O.

 

[JeffWills]

Caleb wrote:
> While we are on the subject. I have thought about upgrading the
> Shimano 600 down-tube shifters to a handlebar configuration. My 600
> system has a 6-speed gear sprocket in the back with 600 SIS (index).
> Most of what I see out there today is 7+ gears cassettes. Is there any
> Shimano handlebar shifters out there that can be adapted? Maybe the
> Ultegra? The background of the proble is that it is difficult to
> convert the entire component set, the bigger cassette needs a wider
> backstay. I don't want to mess with the width of the backstay because
> it can ruin the frame. Any Suggestions?

I assume you're asking about Shimano bar-end shifters:
http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?&sku=12434
Back when these first came out (1990-ish), the 6-speed and 7-speed
shifters were the same. Since 6-speed required a different cable pull,
there was a small plastic shim that fit in the groove of the shifter to
make them index properly. The 6/7-speed shifters are almost impossible
to find now (they haven't been made for nearly ten years) *and* you
would have to find a set *with* the little plastic shim. Double-nearly
impossible IMHO.

(I have a couple sets of 7-speed bar-end shifters- but I'm not selling
them.)

Your best bet to retain your existing drivetrain would be to use
non-index "friction" shifting, either with Shimano or Silver brand
shifters:
http://www.rivbike.com/webalog/shifters_derailleurs/17089.html
This isn't really a step backward- most people can use friction
shifters with only a short learning period.

As to your question about widening your frame "ruining" your frame-
that's hogwash. You would only need to widen it 4mm, a very small
amount. I've done it to a couple frames with no ill effects. This
Harris Cyclery article gives you a good run-down on the procedure:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html
It would be easy to re-space your frame to 130mm width. Then you could
"upgrade" to 8, 9, or 10 speeds on the rear wheel!

Jeff

 

[[email protected]]

nashbar and loosescrews sell the requisite equipment
as does the local flea market man!!
the two sets downtube shifters i have are from 10 speeds at 2/5/10 but
handle 2//8/16 no problem

 

[[email protected]]

gnaw - loosescrews has the rings but i commute and HD tour so the extra
finesse is wasted on me - practically if not asthetically
steel is real - what i would like to find is a box of high end late
'80's SR steel cranksets in 175mm - now that's anicea crankset - word
here is these SR's are $250+ of machining - see the loosescrews special
at $175 - a plainjane set - homely - i have one and keep it hidden
under the bearing cloth
the unworn 600 and another set were replaced with 9 speeds by various
rich folk
have yawl visited the sugino (italy) site? i haven't for a while but
have not located a dealer willing to order tho bike mag had a sidebar
on sugino triples a ways back at $100
the AL rings require every day cleaning before commuting to develop a
sense of longevity - for the CR if not I

 

[Ozark Bicycle]

Caleb wrote:
> While we are on the subject. I have thought about upgrading the
> Shimano 600 down-tube shifters to a handlebar configuration. My 600
> system has a 6-speed gear sprocket in the back with 600 SIS (index).
> Most of what I see out there today is 7+ gears cassettes. Is there any
> Shimano handlebar shifters out there that can be adapted? Maybe the
> Ultegra? The background of the proble is that it is difficult to
> convert the entire component set, the bigger cassette needs a wider
> backstay. I don't want to mess with the width of the backstay because
> it can ruin the frame. Any Suggestions?


First of all, check your frames rear spacing. It's most likely 126mm,
which means switching to 7SP only requires re-dishing the rear wheel (a
7SP FW takes up more space on the right side than a 6SP), not messing
with the frame.

Now, what do you mean by "handlebar configuration" shifters? Do you
mean the integrated brake/shifter levers from Shimano? If so, if you
convert to 7SP, you may be able to find some of the older 7SP
"brifters" through an LBS, RBM or eBay. I would approach used brifters
with a great deal of caution.

And here are two other approaches, usable in 6 or 7 speed:

Kelly Take-offs:

http://tinyurl.com/b4z48

and Dia-Tech bar-end shift mounts from Rivendell:

http://tinyurl.com/d6tw5

HTH

 

[Caleb]

Ozark,

Would re-dishing also apply for 8SP and maybe 9SP?. I'm not trying to
push it, just see hat other options. On the subject of tech specs, I
downloaded the specs out of the shimano Website. I'll check the
spacing. Unless you have a quick answer, I'll look at the specs.
Again, a lot of thanks!

 

[Ozark Bicycle]

Caleb wrote:
> Ozark,
>
> Would re-dishing also apply for 8SP and maybe 9SP?.

8/9/10SP requires ~130mm rear spacing on the frame. IME, 126mm 8/9/10SP
rear wheels are problematic. So you would need to deal with the axle
(you might need a longer axle, or, perhaps just additional spacers),
re-dish the wheel and spead the frame a bit (or, you can just force the
130mm wide axle into the 126mm rear spacing - doable but not
pleasant.).

> I'm not trying to
> push it, just see hat other options. On the subject of tech specs, I
> downloaded the specs out of the shimano Website. I'll check the
> spacing.

The spacing is the frame, not the Shimano components. Take off the rear
wheel and measure the space between the dropouts, which I expect will
be 126mm.


> Unless you have a quick answer, I'll look at the specs.
> Again, a lot of thanks!

 

[[email protected]]

add a couple washers at a time to the present hub and widen the
spacing gradually for the new axle - see wheels mfg for a good axle

 

[jack sprat]

Dude,

You can run 8 cogs of a 9 speed cassette on a 7 speed hub perfectly. That
way you can use modern 9 speed shifters.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html (search for "8 of 9 On 7")

J.


"Ozark Bicycle" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Caleb wrote:
> > Ozark,
> >
> > Would re-dishing also apply for 8SP and maybe 9SP?.
>
> 8/9/10SP requires ~130mm rear spacing on the frame. IME, 126mm 8/9/10SP
> rear wheels are problematic. So you would need to deal with the axle
> (you might need a longer axle, or, perhaps just additional spacers),
> re-dish the wheel and spead the frame a bit (or, you can just force the
> 130mm wide axle into the 126mm rear spacing - doable but not
> pleasant.).
>
> > I'm not trying to
> > push it, just see hat other options. On the subject of tech specs, I
> > downloaded the specs out of the shimano Website. I'll check the
> > spacing.
>
> The spacing is the frame, not the Shimano components. Take off the rear
> wheel and measure the space between the dropouts, which I expect will
> be 126mm.
>
>
> > Unless you have a quick answer, I'll look at the specs.
> > Again, a lot of thanks!
>

 

[john]

Hi Caleb

If your frame is steel, there is really no reason on earth to not
spread the frame. It will give you the freedom to use any free hub
configuration you want, & it will give you much better choices for
keeping a freewheel, along w/ less dish options. I don't know what the
average LBS charges for spreading the stays, but I doubt it's over $35.
We are now in the phase of evolution of shifters where new 6 & 7 &
perhaps 8sp (road) are rare enough that their price is starting to
climb again. If your LBS doesn't want to do it, try another. I suppose
it might be possible to damage a frame, but it's highly unlikely. If it
damaged the frame it's probable that the frame was already damaged.
It's only 2mm per side. It's a risk worth taking. One that I have &
will continue take.

Regards, John

 

[Ozark Bicycle]

jack sprat wrote:
> Dude,
>
> You can run 8 cogs of a 9 speed cassette on a 7 speed hub perfectly. That
> way you can use modern 9 speed shifters.
>
> http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html (search for "8 of 9 On 7")
>
> J.
>
My impression is that the OP has a freewheel, not a freehub/cassette.
Freehubs were the exception, not the rule, at that time.


>
> "Ozark Bicycle" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > Caleb wrote:
> > > Ozark,
> > >
> > > Would re-dishing also apply for 8SP and maybe 9SP?.
> >
> > 8/9/10SP requires ~130mm rear spacing on the frame. IME, 126mm 8/9/10SP
> > rear wheels are problematic. So you would need to deal with the axle
> > (you might need a longer axle, or, perhaps just additional spacers),
> > re-dish the wheel and spead the frame a bit (or, you can just force the
> > 130mm wide axle into the 126mm rear spacing - doable but not
> > pleasant.).
> >
> > > I'm not trying to
> > > push it, just see hat other options. On the subject of tech specs, I
> > > downloaded the specs out of the shimano Website. I'll check the
> > > spacing.
> >
> > The spacing is the frame, not the Shimano components. Take off the rear
> > wheel and measure the space between the dropouts, which I expect will
> > be 126mm.
> >
> >
> > > Unless you have a quick answer, I'll look at the specs.
> > > Again, a lot of thanks!
> >

 

[Qui si parla Campagnolo]

Caleb wrote:
> I have a Shimano 600 set on my road bike (vintage 1987) which I would
> like to upgrade the cahinrings from the Bio Pace system that was
> introduced that year. I would like to change it for a Shimano Ultegra
> 39T/53T chain rings. Will the 5-hole shimano cetner spacing be the
> esame for all of their components?

Yep-

 

[Ozark Bicycle]

Ozark Bicycle wrote:
> jack sprat wrote:
> > Dude,
> >
> > You can run 8 cogs of a 9 speed cassette on a 7 speed hub perfectly. That
> > way you can use modern 9 speed shifters.
> >
> > http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html (search for "8 of 9 On 7")
> >
> > J.
> >
> My impression is that the OP has a freewheel, not a freehub/cassette.
> Freehubs were the exception, not the rule, at that time.
>

>

.....and thinking further, if the OP *does* have a freehub, it's a 6SP,
not 7SP. so he would have to swap out the freehub body, in addition to
the other changes.