Are some cantis easier to adjust?

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Joe Nordic, May 24, 2003.

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  1. Joe Nordic

    Joe Nordic Guest

    I just replaced my rear brake cable and pads. I have Shimano Acera cantis on a Bianchi San Remo. I
    seem to have a heck of a time adjusting them. And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to
    adjust than others?

    Joe
     
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  2. Pete Geurds

    Pete Geurds Guest

    From: "Joe Nordic" [email protected]
    >I just replaced my rear brake cable and pads. I have Shimano Acera cantis on a Bianchi San Remo. I
    >seem to have a heck of a time adjusting them. And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to
    >adjust than others?

    No, they're all hard! Some are just not as hard as others! ;) Are you having trouble getting them
    centered? Have you checked Sheldon Brown's site? http://sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-adjustment.html

    Pete Geurds Douglassville, PA
     
  3. Joe Nordic

    Joe Nordic Guest

    Thanks for the link. My bike was not set up with a rear barrel adjuster, just a front one. I wonder
    if that made it harder to do.

    Bill
    ----------------------------------------------------

    > No, they're all hard! Some are just not as hard as others! ;) Are you having trouble getting them
    > centered? Have you checked Sheldon Brown's site?
    > http://sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-adjustment.html
    >
    >
    > Pete Geurds Douglassville, PA
     
  4. Mark

    Mark Guest

    My Avids are a piece of cake to adjust, much easier than other cantis that I've owned.
    --
    mark "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I just replaced my rear brake cable and pads. I have Shimano Acera cantis on a Bianchi San Remo. I
    > seem to have a heck of a time adjusting them. And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to
    > adjust than others?
    >
    > Joe
     
  5. Ant

    Ant Guest

    "mark" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > My Avids are a piece of cake to adjust, much easier than other cantis that I've owned.

    i second that motion. avid shorties.
     
  6. Joe Nordic

    Joe Nordic Guest

  7. Mark

    Mark Guest

    "Joe Nordic"wrote
    > Could you give any specifics about what makes the Avid shorties easier to set up?
    >
    The big difference (to me) is the pad/shoe design, and how it is attached to the cantilever arms.
    The shoe has a ball and socket incorporated into the post, making it really easy to set toe-in (or
    lack of toe in) and align the pad with the rim (look at a pair in a shop, I don't know how to
    describe it any better). I'm not sure how to describe the other differences, but find a pair of
    Avids and an old style pair of cantis in a shop and compare the two. HTH,
    --
    mark
     
  8. Andy Dingley

    Andy Dingley Guest

    On Sat, 24 May 2003 20:26:36 GMT, "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to adjust than others?

    Onza HO, probably the worst non-pressed steel cantis ever made, and near the most expensive too.
     
  9. Ant

    Ant Guest

    "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Could you give any specifics about what makes the Avid shorties easier to set up?

    well, i suppose im a questionable source, because ive dealt with a lot of cantis, but they're
    generally the cheaper variety. that said,

    the shorties are simple. ive worked on cantis which have every little possible aspect of them
    adjustable, but who needs it? the avids work great. toe-in is done with teh pad washers. carrier
    cable length is a cinch with the two included pre-assembled carriers. adusting centering is simple,
    with a twist of an allen key, and more predictable than others ive set up. (thank gosh they aren't
    phillip screws. why do they do that?). most importantly: they are stiff, good looking, strong, and
    dont need futzing with after the fact.

    i dont think of the shorties as any more difficult to deal with than a sidepull brake. f'rinstance.

    cheers, anthony
     
  10. Robin Hubert

    Robin Hubert Guest

    "Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Sat, 24 May 2003 20:26:36 GMT, "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to adjust than others?
    >
    > Onza HO, probably the worst non-pressed steel cantis ever made, and near the most expensive too.

    Also, Avid Trialign brakes, with the same caveat (plus you can hardly find them anymore).

    --
    Robin Hubert <[email protected]
     
  11. Robin Hubert

    Robin Hubert Guest

    "mark" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Joe Nordic"wrote
    > > Could you give any specifics about what makes the Avid shorties easier to set up?
    > >
    > The big difference (to me) is the pad/shoe design, and how it is attached
    to
    > the cantilever arms. The shoe has a ball and socket incorporated into the post, making it really
    > easy to set toe-in (or lack of toe in) and align
    the
    > pad with the rim (look at a pair in a shop, I don't know how to describe
    it
    > any better). I'm not sure how to describe the other differences, but find
    a
    > pair of Avids and an old style pair of cantis in a shop and compare the
    two.
    > HTH,
    > --

    If I can help ...

    Old style cantilevers used "post-style" pads, with a smooth post for attachment and adjustment, with
    some kind of concave/convex system for adjustment, all held in place with one fixing bolt. These
    brakes take some skill and coordination to adjust.

    New style canti's have bolt-style pads, that have an (usually) allen-head nut that screws onto a
    threaded post, with interposed concave/convex washer system. These are far simpler to adjust. Simple
    take up the slack, approximate the pads to the rim while squeezing the brake lever to hold them
    there, and tighten. If you need to toe-in, just put something between the rim and pad and sqeeze the
    brake, tighten.

    --
    Robin Hubert <[email protected]
     
  12. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    "Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Sat, 24 May 2003 20:26:36 GMT, "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to adjust than others?
    >
    > Onza HO, probably the worst non-pressed steel cantis ever made, and near the most expensive too.
    >

    I've never had a problem with my Onza HOs. As long as you don't loosen everything at once, they're a
    breeze to adjust.

    I do like the Avids though. The V-brake style pads make finding replacement parts easy and they
    require less fiddling with than my LXs, or XC Pros.

    Mike
     
  13. I tend to keep my pads close to the rim, less than 1 MM, if possible, and I love my Avid Shorty 6's.
    They have a spring adjustment screw on both arms, and once it's adjusted, it stays adjusted!

    Much easier than the V brakes they replaced.

    May you have the wind at your back. And a really low gear for the hills! Chris

    Chris'Z Corner "The Website for the Common Bicyclist": http://www.geocities.com/czcorner
     
  14. A Muzi

    A Muzi Guest

    "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I just replaced my rear brake cable and pads. I have Shimano Acera cantis on a Bianchi San Remo. I
    > seem to have a heck of a time adjusting them. And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to
    > adjust than others?

    Mechanics like that type of brake because it affords us more adjustments ( shoe height, shoe
    distance from arm, angle of shoe to rim in both planes, etc). Some riders complain that there are
    too many factors to watch while adjusting the brake shoes. That's a difference of perspective. You
    might stop at your dealer and watch the mechanic adjust your brake shoes while you watch and ask
    questions. It is not black art and easily learned. And remember to oil the threads of the shoe
    holders which makes everything easier.

    --
    Andrew Muzi http://www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April 1971
     
  15. Eric

    Eric Guest

    Have you ever had the adjustment screw strip out? Last year I noticed a lot of drag on my front
    wheel, started to adjust and the screw thread was gone. I was able to get the thing adjusted by
    bending the spring, but it didn't hold right. My LBS installed an old Dia Compe cantis and (after
    figuring out the pad adjustment process), I have to say that it is much easier to adjust the arm
    tension (just use a 13mm cone wrench).

    However, I'm still happy overall with Avid. They were more than happy to send along replacements, no
    charge. No instructions, though!

    Eric

    [email protected] (Chris Zacho "The Wheelman") wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > I tend to keep my pads close to the rim, less than 1 MM, if possible, and I love my Avid Shorty
    > 6's. They have a spring adjustment screw on both arms, and once it's adjusted, it stays adjusted!
    >
    > Much easier than the V brakes they replaced.
    >
    > May you have the wind at your back. And a really low gear for the hills! Chris
    >
    > Chris'Z Corner "The Website for the Common Bicyclist": http://www.geocities.com/czcorner
     
  16. Tim McNamara

    Tim McNamara Guest

    The DiaCompe 986 is about the easiest-to-adjust cantilever brake ever made.
     
  17. A Muzi wrote:
    > "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >
    >>I just replaced my rear brake cable and pads. I have Shimano Acera cantis on a Bianchi San Remo. I
    >>seem to have a heck of a time adjusting them. And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to
    >>adjust than others?
    >
    >
    > Mechanics like that type of brake because it affords us more adjustments ( shoe height, shoe
    > distance from arm, angle of shoe to rim in both planes, etc). Some riders complain that there are
    > too many factors to watch while adjusting the brake shoes. That's a difference of perspective. You
    > might stop at your dealer and watch the mechanic adjust your brake shoes while you watch and ask
    > questions. It is not black art and easily learned. And remember to oil the threads of the shoe
    > holders which makes everything easier.

    I disagree. The "modern" threaded post cantilever shoe (which debuted with Shimano V-brakes) has
    just as much adjustability as the older smooth post shoes. The threaded posts model can be adjusted
    in or out by swapping spacers on the post, can be adjusted up or down on the mounting slots, can be
    rotated in two axes on the ball and socket washers, and rotated along the axes of the post. The
    difference is the threaded pads can be easier to set - just actuate the brake arm to hold the pad
    flush to the rim, and tighten the nut.

    There is an additional feature than makes many threaded pads easier to adjust - most come with
    replaceable pads. When the old pad is worn down, there is no reason to go through the shoe adjusting
    procedure with new shoes - just slip out the old pad and slip in a new pad.

    I'm not sorry to see the old smooth post cantilever go.

    Mark McMaster [email protected]
     
  18. Robin Hubert wrote:
    > "Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >
    >>On Sat, 24 May 2003 20:26:36 GMT, "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to adjust than others?
    >>
    >>Onza HO, probably the worst non-pressed steel cantis ever made, and near the most expensive too.
    >
    >
    > Also, Avid Trialign brakes, with the same caveat (plus you can hardly find them anymore).

    I agree that the Avid Tri-Align brakes are easy to set up, and I agree with the caveat they they
    were some of the most expensive; but I don't agree that they were some of the worst cantilever
    brakes ever made. Tri-Align brakes had very rigid arms and precision pivot bushings that practically
    eliminated brake shudder and squeel, and had grease ports for easy re-lubing to keep them actuating
    smoothly. Whether these features justified there high price may be debatable, but they were
    excellently performing brakes.

    (The Onza HO brakes, on the other hand, were definitely losers).

    Mark McMaster [email protected]
     
  19. Robin Hubert

    Robin Hubert Guest

    "Mark McMaster" <MM[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > A Muzi wrote:
    > > "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > >>I just replaced my rear brake cable and pads. I have Shimano Acera cantis on a Bianchi San Remo.
    > >>I seem to have a heck of a time adjusting them. And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to
    > >>adjust than others?
    > >
    > >
    > > Mechanics like that type of brake because it affords us more adjustments
    (
    > > shoe height, shoe distance from arm, angle of shoe to rim in both
    planes,
    > > etc). Some riders complain that there are too many factors to watch
    while
    > > adjusting the brake shoes. That's a difference of perspective. You might stop at your dealer and
    > > watch the mechanic adjust your brake
    shoes
    > > while you watch and ask questions. It is not black art and easily
    learned.
    > > And remember to oil the threads of the shoe holders which makes
    everything
    > > easier.
    >
    > I disagree. The "modern" threaded post cantilever shoe (which debuted with Shimano V-brakes) has
    > just as much adjustability as the older smooth post shoes. The threaded posts model can be
    > adjusted in or out by swapping spacers on the post, can be adjusted up or down on the mounting
    > slots, can be rotated in two axes on the ball and socket washers, and rotated along the axes of
    > the post. The difference is the threaded pads can be easier to set - just actuate the brake arm to
    > hold the pad flush to the rim, and tighten the nut.

    I think Joe was talking about the in/out adjustability of post-style pads, which have a greater
    range than the bolt-on bads. This isn't much of an issue, but I've seen cases where it would help
    like the recent case of a Bike Friday with Vee brakes. Brake posts are very wide on the rear of this
    bike and with the washers setup so the pads were in as far as possible, they still weren't nearly
    far enough. I don't have a bolt-on pad handy so I can't measure, but I'm looking at a post-style and
    my impression is that it'd go in quite a bit further. Of course, this setup isn't ideal (brings more
    flex into the system) ....

    > There is an additional feature than makes many threaded pads easier to adjust - most come with
    > replaceable pads. When the old pad is worn down, there is no reason to go through the shoe
    > adjusting procedure with new shoes - just slip out the old pad and slip in a new pad.

    Slip-in pads makes the easy adjustability of bolt-style pads kinda redundant, I think. These
    would've helped immensly in the days of centerpull cantilevers.

    > I'm not sorry to see the old smooth post cantilever go.

    Me three!

    --
    Robin Hubert <[email protected]
     
  20. Robin Hubert

    Robin Hubert Guest

    "Mark McMaster" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Robin Hubert wrote:
    > > "Andy Dingley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > >>On Sat, 24 May 2003 20:26:36 GMT, "Joe Nordic" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>And I was wondering if some cantis are easier to adjust than others?
    > >>
    > >>Onza HO, probably the worst non-pressed steel cantis ever made, and near the most expensive too.
    > >
    > >
    > > Also, Avid Trialign brakes, with the same caveat (plus you can hardly
    find
    > > them anymore).
    >
    > I agree that the Avid Tri-Align brakes are easy to set up, and I agree with the caveat they they
    > were some of the most expensive; but I don't agree that they were some of the worst cantilever
    > brakes ever made. Tri-Align brakes had very rigid arms and precision pivot bushings that
    > practically eliminated brake shudder and squeel, and had grease ports for easy re-lubing to keep
    > them actuating smoothly. Whether these features justified there high price may be debatable, but
    > they were excellently performing brakes.

    My favorite canti's. However, I don't know anything about the grease port. It's been a while since I
    serviced them but ....?

    >
    > (The Onza HO brakes, on the other hand, were definitely losers).

    --
    Robin Hubert <[email protected]
     
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