P
- Status
N
Nick Kew
Guest
In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of
"Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of other
ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered for that
is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)
"Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of other
ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered for that
is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)
S
Steve McGinty
Guest
On Thu, 5 Jun 2003 06:46:02 +0100, [email protected] (Nick Kew) wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of
>"Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
>
>> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
>
>Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>
>On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
>Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of
>other ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered
>for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
There are many electrolyte drinks out there that should counter this. A cheaper solution is to
mix half pure fruit juice of your choice with half water and add a teaspoon of salt per water
bottle (750ml)
Regards! Stephen
>In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of
>"Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
>
>> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
>
>Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>
>On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
>Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of
>other ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered
>for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
There are many electrolyte drinks out there that should counter this. A cheaper solution is to
mix half pure fruit juice of your choice with half water and add a teaspoon of salt per water
bottle (750ml)
Regards! Stephen
D
Dave Kahn
Guest
"Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
There is nothing new in this. The danger of hyponatraemia has been known about for years. This is
the origin of isotonic sports drinks.
When I first started cycling the conventional wisdom was that drinking during exercise was bad for
you. If you got thirsty you were supposed to take a mouthful from your bottle, swish it around your
mouth, swallow a tiny bit of it, and spit the rest out. This was supposed to fool your body into
thinking that you'd taken a big drink. If your opponent was thirsty offering him a drink from your
bottle was a subtle away of decreasing his chances of beating you.
We know better than that now, of course, but correct hydration is not the same as consuming as much
water as possible.
--
Dave...
news:<[email protected]>...
> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
There is nothing new in this. The danger of hyponatraemia has been known about for years. This is
the origin of isotonic sports drinks.
When I first started cycling the conventional wisdom was that drinking during exercise was bad for
you. If you got thirsty you were supposed to take a mouthful from your bottle, swish it around your
mouth, swallow a tiny bit of it, and spit the rest out. This was supposed to fool your body into
thinking that you'd taken a big drink. If your opponent was thirsty offering him a drink from your
bottle was a subtle away of decreasing his chances of beating you.
We know better than that now, of course, but correct hydration is not the same as consuming as much
water as possible.
--
Dave...
D
Dave Larrington
Guest
I knew it. This merely confirms my suspicion that water is for [deleted - Ed.]. And voles.
Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
===========================================================
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
===========================================================
Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
===========================================================
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
===========================================================
P
Philip Taylor -
Guest
Well, I take a 1 litre bottle of tonic water with me for shortish rides, and 2 x 1 litres of tonic
water for anything longer (the most I can get on the bike). And I have no compunction about stopping
for a beer, as well. I wonder what the the effects of /that/ lot are likely to be ... !
** Phil.
--------
Dave Larrington wrote:
>
> I knew it. This merely confirms my suspicion that water is for [deleted - Ed.]. And voles.
>
> Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
> ===========================================================
> Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
> http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
> ===========================================================
water for anything longer (the most I can get on the bike). And I have no compunction about stopping
for a beer, as well. I wonder what the the effects of /that/ lot are likely to be ... !
** Phil.
--------
Dave Larrington wrote:
>
> I knew it. This merely confirms my suspicion that water is for [deleted - Ed.]. And voles.
>
> Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
> ===========================================================
> Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
> http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
> ===========================================================
H
Hatchet
Guest
"Nick Kew" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite
monkeys
> at the keyboard of "Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
>
> > Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
>
> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>
> On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
> Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of
> other ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered
> for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
>
<SNIP> Sorry can't let that one go. I've worked and travelled in Italy for many years and I can
categorically state that I've NEVER had a meal where you cannot taste the other ingredients through
the overuse of salt. If food (in general) in the UK was anywhere remotely as good as the quality on
offer in Italy I believe the whole nation would benefit.
Chopper
"Diagonally parked in a parallel universe."
> In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite
monkeys
> at the keyboard of "Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
>
> > Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
>
> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>
> On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
> Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of
> other ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered
> for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
>
<SNIP> Sorry can't let that one go. I've worked and travelled in Italy for many years and I can
categorically state that I've NEVER had a meal where you cannot taste the other ingredients through
the overuse of salt. If food (in general) in the UK was anywhere remotely as good as the quality on
offer in Italy I believe the whole nation would benefit.
Chopper
"Diagonally parked in a parallel universe."
D
David Gillbe
Guest
> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>
I've always been taught that by the time the body demands fluids, you are already dehydrated.
Obviously, I'm not advocating the drinking of vast quantities of water, that is bad as well, but
"drink when the body demands it" is not a sensible attitude either, certainly not for the serious
sportsperson. How to find the happy medium? Very difficult, but generally I've been told that we
should aim to be urinating once every 3-4 hours. I think that's right. But I 'm not entirely sure I
can remember. Anyone know better?
>
I've always been taught that by the time the body demands fluids, you are already dehydrated.
Obviously, I'm not advocating the drinking of vast quantities of water, that is bad as well, but
"drink when the body demands it" is not a sensible attitude either, certainly not for the serious
sportsperson. How to find the happy medium? Very difficult, but generally I've been told that we
should aim to be urinating once every 3-4 hours. I think that's right. But I 'm not entirely sure I
can remember. Anyone know better?
N
Nick Kew
Guest
In article <D%JDa.4438$%[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the
keyboard of "Hatchet" <j-h@TAKE_OUT_THE_TRASH_blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
>> Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of
>> other ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered
>> for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
>>
> <SNIP> Sorry can't let that one go. I've worked and travelled in Italy for many years and I can
> categorically state that I've NEVER had a meal where you cannot taste the other ingredients
> through the overuse of salt.
You haven't tried quick takeaway-pizza in Rome. Or various other places. I lived just outside Rome
from '92 to '98, and experienced a lot of extremely salty food. At worst there was so much you could
actually see a pile of the white stuff as thick as the pizza crust itself.
But having lived in Italy, you'll know they have a lot more regional variation than we do. There was
IIRC somewhat less salt in the north than in Rome, while culinary-tourist-regions such as Tuscany
have some altogether superior cuisine.
Oh, and living in Italy as a non-meat-eater brings it home to you that the first syllable of our
word "salad" is etymologically derived from "Salt".
--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)
keyboard of "Hatchet" <j-h@TAKE_OUT_THE_TRASH_blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead to heart disease. Yet the
>> Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of drowning out the taste of
>> other ingredients, while Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation offered
>> for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
>>
> <SNIP> Sorry can't let that one go. I've worked and travelled in Italy for many years and I can
> categorically state that I've NEVER had a meal where you cannot taste the other ingredients
> through the overuse of salt.
You haven't tried quick takeaway-pizza in Rome. Or various other places. I lived just outside Rome
from '92 to '98, and experienced a lot of extremely salty food. At worst there was so much you could
actually see a pile of the white stuff as thick as the pizza crust itself.
But having lived in Italy, you'll know they have a lot more regional variation than we do. There was
IIRC somewhat less salt in the north than in Rome, while culinary-tourist-regions such as Tuscany
have some altogether superior cuisine.
Oh, and living in Italy as a non-meat-eater brings it home to you that the first syllable of our
word "salad" is etymologically derived from "Salt".
--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)
N
Nick Kew
Guest
In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of "David Gillbe"
<david.NO^&[email protected]> wrote:
>> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>>
> I've always been taught that by the time the body demands fluids, you are already dehydrated.
Umm, I think that might be stretching the definition of "dehydrated" rather beyond where it's
anything to worry about. Except of course when the body is acclimatising to something unaccustomed
(like altitude). I guess unaccustomed exercise counts as acclimatisation for these purposes; hence
the conventional advice to drink lots to the once- a-year crowd.
But I'm not a doctor, and I'm probably talking rubbish
--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)
<david.NO^&[email protected]> wrote:
>> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
>>
> I've always been taught that by the time the body demands fluids, you are already dehydrated.
Umm, I think that might be stretching the definition of "dehydrated" rather beyond where it's
anything to worry about. Except of course when the body is acclimatising to something unaccustomed
(like altitude). I guess unaccustomed exercise counts as acclimatisation for these purposes; hence
the conventional advice to drink lots to the once- a-year crowd.
But I'm not a doctor, and I'm probably talking rubbish
--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)
H
Hatchet
Guest
"Nick Kew" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> In article <D%JDa.4438$%[email protected]>, one of
infinite monkeys
> at the keyboard of "Hatchet" <j-h@TAKE_OUT_THE_TRASH_blueyonder.co.uk>
wrote:
> >>
> >> On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead
to
> >> heart disease. Yet the Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of
> >> drowning out the taste of other ingredients,
while
> >> Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation
offered
> >> for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
> >>
> > <SNIP> Sorry can't let that one go. I've worked and travelled in Italy for many years and I can
> > categorically state that I've NEVER had a meal where you cannot taste the other ingredients
> > through the overuse of salt.
>
> You haven't tried quick takeaway-pizza in Rome. Or various other places. I lived just outside Rome
> from '92 to '98, and experienced a lot of extremely salty food. At worst there was so much you
> could actually see a pile of the white stuff as thick as the pizza crust itself.
No, most of my visits have been north of Rome, up on the Adriatic coast in Marche and Emiliga
Romania and around Milan and Bologna. The seafood and pizza's in Pesaro are to die for.
> But having lived in Italy, you'll know they have a lot more regional variation than we do. There
> was IIRC somewhat less salt in the north than in Rome, while culinary-tourist-regions such as
> Tuscany have some altogether superior cuisine.
True. The really great thing about Italian food is the regional variations and the use of seasonal
ingredients.
<Snip>
Chopper
"Diagonally parked in a parallel universe."
> In article <D%JDa.4438$%[email protected]>, one of
infinite monkeys
> at the keyboard of "Hatchet" <j-h@TAKE_OUT_THE_TRASH_blueyonder.co.uk>
wrote:
> >>
> >> On a related note, UK conventional wisdom tells us that salt can lead
to
> >> heart disease. Yet the Italian diet includes massive amounts of salt, often to the point of
> >> drowning out the taste of other ingredients,
while
> >> Italians have less heart disease than the Brits. An explanation
offered
> >> for that is that the salt replaces what we lose in sweat.
> >>
> > <SNIP> Sorry can't let that one go. I've worked and travelled in Italy for many years and I can
> > categorically state that I've NEVER had a meal where you cannot taste the other ingredients
> > through the overuse of salt.
>
> You haven't tried quick takeaway-pizza in Rome. Or various other places. I lived just outside Rome
> from '92 to '98, and experienced a lot of extremely salty food. At worst there was so much you
> could actually see a pile of the white stuff as thick as the pizza crust itself.
No, most of my visits have been north of Rome, up on the Adriatic coast in Marche and Emiliga
Romania and around Milan and Bologna. The seafood and pizza's in Pesaro are to die for.
> But having lived in Italy, you'll know they have a lot more regional variation than we do. There
> was IIRC somewhat less salt in the north than in Rome, while culinary-tourist-regions such as
> Tuscany have some altogether superior cuisine.
True. The really great thing about Italian food is the regional variations and the use of seasonal
ingredients.
<Snip>
Chopper
"Diagonally parked in a parallel universe."
G
Graham
Guest
I usually carry around a 1 litre bottle of water and add a pinch of salt to it. seems to work OK, I
drink about 250 ml per hour of cycling.
drink about 250 ml per hour of cycling.
P
Pete Biggs
Guest
Dave Kahn wrote:
>> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
>
> There is nothing new in this. The danger of hyponatraemia has been known about for years.
Yes but it's worth publicising again now because the "drink loads of water" advice is being given
more and more. I didn't realise that it was so easy to drink too much.
> This is the origin of isotonic sports drinks.
I was disappointed the article didn't mention them. Do isotonic drinks really make hyponatraemia
much more difficult?
> When I first started cycling the conventional wisdom was that drinking during exercise was bad for
> you. If you got thirsty you were supposed to take a mouthful from your bottle, swish it around
> your mouth, swallow a tiny bit of it, and spit the rest out.
I remember my grandmother saying that but I never did understand!
> This was supposed to fool your body into thinking that you'd taken a big drink.
Ah right!
~PB
>> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
>
> There is nothing new in this. The danger of hyponatraemia has been known about for years.
Yes but it's worth publicising again now because the "drink loads of water" advice is being given
more and more. I didn't realise that it was so easy to drink too much.
> This is the origin of isotonic sports drinks.
I was disappointed the article didn't mention them. Do isotonic drinks really make hyponatraemia
much more difficult?
> When I first started cycling the conventional wisdom was that drinking during exercise was bad for
> you. If you got thirsty you were supposed to take a mouthful from your bottle, swish it around
> your mouth, swallow a tiny bit of it, and spit the rest out.
I remember my grandmother saying that but I never did understand!
> This was supposed to fool your body into thinking that you'd taken a big drink.
Ah right!
~PB
D
Dave Kahn
Guest
"Philip TAYLOR [PC336/H-XP]" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> Well, I take a 1 litre bottle of tonic water with me for shortish rides, and 2 x 1 litres of tonic
> water for anything longer (the most I can get on the bike). And I have no compunction about
> stopping for a beer, as well. I wonder what the the effects of /that/ lot are likely to be ... !
Well, you're unlikely to contract malaria while you're out cycling.
--
Dave...
news:<[email protected]>...
> Well, I take a 1 litre bottle of tonic water with me for shortish rides, and 2 x 1 litres of tonic
> water for anything longer (the most I can get on the bike). And I have no compunction about
> stopping for a beer, as well. I wonder what the the effects of /that/ lot are likely to be ... !
Well, you're unlikely to contract malaria while you're out cycling.
--
Dave...
W
W K
Guest
"Nick Kew" <[email protected]> wrote in message news[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of "David Gillbe"
> <david.NO^&[email protected]>
wrote:
> >> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
> >>
> > I've always been taught that by the time the body demands fluids, you
are
> > already dehydrated.
>
> Umm, I think that might be stretching the definition of "dehydrated" rather beyond where it's
> anything to worry about.
Nothing to worry about, but enough to make you slower. I think the point was that some runners were
getting into the idea that the difference would be so important that they had to drink huge
quantities. (ie take some sensible advice and over-do it to make it silly).
Anyone who "trains" ie has a go regularly, is likely to work out what is sensible, esp if they pay
attention to the urine colour advice.
[email protected]...> In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of "David Gillbe"
> <david.NO^&[email protected]>
wrote:
> >> Moral: the rather obvious one - drink when the body demands it.
> >>
> > I've always been taught that by the time the body demands fluids, you
are
> > already dehydrated.
>
> Umm, I think that might be stretching the definition of "dehydrated" rather beyond where it's
> anything to worry about.
Nothing to worry about, but enough to make you slower. I think the point was that some runners were
getting into the idea that the difference would be so important that they had to drink huge
quantities. (ie take some sensible advice and over-do it to make it silly).
Anyone who "trains" ie has a go regularly, is likely to work out what is sensible, esp if they pay
attention to the urine colour advice.
D
David E. Belche
Guest
"Dave Larrington" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> I knew it. This merely confirms my suspicion that water is for [deleted - Ed.]. And voles.
>
Cue W. C. Fields quotes.... ;-)
David E. Belcher
Dept. of Chemistry, University of York
news:<[email protected]>...
> I knew it. This merely confirms my suspicion that water is for [deleted - Ed.]. And voles.
>
Cue W. C. Fields quotes.... ;-)
David E. Belcher
Dept. of Chemistry, University of York
D
Dave
Guest
"Pete Biggs" <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Dave Kahn wrote:
>
> >> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
> >
> > There is nothing new in this. The danger of hyponatraemia has been known about for years.
>
> Yes but it's worth publicising again now because the "drink loads of water" advice is being given
> more and more. I didn't realise that it was so easy to drink too much.
>
<snip> I believe this was the problem with Leah Betts ( Ecstacy pill 'victim' according to media and
all other worthies). Due to a lack of education all she had heard about taking ecstacy was that you
should drink loads of water. This came from the early rave days when folks danced all night, sweated
gallons, then keeled over due to dehydration. Unfortunately, one of the other potential side effects
is that it stops you sweating, only not many people get to hear about this. As a result they stop
sweating and think they must be dehydrated, so drink more :-( <\rant on\> Leah died from a water
overdose according to the coroner, but as far as all worthies are concerned, it wasn't ignorance or
a lack of education due to prohibition, but ecstacy that killed her !! WATER KILLED HER and they
still don't bother letting the kids know this!!!! <\rant off\>
Water, miracle of life. You cant see it, you can't smell it, it's almost not there at all, but try
living without it!! Caution, treat with respect. Dave.
news:[email protected]...
> Dave Kahn wrote:
>
> >> Interesting Daily Telegraph article: http://tinyurl.com/di9y
> >
> > There is nothing new in this. The danger of hyponatraemia has been known about for years.
>
> Yes but it's worth publicising again now because the "drink loads of water" advice is being given
> more and more. I didn't realise that it was so easy to drink too much.
>
<snip> I believe this was the problem with Leah Betts ( Ecstacy pill 'victim' according to media and
all other worthies). Due to a lack of education all she had heard about taking ecstacy was that you
should drink loads of water. This came from the early rave days when folks danced all night, sweated
gallons, then keeled over due to dehydration. Unfortunately, one of the other potential side effects
is that it stops you sweating, only not many people get to hear about this. As a result they stop
sweating and think they must be dehydrated, so drink more :-( <\rant on\> Leah died from a water
overdose according to the coroner, but as far as all worthies are concerned, it wasn't ignorance or
a lack of education due to prohibition, but ecstacy that killed her !! WATER KILLED HER and they
still don't bother letting the kids know this!!!! <\rant off\>
Water, miracle of life. You cant see it, you can't smell it, it's almost not there at all, but try
living without it!! Caution, treat with respect. Dave.
- Status
