Armstrong greatest American athelte 10 yrs

[limerickman]

Talking about US success : Michael Johnson 100m, 200m and 400m athlete.
Is he ever mentioned Stateside?

The man is a near legend here in Europe.

Another great favourite is/was Pete Sampras.

Along with Tiger Woods I would have thought that these guys would have been in contention?

 

[Capt.Injury]

Talking about US success : Michael Johnson 100m, 200m and 400m athlete.
Is he ever mentioned Stateside?

The man is a near legend here in Europe.

Another great favourite is/was Pete Sampras.

Along with Tiger Woods I would have thought that these guys would have been in contention?

In between the 96-00 Olympics, everybody recognizes the name, buts its not a forefront thought. If you mention Michael Johnson to someone they will go, He is the guy the won the gold medals and broke records. Since Johnson is now retired, he really doesn't get mentioned much at all. Track and Field runners, and other competitors aren't considered mainstream, so they really only get brought up around the time the Olympics about to happen. People who don't keep up with Track and Field, may not even recognize the name at all.

Sampras outside of avid tennis fans, really dont get hte credit he deserves. Non Tennis fans would probably think Agassi was the best, even during his really down years before he was the more flamboyant and his face was plastered all over commercials during Pete's remarkable run.

With Golf being the being craze , everyone knows who Woods, so his name is known among all people, especially the astronimcal heights that golf has gone in terms of popularity over the last 10-15 years.

The main reason I think Armstrong is voted, is his story. I am not saying he isn't one of the greatest athletes, because he is one of the best, and by far the best endurance athlete, but I think because his cancer story hits home in so many household, he be considered the greatest just by winning 2 or 3 Tour De France. Every year the Tour De France will get 15-30 second blurb on Sportscenter on the day of each stage, and thats really all the mention, until the last couple of days, when Armstrong is in the lead, where they will interview guys like John Eustache (Hope thats the right name; bald guy), and Chris Carmichael, maybe Jim Ock., and ask about how amazing it is he can comeback from cancer and win. They don't ask how incredible is it to win x amount of TDFs in a row, its has to include the mention of cancer.

 

[limerickman]

In between the 96-00 Olympics, everybody recognizes the name, buts its not a forefront thought. If you mention Michael Johnson to someone they will go, He is the guy the won the gold medals and broke records. Since Johnson is now retired, he really doesn't get mentioned much at all. Track and Field runners, and other competitors aren't considered mainstream, so they really only get brought up around the time the Olympics about to happen. People who don't keep up with Track and Field, may not even recognize the name at all.

Sampras outside of avid tennis fans, really dont get hte credit he deserves. Non Tennis fans would probably think Agassi was the best, even during his really down years before he was the more flamboyant and his face was plastered all over commercials during Pete's remarkable run.

With Golf being the being craze , everyone knows who Woods, so his name is known among all people, especially the astronimcal heights that golf has gone in terms of popularity over the last 10-15 years.

The main reason I think Armstrong is voted, is his story. I am not saying he isn't one of the greatest athletes, because he is one of the best, and by far the best endurance athlete, but I think because his cancer story hits home in so many household, he be considered the greatest just by winning 2 or 3 Tour De France. Every year the Tour De France will get 15-30 second blurb on Sportscenter on the day of each stage, and thats really all the mention, until the last couple of days, when Armstrong is in the lead, where they will interview guys like John Eustache (Hope thats the right name; bald guy), and Chris Carmichael, maybe Jim Ock., and ask about how amazing it is he can comeback from cancer and win. They don't ask how incredible is it to win x amount of TDFs in a row, its has to include the mention of cancer.

Thanks for the reply : yeah I can see how the LA story would capture the imagination, especially after his illness.

The guys that I mentioned would be very well known US sports stars over here.
More so than Michael Jordan - which might come as a big surprise to American
members.
(Jordan is known but not to the same extent).

Just trying to give you guys some perspective as to how famous some of your guys are over here.
Woods - definitely a star.
Nicklaus - ditto.
Mike Tyson (certainly before his troubles, would have been perceived as being very very well known and admired).
Sampras.
Johnson.
Armstrong is very well known on this side of the world too.
But a guy like Dan Marino would barely cause a ripple here (he'd cause a stampede in the USA, of course).
Michael Phelps might make a slight impact.

It is interesting though to see how different people are perceived in different
parts of the planet.

 

[Capt.Injury]

Thanks for the reply : yeah I can see how the LA story would capture the imagination, especially after his illness.

The guys that I mentioned would be very well known US sports stars over here.
More so than Michael Jordan - which might come as a big surprise to American
members.
(Jordan is known but not to the same extent).

Just trying to give you guys some perspective as to how famous some of your guys are over here.
Woods - definitely a star.
Nicklaus - ditto.
Mike Tyson (certainly before his troubles, would have been perceived as being very very well known and admired).
Sampras.
Johnson.
Armstrong is very well known on this side of the world too.
But a guy like Dan Marino would barely cause a ripple here (he'd cause a stampede in the USA, of course).
Michael Phelps might make a slight impact.

It is interesting though to see how different people are perceived in different
parts of the planet.

Interesting you say that about Phelps, because I would think he might have more star power over there since he was an Olympic star. Athletes that compete in Olympic Games get what seems to be "15 minutes of fame" treatment. There be one or two that got a little more, best example being Carl Lewis.

I would also imagine that Soccer stars like Ronaldo, are practically rock stars status, while in the US, the only name known to the mainstream for soccer here would be Freddie Adu just because he got a million dollar contract at 14. Tyson was big over here, mainly for the way he knocked out opponents so quick and so devastating. After his rape conviction and other legal problems, he may have gotten bigger in fact because of the "sideshow distraction" he could provide.

It is quite interesting about the difference of opinions around the world of athletes. For a while I bowled for a living on an amateur level. If I told most people in the US this, they be looking to check me into a mental health clinic. A coouple of guys i have talked to like Tim Mack (For many years the best International Bowler), goes to Australia, the Far East, some of the Middle East, Scandanivia, and he gets treated like a star. Its always quite interesting

 

[KennyCartman]

Talking about US success : Michael Johnson 100m, 200m and 400m athlete.
Is he ever mentioned Stateside?

The man is a near legend here in Europe.

I think he never run 100 meters with success...

 

[wolfix]

I think Armstrong introduced cycling to the American mainstream sports fan. It was the total package of Armstrong that did it. The cancer story was what brought the attention to Armstrong in the first place, followed up by the number of victories, then the interest was created and many mainstream American sports fans started actually watching the TDF's daily coverage. The sports fans I know was amazed at the "team aspect" of the sport and other interesting aspects of cycling. I have to say this ......In America, Armstrong is bigger then the TDF among non-fans.

Cycling will never be a mainstream sport in America. We can continue to send to Europe a few riders who are competitive and can do well. Cycling faces too many obstacles in America. The major one is the basis of our sports system in this country. Our sports programs have their base in the school systems. And then there is the cost of cycling equipment which does not make it easy for any young child to suggest to his parents .... "Hey mom, I need a extra set of wheels next week to compete in the state TT. Do you have an extra $500 bucks?"
In America we also have the logistic problems of handling races, along with high insurance cost. There is not enough public support to overcome these things. If criterium racing was pushed it might have a chance. But the thrust of the big money seems to be at road races. I am a cyclist and I find road racing to be boring from the perspective of a fan.
I thought mountain bike racing would go mainstream. But it does not have the success that I thought it would. And I have a feeling we can look at the governing bodies of cycling to see what stunted it's growth.

 

[MJtje]

Very true cycling will never be mainstream, like baseball, basketball and ice
hocky will never be mainstream in europe......

Champions come and go.....we'll see if the ''american fans'' will stick.

I think Armstrong introduced cycling to the American mainstream sports fan. It was the total package of Armstrong that did it. The cancer story was what brought the attention to Armstrong in the first place, followed up by the number of victories, then the interest was created and many mainstream American sports fans started actually watching the TDF's daily coverage. The sports fans I know was amazed at the "team aspect" of the sport and other interesting aspects of cycling. I have to say this ......In America, Armstrong is bigger then the TDF among non-fans.

Cycling will never be a mainstream sport in America. We can continue to send to Europe a few riders who are competitive and can do well. Cycling faces too many obstacles in America. The major one is the basis of our sports system in this country. Our sports programs have their base in the school systems. And then there is the cost of cycling equipment which does not make it easy for any young child to suggest to his parents .... "Hey mom, I need a extra set of wheels next week to compete in the state TT. Do you have an extra $500 bucks?"
In America we also have the logistic problems of handling races, along with high insurance cost. There is not enough public support to overcome these things. If criterium racing was pushed it might have a chance. But the thrust of the big money seems to be at road races. I am a cyclist and I find road racing to be boring from the perspective of a fan.
I thought mountain bike racing would go mainstream. But it does not have the success that I thought it would. And I have a feeling we can look at the governing bodies of cycling to see what stunted it's growth.

 

[bobke]

Best American Athletes ever?
male, recent times:

Jim Ryan, mile runner
Gayle Sayers, football
Bob Hayes, fastest 100 m in world for long time
Bob Beamon, held long jump record for like a century
Sampras, tennis in terms # grand slams
Air Jordan, nuff said
Lance, broke Eddy Mercxkx tour record for petes sake
Eric freekin Heiden, MR 5 skating medals
Mark Spitz, swimmimg 22 gold medals or whatever

golf? is a game, like bowling, not a sport, only Tiger does conditioning and
training, those guys are crazy skilled but not athletes
Athlete no:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/12/22/gallery.siyear/content.2.html

Athlete yes:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/12/22/gallery.siyear/content.7.html

 

[JohnO]

I tend to think that cycling will never be a huge sport in the US, because cycling itself is not a particularly popular pastime. And the reason for that is fairly simple - a combination of huge distances and (relatively) cheap fuel. I spent some time in the Netherlands, where the distances involved are short enough to make cycling commuting practical, and energy prices are high enough to provide a financial incentive. Everyone rode bikes over there, and it was so pleasant to be in a situation where one could cycle to just about anywhere they wanted to go.

Having said that, Lance has gotten a lot of Americans back on the bike, and that's a good thing. Will it last? I'll keep riding. Beyond that, it's hard to say.

 

[barnstorm]

Talking about US success : Michael Johnson 100m, 200m and 400m athlete.
Is he ever mentioned Stateside?

The man is a near legend here in Europe.

Another great favourite is/was Pete Sampras.

Along with Tiger Woods I would have thought that these guys would have been in contention?

Sampras is often discussed as a possible best ever male tennis player and tennis gets a lot of coverage here. He is well known. Michael Johnson was very well known during his reign. Lot's of nike ads with him running in those gold shoes. The US cares little for endurance sports but sprinters get some love. Carl Lewis was quite popular too.

Limerick, your comment that the cancer would be the reason for the Lance popularity is spot on. That's why he is popular here. Very few people care much about what he has actually done in cycling and what that means. Beating cancer and winning anything is a big deal to americans. If you watch American olympic coverage, there is almost no coverage of the athletics, just one human interest story after another. The rower whose brother died in a war, the skater that beat diabetes, the swimmer who is an orphan. That's all you see here.

 

[sheckie]

Best American Athletes ever?
male, recent times:

Jim Ryan, mile runner
Gayle Sayers, football
Bob Hayes, fastest 100 m in world for long time
Bob Beamon, held long jump record for like a century
Sampras, tennis in terms # grand slams
Air Jordan, nuff said
Lance, broke Eddy Mercxkx tour record for petes sake
Eric freekin Heiden, MR 5 skating medals
Mark Spitz, swimmimg 22 gold medals or whatever

golf? is a game, like bowling, not a sport, only Tiger does conditioning and
training, those guys are crazy skilled but not athletes
Athlete no:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/12/22/gallery.siyear/content.2.html

Athlete yes:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/12/22/gallery.siyear/content.7.html

I forgot there are no overweight football players. Wake Up! Tiger is not the only golfer who trains. I could list 50 players who have personal trainers. They are definitley not in the same shape as professional cyclists, but some sports require a higher level of fitness than others, that's just they way it is.

 

[bobke]

I forgot there are no overweight football players. Wake Up! Tiger is not the only golfer who trains. I could list 50 players who have personal trainers. They are definitley not in the same shape as professional cyclists, but some sports require a higher level of fitness than others, that's just they way it is.

I could list fifty soccer moms with personal trainers too, he he.
Before Tiger, no one did stretching. resistance training etc.
How many books are there on the "mental" part of the golf game?
Like a million.
Then a bunch of books on the "swing."
Very few if any on strength, endurance, speed, training, etc the hallmarks of most real sports.
Just a thought, I really could not care less about golf or whether folks think its a sport.
Many retired folks play golf, not many retired folks do triathlons, crtiteriums, marathons, 5 K footraces, rugby, football, soccer, baseball etc etc. Golf is especially prized by older folks BECAUSE it is not strenuous.
And therefor, a polar opposite to real sport.
Of course the Olympics has flag dancing so who am I to say what is sport?

The original Olympics also had poetry and other arts however but I digress.

 

[Dini77]

Before Tiger, no one did stretching. resistance training etc..

Ever heard of a guy called Greg Norman (aka the Shark)? He was doing strength/conditioning training for 10 years before Tiger came along.

....Very few if any on strength, endurance, speed, training, etc the hallmarks of most real sports.
Just a thought, I really could not care less about golf or whether folks think its a sport.
Many retired folks play golf, not many retired folks do triathlons, crtiteriums, marathons, 5 K footraces, rugby, football, soccer, baseball etc etc. Golf is especially prized by older folks BECAUSE it is not strenuous.
And therefor, a polar opposite to real sport.

Interesting view of what constitutes a 'real' sport'. On your definition i'd say NFL and baseball are dubious 'real sports'. I'd say a pro golfer spends more time training (technique, strength, endurance) than both these sports - it's just a different form of training for a different overall requirement.

How do you define strenuous? Ever walked for 18 holes (4+ hrs) on a hot day? I ride 15hours a week and i'm stuffed after walking around for 18holes and definitely think it's strenuous - it's a different type of conditioning. Different sports have different requirements - golf is more weighted to the technical/mental aspect rather than 'aerobic' fitness, hence the # of books on those aspects. How many books are there on the mental/tactical side for cyclists? Does that mean we don't/shouldn't use our brains when racing?

On another note, here in Australia cycling (& triathlons for a time) are amongst the fastest growing recreational sports - huge increase in participation amongst older (& retired) population. More and more people switch to them as an alternative from 'impact' sports due to injuries and the fact that you can participate (quite competitively) for a long time.

 

[sheckie]

I could list fifty soccer moms with personal trainers too, he he.
Before Tiger, no one did stretching. resistance training etc.
How many books are there on the "mental" part of the golf game?
Like a million.
Then a bunch of books on the "swing."
Very few if any on strength, endurance, speed, training, etc the hallmarks of most real sports.
Just a thought, I really could not care less about golf or whether folks think its a sport.
Many retired folks play golf, not many retired folks do triathlons, crtiteriums, marathons, 5 K footraces, rugby, football, soccer, baseball etc etc. Golf is especially prized by older folks BECAUSE it is not strenuous.
And therefor, a polar opposite to real sport.
Of course the Olympics has flag dancing so who am I to say what is sport?

The original Olympics also had poetry and other arts however but I digress.

Dude you hit the nail on the head. All I am saying is that the definition of sport is very broad. We can argue back and forth but I am just sticking up for a game I love and under the definition it is a sport.By the way can you hit a golf ball over 300 yards straight on a regular basis? Trust me it takes athletic ability.

I must say I am enjoying this thread. It is interesting to get everones opinion of a sport. In the end no one is right or wrong anyway.


Entry Word: sport
Function: noun
Text: 1 activity engaged in to amuse oneself <I don't care terribly whether I actually catch any fish, as I'm just doing this for sport>

Right from Websters. Hmmm.....Fishing?

 

[bobke]

Dude you hit the nail on the head. All I am saying is that the definition of sport is very broad. We can argue back and forth but I am just sticking up for a game I love and under the definition it is a sport.By the way can you hit a golf ball over 300 yards straight on a regular basis? Trust me it takes athletic ability.

I must say I am enjoying this thread. It is interesting to get everones opinion of a sport. In the end no one is right or wrong anyway.


Entry Word: sport
Function: noun
Text: 1 activity engaged in to amuse oneself <I don't care terribly whether I actually catch any fish, as I'm just doing this for sport>

Right from Websters. Hmmm.....Fishing?

I doubt I could hit a golf ball 200 yards, so I suppose from that point of view you are right. There is a lot of skill involved in golf for sure and the same kind of mental game as tennis, only you take a shot every 5-10 minutes in golf, not every 1-3 seconds like tennis. Harder to get in and stay in the zone or flow state.

Wow, I must be in cycling withdraw to even write that ****.
Sheez.
Wont Milan San Remo ever come!?!?

 

[sheckie]

I doubt I could hit a golf ball 200 yards, so I suppose from that point of view you are right. There is a lot of skill involved in golf for sure and the same kind of mental game as tennis, only you take a shot every 5-10 minutes in golf, not every 1-3 seconds like tennis. Harder to get in and stay in the zone or flow state.

Wow, I must be in cycling withdraw to even write that ****.
Sheez.
Wont Milan San Remo ever come!?!?

I live in Canada! You don't have to tell me about cycling withdrawl. The trainer gets tough every day, but soon enough.

 

[noonievut]

Very few if any on strength, endurance, speed, training, etc the hallmarks of most real sports.
Just a thought, I really could not care less about golf or whether folks think its a sport.
Many retired folks play golf, not many retired folks do triathlons, crtiteriums, marathons, 5 K footraces, rugby, football, soccer, baseball etc etc. Golf is especially prized by older folks BECAUSE it is not strenuous.
And therefor, a polar opposite to real sport.
Of course the Olympics has flag dancing so who am I to say what is sport?

The original Olympics also had poetry and other arts however but I digress.

I think if you ask any 'successful' athlete the hallmark of their sport, the mental game would be right up there. That is usually what makes the difference between the best and the rest. Tiger is arguably the best not just because of his mental conditioning, but also because of his physical. I think I would say the same for Lance.