Ascension rates and power outputs

Discussion in 'Power Training' started by Alex Simmons, Jul 10, 2010.

  1. Alex Simmons

    Alex Simmons Member

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  2. SolarEnergy

    SolarEnergy New Member

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    Thanks Alex, all that is very interesting.
     
  3. bbrauer

    bbrauer New Member

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    Who is responsible for that 6.4 W/Kg 1 hour effort? Boardman?

    One of Lemond's arguments is that the levels of performance of top level cyclists exceed the highest theoretical VO2 max levels that a human can achieve. I don't know that he's enough of an authority in exercise physiology to say with any certitude what is the maximum VO2 a human can achieve, but one can calculate estimated VO2 from power to weight. I did that once with Lance's time trail up L'Alpe in 04, and I think I came up with a figure around 83.....very high, but not implausible for one of the best endurance athletes in the world.

    My main difficulty with setting some sort of limit on human performance to judge "plausibility" is just that, it sets a limit on human performance. There was a time when breaking the 4 minute mile was considered not only implausible, but impossible.
     
  4. Alex Simmons

    Alex Simmons Member

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    But ignores the two other primary variables: metabolic efficiency and the % of VO2max one can sustain at threshold, which can and do vary between individuals, and the latter is also highly trainable.
     
  5. bbrauer

    bbrauer New Member

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    Not contesting....and I agree with you, and find Lemond's idea of using power improvement as a way to red flag potential cheaters as flawed for this reason, as well as a host of others.
     
  6. 11ring

    11ring New Member

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    Is the latter that variable at the super elite level ?

    As in, the very best athletes will be at threshold around 88-89% of Vo2max, which is probably near the limit of human potential. You may see some push 90, maybe 91 or so but not much more is physiologically possible. Of course there is very big scope for variation downwards.
     
  7. lanierb

    lanierb New Member

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    Nice post Alex. Measurement is a real issue. However, I think the problem with Lemond's idea is even more fundamental: you can't use performance itself to detect cheating. You need to measure at least two variables to separate out who is best from who is cheating.

    IMO Lemond just wants to argue (indirectly) that anyone who is faster than he was must be doping.
     
  8. Alex Simmons

    Alex Simmons Member

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    It's still trainable but yes, the super fit have less head room to play with.
     
  9. smaryka

    smaryka Member

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    Well considering Lemond wasn't a doper and nearly every guy who came after him was, he's not exactly wrong there. :D
     
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