Australian team pursuit team tests positive

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Ilan Vardi, Aug 3, 2003.

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  1. Ilan Vardi

    Ilan Vardi Guest

    They broke the world record by over 2 seconds, and gave no explanation other than talent and hard
    work. Therefore, they fail the Le Monde drug test.

    -ilan
     
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  2. "Andrew McDonald" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > [email protected] (Ilan Vardi) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > > They broke the world record by over 2 seconds, and gave no explanation other than talent and
    > > hard work. Therefore, they fail the Le Monde drug
    test.
    > >
    > > -ilan
    >
    > And by Athens 2004 they predict the winning time to be 3.55 - a further 2 seconds off.
    >

    I saw that and was thinking it was a bold statement.

    When I saw 3:57, my immediate thought was: "Is 285m an optimal length for a pull?"

    Nevertheless, most pursuit and kilo records have been set on indoor (wood) tracks, Athens is
    outdoors (although I just read that they are planning to cover it for the Olympics). I've not had
    the pleasure to visit Athens, but it is reputed to be one of the more air polluted cities in the
    world. OTOH, humid air is faster than dry air and I believe Athens has fairly high humidity.

    Other factors are that the Athens track was built by Ron Webb, who also built the Superdome in
    Adelaide, the home of the AIS track squad. They are both 250m tracks and if Athens was built to the
    same specs as Adelaide, then it is more of a pursuiter's track than a sprinters' (fairly wide bends
    and short straights), so performance assessments could be made on that basis.

    Lastly, I don't know what kind of effect weathering has on the track surface, i.e. making it faster
    as it ages or slower, but the Athens track is at least 10 years old.
     
  3. Warren

    Warren Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, Carl Sundquist <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Lastly, I don't know what kind of effect weathering has on the track surface, i.e. making it
    > faster as it ages or slower, but the Athens track is at least 10 years old.

    I believe the wood used is the super-hard asezia (spelling?) wood, much harder than pine.

    -WG
     
  4. Howard Kveck

    Howard Kveck Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, "Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Other factors are that the Athens track was built by Ron Webb, who also built the Superdome in
    > Adelaide, the home of the AIS track squad. They are both 250m tracks and if Athens was built to
    > the same specs as Adelaide, then it is more of a pursuiter's track than a sprinters' (fairly wide
    > bends and short straights), so performance assessments could be made on that basis.

    Would that track configuration tend to be better for all the strictly timed
    events? I imagine events like points are affected the same way as the sprints...

    --
    tanx, Howard

    Read. Think. Type. Send.

    remove YOUR SHOES to reply, k?

    For some people, quantity IS quality...
     
  5. "Howard Kveck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, "Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > Other factors are that the Athens track was built by Ron Webb, who also built the Superdome in
    > > Adelaide, the home of the AIS track squad. They
    are
    > > both 250m tracks and if Athens was built to the same specs as Adelaide,
    then
    > > it is more of a pursuiter's track than a sprinters' (fairly wide bends
    and
    > > short straights), so performance assessments could be made on that
    basis.
    >
    > Would that track configuration tend to be better for all the strictly
    timed
    > events? I imagine events like points are affected the same way as the
    sprints...

    IMO, although yes, a points race is affected by track configuration, it is to a lesser degree when
    compared to match sprints. Much of the tactics in points racing is done off the front.
     
  6. "Howard Kveck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, "Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > Other factors are that the Athens track was built by Ron Webb, who also built the Superdome in
    > > Adelaide, the home of the AIS track squad. They
    are
    > > both 250m tracks and if Athens was built to the same specs as Adelaide,
    then
    > > it is more of a pursuiter's track than a sprinters' (fairly wide bends
    and
    > > short straights), so performance assessments could be made on that
    basis.
    >
    > Would that track configuration tend to be better for all the strictly
    timed
    > events? I imagine events like points are affected the same way as the
    sprints...
    >

    IMO, generally yes, but literally no. What I mean is that for the 500m, kilo, and all pursuits I
    believe it is a faster design (although there was a thread last winter or sometime last year
    discussing speed through the bends with the centerpoint of the bike/body mass having a slightly
    smaller radius than the wheels on the track surface and the effects thereof).

    My reference to literally is that the 200m TT is part of the sprint tournament, and slightly longer
    straights and a more pronounced downhill on the transition from the end of the bend to the straight
    at the top of the track are more suited to faster 200m times.

    Because the points race is a massed start, multiple scoring opportunity event, the tactics for
    sprinting are pretty much different match sprints, even the 4-up 5th-8th place race tactics aren't
    really the same as points race sprints. I think tracks like Athens (bigger turns, shorter
    straights) are probably easier for points races because after a while, the compression of your body
    on your arms (and crotch to some degree) from the bends is fatiguing. Larger radius bends reduce
    that effect slightly.
     
  7. Howard Kveck

    Howard Kveck Guest

    In article <030820032203339142%[email protected]>, warren <[email protected]> wrote:

    > I believe the wood used is the super-hard asezia (spelling?) wood, much harder than pine.
    >
    > -WG

    This got the woodworker side of me curious, but I couldn't identify the wood you mention, or find
    a site that went into detail on the Athens track. Have you got a reference? I wonder how fast a
    track could be if it was made out of eastern maple (rock maple is a common nickname for that):
    very tight grain and it is hard as rock.

    --
    tanx, Howard

    remove YOUR SHOES to reply, k?
     
  8. Howard Kveck

    Howard Kveck Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, "Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > "Howard Kveck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > Would that track configuration tend to be better for all the strictly
    > timed
    > > events? I imagine events like points are affected the same way as the
    > sprints...
    > >
    >
    > My reference to literally is that the 200m TT is part of the sprint tournament, and slightly
    > longer straights and a more pronounced downhill on the transition from the end of the bend to the
    > straight at the top of the track are more suited to faster 200m times.
    >
    > Because the points race is a massed start, multiple scoring opportunity event, the tactics for
    > sprinting are pretty much different match sprints, even the 4-up 5th-8th place race tactics aren't
    > really the same as points race sprints. I think tracks like Athens (bigger turns, shorter
    > straights) are probably easier for points races because after a while, the compression of your
    > body on your arms (and crotch to some degree) from the bends is fatiguing. Larger radius bends
    > reduce that effect slightly.

    So riding a long points race at a track like Ghent or Antwerp (132m!) would get to be pretty
    brutal, right? Are you at all familiar with the shape of the Athens track? How does it compare to
    Frisco (besides being the same length and similar banking)?

    --
    tanx, Howard

    remove YOUR SHOES to reply, k?
     
  9. "Howard Kveck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article <030820032203339142%[email protected]>, warren <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > I believe the wood used is the super-hard asezia (spelling?) wood, much harder than pine.
    > >
    > > -WG
    >
    > This got the woodworker side of me curious, but I couldn't identify the
    wood
    > you mention, or find a site that went into detail on the Athens track.
    Have you
    > got a reference? I wonder how fast a track could be if it was made out of eastern maple (rock
    > maple is a common nickname for that): very tight grain
    and
    > it is hard as rock.
    >

    I believe the correct spelling is afzelia. You might get more information at
    http://www.velodromes.com/ .
     
  10. Carl Sundquist

    Carl Sundquist New Member

    Joined:
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  11. Gary K

    Gary K Guest

    Looks like such a drug test has been performed by journo Giancarlo Ceruti of La Gazzetta
    Dello Sport.

    Last article: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/aug03/aug06news

    Its because Italy failed to win a medal.

    Ilan Vardi <[email protected]> wrote:

    > They broke the world record by over 2 seconds, and gave no explanation other than talent and hard
    > work. Therefore, they fail the Le Monde drug test.
    >
    > -ilan
     
  12. Howard Kveck

    Howard Kveck Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, Carl Sundquist
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > I've only ridden three really short tracks -- the INSEP training track in Paris (166m), a portable
    > track in Buenos Aires, and the Vandedrome.
    >

    Thanks for the very thorough info, Carl. I could easily see that the track in BA would have been
    pretty hectic with a few people on it.

    --
    tanx, Howard

    "The new way is the old way, 'cuz we know it all by heart..."
    the Suicide Commandos

    remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?
     
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