Basso admits involvement in doping scandal



gplama said:
Mike Tomalaris and Gabrielle Gatte? Please please please please!!! ;)
wot, no Left Bank...errr Southbank pics of accordian players in a beret, it will never be the same?
 
On May 8, 1:56 pm, alex <[email protected]> wrote:
> May 8, 2007 - 11:18AM
>
> Italian cycling star Ivan Basso admitted to the anti-doping prosecutor
> of the Italian Olympic Committee (CONI) on Monday that he was involved
> in the Operation Puerto blood doping scandal.
>
> ..... and so on..
>
> http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/tour-favourite-admits-involvement-in...
>
> Its that time of year again. Who else is going to be yanked from le
> tour?


If he's admitted it, it's hardly being yanked, it seems fair enough.
It wasn't fair last year when nothing was proven, but this changes
things considerably.

Could be a very interesting Tour for Mick Rogers and Cadel Evans ...
 
rooman said:
wot, no Left Bank...errr Southbank pics of accordian players in a beret, it will never be the same?

How about some reality, like cookery tips *live* from Fountain Gate Krispy Kreme?

Or even more budget-conscious, for Stage 5, SBS go live to Beer Can Hill where Bikesoiler & moi are cooking up a storm with popcorn, sampling the latest batch of wheat bier homebrew and pushing the cats off the lounge.
 
Bleve wrote:
> On May 8, 1:56 pm, alex <[email protected]> wrote:
>> May 8, 2007 - 11:18AM
>>
>> Italian cycling star Ivan Basso admitted to the anti-doping prosecutor
>> of the Italian Olympic Committee (CONI) on Monday that he was involved
>> in the Operation Puerto blood doping scandal.
>>
>> ..... and so on..
>>
>> http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/tour-favourite-admits-involvement-in...
>>
>> Its that time of year again. Who else is going to be yanked from le
>> tour?

>
> If he's admitted it, it's hardly being yanked, it seems fair enough.
> It wasn't fair last year when nothing was proven, but this changes
> things considerably.
>
> Could be a very interesting Tour for Mick Rogers and Cadel Evans ...
>


Toot, toooot. chugga, chugga, chugga, chugga. That's the sound of the
Cadel train leaving. This year I'm getting on the Mick Rogers train.

DaveB
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Bleve <[email protected]> wrote:

> He's admitted involvement. I'd call that proof.


I'd call it a confession, not proof. Was the evidence so overwhelming,
or had he just had enough of it all?

--
Shane Stanley
 
Shane Stanley said:
In article <[email protected]>,
Bleve <[email protected]> wrote:

> He's admitted involvement. I'd call that proof.


I'd call it a confession, not proof. Was the evidence so overwhelming,
or had he just had enough of it all?

--
Shane Stanley
No need to even ask such a question. In the absence of good reason to impugn the confession (you know - duress, insanity, [x] years served at Guantanamo Bay .. ..), the law recognises that no further proof is required. The confession taken as the ultimate, unimpeachable proof.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
monsterman <[email protected]> wrote:

> In the absence of good reason to
> impugn the confession (you know - duress, insanity, [x] years served at
> Guantanamo Bay .. ..), the law recognises that no _further_ proof is
> required.


I guess I was trying to point out that it looks like being yet another
guilty verdict without proof in the form of a failed doping control.

--
Shane Stanley
 
Shane Stanley said:
I guess I was trying to point out that it looks like being yet another
guilty verdict without proof in the form of a failed doping control.

--
Shane Stanley
Aaaahhhhh ..... ...... .....but the failed doping controls seem to be the most impeachable of all "proof". You just wheel out the white coat brigade (the contrarian variety being seemingly available on any street corner) and challenge the testing science / false positive rates / chain of custody / disappearing chimera theories / testosterone genesis / Landis gumf blah blah / BelieveTyler **** blah blah ... ... and all our eyes start to glaze over. Forensic science of the medical variery ain't 10% as sexy as Gil Grisham and his team of dedicated well-resourced colleagues would have us believe:rolleyes:

One confession from the pointy end of the pro peleton will have 1000 times the impact (in the public arena) as 100 failed doping controls. Its the only kind of proof that we all must value. :eek:

Now if Tyler would just come clean, Ekimov gets his gold and Mick Rogers gets a bronze ... ... ...
 
On Tue, 08 May 2007 17:53:14 +1000, Shane Stanley wrote:

> I'd call it a confession, not proof. Was the evidence so overwhelming,
> or had he just had enough of it all?


Perhaps he thought he might get a shorter ban if he confessed rather than
waiting to be caught by a DNA match, or that some team might be more
willing to pick him up afterwards.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw
 
Michael Warner said:
On Tue, 08 May 2007 17:53:14 +1000, Shane Stanley wrote:

> I'd call it a confession, not proof. Was the evidence so overwhelming,
> or had he just had enough of it all?


Perhaps he thought he might get a shorter ban if he confessed rather than
waiting to be caught by a DNA match, or that some team might be more
willing to pick him up afterwards.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw
CONI think he should , and want him to be supported and "not left alone", ie stood by, (not harrassed). UCI's McQuaid on the other hand thinks he shouldnt have any reduction in penalty for his admission (Quoting WADA rules).

So I guess he will get 2 years, and then return to a non pro tour team. unless CAS action gets a reduction. Amore e Vita have said they are interested in him and support him breaking the omerta code that they said had existed in ProCycling.
Tonight Basso said he "confessed to "attempted to dope" not that he ever did dope, and he states he is aware an to attempt to dope is "tantamount to" doping.

Nothing has come out yet from him on what they were trying to achieve in the blood bag , whether it was oxygenated, super fortified, or what..."just attempted"... maybe in a day or so Jan will come out of the cupboard too, or it will become clearer to us what they were "attempting" to do and that might throw some light on all the other names and those outside cycling that we have been told exist but havnt been ID'd ( footballers, athletes etc)...

the plot thickens...
 
On May 8, 10:09 pm, monsterman <monsterman.2q9...@no-
mx.forums.cyclingforums.com> wrote:
Forensic science of the medical variery
> ain't 10% as sexy as Gil Grisham and his team of dedicated
> well-resourced colleagues would have us believe:rolleyes:


You must be wrong - these shows seem to have taken over from the legal
dramas, thank heavens. White coats give me much more of a horn than
f*cken lawyers do - except MM and SteveA, of course ;)

Donga
 
Donga said:
White coats give me much more of a horn than
f*cken lawyers do - except MM and SteveA, of course ;)

Donga
Freud would draw a line between that statement and your unnatural affinity for goal umpires:D
 
In article <[email protected]>,
rooman <[email protected]> wrote:

> Amore e Vita have said they are
> interested in him and support him breaking the omerta code that they
> said had existed in ProCycling.


Judging by the latest quotes, the code looks safe: "I want to clarify
that I was not asked about the other people involved, further, I don't
know of riders or other people involved."

Although he did throw a little mud indirectly: "I can't vouch for the
honour of my colleagues, who wins honestly, like I have always done." A
year of dishonest denials, including presumably false legal declarations
to Discovery, and now a holier-than-them proclamation of honesty.
Self-delusion is an amazing thing.

> Nothing has come out yet from him on what they were trying to achieve
> in the blood bag , whether it was -oxygenated, super fortified-, or
> what..


I'm waiting for the Japanese whaling defence...

--
Shane Stanley
 
On Wed, 09 May 2007 08:58:49 +1000, Shane Stanley wrote:

> I'm waiting for the Japanese whaling defence...


Norwegian cyclists are doing it, and Micronesia thinks it's ok?

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw
 
Shane Stanley said:
In article <[email protected]>,
rooman <[email protected]> wrote:

> Amore e Vita have said they are
> interested in him and support him breaking the omerta code that they
> said had existed in ProCycling.


Judging by the latest quotes, the code looks safe: "I want to clarify
that I was not asked about the other people involved, further, I don't
know of riders or other people involved."

Although he did throw a little mud indirectly: "I can't vouch for the
honour of my colleagues, who wins honestly, like I have always done." A
year of dishonest denials, including presumably false legal declarations
to Discovery, and now a holier-than-them proclamation of honesty.
Self-delusion is an amazing thing.

> Nothing has come out yet from him on what they were trying to achieve
> in the blood bag , whether it was -oxygenated, super fortified-, or
> what..


I'm waiting for the Japanese whaling defence...

--
Shane Stanley
love that...."yeah its all for research you honour, we had to know what the effects were and you can't do that unless you are in a real race...errr hunting & killing live whales in the Southern Ocean and eating them in school canteens in Japan"...good analogy SS.

interesting how during this past year they interpret it (as riders and as team managers)...seems he (Basso) and Discovery had a pact according to what Johan said too... words like "he would ride with us whilst he could assure us he wouldnt be "found" guilty of a doping offence"..put the onus on Ivan and seems to be have adopted a "wash " hands of it..."we didnt know, Ivan had to assure us he wouldnt be found guilty, and when he no longer could do that he had to leave the team...." great, stick head in sand becuase he just might win a race and get away with it...

Now I know why Discovery are distancing themsleves from these "heroes"...I guess they and US Postal saw Lance's 7 years as lucky beyond belief and it couldn't last...

Hopefully now its time for the Aussie train to conquer the world with clean riding and bloody hard work, tenacity and tuff stuff as shown by Stuey in P-R.
MR is well placed, CE is still working at it but may just hit the podium in LeTour this year if Lotto protect him and he rides those climbs many times between now and July. Even in the future Simon gerrans, he is a great talent and a nice guy to boot, sad about his leaving the Tour of Romandie after the prologue... I hope he's mending and out and about soon, which leads me to....

OT, but its about survival in a big ocean....Bets for the Giro?, sadly some good Aussie riders are stuck in the domestiqe role, but I reckon given a chance Matty Lloyd and Will Walker will equip themselves well...though, I think they will be used and ground into the road by their team's demands to protect and set up leaders. They will have to wait "do time" in the peleton down the years....but watch out...down the track these guys can shine, they have great talent and tough heads.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
rooman <[email protected]> wrote:

> I guess they and US Postal saw Lance's 7 years as lucky
> beyond belief and it couldn't last...


And yet it so easily could have. The technology was clearly staying
ahead of the testers most of the time, and it was only action by
non-sporting authorities that produced any real evidence. What would the
situation be today if the Spanish police had decided what Fuentes was
doing was none of their business?

I feel some sympathy for Basso because I don't believe these guys do
this stuff without a nod and a wink, or at least a blind eye, from the
teams. But playing the victim sounds a bit pathetic after nearly a
year's denials. There's this thing called credibility...

--
Shane Stanley
 

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