beginning to see achink of light

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I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung (with all
due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be unable to further
support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for it'. I find this a
curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal brains used this argument
the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems to welcome open debate and
dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial case for Buddhism and it's
teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view to advising me as I have an
interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail. Can you advise please Mozz?
 
Searching for the truth wrote:

> I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung (with
> all due respect...

...nothing could be further from the truth.

Witness the gift of truth discernment at work :)

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

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Hi,

Thanks for the kind words of support.

I am glad I seem to represent the dharma in a way that seems fair.

Sure, I will email you some information. No problem.

Regards,

>I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung (with
>all due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be unable to
>further support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for it'. I find this
>a curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal brains used this argument
>the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems to welcome open debate and
>dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial case for Buddhism and it's
>teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view to advising me as I have an
>interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail. Can you advise please Mozz?
 
[email protected] (Searching for the truth) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung (with
> all due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be unable to
> further support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for it'. I find
> this a curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal brains used this
> argument the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems to welcome open
> debate and dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial case for Buddhism and
> it's teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view to advising me as I have
> an interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail.

If you intend to insult the ethnicity of your interlocutor as a way to promote Buddhism, you would
have got it wrong the other way around.

FP

Can you
> advise please Mozz?
 
francispoon wrote:

> [email protected] (Searching for the truth) wrote in message
> news:<[email protected]>...
> > I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung (with
> > all due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be unable to
> > further support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for it'. I find
> > this a curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal brains used this
> > argument the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems to welcome open
> > debate and dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial case for Buddhism
> > and it's teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view to advising me as I
> > have an interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail.
>
> If you intend to insult the ethnicity of your interlocutor as a way to promote Buddhism, you would
> have got it wrong the other way around.
>
> FP

Sounds like you also have the gift of truth discernment, Francis :)

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

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Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

> francispoon wrote:
>
>
>>[email protected] (Searching for the truth) wrote in message
>>news:<[email protected]>...
>>
>>>I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung (with
>>>all due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be unable to
>>>further support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for it'. I find
>>>this a curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal brains used this
>>>argument the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems to welcome open
>>>debate and dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial case for Buddhism
>>>and it's teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view to advising me as I
>>>have an interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail.
>>
>>If you intend to insult the ethnicity of your interlocutor as a way to promote Buddhism, you would
>>have got it wrong the other way around.
>>
>>FP
>
> Sounds like you also have the gift of truth discernment, Francis :)

<LOL> Anyone who agrees with Chung has "the gift of truth discernment," Francis. It's unfortunately
a rather debased currency in Chung's hands.

Of course, ethnic slurs have no place in civil discourse. But I recall Chung & Co. talking about
Jews in rather an unpleasant way.

Ah, well...

Bob
 
Why on earth should you all leap to the conclusion that Francis is insulting anyones ethnicity???

The expression 'a chink of light' is a quite common term used to express the dawning of a new
understanding, or vision etc... Another similar term would be 'a chink in the armour' to express a
weakness in a defense.

It says more about what is in others minds than Francis's! Oh dear oh dear...

Respectfully,

On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:34:41 -0500, "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email protected]> wrote:

>francispoon wrote:
>
>> [email protected] (Searching for the truth) wrote in message
>> news:<[email protected]>...
>> > I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung
>> > (with all due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be
>> > unable to further support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for
>> > it'. I find this a curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal
>> > brains used this argument the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems
>> > to welcome open debate and dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial
>> > case for Buddhism and it's teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view
>> > to advising me as I have an interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail.
>>
>> If you intend to insult the ethnicity of your interlocutor as a way to promote Buddhism, you
>> would have got it wrong the other way around.
>>
>> FP
>
>Sounds like you also have the gift of truth discernment, Francis :)
>
>
>
>Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
>
>Andrew
 
I apologise - I meant to say Julie instead of Francis.

On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 15:45:01 +0000, Mozz <[email protected]> wrote:

>Why on earth should you all leap to the conclusion that Francis is insulting anyones ethnicity???
>
>The expression 'a chink of light' is a quite common term used to express the dawning of a new
>understanding, or vision etc... Another similar term would be 'a chink in the armour' to express a
>weakness in a defense.
>
>It says more about what is in others minds than Francis's! Oh dear oh dear...
>
>Respectfully,

>
>On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:34:41 -0500, "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>francispoon wrote:
>>
>>> [email protected] (Searching for the truth) wrote in message
>>> news:<[email protected]>...
>>> > I have read the dialogue between Dr Chung and Mozz very carefully. I observe that Dr.Chung
>>> > (with all due respect) consistently reaches a point in his argument whereby he seems to be
>>> > unable to further support his reasoning and therefore suggests that Mozz 'takes his word for
>>> > it'. I find this a curious suggestion from one who professes to 'know' "God". If our legal
>>> > brains used this argument the justice system would collapse round our ears. Whereas Mozz seems
>>> > to welcome open debate and dissent whilst successfully offering what I view as a substantial
>>> > case for Buddhism and it's teachings. Might I invite Mozz to contact me directly with the view
>>> > to advising me as I have an interest in pursuing Buddhism in more detail.
>>>
>>> If you intend to insult the ethnicity of your interlocutor as a way to promote Buddhism, you
>>> would have got it wrong the other way around.
>>>
>>> FP
>>
>>Sounds like you also have the gift of truth discernment, Francis :)
>>
>>
>>
>>Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
>>
>>Andrew
 
Mozz wrote:

> Why on earth should you all leap to the conclusion that Francis is insulting anyones ethnicity???
>

When is discerning the truth insulting except to the untruthful?

>
> The expression 'a chink of light' is a quite common term used to express the dawning of a new
> understanding, or vision etc...

I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this phrase with "a beam of light" or "a ray
of light."

>
> Another similar term would be 'a chink in the armour' to express a weakness in a defense.
>

Similarly uncommon.

>
> It says more about what is in others minds than Francis's! Oh dear oh dear...
>

Would the Dalai Lama approve of your behavior, Mozz?

I think not.

This does not bode well for your dharma, Mozz.

Jesus is more forgiving.

You remain in my prayers, neighbor.

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
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On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 12:36:16 -0500, "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"
<[email protected]> wrote:

^Mozz wrote: ^ ^> Why on earth should you all leap to the conclusion that Francis is ^> insulting
anyones ethnicity??? ^> ^ ^When is discerning the truth insulting except to the untruthful?

It isn't -- it's just a silly concept, this oracular "gift" of "truth discernment" you claim to
have. You've probably been lied to quite successfully many times.

^ ^> ^> The expression 'a chink of light' is a quite common term used to ^> express the dawning of a
new understanding, or vision etc... ^ ^I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this
phrase with "a beam of light" or "a ray of light."

I've heard it before. Webster's Dictionary defines "chink" as "a narrow opening." A "chink in the
armor" is an old expression. "Chink of light" is somewhat less common, meaning a narrow opening
through which light can be seen. It unfortunately is also a homonym for a particular ethnic slur. I
don't think Julie meant it in that insulting way, however.

^ ^> ^> Another similar term would be 'a chink in the armour' to express a ^> weakness in a defense.
^> ^ ^Similarly uncommon.

I've heard it quite a lot.

^ ^> ^> It says more about what is in others minds than Francis's! Oh dear oh ^> dear... ^> ^ ^Would
the Dalai Lama approve of your behavior, Mozz?

Sure he would. He knows enough English to know the meaning of that expression.

^ ^I think not. ^ ^This does not bode well for your dharma, Mozz. ^ ^Jesus is more forgiving.

And I suppose he will forgive you for having the arrogance to claim a "gift of truth discernment."
It shows a distinct lack of humility.

^ ^You remain in my prayers, neighbor. ^ ^ ^Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

This person obviously doesn't mind having an egotistical servant who thinks he is a walking
lie detector.

^ ^Andrew
 
In article <[email protected]>, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD says...
>
>>
>I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this phrase with "a beam of light" or "a ray
>of light."
>
No confusion. The same meaning as a "beam of light", at least according the the dictionary.

Here is the Merriman Webster reference on-line.

Main Entry: 1chink Pronunciation: 'chi[ng]k Function: noun Etymology: probably alteration of Middle
English chine crack, fissure
1 : a small cleft, slit, or fissure
2 : a weak spot that may leave one vulnerable
3 : a narrow beam of light shining through a chink

Mark
 
On 3 Mar 2004 13:21:18 -0800, Mark Filice
<[email protected]> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD says...
>>
>>>
>>I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this phrase with "a beam of light" or "a ray
>>of light."
>>
>No confusion. The same meaning as a "beam of light", at least according the the dictionary.
>
>Here is the Merriman Webster reference on-line.
>
>Main Entry: 1chink Pronunciation: 'chi[ng]k Function: noun Etymology: probably alteration of Middle
>English chine crack, fissure
>1 : a small cleft, slit, or fissure
>2 : a weak spot that may leave one vulnerable
>3 : a narrow beam of light shining through a chink

Had you looked a little further - the dictionary contained within Google you would have discovered:

Chink
n. Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for person of Chinese birth or descent.

What we appear to have here is actually a sly pun - and a not very nice one, although possibly
inadvertant, but this being USENET, probably not.

John
 
On 2 Mar 2004 16:33:17 -0800, [email protected] (Searching for
the truth) wrote (in part):

>beginning to see achink of light

..............

Please, the above phraseology - given that Dr. Chung is of oriental extraction - is either
unfortunate or mean-spirited.

If it is unfortunate, then a simple "I didn't even think about a possible double-meaning; sorry if I
inadvertently offended anyone" would be greatly appreciated.

If it is a mean-spirited pun, then whether or not Dr. Chung takes offense, as a participant on this
newsgroup I personally take offense that one of us would choose to refer to another in such a
manner. Shame on you.

stephen nagler
 
Mark Filice wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD says...
> >
> >>
> >I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this phrase with "a beam of light" or "a
> >ray of light."
> >
> No confusion. The same meaning as a "beam of light", at least according the the dictionary.
>
> Here is the Merriman Webster reference on-line.
>
> Main Entry: 1chink Pronunciation: 'chi[ng]k Function: noun Etymology: probably alteration of
> Middle English chine crack, fissure
> 1 : a small cleft, slit, or fissure
> 2 : a weak spot that may leave one vulnerable
> 3 : a narrow beam of light shining through a chink
>

Then the phrase "chink of light" is redundant because it would be analogous to saying:

"a narrow beam of light of light"

No wonder I've not ever heard this phrase before.

The truth is simpler.

Again, witness how effectively God's gift of truth discernment works.

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
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Richard Lucarno wrote:

> On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 12:36:16 -0500, "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> ^Mozz wrote: ^ ^> Why on earth should you all leap to the conclusion that Francis is ^> insulting
> anyones ethnicity??? ^> ^ ^When is discerning the truth insulting except to the untruthful?
>
> It isn't -- it's just a silly concept, this oracular "gift" of "truth discernment" you claim to
> have. You've probably been lied to quite successfully many times.

Lies are never successful. The only person deceived by the deceiver is himself/herself.

> ^> The expression 'a chink of light' is a quite common term used to ^> express the dawning of a
> new understanding, or vision etc... ^ ^I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this
> phrase with "a beam of light" or "a ray of light."
>
> I've heard it before. Webster's Dictionary defines "chink" as "a narrow opening." A "chink in the
> armor" is an old expression. "Chink of light" is somewhat less common, meaning a narrow opening
> through which light can be seen. It unfortunately is also a homonym for a particular ethnic slur.
> I don't think Julie meant it in that insulting way, however.

Julie has not denied it.

> ^> Another similar term would be 'a chink in the armour' to express a ^> weakness in a defense.
> ^Similarly uncommon.
>
> I've heard it quite a lot.
>

Perhaps they wear more armour where you live.

>
> ^> It says more about what is in others minds than Francis's! Oh dear oh ^> dear... ^> ^ ^Would
> the Dalai Lama approve of your behavior, Mozz?
>
> Sure he would. He knows enough English to know the meaning of that expression.
>

Perhaps. But what about Mozz's behavior?

Would the Dalai Lama believe Mozz is closer or farther away from enlightenment?

>
> ^ ^I think not. ^ ^This does not bode well for your dharma, Mozz. ^ ^Jesus is more forgiving.
>
> And I suppose he will forgive you for having the arrogance to claim a "gift of truth discernment."

Being truthful is not a sin.

> It shows a distinct lack of humility.
>

Using one's gifts to glorify God rather than oneself is an expression of humility.

>
> ^ ^You remain in my prayers, neighbor. ^ ^ ^Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
>
> This person obviously doesn't mind having an egotistical servant who thinks he is a walking lie
> detector.
>

The untruthful can't help but hate lie detectors.

You will be in my prayers, neighbor.

May you accept Christ as your Lord and Savior, someday, so that you too can be more truthful.

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

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Dear Andrew,

Perhaps it is now the time for us to close our current 'discussion' ? The remarks below are so
unwaranted from any genuine attempt or wish to understand my spiritual practices that I cannot see
any helpful way to proceed.

>Perhaps. But what about Mozz's behavior?
>
>Would the Dalai Lama believe Mozz is closer or farther away from enlightenment?

You are suggesting that my 'behaviour' for some reason is antithetical to dharma practice yet give
no reasonable illustration as to why this might be the case. I can only conclude that anything I say
to you is in your terms invalid of integrity, therefore pointless.

Have not you heard 'blessed are the peace makers'?

Respectfully,

Mozz x
 
In article <[email protected]>, John says...
>

>>1 : a small cleft, slit, or fissure
>>2 : a weak spot that may leave one vulnerable
>>3 : a narrow beam of light shining through a chink
>
>Had you looked a little further - the dictionary contained within Google you would have discovered:
>
>Chink
>n. Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for person of Chinese birth or descent.
>
Why look any further than Merriman-Webster?

I certainly know that the word does have negative connotations, but didn't feel the need to
bring it up.

It is a small cleft, slit, or fissure.

Dictionary.com has 10 meanings for the word and it's variations. It has the derogatory
definition as well.

The first one is (which is typically the primary definition):

A narrow opening, such as a crack or fissure.

Mark
 
John wrote:

> On 3 Mar 2004 13:21:18 -0800, Mark Filice <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >In article <[email protected]>, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD says...
> >>
> >>>
> >>I've never heard it before. Perhaps you are confusing this phrase with "a beam of light" or "a
> >>ray of light."
> >>
> >No confusion. The same meaning as a "beam of light", at least according the the dictionary.
> >
> >Here is the Merriman Webster reference on-line.
> >
> >Main Entry: 1chink Pronunciation: 'chi[ng]k Function: noun Etymology: probably alteration of
> >Middle English chine crack, fissure
> >1 : a small cleft, slit, or fissure
> >2 : a weak spot that may leave one vulnerable
> >3 : a narrow beam of light shining through a chink
>
> Had you looked a little further - the dictionary contained within Google you would have
> discovered:
>
> Chink
> n. Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for person of Chinese birth or descent.
>
> What we appear to have here is actually a sly pun - and a not very nice one, although possibly
> inadvertant, but this being USENET, probably not.
>
> John

It seems that you also have the gift of truth discernment :)

And someone claimed that such gifts were rare.

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
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Mark Filice wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, John says...
> >
>
> >>1 : a small cleft, slit, or fissure
> >>2 : a weak spot that may leave one vulnerable
> >>3 : a narrow beam of light shining through a chink
> >
> >Had you looked a little further - the dictionary contained within Google you would have
> >discovered:
> >
> >Chink
> >n. Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for person of Chinese birth or descent.
> >
> Why look any further than Merriman-Webster?
>

To discern the truth.

> I certainly know that the word does have negative connotations, but didn't feel the need to
> bring it up.
>

Was already brought up by Francis.

>
> It is a small cleft, slit, or fissure.
>
> Dictionary.com has 10 meanings for the word and it's variations. It has the derogatory definition
> as well.
>
> The first one is (which is typically the primary definition):
>
> A narrow opening, such as a crack or fissure.
>
> Mark

Julie's absence from this is quite telling.

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

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Hi Mozz,

Mozz wrote:

> Perhaps it is now the time for us to close our current 'discussion' ?

This thread probably should not have started in the first place.

> The remarks below are so unwaranted from any genuine attempt or wish to understand my spiritual
> practices that I cannot see any helpful way to proceed.

Your participation in this particular thread casts much doubt on your spiritual practices.

> >Perhaps. But what about Mozz's behavior?
> >
> >Would the Dalai Lama believe Mozz is closer or farther away from enlightenment?
>
> You are suggesting that my 'behaviour' for some reason is antithetical to dharma practice yet give
> no reasonable illustration as to why this might be the case.

It remains a fair question.

> I can only conclude that anything I say to you is in your terms invalid of integrity, therefore
> pointless.

Do you have integrity, Mozz?

> Have not you heard 'blessed are the peace makers'?

I have.

>
> Respectfully,
>
> Mozz x

You remain in my prayers to God, neighbor.

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
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