Best investment? Coach/Power Meter/HRM

[Sillyoldtwit]

I am shocked that you said this, Tyson.

What do you think that RDO was doing?

He was coaching you...

The only differences were that you were not paying for the service and it was public...

One of the most critical aspects of coaching is being able to get inside your athlete's head and find out what makes him/her tick. This will enable you to coach them better and help them improve.

Tell me that Paul doesn't know what makes you tick and how to direct you to help you improve your cycling...

I think we all have an idea. Because it was public...

I am not saying this is a bad thing. I just think you are not understanding what was happening...

Jim

Our posts crossed Jim, but I think you misunderstood me somewhere along the line. Of course RD has been coaching me and I have expressed my gratitude on many an occasion, and I think I've made this clear in a post a few minutes ago.
However, the OP is not talking about a virtual coach, he is talking about finding, I assume, a local coach. And if you read my original post, I said quite plainly, read the "Killing me" thread and follow the excellent advice given by RD. I also added read Ric and Andy, which seems to have upset DM.

Hope this clears things up Jim and you have recovered from your shock. TYSON

 

[normZurawski]

But if you want to get to the next level, a power meter is the first step in my opinion.

I have to sort of disagree here, or at least say that you should clarify. I think it really depends where the OP is now, and what the next level is for him. If you've been following my estimated TSS foray, it's already clear that this approach will get me to the next level. Granted, the current/previous level wasn't anything to inspire fear in my competitors. And admittedly, I'm probably not going to get so far as I might with a PM. But that's sort of the next-next level. One step at a time.

 

[SolarEnergy]

However, the OP is not talking about a virtual coach, he is talking about finding, I assume, a local coach.

Virtual coach or real life coach.

The question is :

Who, or I should say which approach is more likely to be really efficient?
a) RapDaddyo coaching a rider that owns a powermeter
b) World level PhD coaching a rider with no tools

 

[otb4evr]

Virtual coach or real life coach.

The question is :

Who, or I should say which approach is more likely to be really efficient?
a) RapDaddyo coaching a rider that owns a powermeter
b) World level PhD coaching a rider with no tools

There are many examples of each way being successful, so I would say that it depends.

The most important factor in finding a coach is to find one that you 'click' with...

Jim

 

[ric_stern/RST]

There are many examples of each way being successful, so I would say that it depends.

The most important factor in finding a coach is to find one that you 'click' with...

Jim

This is definitely important when it comes to selecting a coach. Not every coach is suitable for every athlete, and not every athlete is suitable for every coach.

When you think about getting a coach (and for the OP this is the most important aspect, even though it may appear i have bias*) you should always have a chat or a thorough email with him/her to make sure you gel. If you don't gel, the coaching *may* still work, but it may not be as fruitful.

Gelling or clicking in a coach/rider relationship doesn't mean that you both have to suck up to each other or that neither party can be wrong, it just means do you get on well enough to work together.

*To the OP, while my response may seem biased (i.e., i'm a coach, and potentially i could be looking for you as a client) it isn't, because at this point i'm looking to only coach people who have a power meter (or who want to get one when we start coaching). And, yes, you can have good coaching with just a HRM.

Ric

 

[SolarEnergy]

*To the OP, while my response may seem biased (i.e., i'm a coach, and potentially i could be looking for you as a client) it isn't, because at this point i'm looking to only coach people who have a power meter

Me too.

And, yes, you can have good coaching with just a HRM.

Can one get good coaching without a pm and without a hrm in your opinion?

 

[ric_stern/RST]

Can one get good coaching without a pm and without a hrm in your opinion?

Perhaps. It would probably depend on the people concerned. So many points could be open to interpretation that the no data route could be fraught with difficulties (for e.g., there was a thread a while back about what "tempo" meant, and many people had different ideas about what tempo entailed, thus, poor communication/understanding could really cause confusion).

ric

 

[normZurawski]

Perhaps. It would probably depend on the people concerned. So many points could be open to interpretation that the no data route could be fraught with difficulties (for e.g., there was a thread a while back about what "tempo" meant, and many people had different ideas about what tempo entailed, thus, poor communication/understanding could really cause confusion).

ric

This is why I suggest that the OP learn more about himself, so that in (potentially) going forward, this will be less of an issue.

 

[gimpy_calfee]

this is probably the last post I wil ever make on this forum...way too many W@^K3RS on this site who think they know it all coz RD and RST told them.

Its really hard to find a second opinion on this site without being shut down by a few "qualified experts in there own mind" eg. SOT.

Hope I didn't offend anyone but there are better forums than this. If you showed this thread to 99% of GOOD cyclists in the world they would just laugh out loud.

Im off to Weightweenies.com got some extremely gifted cyclists on that site and some very good juniors.

To SOT- Do you really think you could have achieved the same results if you didnt have rapdaddyo coaching you? Would you have improved just as quickly with a HRM alone? Of course you would of. Maybe if you had of got a better coach locally to train you, you could have even better results with dare I say it a HRM

I am posting this message to ppl like whoawhoa...take a step back man and see who is advising you. A 60 year old man from japan, a supposedly qualified internet coach Ric Stern who is probably the most narrow minded person I have seen on a forum and some rap daddyo fella.

GET YOURSELF A COACH PPL!!!

PS: WTF is wrong with HRM, if you know your body properly a PM doesnt make it any easier when it comes to actually pushing on the pedals. Save your money unless of course you get paid to use one.

Dood,
Relax. Why on earth would you be involved in this forum with that outlook anyway?
S

 

[wiredued]

Escalation List (only at step 2 right now)

1. HRM
2. Kurt Kinetic Road Machine with Power Computer
3. Power Tap or SRM Power Meter
4. Coach

 

[RidwarePhil]

Ok Guys - Thanks for all the advice

Didn't mean to start an argument / debate with my original post!

I cant really push to a really good power meter i.e. SRM etc and I think the iBike? versions looks limited in useful ness as a large qty of my time is spent on the turbo or in groups where it doesnt seem to work at all / well.

I am also a bit on teh techy side (physics degree) so like to get into things and understand why so I think using teh information here may be a simpler place to start than a coach. I have raced etc before but was just looking for advice as to ways to improve.

Do any of you guys have any experience of the Polar PM. It looks to me like a bit of a halfway house in that I can use with my turbo / out on the road. Its only a small additional outlay after a new HRM.

Seems more useful than spending money on a Tacx Flow or a Kurt Kinetic as they PM's dont work on the road AFAIK!

I already have baci uncalibrated power curves for the Tacx flow from the Tacx manual so I figure that will give me a good start even before I have a power meter.

Next steps is to read more of this damn forum

 

[normZurawski]

I cant really push to a really good power meter i.e. SRM etc and I think the iBike? versions looks limited in useful ness as a large qty of my time is spent on the turbo or in groups where it doesnt seem to work at all / well.

The iBike is useless on the trainer. It needs wind, among other things. Consider the MicroSport, which is a shoe insert. So it's highly portable. But it's not due out until spring 2007.

Do any of you guys have any experience of the Polar PM. It looks to me like a bit of a halfway house in that I can use with my turbo / out on the road. Its only a small additional outlay after a new HRM.

Perish the thought! The Polar PM is presumably fine for the road. But on the trainer apparently the resonances (or some kind of noise) render it useless. Someone who I occasionally trade emails with who is heavily into the PM world once said, "Forget the Polar, it's a piece of sh!t." This same person is also pretty stoked about the MicroSport, having already pre-ordered one.

I've been down the road you're on, very recently. My advice is to read more, bide your time, and hope the MicroSport works with relative consistency. Also get more familiar with RPE and try to get the most out of those trainer hours.

 

[Felt_Rider]

This same person is also pretty stoked about the MicroSport, having already pre-ordered one.

I've been down the road you're on, very recently. My advice is to read more, bide your time, and hope the MicroSport works with relative consistency.

Not to hijack this thread, but I will be watching for your review.

 

[whoawhoa]

I am posting this message to ppl like whoawhoa

So you got your feelings hurt and want to cry about it before running off? I just can't figure out what about, since I pretty much agreed with your earlier point.

 

[MY02_STi]

.....Do any of you guys have any experience of the Polar PM.......

I us the Polar system (including the HRM ) and I find it more than adequate (I'd like a PowerTap 2.4 but then again who wouldn't)

The Polar is a bit of a pain to install but if you take your time, and follow the on line video, its not all that bad.

On the road, the unit is rock solid and used in conjunction with the Polar HRM you have a huge amount of information/feedback available.

I've heard many horror stories about using the Polar on a trainer, and IMHO these come from those that haven't bothered to understand the problem(s), mainly resonance, and try to solve them. In my case, I use an industrial grade vibration pad (waffle pad is the generic term) under each point my trainer (Cateye CS1000) contacts the floor and this has largely 'solved' the problem the only gear I find a bit flakey is 53*18 (which reads about 50W high) but out of 20 gears to choose from, that's not a bad outcome

Given that you can pick up Polar units on eBay at considerably reduced prices, maybe you should consider this as a viable option

When all said and done, any 'instrument' that can validate/verify/quantify your improvement is a worthwhile investment

 

[Alex Simmons]

I cant really afford more than 1 so I was wondering what had made the biggest difference to forum members.

Perhaps if more posters had just actually answered the OP's original question? In reality this was a poll: What worked for you and elicited the best performance improvements? What worked for me may not work for the OP or anyone else...

 

[normZurawski]

I've heard many horror stories about using the Polar on a trainer, and IMHO these come from those that haven't bothered to understand the problem(s), mainly resonance, and try to solve them. In my case, I use an industrial grade vibration pad (waffle pad is the generic term) under each point my trainer (Cateye CS1000) contacts the floor and this has largely 'solved' the problem the only gear I find a bit flakey is 53*18 (which reads about 50W high) but out of 20 gears to choose from, that's not a bad outcome

Given that you can pick up Polar units on eBay at considerably reduced prices, maybe you should consider this as a viable

Very interesting indeed. Waffle pad? Where does one get such a thing?

 

[otb4evr]

Very interesting indeed. Waffle pad? Where does one get such a thing?

At this place:

http://www.redpac.com/photo/pics/outsidewafflehouse.jpg



Jim

 

[MY02_STi]

Very interesting indeed. Waffle pad? Where does one get such a thing?

Go to http://209.200.80.33/html/vibration_pads.htm and check out the Neoprene Waffle Pads - I'm presuming you're in the USA but Mason's have branches all over the world - I got mine from thier branch in Sydney

 

[wiredued]

Wow only $500 thanks for mentioning that much cheaper than PT or SRM.

I've been down the road you're on, very recently. My advice is to read more, bide your time, and hope the MicroSport works with relative consistency. Also get more familiar with RPE and try to get the most out of those trainer hours.