wadoflove said:
Sorry, I have been busy but the Dr is now in...
1) So I have searched for use of this procedure in paternity testing on the web and have found one reference to it and that was a cost-effectiveness analysis by a company trying to sell the equipment to hospitals. That means it is not an established technique for paternity testing. This claim appears to be incorrect or overstated.
2) I cannot believe that a technique that was published for the first time in a peer reviewed journal in November of 2003 can be a well established technique 6 months later. There would have to be a greater consensus in the scientific community. My wife works with this technique and she tells me constantly that it is very tricky and you can see whatever you want to in the results. The article on cyclingnews indicates that they are looking for an absence of signal on some blood cells as a positive indicator. There could be a number of reasons that some cells do not light up.
3) "Length of time until a transfusion is undetectable? Up to 120 days; for athletes, probably less than 90 days because red cells have shorter lives in highly active individuals". If he tested positive a couple of weeks ago then they can do another blood test and have different labs analyse the blood and see if a consensus can be arrived at because apparently the first test was considered questionable by the lab that performed it until "outside experts were brought in to confirm it" (who were they I wonder?).
It appears that the experts on this topic are the people that developed and published the test in the first place. I am not saying these are dishonest scientists but it may be that they unconsciously are aware that catching a high profile athlete with their new test could lead to a great deal of publicity and liscencing fees for their university... Also these people are extremely adamant that their test is basically foolproof and I would not trust any scientist that talks this way about their results. NOTHING IS FOOLPROOF! There are always exceptions and different interpretations of results. Especially with these sorts of biological reagents.
For these and other reasons I would recommend an independant scientific study a decision that Phonak has taken already.
4) So what do you do over there at Velonews AntoineG?
Same issues here...apparent lack of peer review, results at this time seem to be pretty "lab dependent", subjective and interpretative nature of the analysis. As most pathology depts will admit to, some days are more cancerous than others.
And whoa, what is with this whole the "he's guilty but getting off on a technicality" ******** I keep hearing. Sorry, the B test is not a technicality. The function of the B test is to confirm the A test findings ... to eliminate tester error, lab error, dog ate my homework error etc. Without the B test to confirm the A test, there is NO guilty.
I'm curious as to why the A test results were publicly released when the IOC obviously knew they could never supply B testing confirmation. Second, was the Vuelta doping control staff notified at any time by the IOC of this A sample result....any "You might want to check Hamilton, wink wink, nudge, nudge". That is very problematic with an interpretative testing procedure. Pretty much introduces tester bias quite nicely, which is not malice but a well documented human phenomenon. It's why people bend over backwards so hard to eliminate it.
Finally, an issue of pure curiousity...any published work on the differences in blood chemistry/physiology etc etc between physically active and sedentary persons that one can think of off hand? I know my husband often gets flagged for "trace blood in urine" in his routine physicals but on the secondary investigation, it's explained by his level of physical activity. The tests are so sensitive nowdays that they pick up everything, even what is "normal" for an athletic person.
Has anyone found any peer-reviewed published articles on this technique other than the Nov 2003
Haematologica 88:1284-1295 article? 25 post surgical patients, orthopedic surgurgical patients none the less, and this is representative of the general population?? Does anyone think that a small sample of orthopedic patients might not be a highly physically active group? And is that relevant -- straight up question, I don't know.
And what about the caveat attacted to the article in question? "In the absense of a monoclonal antibody-based panel of antisera, variations in the analytical perfomace of this test due to variablility in potency or specificity of the polyclonal antibodies remain a major concern. Rigorous standardization of the assay will be essential to obtain reliable results in different laboratories. The article was submitted for publication April 2003; it was used as a definitive testing protocol sometime prior to Aug 2004. In the intervening time, what work was done to develop the required standardization, who did it, and where is their work available for review?
I'm not saying Hamilton is innocent. I'm not saying Hamilton is guilty. However, sometimes the devil is in the details and I'd like to know a bit more about the subject.