Brooks B17 - pre-aged vs standard

[John Thompson]

On 2008-02-16, DaveB <[email protected]> wrote:

> I've got two Brooks B17 saddles. One is the pre-aged model and the other
> is the standard B17. I got the pre-aged saddle about a year ago for my
> roadbike and found it had shaped nicely to me within a couple of weeks
> riding. About a month later I got the standard B17 for my commuter. 12
> months later and it is still not to the shape the pre-aged saddle was in
> a couple of weeks.
>
> For both saddles I gave them a coat of the Brooks Proofide when I first
> got them and again every couple of months. Is there anything else I can
> do with the standard saddle?

Keep riding it. I've never used a "pre-aged" Brooks, but my 25 year old
Brooks Pro broke in in less than a year and is still one of my favorite
saddles.

--

John ([email protected])

 

[John Thompson]

On 2008-02-16, Leo Lichtman <[email protected]> wrote:

> "A R:nen" wrote: (clip) pour plenty of linseed oil into it (clip)
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Why not neatsfoot oil?

What passes for "neatsfoot oil" is usually a mineral oil based substance
that will degrade the leather. It might be ok on shoes and such, but on
a saddle you need the leather to stay strong enough to support your
weight.

I'd avoid the linseed oil tip for the same reason. Vegetable based oils
are probably less destructive, but softness and support are largely
mutually exclusive properties.

Stay with sparing quantities of Proofhide and your saddle should last a
lifetime.

--

John ([email protected])

 

[John Thompson]

On 2008-02-16, * * Chas <[email protected]> wrote:

> I put Proofide on with an old tooth brush and use a hair dryer to get it
> to soak in, 15-20 minutes total and I'm done.

I just keep the bike in the garage. It gets plenty warm on a sunny day
to melt the Proofhide and allow it to soak in.

> I have one early 80s Pro that has leather that's about 1/2 as thick as on
> my others. It's still pretty hard after all these years.
>
> My experience with about 3 Ideale pre-softened saddles is that they tended
> to be too soft and started to sag after very little use. I stretched 1 out
> over an inch with the adjuster trying to get some form back.
>
> I've seen some leather saddles on eBay that had almost 2" of stretch;
> caveat emptor....

Leather saddles are not like plastic-based saddles. It's not a
one-way street: your butt and the saddle accommodate to each other, and
in the long run can give you better confort than a generically formed
plastic base saddle. Pre-softened saddles are an attempt to get the
initial comfort of a plastic-based saddle in a leather form, at the
cost of longevity. When I pay top dollar for a decent leather saddle, I
expect it to last.

--

John ([email protected])

 

[Andrew Price]

On Sat, 16 Feb 2008 19:16:50 -0500, Eric Vey <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Does the B-17 have thin leather? My 196xish B-66 has 15 oz leather.

Thinner than the leather on the Swift and the Professional (and its
sprung variant, the Conquest).

 

[Jay]

"DaveB" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've got two Brooks B17 saddles. One is the pre-aged model and the other
> is the standard B17. I got the pre-aged saddle about a year ago for my
> roadbike and found it had shaped nicely to me within a couple of weeks
> riding. About a month later I got the standard B17 for my commuter. 12
> months later and it is still not to the shape the pre-aged saddle was in a
> couple of weeks.
>
> For both saddles I gave them a coat of the Brooks Proofide when I first
> got them and again every couple of months. Is there anything else I can do
> with the standard saddle?
>
> DaveB
>
I fear your bum is not up to the current Brooks standard.

Brooks has, I am sure, done research world wide. It is possible that your
bum is simply inadequate.

Perhaps your bum is still under warranty?

J.

 

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Michael Press:
>
>Put the saddle upside down under a 100 watt incandescent
>light bulb. Slather the underside with Proofide. Leave
>overnight. I use a 2 cm stiff artist's paint brush for
>the slathering. Proofide will migrate to the riding
>surface side of the leather. A second treatment in a
>fortnight maybe called for.

I thought the spiel on Proofide was that it didn't penetrate the
leather - instead forming a protective layer on the surface.

?
--
PeteCresswell

 

[[email protected]]

On Feb 17, 2:33 pm, Andrew Price <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Feb 2008 19:16:50 -0500, Eric Vey <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >Does the B-17 have thin leather? My 196xish B-66 has 15 oz leather.
>
> Thinner than the leather on the Swift and the Professional (and its
> sprung variant, the Conquest).

i have both a b-17 and a swift. the leather on the b-17 is noticeably
thicker than on the swift.

 

[still just me]

On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 13:10:26 -0600, John Thompson
<[email protected]> wrote:

>What passes for "neatsfoot oil" is usually a mineral oil based substance
>that will degrade the leather. It might be ok on shoes and such, but on
>a saddle you need the leather to stay strong enough to support your
>weight.

I have to disagree with the religious obsession regarding avoiding
neatsfoot oil. I have a b17 I treated with neatsfoot oil repeatedly as
a kid. 35 years later it's still going strong.

Sheldon agrees: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/leather.html

 

[rick b]

Like somebody said....if it doesn't soften up after a month, get rid
of it.
I found the standard B17 (small rivets) breaks in rapidly for
me...I've had 3 of them. In fact, I've worn out two of those. The
leather stretched more than the adjuster could compensate for. I
suspect I applied too much proofide and dripped too much sweat. They
are now candidates for the shoestring treatment- I'll drill holes in
the sides and use the shoestings to tighten up the leather. The
third new saddle is still ok.
Then I bought a 'professional' B17 with big rivets..I never did break
that one in after 3 months and sold it to somebody else.
I recommend avoiding those so-called broken-in well-used B17's on
Ebay. They tend to be so dried out they are hard as Sheldon's rock
saddle.

 

[Michael Press]

In article <[email protected]>,
"(PeteCresswell)" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Per Michael Press:
> >
> >Put the saddle upside down under a 100 watt incandescent
> >light bulb. Slather the underside with Proofide. Leave
> >overnight. I use a 2 cm stiff artist's paint brush for
> >the slathering. Proofide will migrate to the riding
> >surface side of the leather. A second treatment in a
> >fortnight maybe called for.
>
> I thought the spiel on Proofide was that it didn't penetrate the
> leather - instead forming a protective layer on the surface.

Whoops!

One saddle is twenty years old, is hard as a new saddle,
is perfectly comfortable, and always shows a thin layer
of Proofide on the surface from interior exudation.
Proofide does not soften a saddle; it is not meant to.

--
Michael Press

 

[* * Chas]

"John Thompson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2008-02-16, DaveB <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > I've got two Brooks B17 saddles. One is the pre-aged model and the
other
> > is the standard B17. I got the pre-aged saddle about a year ago for my
> > roadbike and found it had shaped nicely to me within a couple of weeks
> > riding. About a month later I got the standard B17 for my commuter. 12
> > months later and it is still not to the shape the pre-aged saddle was
in
> > a couple of weeks.
> >
> > For both saddles I gave them a coat of the Brooks Proofide when I
first
> > got them and again every couple of months. Is there anything else I
can
> > do with the standard saddle?
>
> Keep riding it. I've never used a "pre-aged" Brooks, but my 25 year old
> Brooks Pro broke in in less than a year and is still one of my favorite
> saddles.
>
> --
>
> John ([email protected])

I got my first Brooks Pro in 1975 from a local racer when he hung up his
cleats. He put about 20,000 miles on it and I've probably put another 20k
on it myself since then. It's still my most comfortable saddle. Proofide
once a year, no cracks just a beautiful brown patina. I don't remember
ever adjusting it.

Last month I found an all original 1967 Peugeot PX10 "barn bike". The
Brooks Pro had a reddish russet brown color from years of storage. I was
hoping to preserve the color but it started darkening from handling so I
put some proofide on it.

I took the bike out for a little spin today and pretty soon junior and the
boys were complaining. The saddle was soft from all the years of dry
storage and was sagging in the middle applying pressure to a sensitive
area. I went back home and tightened the saddle up about a 1/2" so that it
feels the same as my other Brooks Pros. It rides great just like the other
ones.

Chas.

 

[* * Chas]

"DaveB" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've got two Brooks B17 saddles. One is the pre-aged model and the other
> is the standard B17. I got the pre-aged saddle about a year ago for my
> roadbike and found it had shaped nicely to me within a couple of weeks
> riding. About a month later I got the standard B17 for my commuter. 12
> months later and it is still not to the shape the pre-aged saddle was in
> a couple of weeks.
>
> For both saddles I gave them a coat of the Brooks Proofide when I first
> got them and again every couple of months. Is there anything else I can
> do with the standard saddle?
>
> DaveB

Everyone's anatomy is different. I've seen people who are comfortable on
leather saddles that have 1/2" deep recessed areas where their pelvic
bones sit in the rear and a high ridge down the middle. That would kill
me.

I ruined several saddles by softening them up with a ball peen hammer in
the pelvic bone contact area. I found that I need my saddles to be flat in
the rear and provide support with no contact in the middle. So I like my
Brooks Pros hard, that's what works for me.

Chas.

 

[Andrew Price]

On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 14:25:19 -0800 (PST), [email protected] wrote:

>> Thinner than the leather on the Swift and the Professional (and its
>> sprung variant, the Conquest).
>
>i have both a b-17 and a swift. the leather on the b-17 is noticeably
>thicker than on the swift.

You're right, I checked - my standard B17 is slightly thicker, and my
B17N is noticeably thicker than the Swift. It's the Professional and
the Conquest which are the thickest of those which I have.

 

[Leo Lichtman]

"Michael Press" wrote: Impedance matching.
> Our connective tissue is made out of the same stuff as leather.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Impedance matching is accomplished by a transformer. In this case, the
"transformer" would be a pair of padded shorts.

 

[still just me]

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:46:46 GMT, "Leo Lichtman"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Impedance matching is accomplished by a transformer. In this case, the
>"transformer" would be a pair of padded shorts.

Then the "lube" some guys used would be the thermal paste?