Building up bike--what should I get LBS to do?



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"Michael Dart" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> Pardon me but, IMO, The tool required [for setting star nuts) (Park TNS-1) is neither fancy (a
> round piece of steel with a threaded stud on the end of it) or particularly expensive (about $16).
> It makes really short work of the procedure and ensures the nut is set to the proper depth. You
> can also DIY with a cut off piece of broomstick and use the rounded end to set the star nut. A box
> of band-aids may also be required using this method. ;^)

hear, hear. star fangled nut is definitely a do it yourselfer. ive had excellent success at home
just threading the preload adjusting bolt into it and tapping it down. i suppose there is a risk of
the thread bit separating from the star bit, but it hasnt happened to me, and you dont worry abotu
damaging threads. all the bolt does it a littl bit of preload. not load bearing.

of course, with a carbon fork, star fangled nuts need not apply.

as other posters have said, i definitely Definitely agree that headset pressing is also a very
reasonable thing to do at home, either the caveman-like laboriously slow way of tapping it in with a
block of wood, or the much quicker (but bigger investment in setup time) bolt adn appropriate
washers. i used to hear so much nay saying about doing this at home, but many naysayers must never
have used the pro tool. There Is Nothing Magic About The Shop Tool. the largest part, IMHO, of
installing tricky bits and pieces is the mechanical competence that goes into telling whether things
are going well or not. Whether you use a very easy, fast, and expensive shop tool, or a home brew
get up means little if you are somewhat mechanically inclined.

if one is not mechanically inclined, so to speak, or doubts themself, then i wouldnt even give up
there. i truly beleive that you can replace mechanical competency with time. if you do everything
slowly. check things again and again. there is very very very little that i know of that can go
wrong quickly.

if you are using a cartridge bottom bracket, and it threads in nicely when you try it the first
time, i would feel good about foregoing the BB machining work. if you press your headset, and it
slides in smooth and straight, and when adjusted there are no tight spots, then i would leave that
as it is. things to watch for would be whether the headtube is the right inside diameter for the
headset. however, i think a company in this day and age who is selling unfinished frames shoudl be
embarassed. thirty seconds with a caliper would verify this for you, or sloooow judicious pressing.

things that shoudl Not be done at home, despite my admittedly liberal views on the matter, are
frame machining jobs. facing, reaming, and threading are tricky to pull off with a file and a
bearing scraper;)

why would i advocate doing everything yourself? becuase it feels that much better. yes, it will take
longer. yes, the time it takes you will probably be more than the time it takes you to earn the
money it woudl take to pay the shop, if that makes sense. but it feels better, you know more, and
youre faster next time.

right. thats enough of me, then.

anthony
 
Thanks. You list precisely the reasons that I want to build up my bike myself. The argument that the
money you save by DIY is more than offset by the money you could be earning in the meantime seem
rediculous to me, unless you're literally missing work that you would normally be doing to do this,
and it comes out of your paycheck. Not sure how often this would be the case for most people.
Otherwise, this argument is similar to arguing that you shouldn't cook for yourself to save money
because the time spent cooking could be spent making money. In either case, this argument is dubious
at best, and completely ignores the fact that a lot of people simply LIKE to work on their bikes (or
cook), and that money saved or lost is simply not part of the equation. I'm in this camp.

I'm going to install my BBs and just bought the tools to do it properly. The frame does indeed come
ready for assembly (i.e. reamed, faced, threaded, chased, etc.). But I'll probably still get a local
shop to press my headset simply because I also want them to cut my carbon fork and custom-fit the
stem height for me. And it doesn't hurt to establish a good working relationship with a shop you
trust in case I need help with more serious problems down the line, or simply to turn to for
occasional hands-on advice.

--
Kovie [email protected]

"ant" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Michael Dart" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > Pardon me but, IMO, The tool required [for setting star nuts) (Park TNS-1) is neither fancy (a
> > round piece of steel with a threaded stud on the end of it) or particularly expensive (about
> > $16). It makes really short work of the procedure and ensures the nut
is
> > set to the proper depth. You can also DIY with a cut off piece of
broomstick
> > and use the rounded end to set the star nut. A box of band-aids may
also be
> > required using this method. ;^)
>
> hear, hear. star fangled nut is definitely a do it yourselfer. ive had excellent success at home
> just threading the preload adjusting bolt into it and tapping it down. i suppose there is a risk
> of the thread bit separating from the star bit, but it hasnt happened to me, and you dont worry
> abotu damaging threads. all the bolt does it a littl bit of preload. not load bearing.
>
> of course, with a carbon fork, star fangled nuts need not apply.
>
> as other posters have said, i definitely Definitely agree that headset pressing is also a very
> reasonable thing to do at home, either the caveman-like laboriously slow way of tapping it in with
> a block of wood, or the much quicker (but bigger investment in setup time) bolt adn appropriate
> washers. i used to hear so much nay saying about doing this at home, but many naysayers must never
> have used the pro tool. There Is Nothing Magic About The Shop Tool. the largest part, IMHO, of
> installing tricky bits and pieces is the mechanical competence that goes into telling whether
> things are going well or not. Whether you use a very easy, fast, and expensive shop tool, or a
> home brew get up means little if you are somewhat mechanically inclined.
>
> if one is not mechanically inclined, so to speak, or doubts themself, then i wouldnt even give up
> there. i truly beleive that you can replace mechanical competency with time. if you do everything
> slowly. check things again and again. there is very very very little that i know of that can go
> wrong quickly.
>
> if you are using a cartridge bottom bracket, and it threads in nicely when you try it the first
> time, i would feel good about foregoing the BB machining work. if you press your headset, and it
> slides in smooth and straight, and when adjusted there are no tight spots, then i would leave that
> as it is. things to watch for would be whether the headtube is the right inside diameter for the
> headset. however, i think a company in this day and age who is selling unfinished frames shoudl be
> embarassed. thirty seconds with a caliper would verify this for you, or sloooow judicious
> pressing.
>
> things that shoudl Not be done at home, despite my admittedly liberal views on the matter, are
> frame machining jobs. facing, reaming, and threading are tricky to pull off with a file and a
> bearing scraper;)
>
> why would i advocate doing everything yourself? becuase it feels that much better. yes, it will
> take longer. yes, the time it takes you will probably be more than the time it takes you to earn
> the money it woudl take to pay the shop, if that makes sense. but it feels better, you know more,
> and youre faster next time.
>
> right. thats enough of me, then.
>
> anthony
 
"Kovie" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<tuXpb.108600$Tr4.291436@attbi_s03>...
> Thanks. You list precisely the reasons that I want to build up my bike myself.

cool.

> The argument that the money you save by DIY is more than offset by the money you could be earning
> in the meantime seem rediculous to me, unless you're literally missing work that you would
> normally be doing to do this, and it comes out of your paycheck. Not sure how often this would be
> the case for most people. Otherwise, this argument is similar to arguing that you shouldn't cook
> for yourself to save money because the time spent cooking could be spent making money. In either
> case, this argument is dubious at best, and completely ignores the fact that a lot of people
> simply LIKE to work on their bikes (or cook), and that money saved or lost is simply not part of
> the equation. I'm in this camp.
> >

im not sure i follow you. i wrote:

> > why would i advocate doing everything yourself? becuase it feels that much better. yes, it will
> > take longer. yes, the time it takes you will probably be more than the time it takes you to earn
> > the money it woudl take to pay the shop, if that makes sense. but it feels better, you know
> > more, and youre faster next time.

for the record, i couldnt agree with you more that money saved or lost isnt the issue. however, for
some people it is, and that is why i threw that comment out there. i intended it to be an argument
for doing everything yourself *despite* it's possible net financial loss. of course, in the big
picture, doing your work is going to earn you money once youve done it once and know what youre
doing, with bike mech labor as high as it seems to be right now. and if youre sharp it might not
take that much time the first time around. apologies, much ado about nothing.

we're in agreement. i didnt want to be google-archived as a person who would rather not work on his
own bike if i could get someone else to do it for me for cheaper.

cheers :) ant
 
Yes, I agree that we're in agreement! ;-) People who take their bikes to a shop probably do so
because they either don't know how to maintain their bikes, don't trust their ability to maintain
their bikes, think the shop can do a better job, or simply don't particularly enjoy maintaining
their bikes, and would rather be doing other things with their free time. It's really not a matter
of money being saved UNLESS one knows how to maintain one's bike, does about as good a job as a bike
shop would, and likes working on one's bike, in which case you're obviously saving money AND
enjoying yourself. (Unless, of course, one thinks of free time as lost wages, which is kind of a
wacky way to look at things IMHO.)

And I wouldn't worry too much about being misinterpreted on something like this from a
google-archive pov. If you're worried about people misunderstanding your attitudes towards bike
maintenance, then you must not have a lot of worries in life!

--
Kovie [email protected]

"ant" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Kovie" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<tuXpb.108600$Tr4.291436@attbi_s03>...
> > Thanks. You list precisely the reasons that I want to build up my bike myself.
>
> cool.
>
> > The argument that the money you save by DIY is more than offset by the money you could be
> > earning in the meantime seem rediculous to me,
unless
> > you're literally missing work that you would normally be doing to do
this,
> > and it comes out of your paycheck. Not sure how often this would be the
case
> > for most people. Otherwise, this argument is similar to arguing that you shouldn't cook for
> > yourself to save money because the time spent cooking could be spent making money. In either
> > case, this argument is dubious at best, and completely ignores the fact that a lot of people
> > simply LIKE
to
> > work on their bikes (or cook), and that money saved or lost is simply
not
> > part of the equation. I'm in this camp.
> > >
>
> im not sure i follow you. i wrote:
>
> > > why would i advocate doing everything yourself? becuase it feels that much better. yes, it
> > > will take longer. yes, the time it takes you will probably be more than the time it takes you
> > > to earn the money it woudl take to pay the shop, if that makes sense. but it feels better, you
> > > know more, and youre faster next time.
>
> for the record, i couldnt agree with you more that money saved or lost isnt the issue. however,
> for some people it is, and that is why i threw that comment out there. i intended it to be an
> argument for doing everything yourself *despite* it's possible net financial loss. of course, in
> the big picture, doing your work is going to earn you money once youve done it once and know what
> youre doing, with bike mech labor as high as it seems to be right now. and if youre sharp it might
> not take that much time the first time around. apologies, much ado about nothing.
>
> we're in agreement. i didnt want to be google-archived as a person who would rather not work on
> his own bike if i could get someone else to do it for me for cheaper.
>
> cheers :) ant
 
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