Cadel Evans Interview - 100% certain he is clean

[nitrous]

its actually a better knowledge of the sport Scottri.

You have to explain away many things, one of not least, is why riders from the EPO era onwards can suddenly climb over 420 watts, when in the Lemond era, it was not possible to hit 400 on the finishing climb.

There are myriad of facts that create a picture.

So are we all in agreeance that the only thing that can increase a cyclist's power is EPO. What about nutrition, technological advances, training techniques and advances in (legal) treatments.

You state that there are a myriad of facts but then attribute the increase in power to EPO.

Over time, as technology advances, things get better and stronger. Have a look at Moore's Law of computing. Are all of those computers on EPO too?

Granted, you may have a better understanding of the sport than me, but what I am interested in is whether you (and others on this forum) believe it is possible to be competitive without dope? I think it is. I think it is possible to win clean, just like it is possible for any legitimate participant in any activity to beat the cheaters.

 

[Rhubarb]

So are we all in agreeance that the only thing that can increase a cyclist's power is EPO. What about nutrition, technological advances, training techniques and advances in (legal) treatments.

You state that there are a myriad of facts but then attribute the increase in power to EPO.

Over time, as technology advances, things get better and stronger. Have a look at Moore's Law of computing. Are all of those computers on EPO too?

Granted, you may have a better understanding of the sport than me, but what I am interested in is whether you (and others on this forum) believe it is possible to be competitive without dope? I think it is. I think it is possible to win clean, just like it is possible for any legitimate participant in any activity to beat the cheaters.

It’s a nice thought to have, that it is indeed to possible to win clean. I guess the longer you follow cycling the more jaded you become.

If someone would pull their finger out, get the pro peleton's DNA tested against the OP blood bags, we would have fairly black and white picture of bad the problem really is, instead of the continual speculation feed by a constant dribble of postive dope tests.

In the current atmosphere you don't want to put trust in any of the riders, because you are only making yourself vulnerable to more disappointment.

 

[donrhummy]

So, are you saying that you think the entire peleton is doping? Or that it is not possible to finish high up the table without it?

My comments were a small excerpt of the interview, the whole package was convincing, I hope to find a copy online that I can link to from here.

Fact - Cadel Evans has the highest recorded VO2 Max at the Australian Institute of Sport. His power output over 30 minutes exceeds 400 watts, also one of the highest on AIS records for a cyclist of his size and weight.

If you're not Australian you won't understand that the Aussie battler attitude of doing the best you can, winning is not important, it's how you play the game and playing by the rules (sportsmanship) is instilled in kids from very early on.

It will be really easy for you doubters to counter my arguments here, but let me say that I am up for any challenge that anyone can throw at me. Cadel is clean and will never ever be proven otherwise.

Not saying he's doping but...

1. Who cares what his vo2Max is? DRUGS can improve your VO2Max!!
2. Do you think that Cadel beat doping cyclists while riding 100% clean? (And he DID beat doping cyclists for certain as some who placed below him were caught doping)

 

[Tim Lamkin]

Cadel Evans is a doper that is all there is to it.
Everyone knows it, he is like the rest, not caught yet.

 

[thunder]

So are we all in agreeance that the only thing that can increase a cyclist's power is EPO. What about nutrition, technological advances, training techniques and advances in (legal) treatments.

You state that there are a myriad of facts but then attribute the increase in power to EPO.

Over time, as technology advances, things get better and stronger. Have a look at Moore's Law of computing. Are all of those computers on EPO too?

Granted, you may have a better understanding of the sport than me, but what I am interested in is whether you (and others on this forum) believe it is possible to be competitive without dope? I think it is. I think it is possible to win clean, just like it is possible for any legitimate participant in any activity to beat the cheaters.

declining economies, good TT wheels over a few watts compared to the previous decades wheels.

Nutrition and training all improve, no doubt.

Some like wheels and technology are exogenous factors, that the formula will account for, the ednogenous factors, like training, nutrition, recovery, labs, rehabs, docs, physiology science etc, will provide an advantage.

But, it is a declining economy as you approach some limit.

Point being, the limit is somewhere between Lemond, and where they are at now.

Your position is valid, but take the natural limit back a little. Read Walsh, read the other stuff. (Not said in a patronising tone.)

 

[limerickman]

Cadel Evans is a doper that is all there is to it.
Everyone knows it, he is like the rest, not caught yet.

How many tests has Evans failed?

 

[nitrous]

But, it is a declining economy as you approach some limit.

Agree that there are limits but I'd maintain that there is no reason why someone can't go a bit faster next year than he did last year - thanks mainly to the tech, health, nutrition etc etc. Further, (sorry creationists) we have evolved from the swamp and continue to evolve so the next generation should be stronger than the previous.

So, we know that Cadel has beaten other riders that are doping. But, were they all trying to win or just doping so they could sit on the front for 100km and pull their team leader. Just as much incentive for a domestique to dope as a team leader.

Don't get me wrong, I've been around the sport long enough to be as jaded and cynical as the next guy BUT I do believe Cadel is clean. Maybe it is deep seated patriotism or naivity, but something tells me it is possible to win clean and if anyone can do it.....

 

[thunder]

Agree that there are limits but I'd maintain that there is no reason why someone can't go a bit faster next year than he did last year - thanks mainly to the tech, health, nutrition etc etc. Further, (sorry creationists) we have evolved from the swamp and continue to evolve so the next generation should be stronger than the previous.

So, we know that Cadel has beaten other riders that are doping. But, were they all trying to win or just doping so they could sit on the front for 100km and pull their team leader. Just as much incentive for a domestique to dope as a team leader.

Don't get me wrong, I've been around the sport long enough to be as jaded and cynical as the next guy BUT I do believe Cadel is clean. Maybe it is deep seated patriotism or naivity, but something tells me it is possible to win clean and if anyone can do it.....

I think the most damning piece of information, from those who know the sport, has nothing to do with Evans on the road.

It is to do with his quotes and his personality. He rarely pulls a punch, he will complain about something if he is ******, where others tow the line.

Evans is known as a whiner. He might be a hard guy, that is, capable of immense suffering on the bike, but that is not mutually exclusive to being a complainer.

He complains to the press.

Now why, when sport is all about winning, and rewards, and riches, does Evans say "the tests are working, the UCI is doing a good job, the cheats are getting caught". Every poster on this board with more than a cursory knowledge of this sports, understands this is utter ********.

Why would you come second, and lose the millions and the title as a Tour winner, to obviously doped Contador and Rass. It makes no sense, it contradicts known human behaviour.

I know Evans offers hackneyed soundbites on "I only worry about riding my own race, about riding my own tour, not worrying about anyone else. If I do my best tour, I will be satisfied".

Everyone knows that if you lose to a doper, you would be ******, and intimate it in not so many words.

Has Leipheimer ever whinged since Vino's DQ about losing 5th place in the 2005 Tour.

Why did everyone support Armstrong.

Please, human psychology betrays their guilt.

 

[poulidor]

A swiss lab reported that around a quarter of the riders have abnormal blood. And that is the most likely top-riders.
It's very probable the top 10 were all on blood doping, may I say the top 15 or 20...

 

[JAPANic]

Cadel Evans
Robbie McEwen
Brad McGee
Allan Davis
Michael Rogers
Nick Gates
Brett Lancaster
Simon Gerrans
Matt White
Stuart O'Grady
Baden Cooke

etc

are all taking Vegemite.

 

[mitosis]

I think the most damning piece of information, from those who know the sport, has nothing to do with Evans on the road.

It is to do with his quotes and his personality. He rarely pulls a punch, he will complain about something if he is ******, where others tow the line.

Evans is known as a whiner. He might be a hard guy, that is, capable of immense suffering on the bike, but that is not mutually exclusive to being a complainer.

He complains to the press.

Now why, when sport is all about winning, and rewards, and riches, does Evans say "the tests are working, the UCI is doing a good job, the cheats are getting caught". Every poster on this board with more than a cursory knowledge of this sports, understands this is utter ********.

Why would you come second, and lose the millions and the title as a Tour winner, to obviously doped Contador and Rass. It makes no sense, it contradicts known human behaviour.

I know Evans offers hackneyed soundbites on "I only worry about riding my own race, about riding my own tour, not worrying about anyone else. If I do my best tour, I will be satisfied".

Everyone knows that if you lose to a doper, you would be ******, and intimate it in not so many words.

Has Leipheimer ever whinged since Vino's DQ about losing 5th place in the 2005 Tour.

Why did everyone support Armstrong.

Please, human psychology betrays their guilt.

The poor guy is copping a bit of a hammering here. During the race he was criticised for not attacking. Now that he finished a strong second he is accused of being a doper. For not criticising other riders who have been accused of doping he is called a whiner. None of your comments, and you have quoted Evans, suggest he is complaining about anyone or anything.

He is a fairly typical Aussie in my opinion - doesn't talk himself up too much and doesn't put the opposition down, just gets on with his job. I can relate perfectly to him because I race in a similar grinding way (albeit at about 200W less).

He has a history of being an outstanding athlete, he hasn't jumped from the bottom of the peloton to the top in a short time and he looks absolutely rooted at the mountain top finishes where he was worked over by Rasmussen and Contador and he didn't once complain. In fact his typical response was that he did his best on the day, the other guys were too good and that he would see what he could do tomorrow - hardly whinging.

No, it won't be a huge surprise if he is doping, but I will be less surprised if he is clean. Everything you have written seems to point to that conclusion too.

As I have said before, if you go far enough into the pro ranks you will find someone competing with the best who is not taking PEDs. Don't be surprised if it is Evans.

 

[Frihed89]

So, it's agreed: any change in human performance in sports has nothing to do with "improvements" in training, equipment, competition, motivation. It's all due to drugs - 100%.

Is this the noble savage theory rearing its head against the ugly idea of man-made progress?

You're a bunch of Luddites.

 

[nns1400]

Agree that there are limits but I'd maintain that there is no reason why someone can't go a bit faster next year than he did last year - thanks mainly to the tech, health, nutrition etc etc. Further, (sorry creationists) we have evolved from the swamp and continue to evolve so the next generation should be stronger than the previous.

So, we know that Cadel has beaten other riders that are doping. But, were they all trying to win or just doping so they could sit on the front for 100km and pull their team leader. Just as much incentive for a domestique to dope as a team leader.

Don't get me wrong, I've been around the sport long enough to be as jaded and cynical as the next guy BUT I do believe Cadel is clean. Maybe it is deep seated patriotism or naivity, but something tells me it is possible to win clean and if anyone can do it.....

Wow, maybe they should put Cadel in the museum of natural history. I mean, he evolved into the most powerful cycling specimen, since like, last year. I guess evolution explains why the new young generation of riders is clean.

Barry Bonds is clearly still evolving since his own birth. His head got two sizes bigger in one decade.

 

[Serafino]

How many tests has Evans failed?

As many as Contador!

 

[Klodifan]

... Please, human psychology betrays their guilt.

very astute observation, thunder...

 

[Klodifan]

Cadel Evans
Robbie McEwen
Brad McGee
Allan Davis
Michael Rogers
Nick Gates
Brett Lancaster
Simon Gerrans
Matt White
Stuart O'Grady
Baden Cooke

etc

are all taking Vegemite.

LOL!

 

[Klodifan]

He has a history of being an outstanding athlete, he hasn't jumped from the bottom of the peloton to the top in a short time and he looks absolutely rooted at the mountain top finishes where he was worked over by Rasmussen and Contador and he didn't once complain. In fact his typical response was that he did his best on the day, the other guys were too good and that he would see what he could do tomorrow - hardly whinging.

actually, he complained quite a bit during this year's tour. he complained about astana not riding a smart tour and how kash wouldnt work with him. he also complained about being on a team that couldnt afford to get top quality super domestiques to help him in the mountains. he was so whiny each time he lost time, and cried if only my team had a bigger budget id be leading the pack, blah blah blah.

 

[mitosis]

Wow, maybe they should put Cadel in the museum of natural history. I mean, he evolved into the most powerful cycling specimen, since like, last year. I guess evolution explains why the new young generation of riders is clean.

Barry Bonds is clearly still evolving since his own birth. His head got two sizes bigger in one decade.

Good morning.

Are you sure you are not getting your threads mixed up.

One of my points about Evans is that there hasn't been a dramatic improvement or sudden peaks during his career, he is been consistently good.

The view that individuals evolve is one held by Lamarck - long discredited. The current view is that populations evolve.

 

[mitosis]

actually, he complained quite a bit during this year's tour. he complained about astana not riding a smart tour and how kash wouldnt work with him. he also complained about being on a team that couldnt afford to get top quality super domestiques to help him in the mountains. he was so whiny each time he lost time, and cried if only my team had a bigger budget id be leading the pack, blah blah blah.

Not in the interviews I heard. He mentioned the things in your post but it must depend on how listen to them as to whether you hear them as a complaint. I'm a glass half full person so maybe I heard it differently. There was no whine and no crying. Yes, it would be better if I had my team with me and yes, it would be good if we had a better climber but I did my best today and will try again tomorrow.

I'm not sure what you hope to gain by misrepresenting him.

 

[fbircher]

Good morning.

Are you sure you are not getting your threads mixed up.

One of my points about Evans is that there hasn't been a dramatic improvement or sudden peaks during his career, he is been consistently good.

The view that individuals evolve is one held by Lamarck - long discredited. The current view is that populations evolve.

The improvement over time that happens in many sports probably has far less to do with human evolution than it does with mastering the body of knowledge to optimize performance in that sport. As people learn the training techniques, competition strategies, nutrirional approaches, physical traits for the selection of ideal competitors, etc. that work best, then performance increases. In very mature sports that have been around for a long time (such as cycling), most of the low-hanging fruit (easy and legal ways to get big improvements) has been picked a long time ago, and we are at the point where those types of incremental knowledge gains shouldn't be delivering huge improvements over short periods of time. Cycling has been around for along time, and according to Lemond the understanding of how to train effectively has been been quite good for quite some time.