Campag Shamal (1994 vintage) 8speed to 10/11 speed?

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by swampy1970, Nov 2, 2010.

  1. swampy1970

    swampy1970 Well-Known Member

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    I have a pair of old Shamals that I used to time trial on. Great wheels but I've no use for 8 speed and I aint buying another bike just to run 8 speed on...

    So, my question is...

    Is there a Campagnolo or aftermarket way of updating these wheels to 10 (pref Shimano) or 11 speed?
     
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  2. Peter@vecchios

    [email protected] New Member

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    Only way is to get a 1997, early 1998 9s Record or Chorus freehub body. The ones just before Record and Chorus went to a oversized aluminum axle. The ones made for 12mm axles, steel and titanium. Another way is to get a 1997/8 Athena freehub AND axle, since it used a different axle than Record/Chorus. BUT is the hub is HPW, straight pull spokes, with the freehub offset way into the hub shell, 11s will probably hit the hub body..OK for 10s tho.

    BTW 2004(+/-) Centaur hubs use the same aluminum axle as Record/Chorus, have since 1999(Daytona). Veloce/Mirage use a steel axle. AND that steel axle is made specifically for the cartridge bearing hub, different than the steel axle in Athena, Daytona, Record and Chorus. Cannot use Mirage/Veloce freehub on the cup and ball hub type Campagnolo hub.

    BUT if you want to use a Campagnolo 10s cogset see above. If HPW, 11s Campagnolo probably will hit the shell.
     
  3. alfeng

    alfeng Well-Known Member

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    Quote:

    Is there a Campagnolo or aftermarket way of updating these wheels to 10 (pref Shimano) or 11 speed?


    FWIW. IMO, some people like to suggest that they are more knowledgeable than they actually are-or-should-be when, in truth, they can only speak gorgonzola ... and, due to the limited scope of their knowledge their suggestions do not cover the gamut of possibilities which can be investigated to bring your 1994 Shamal wheelset (or, other components) into the 21st Century ...

    You can believe them, or you can read further ...

    THE FREE SOLUTION. Okay, it's only "free" if you have a non-Shimano, Shimano-compatible rear hub to cannibalize AND you have the skill-and-capability to DIY ...

    I (will) presume that the1994 Shamal rear wheel also has what I will refer to as a "big bell" rear hub shell & that its parts are interchangeable with other "big bell" Campagnolo hubs.

    So, here's an old, "big bell" Record hub onto which I transplanted a non-Shimano, Shimano-compatible Freehub body because my LBS was unable-or-unwilling to order replacement bearings for the original Freehub body.

    [​IMG]
     
    N.B. The diameter of the pawls engagement circumference MAY be different from hub brand to hub brand AND some trial-and-error may be involved.

    Subsequent investigation revealed that the particular Freehub did NOT work in a different Campagnolo hub shell whose planetary ring's engaging teeth (for want of a better description) were not worn because the Campagnolo engaging ring's inner circumference must be about 0.5mm (?) smaller than the Shimano compatible hub's engaging ring BUT the teeth on the particular hub which is pictured above were worn enough to allow the pawls to pass the engaging teeth.
     
    The inner diameter of the bearings in the particular Freehub body's cartridge bearings must be the same size -- presumably, 10mm.

    The freewheeling isn't as smooth as it would be if I were more inspired ... but, it works.

    That is, if I wanted to make the hub smoother OR if I wanted to use the particular freehub body on a hub whose engagement teeth were newer, then I could-and-would reduce the length of the pawls by an infinitesimal amount (trial-and-error).

    THE $30+ SOLUTION. Now, if you aren't the hoity-toity type who never looks at anything below Chorus (in the past, and Athena, now), you will observe that the circa 2004 (+/-) Centaur/Veloce/Mirage rear hub carries on the legacy of the "big bell" rear hub shell.

    Although I haven't had a reason to disassemble one of the fore mentioned Centaur/Veloce/Mirage rear hubs, I would bet dollars-to-donuts that I could sleeve the Freehub & axle onto & into either the hubshell pictured above OR your Shamal's rear hub.


    • REMEMBER. THE PAWLS ARE LOOSE!

    So, if you wanted to simply update your rear wheel to allow it to use 9-/10-/11-speed Campagnolo cassettes, transplanting the Freehub body from a recent, "big bell" Mirage-or-better rear hub should work ... but, NO GUARANTEES.

    THE $80 SOLUTION. JENSON used to carry the following freehub body to convert a Campagnolo hub to a Shimano compatible hub:

    [​IMG]

    I didn't pay that much attention to it so I don't know which axle size this is meant to fit ... or, if they have both sizes available.


    It used to cost $80 ... maybe, it costs more now ... maybe, it costs less. If JENSON'S doesn't carry it, then someone does.

    ALSO, I had previously seen (on eBay) a two-pawl, Shimano-compatible Freehub body which was presumably "old stock" & appeared to have been designed for the older rear hubs which have a standard 10mm axle ... they were selling for about $50 at the time.


    OTHER SOLUTIONS. There are other solutions ...

    If WHEELS MANUFACTURING doesn't make spacers, then you can probably fabricate some by shaving the thickness to a reduced amount that is closer to 2.0mm or substitute BB spacers which were once avaialbe in varying widths ...


    • that is, 1.9mm + 2.0mm == 3.9mm == half-way between 10-and-11-speed Campagnolo spacing ... adjust, accordingly.
    Also:

    • A 10-speed Campagnlo shifter + 8-/9-speed Shimano rear derailleur == 8-speed indexing.

    If you remount the rear cable in the equivalent of position 'A' (in Shimano parlance) on a Campagnolo rear derailleur, it should slug a 9-/10-speed Campagnolo rear derailleur to 8-speed indexing -- the older (circa 2000 Chorus) rear derailleur's anchoring "washer" appeared to have been made to facilitate that anchoring even though I don't recall that it was documented ... maybe, it was.

    I have no doubt that there are other resolutions!
     
  4. alfeng

    alfeng Well-Known Member

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    Quote:
    BTW 2004(+/-) Centaur hubs use the same aluminum axle as Record/Chorus, have since 1999(Daytona). Veloce/Mirage use a steel axle.


    So much the better ... swampy1970/whomever can limit his/her rear, donor-hub choice to a less expensive, "big bell" Veloce/Mirage/whatever hub rather than paying a premium for a Centaur-or-better rear hub.
     
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