Campy Ergo Record vs. Chorus Question



D

D'ohBoy

Guest
With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

TIA

D'ohBoy
 
A

Allan Leedy

Guest
I've got Record shifters on one bike, Chorus on two others. My observation
would be that they both start out somewhat stiff and soften as the springs
wear. The springs are replaceable, and replacing them restores the original
stiffness (and quickness) of the shifts. If your father likes Ultegra, why
not acknowledge that?


On 7/11/07 7:31 AM, in article
[email protected], "D'ohBoy"
<[email protected]> wrote:

> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
> click than my Chorus.
>
> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
> extra cash.
>
> TIA
>
> D'ohBoy
>
 
C

Colin Campbell

Guest
Sons and daughters, don't let your father get stuck with Shimano! Get
'em the good stuff.

A couple I ride with went from Treks with Shimano to Italian bikes
(Pinarello for her, Colnago for him) with Campagnolo earlier this year.
They both like the "Italian junk", as he calls it.

I've been converted since 1995. I have to stop and think about how to
shift Shimano equipped bikes when I try to help someone who is in the
wrong gear.

Allan Leedy wrote:
> I've got Record shifters on one bike, Chorus on two others. My observation
> would be that they both start out somewhat stiff and soften as the springs
> wear. The springs are replaceable, and replacing them restores the original
> stiffness (and quickness) of the shifts. If your father likes Ultegra, why
> not acknowledge that?
>
>
> On 7/11/07 7:31 AM, in article
> [email protected], "D'ohBoy"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
>> click than my Chorus.
>>
>> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
>> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
>> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
>> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
>> extra cash.
>>
>> TIA
>>
>> D'ohBoy
>>

>
 
J

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman

Guest
Colin Campbell TOP POSTED:
> Sons and daughters, don't let your father get stuck with Shimano! Get
> 'em the good stuff.


Go SRAM!!!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
 
Q

Qui si parla Campagnolo

Guest
On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
> click than my Chorus.
>
> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
> extra cash.
>
> TIA
>
> D'ohBoy


Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
the same.
 
Q

Qui si parla Campagnolo

Guest
On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
> click than my Chorus.
>
> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
> extra cash.
>
> TIA
>
> D'ohBoy


Related to another poster, It is 'nice' that Sram is changing their
design already, particularly the FD, but disappointing that they
didn't do this at the first go. Sram works well enough but the FD
action and the foldable big ring(both corrected in 'Red') should have
been corrected with first gen Force and Rival.

OEM is seeing lots of Sram and we have had a Sram group early on onto
a bike but interest has been 'slow' with no new bikes with it from our
shop(no bikes OEM here, thanks).
 
B

Bill

Guest
"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Colin Campbell TOP POSTED:
> > Sons and daughters, don't let your father get stuck with Shimano! Get
> > 'em the good stuff.

>
> Go SRAM!!!
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
>

Went SRAM on a new bike this spring. Been riding STI since the first DuraAce
8 speed. Much to my surprise, I find my STI equipped bikes totally
non-intuitive. Double tap really works and seems natural.
Bill
 
D

D'ohBoy

Guest
On Jul 11, 7:51 pm, Allan Leedy <[email protected]> wrote (in part):
> If your father likes Ultegra, why
> not acknowledge that?


He fell in love with my Campy one day. His Ultegra is crapping out on
him, and he wants something better.

D'ohBoy
 
B

Bill Westphal

Guest
Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email protected]> writes:

> On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email protected]> wrote:
>> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
>> click than my Chorus.
>>
>> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
>> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
>> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
>> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
>> extra cash.
>>
>> TIA
>>
>> D'ohBoy

>


Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
bikerides in traffic.

> Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
> teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
> carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
> the same.


Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.
I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
"penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
to rebuild when you cable change.

Bill Westphal
 
Q

Qui si parla Campagnolo

Guest
On Jul 13, 2:23 am, Bill Westphal <[email protected]> wrote:
> Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email protected]> writes:
>
> > On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
> >> click than my Chorus.

>
> >> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
> >> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
> >> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
> >> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
> >> extra cash.

>
> >> TIA

>
> >> D'ohBoy

>
> Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
> stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
> first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
> really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
> Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
> bikerides in traffic.
>
> > Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
> > teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
> > carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
> > the same.

>
> Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.


errrr, the Chorus 10s disc costs the same as the Record one and the
fiber spring carrier is $5 more($15 vs $10)..Hardly a fortune.


> I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
> versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
> "penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
> very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
> they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
> other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
> so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
> to rebuild when you cable change.
>
> Bill Westphal
 
B

Bill Westphal

Guest
Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email protected]> writes:

> On Jul 13, 2:23 am, Bill Westphal <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email protected]> writes:
>>
>> > On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
>> >> click than my Chorus.

>>
>> >> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
>> >> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
>> >> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
>> >> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
>> >> extra cash.

>>
>> >> TIA

>>
>> >> D'ohBoy

>>
>> Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
>> stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
>> first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
>> really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
>> Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
>> bikerides in traffic.
>>
>> > Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
>> > teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
>> > carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
>> > the same.

>>
>> Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.

>
> errrr, the Chorus 10s disc costs the same as the Record one and the
> fiber spring carrier is $5 more($15 vs $10)..Hardly a fortune.
>
>
>> I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
>> versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
>> "penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
>> very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
>> they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
>> other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
>> so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
>> to rebuild when you cable change.
>>
>> Bill Westphal



The "fortune" was coming from memory. I took notes when I did the
shifter job, and attach below. Somewhere in here there is a "fortune"
to be made by Campy/Branford for saving me mere grams. I thought them
too greedy with their "recommendations", so I outsmarted them, and no
one got a nickel:

* branford bike order, spoke with new owner Rod Wagner Mon, 04/23/07
(206)323-1218

campagnolo blue ergo manual 1998-current $4.88
cost to rebuild a lever: $55 for parts, $40-$50 for labor

"We recommend replacing the
- G springs,
- Ergo Index gear,
- Thumb Button spring and
- Ergo Coil
spring when rebuilding a right side lever."

What about left side lever?
Can I use improved record parts for centaur rebuild, such as

"Teflon coated, Ergo Index gear for smoother shifting and a carbon
polymer, G spring carrier for greater durability

"You can upgrade any 1999 to current right hand 10 speed Ergo shifter
to Ultra shifting by simply replacing the above three parts

- ultra 01 index gear
- carbon carrier teflon washer
- carbon G Spring Carrier

Is the ultra 10 just a lightweight 10? difference in price 54 vs 44

Right side:


(from campy ergo lever parts - 1, 2, 3 and 4)
thumb button return spring right EC-RE215 $ 5.88
thumb button return lever right EC-RE204 $24.88
G spring right EC-RE-209 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76

(from campy ergo lever parts - 5 and 6)
finger shift lever return right EC-RE137 $ 5.88
ultra 10 index gear right EC-RE161 $54.88
-or
10 index gear right EC-RE061 $44.88
carbon G spring carrier right EC-RE065 $15.88
carbon G Spring Carrier
teflon coated bushing EC-RE157 $ 3.88

alloy G Spring Carrier right EC-RE111 $ 9.88

(from campy ergo lever parts - 14, 15, 18 and 19)
coil spring right EC-RE055 $ 9.88

Left side:

(from campy ergo lever parts - 1, 2, 3 and 4)
thumb button return spring left EC-RE216 $ 5.88
thumb button return lever left EC-RE205 $24.88
G spring left EC-RE-210 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76

(from campy ergo lever parts - 5 and 6)
finger shift lever return left EC-RE138 $5.88
ergo (ultra) index gear left EC-RE314 $39.88
ultra carbon G spring carrier left EC-RE066 $15.88

alloy G Spring Carrier left EC-RE112 $ 9.88

(from campy ergo lever parts - 14, 15, 18 and 19)
coil spring left EC-RE054 $ 9.88

--recommended for replacement by Branford Bike:

* thumb button return spring right EC-RE215 $ 5.88
* thumb button return spring left EC-RE216 $ 5.88
thumb button return lever right EC-RE204 $24.88
thumb button return lever left EC-RE205 $24.88
* G spring right EC-RE-209 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
* G spring left EC-RE-210 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
finger shift lever return left EC-RE138 $ 5.88
finger shift lever return right EC-RE137 $ 5.88
* ultra 10 index gear EC-RE161 $54.88
* carbon G spring carrier right EC-RE065 $15.88
* carbon G Spring Carrier right
teflon coated bushing EC-RE157 $ 3.88
* ergo (ultra) index gear left EC-RE314 $39.88
* ultra carbon G spring carrier left EC-RE066 $15.88
* coil spring right EC-RE055 $ 9.88
* coil spring left EC-RE054 $ 9.88

5.88+5.88+24.88+24.88+11.76+11.76+5.88+5.88+54.88+15.88+3.88+39.88+15.88+9.88+9.88
=$246.96

remove 2 return levers @ 24.88 * 2 = 49.76
246.96-49.76
=$197.20

only the starred, which meet criteria recommendation:
- G springs,
- Ergo Index gear,
- Thumb Button spring and
- Ergo Coil

5.88+5.88+11.76+11.76+54.88+15.88+3.88+39.88+15.88+9.88+9.88
= 185.44

ordering only replacement parts recommended for right shifter

* thumb button return spring right EC-RE215 $ 5.88
* G spring right EC-RE-209 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
* ultra 10 index gear EC-RE161 $54.88
* carbon G spring carrier right EC-RE065 $15.88
* carbon G Spring Carrier right
teflon coated bushing EC-RE157 $ 3.88
* coil spring right EC-RE055 $ 9.88

5.88+11.76+54.88+15.88+3.88+9.88
= $102.16

for left shifter, only get these:

* thumb button return spring left EC-RE216 $ 5.88
* G spring left EC-RE-210 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
* coil spring left EC-RE054 $ 9.88
(leave out the very expensive Ergo Index gear)
5.88+11.76+9.88
= $27.52

total:
102.16 + 27.52
= $129.68

How much for replacement ergolevers?

2007 QS Chorus Ergo ebay: $224.95 buy-it-now

lickbike: Centaur 2006 10sp $189.88 + shipping = $197
Universal:
Centaur Ergo: $161 backordered
Chorus: $253 backordered (photo of silver 9s), higher price than 10s record
Record $243 in stock

think about order from Licktons:
 
Q

Qui si parla Campagnolo

Guest
On Jul 13, 11:07 am, Bill Westphal <[email protected]> wrote:
> Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email protected]> writes:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 13, 2:23 am, Bill Westphal <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email protected]> writes:

>
> >> > On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
> >> >> click than my Chorus.

>
> >> >> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
> >> >> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
> >> >> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
> >> >> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
> >> >> extra cash.

>
> >> >> TIA

>
> >> >> D'ohBoy

>
> >> Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
> >> stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
> >> first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
> >> really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
> >> Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
> >> bikerides in traffic.

>
> >> > Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
> >> > teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
> >> > carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
> >> > the same.

>
> >> Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.

>
> > errrr, the Chorus 10s disc costs the same as the Record one and the
> > fiber spring carrier is $5 more($15 vs $10)..Hardly a fortune.

>
> >> I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
> >> versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
> >> "penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
> >> very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
> >> they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
> >> other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
> >> so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
> >> to rebuild when you cable change.

>
> >> Bill Westphal

>
> The "fortune" was coming from memory. I took notes when I did the
> shifter job, and attach below. Somewhere in here there is a "fortune"
> to be made by Campy/Branford for saving me mere grams. I thought them
> too greedy with their "recommendations", so I outsmarted them, and no
> one got a nickel:
>
> * branford bike order, spoke with new owner Rod Wagner Mon, 04/23/07
> (206)323-1218
>
> campagnolo blue ergo manual 1998-current $4.88
> cost to rebuild a lever: $55 for parts, $40-$50 for labor
>
> "We recommend replacing the
> - G springs,
> - Ergo Index gear,
> - Thumb Button spring and
> - Ergo Coil
> spring when rebuilding a right side lever."


That's the problem. All you need is the shift springs. AND maybe the
spring carrier if it's broken. Never have replaced a shift disc, never
seen one wear out, in 17 years of OVH-ing these levers. The other
springs don't wear out, certainly not the coil spring.
>
> What about left side lever?
> Can I use improved record parts for centaur rebuild, such as
>
> "Teflon coated, Ergo Index gear for smoother shifting and a carbon
> polymer, G spring carrier for greater durability
>
> "You can upgrade any 1999 to current right hand 10 speed Ergo shifter
> to Ultra shifting by simply replacing the above three parts
>
> - ultra 01 index gear
> - carbon carrier teflon washer
> - carbon G Spring Carrier


To upgrade you need the shift disc and front toothed bushing..NOT the
spring carrier at all.

>
> Is the ultra 10 just a lightweight 10? difference in price 54 vs 44
>
> think about order from Licktons:


Or anybody else that actually OVHes these things, not just MO to get
your $