Campy mirage hub questions

[rwinthenorth]

Questions regarding repacking these hubs. I might of let them go a little longer then they should. There is some discoloration inside the bell area and I'm wondering is it a safety issue or a noise issue if I repack this hub and use it. I haven't yet delved into the rear hub. So far, it's quite back there. The hubs have about 1600 miles on them. Also, how many miles do you guys recommend each time to regrease/pack these hubs. The Sheldon Brown site wasn't clear on a schedule.
Has anyone figured out a way to seal this front hub? It seems wide open to me which might be the reason it looks oxidized. All Thoughts Welcomed. Thanks.

 

[p38lightning]

What year are your hubs? The latest ones use cartridge bearings. See the repair instructions and parts catalogs on the official website:http://www.campagnolo.com/info.php
The parts catalogs give exploded views of assemblies which I often find as beneficial as their repair instructions. The text of many of them seem to have been translated from Italian to French, German, Russian, Aramaic, Finno-Ubric,and Dravidian before finally ending up in English! Their Torque recommendations are always worth knowing. Rebuild schedule is a matter of mileage, typical use, terrain, rider weight and strength, and ultimately the nit pick and paranoid nature of the rider, all rather non-specific. I do it once a year with good results, as everything is holding up well. Use synthetic grease only, Campy recommends this. Let some of the grease that oozes out of the hubs stay there, as this acts as a barrier for grit. Watch the water pressure when you wash your bike. In an email from Campy they said that water from washing getting in the hubs was more destructive than infrequent service.

 

[rwinthenorth]

What year are your hubs? The latest ones use cartridge bearings. See the repair instructions and parts catalogs on the official website:http://www.campagnolo.com/info.php
The parts catalogs give exploded views of assemblies which I often find as beneficial as their repair instructions. The text of many of them seem to have been translated from Italian to French, German, Russian, Aramaic, Finno-Ubric,and Dravidian before finally ending up in English! Their Torque recommendations are always worth knowing. Rebuild schedule is a matter of mileage, typical use, terrain, rider weight and strength, and ultimately the nit pick and paranoid nature of the rider, all rather non-specific. I do it once a year with good results, as everything is holding up well. Use synthetic grease only, Campy recommends this. Let some of the grease that oozes out of the hubs stay there, as this acts as a barrier for grit. Watch the water pressure when you wash your bike. In an email from Campy they said that water from washing getting in the hubs was more destructive than infrequent service.

Where do you get the synthetic grease? LBS? What do you think of general weight automotive grease?

 

[alfeng]

Where do you get the synthetic grease? LBS? What do you think of general weight automotive grease?

You know, I had a similar inclination, once ... I packed a rear hub AND a BB with heavy weight RED automotive grease (you know, super wateproof, super-duper, etc.) -- I thought I could subsequently extend the time between hub/BB maintenance. I realized the amount of resistance was so "high" (you may think otherwise) that I repacked BOTH almost immediately.

I used to use Phil Wood GREEN grease. To that, I would now say "Why bother?"

If you want to use an "automotive" grease (or, one that you would buy from Autozone, et al), I recommend that you opt for a WHITE (lithium?) grease for your wheel & BB bearings (the latter, when applicable) ... fairly lightweight stuff which I believe is the basis for Campagnolo's highly regarded bearing grease (it's off-white in color) OR you could spend big-bucks to buy some Campy bearing grease. I now use the "white" grease for hub bearings.

As far as frequency of repacking the bearings, once a season OR every 5,000 miles should be "okay" ... whichever you're inclined toward ... unless you threw your bike into a silty river/lake, recently.

I know one person who might have had 15,000-to-20,000+ miles on his bottom bracket (the older, caged bearing style) WITHOUT ever repacking the bearings! He would have EVEN MORE miles on the BB, but he finally put an Octalink crank on the bike a few of seasons ago. Maybe his BB was packed with some of the RED grease ... I doubt it. Oh, and I don't think he has ever serviced the 8-speed Dura Ace hubs which he is still using!

I'm not sure what you mean by "discoloration" ... I have ONE Mirage hub which is basically the same as a Record hub (sans oil hole) from about 12 years ago. The discoloration may simply be grease which has bled from the hub & subsequently varnished on the hub ... OR, some road grime. Put some FORMULA 409 on a paper towel, and see if it will wipe off.

Now, with regard to repacking Campagnolo hubs -- the CAVEAT is that you need to know that the pawls (there are three) ARE NOT attached to the freehub body the way they seem to be with Asian variants of the same design that I've seen ... that is, when you slide the Campagnolo freehub body off the driveside of the axle, one-to-three of the pawls MAY fall away from the hub and onto whatever surface is below the wheel ... so, WORK ABOVE A BOX to catch the pawls. Reinstallation of the freehub is facilitated by strapping the pawls down with some dental floss which you will unwind from the freehub just before pushing the freehub the last couple of millimeters into the hub body -- it took me about a half-dozen failed (and, FRUSTRATING) re-installations of the freehub body to figure out that the pawls had to be strapped down ... my subsequent impression is that using floss is apparently a way "everyone" has independently deduced to handle holding the pawls on the Campagnolo freehub during re-installation. Of course, Campagnolo may use a something more sophisticated than floss during "factory" assembly, or not!?!

Save the general weight automotive grease for your headset bearings.

 

[John M]

White lithium grease is fine-used it for years. I do use Phil grease because it is easy to dispense from the tube, which lasts me a few years so the added cost isn't that big of a deal.

Sounds like you have the older conventional cup/cone Mirage hubs. These are not sealed and are susceptible to contamination. I would not go by a strict mileage cut off for repacking but rather repack when needed. If you ride in dry non-dusty conditions that could be 10K miles. If you ride in wet, crappy conditions like I do here in Seattle during winter, it is every few months or so.

If the races are smooth (cup and cone races) then don't worry about discoloration. It is expected that you will see a polished track in the hub race where the bearings run. If there is roughness, scoring, or pitting, then the damaged part (races or cones) should be replaced, as well as the bearings. Replacement Campy races and cones are available. They will be expensive to order through your LBS, but can be obtained online through AEBike, Branford Bike, or Airbomb (probably others as well) for a little less. Mirage, Veloce, and older Campy Record are interchangeable. You don't need the ultra expensive Campy bearings.

If you don't have obvious damage to the race/cone surfaces, I would suggest repacking yours with new grease and see how smooth they are. It may be good enough for training or commuting. If the cones or bearings are bad, they will eventually damage the hub races.

 

[rwinthenorth]

You know, I had a similar inclination, once ... I packed a rear hub AND a BB with heavy weight RED automotive grease (you know, super wateproof, super-duper, etc.) -- I thought I could subsequently extend the time between hub/BB maintenance. I realized the amount of resistance was so "high" (you may think otherwise) that I repacked BOTH almost immediately.

I used to use Phil Wood GREEN grease. To that, I would now say "Why bother?"

If you want to use an "automotive" grease (or, one that you would buy from Autozone, et al), I recommend that you opt for a WHITE (lithium?) grease for your wheel & BB bearings (the latter, when applicable) ... fairly lightweight stuff which I believe is the basis for Campagnolo's highly regarded bearing grease (it's off-white in color) OR you could spend big-bucks to buy some Campy bearing grease. I now use the "white" grease for hub bearings.

As far as frequency of repacking the bearings, once a season OR every 5,000 miles should be "okay" ... whichever you're inclined toward ... unless you threw your bike into a silty river/lake, recently.

I know one person who might have had 15,000-to-20,000+ miles on his bottom bracket (the older, caged bearing style) WITHOUT ever repacking the bearings! He would have EVEN MORE miles on the BB, but he finally put an Octalink crank on the bike a few of seasons ago. Maybe his BB was packed with some of the RED grease ... I doubt it. Oh, and I don't think he has ever serviced the 8-speed Dura Ace hubs which he is still using!

I'm not sure what you mean by "discoloration" ... I have ONE Mirage hub which is basically the same as a Record hub (sans oil hole) from about 12 years ago. The discoloration may simply be grease which has bled from the hub & subsequently varnished on the hub ... OR, some road grime. Put some FORMULA 409 on a paper towel, and see if it will wipe off.

Now, with regard to repacking Campagnolo hubs -- the CAVEAT is that you need to know that the pawls (there are three) ARE NOT attached to the freehub body the way they seem to be with Asian variants of the same design that I've seen ... that is, when you slide the Campagnolo freehub body off the driveside of the axle, one-to-three of the pawls MAY fall away from the hub and onto whatever surface is below the wheel ... so, WORK ABOVE A BOX to catch the pawls. Reinstallation of the freehub is facilitated by strapping the pawls down with some dental floss which you will unwind from the freehub just before pushing the freehub the last couple of millimeters into the hub body -- it took me about a half-dozen failed (and, FRUSTRATING) re-installations of the freehub body to figure out that the pawls had to be strapped down ... my subsequent impression is that using floss is apparently a way "everyone" has independently deduced to handle holding the pawls on the Campagnolo freehub during re-installation. Of course, Campagnolo may use a something more sophisticated than floss during "factory" assembly, or not!?!

Save the general weight automotive grease for your headset bearings.

Thanks for all that info. The discoloration is smooth but looks like oxidation. I'll just repack with lithium grease and see what happens. Looks like the rear hub might be challenging enough to drop it at the LBS. I'm not sure I have the time or patience for it. Thanks though for the great descriptions of all things wheel hubs.

 

[alfeng]

Thanks for all that info. The discoloration is smooth but looks like oxidation. I'll just repack with lithium grease and see what happens. Looks like the rear hub might be challenging enough to drop it at the LBS. I'm not sure I have the time or patience for it. Thanks though for the great descriptions of all things wheel hubs.

It isn't as difficult as it probably sounds to re-install the freehub ONCE YOU KNOW that the pawls have to be strapped down, momentarily ...

AND, I guess it may not be obvious to someone who hasn't already looked at a Campagnolo rear hub assembly, but the driveside bearings are inboard (essentially, inside the flange edge of the "bell" housing on the hub body). The Campagnolo freehub does have some small cartridge bearings which are non-serviceable (for all practical purposes).

BTW. I completely agree about the convenience of a squeeze tube. Fortunately for me, the white "lithium" grease I buy comes in a large, squeeze tubes with a screw-top ... no need for a grease gun!

 

[p38lightning]

I agree with the other posters in what they have advised. Many bicycle greases are synthetic, Pedro's Syn, Phil Wood, Polylube, it will say on the tube. I like alfeng's dental floss techneque for holding down the pawls, I have the Campy wire tool most people don't. Campy grease is no longer available. The torque on the freehub side nut is only about 2.5 foot pounds (that's why the set screw) as it bears against the freehub outer cartridge bearing. Watch your step here. One more link is the Campy Only website:http://www.campyonly.com/ Lots of links and good stuff to the members of the "Campy Cult" Best of luck.