Campy Triple Ring Question?

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Tom, Feb 19, 2004.

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  1. Tom

    Tom Guest

    I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a
    13/26 rear cog. I am a 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would like
    to have more gears for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14% grades.

    What is the simplest and cheapest modification to my set up to get the desired relief on the
    mountains? I heard of someone putting 26 on the front ring in lieu of the 30; but, I am not an
    expert on these things and need some advice.

    Thanks

    Tom
     
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  2. Tom wrote:
    > I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a 13/26 rear cog. I am a
    > 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would like to have more gears
    > for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14% grades.
    >
    > What is the simplest and cheapest modification to my set up to get the desired relief on the
    > mountains? I heard of someone putting 26 on the front ring in lieu of the 30; but, I am not an
    > expert on these things and need some advice.
    >
    > Thanks
    >
    > Tom

    That's one possibility. I have mine set up with 50/39/26 and it works fine (even without ramps and
    pins). The other is to switch your 13/26 cassette for Veloce 13(?)/29. Doing both will give you some
    seriously low gears but you'll probably find that your chain drags on the derailleur cage if you're
    using the 26 granny and any cog smaller than 20 or so on the rear.

    Rob Strickland
     
  3. In article <[email protected]>,
    Tom <tomhob(nospam)@overland.net> wrote:
    >I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a
    >13/26 rear cog. I am a 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would like
    > to have more gears for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14% grades.

    I have set up several bikes recently using Campy 13/28 9-speed (Veloce cogset) or 13/29 10-speed,
    with 28/40/50 gearing in front, works great. Probably the 26/39/52 would shift OK as well, although
    there is some benefit to shifting when you switch to the 50t big ring.

    --Paul
     
  4. Tom

    Tom Guest

    Paul,

    I should have said my bike is a 9spd Campy triple. I have a 13/29 cog on my double ring Campy bike;
    but, didn't know they made a 13/28 for my 9spd Campy triple setup. Sounds to me like changing to
    that cog and/or adding the 26 up front could make a real difference.

    Tom

    "Paul Southworth" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:p[email protected]
    read.news.verio.net...
    >> I have set up several bikes recently using Campy 13/28 9-speed
    > (Veloce cogset) or 13/29 10-speed, with 28/40/50 gearing in front, works great. Probably the
    > 26/39/52 would shift OK as well, although there is some benefit to shifting when you switch to the
    > 50t big ring.
    >
    > --Paul
     
  5. Tom wrote:

    > I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a
    > 13/26 rear cog. I am a 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would
    > like to have more gears for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14%
    > grades.
    >
    > What is the simplest and cheapest modification to my set up to get the desired relief on the
    > mountains? I heard of someone putting 26 on the front ring in lieu of the 30

    Bingo!

    See: http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/chainrings.html#74 for details.

    Sheldon "30 Isn't A Granny" Brown Evanston, Illinois +------------------------------------------------
    +
    | You can get more with a kind word and a gun | than you can with a kind word alone. | -- Al
    | Capone |
    +------------------------------------------------+ Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts Phone
    617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041 http://harriscyclery.com Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
    http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com
     
  6. On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 16:44:52 -0600, Tom wrote:

    > Paul,
    >
    > I should have said my bike is a 9spd Campy triple. I have a 13/29 cog on my double ring Campy
    > bike; but, didn't know they made a 13/28 for my 9spd Campy triple setup. Sounds to me like
    > changing to that cog and/or adding the 26 up front could make a real difference.

    Well, using a wider cassette will increase the size of the jumps, and a 26 versus the 30 won't get
    you all that much. For less money you can probably get a cheap mountain-bike crankset and bottom
    bracket. That will give you maybe a 22 granny (great-granny?). I use this for touring, and leave
    granny home for other rides.

    --

    David L. Johnson

    __o | To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or _`\(,_ | that we are to
    stand by the president right or wrong, is not only (_)/ (_) | unpatriotic and servile, but is
    morally treasonable to the American public. --Theodore Roosevelt
     
  7. In article <[email protected]>,
    Tom <tomhob(nospam)@overland.net> wrote:
    >Paul,
    >
    >I should have said my bike is a 9spd Campy triple. I have a 13/29 cog on my double ring Campy bike;
    >but, didn't know they made a 13/28 for my 9spd Campy triple setup. Sounds to me like changing to
    >that cog and/or adding the 26 up front could make a real difference.

    Yes if you put a 28 in back, using a 28 in front would still give you a nice low gear and would
    probably shift better in front than the 26t chainring would.

    You could also use this as an opportunity to standardize your bikes and make the wheels
    interchangeable - replace the shift disk in your 9-speed shifter with a 10-speed one, get the 13/29
    cassette and a 10 speed chain. Then when you have a problem with a wheel on one bike, just grab the
    rear wheel off the other bike.

    People sometimes make a big deal out of the difference between 9 and 10 speed derailleurs, cranks,
    etc. but in reality the difference is not enough to matter unless the the parts are excessively worn
    or damaged.

    --Paul
     
  8. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    Tom wrote:
    > I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a 13/26 rear cog. I am a
    > 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would like to have more gears
    > for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14% grades.
    >
    > What is the simplest and cheapest modification to my set up to get the desired relief on the
    > mountains? I heard of someone putting 26 on the front ring in lieu of the 30; but, I am not an
    > expert on these things and need some advice.

    13-28 or 14-28 cassette would be the easiest and cheapest improvement but not necessarily the very
    best. I suggest first changing the inner chainring to 28, 27 or 26T* - seeing how that feels - then
    changing the cassette as well if necessary. I've done similar (with Campag) - it really is worth the
    trouble and expense.

    By the way, also changing the outer ring to 50T would help with front derailleur setup and could
    possibly enable the chain to be shortened (helps bottom gear) - but won't be essential.

    * 28T would be best in terms of shifting performance, inner/middle difference and minimal risk of
    complication but 26 (what I use) is significantly lower. 27 might be a neat compromise (and
    Specialtes TA do make this size). Note. Crank would have to be removed to fit anything smaller
    than 32T. 24T is the minimum that would fit (although difference from middle is rather crazy with
    it; I've tried it). Stronglight and Shimano make some cheaper suitable 74mm inner rings if the
    expense is a concern.

    ~PB
     
  9. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    I wrote:
    > 13-28 or 14-28 cassette would be the easiest and cheapest improvement but not necessarily the very
    > best. I suggest first changing the inner chainring to 28, 27 or 26T* - seeing how that feels -
    > then changing the cassette as well if necessary.

    On second thoughts, I don't see the harm in changing the cassette first, especially if to a 14-28.
    Having a 52T outer ring makes the 14T a decent top gear, and the gears would be no more widely
    spaced than what you have now Tom. However, it won't make a massive difference on its own. You
    probably will want to change the granny ring as well later. An extra link in the chain may be
    required but hopefully not, with a bit of luck. 14-28 9-speed option was introduced in 2003 to
    Veloce, I think.

    ~PB
     
  10. Tom-<< I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a
    13/26 rear cog. I am a 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would like
    to have more gears for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14% grades.
    >><BR><BR> << What is the simplest and cheapest modification to my set up to get the desired
    relief on the mountains? I heard of someone putting 26 on the front ring in lieu of the 30; but,
    I am not an expert on these things and need some advice. >><BR><BR>

    yes, a 26t small ring and a larger than 26t rear cog. If you are 9s, a 13-28, if you are 10s a 13-
    29. If you are 8s, 28t cogs are available as well.

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (14)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  11. See my response in the thread titled "Long Cage Campag". It applies to your problem too.

    Something I did not mention in the other thread is to fix your rear 9 speed cassette. Assuming it is
    the 13-26 Veloce loose cog set, and not the higher priced bolted together on carriers Chorus 13-26
    cassette. You can buy a 28 tooth 9 speed cog from QBP for $20 and put it on instead of your 26.
    Harris Cyclery sells the loose 28 tooth QBP cog. It will give you a 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-28
    cassette. When I need the big cog in back, I really need it. So I like having good gaps between
    gears up until the need for the big cog. The normal 13-28 Veloce cassette directly from Campagnolo
    has much poorer gear spacing than the "custom" version I just described.

    "Tom" <tomhob(nospam)@overland.net> wrote in message news:<[email protected]
    berlin.de>...
    > I have a nice Landshark with a Campy triple ring set up as 52/39/30 and a
    > 13/26 rear cog. I am a 'senior citizen' and live in the Davis Mountains of West Texas. I would
    > like to have more gears for the mountains in order to spin a little easier on the 9 to 14%
    > grades.
    >
    > What is the simplest and cheapest modification to my set up to get the desired relief on the
    > mountains? I heard of someone putting 26 on the front ring in lieu of the 30; but, I am not an
    > expert on these things and need some advice.
    >
    > Thanks
    >
    > Tom
     
  12. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    Russell Seaton wrote:
    > Something I did not mention in the other thread is to fix your rear 9 speed cassette. Assuming it
    > is the 13-26 Veloce loose cog set, and not the higher priced bolted together on carriers Chorus
    > 13-26 cassette. You can buy a 28 tooth 9 speed cog from QBP for $20 and put it on instead of your
    > 26. Harris Cyclery sells the loose 28 tooth QBP cog. It will give you a 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-28
    > cassette. When I need the big cog in back, I really need it. So I like having good gaps between
    > gears up until the need for the big cog. The normal 13-28 Veloce cassette directly from Campagnolo
    > has much poorer gear spacing than the "custom" version I just described.

    I think the 14-28 is better than both, or even better: 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-24-27 or 14-15-16-17-19-21-24-27-
    30 - which can be acheived by using some Marchisio cogs.

    ~PB
     
  13. "Pete Biggs" <ptangerine{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote in message news:<[email protected]ws.uni-berlin.de>...
    > Russell Seaton wrote:
    > > Something I did not mention in the other thread is to fix your rear 9 speed cassette. Assuming
    > > it is the 13-26 Veloce loose cog set, and not the higher priced bolted together on carriers
    > > Chorus 13-26 cassette. You can buy a 28 tooth 9 speed cog from QBP for $20 and put it on instead
    > > of your 26. Harris Cyclery sells the loose 28 tooth QBP cog. It will give you a 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-
    > > 28 cassette. When I need the big cog in back, I really need it. So I like having good gaps
    > > between gears up until the need for the big cog. The normal 13-28 Veloce cassette directly from
    > > Campagnolo has much poorer gear spacing than the "custom" version I just described.
    >
    > I think the 14-28 is better than both, or even better: 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-24-27 or 14-15-16-17-19-21-24-27-
    > 30 - which can be acheived by using some Marchisio cogs.
    >
    > ~PB

    No. None of the cassettes you mention are worthwhile for me or many other people I suspect. When I
    need a low gear, I need a low gear. Otherwise I prefer evenly spaced usable medium gears.

    The brand new for 2004 14-28 Campagnolo 9 speed Veloce cassette has 14-15-16-17-19-21-23-25-28 cogs.
    My custom cassette is 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-28. Why would I or anyone give up a usable 13 cog for
    a rarely used extra low gear in the 25 tooth cog? Why do you need a low gear in the 28 tooth and a
    pretty low in the 25 tooth? Why not just get a low gear and more usable gears? By starting with the
    13 as the small cog, I can actually use the 14 tooth cog with the inner chainring. I would be very
    unhappy if my highest gear was restricted to the 15 cog as with the Veloce 14-28 cassette. And I run
    a 42 chainring. Those running a 39 chainring would quickly run out of usable gears on the inner
    chainring with a 39x15 as the high with the Veloce 14-28 cassette.

    As for the Marchisio combinations, the 13-27 has no usability. My 13-28 custom has a more useful 23
    cog than the 24 cog in the Marchisio. And my 28 cog is lower than the 27 cog in the Marchisio. I
    don't know why anyone would buy this 13-27 combination when they could get my 13-28 custom.

    The 14-30 would be useful if I wanted lower gears. The 30 would be nice occassionally. But to get it
    I have to sacrifice the 13 and replace it with the 27. I would end up with two or maybe three low
    gears if the 24 tooth is counted. I only really need one low gear
    (28) on a road racing bike, not two or three (24-27-30). I would have to sacrifice several medium
    gears on the inner chainring with the Marchisio 14-30 cassette.

    I think of my 13-28 custom cassette as a half step plus granny for the road racing bike. Plenty of
    closely spaced useful medium gears and the granny gear of the 28 cog.
     
  14. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    Russell Seaton wrote:
    >>> It will give you a 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-28 cassette. When I need the big cog in back, I
    >>> really need it. So I like having good gaps between gears up until the need for the big cog. The
    >>> normal 13-28 Veloce cassette directly from Campagnolo has much poorer gear spacing than the
    >>> "custom" version I just described.
    >>
    >> I think the 14-28 is better than both, or even better: 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-24-27 or 14-15-16-17-19-21-24-27-
    >> 30 - which can be acheived by using some Marchisio cogs.

    > No. None of the cassettes you mention are worthwhile for me or many other people I suspect. When I
    > need a low gear, I need a low gear. Otherwise I prefer evenly spaced usable medium gears.

    Each to his own Russ. I much prefer my two custom cassettes to your ratios with the huge jump from
    23 to 28T (I don't even like 24 to 28), although I agree the 14-28 is not perfect (that's why I
    don't use it!). In fact no gear system is perfect - including mine and yours. I just still think the
    cassettes I mentioned are better in general than yours; they are less extreme. I wasn't suggesting
    you personally would be better off with my gears.

    > The brand new for 2004 14-28 Campagnolo 9 speed Veloce cassette has 14-15-16-17-19-21-23-25-28
    > cogs. My custom cassette is 13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-28. Why would I or anyone give up a usable 13
    > cog for a rarely used extra low gear in the 25 tooth cog?

    When it would not be rarely used. In other words, for slower riders/bikes or riders climbing a lot
    and climbing hills of various gradients (not all mega steep) - but riders who also like to keep the
    gaps small at the small end.

    It's also useful for junior racers who have their top gears restricted.

    > Why do you need a low gear in the 28 tooth and a pretty low in the 25 tooth? Why not just get a
    > low gear and more usable gears?

    Because 28 can be TOO low and it's useful to have some gears inbetwen 23 and 28+ for use with the
    middle ring when using triples. Yes we are talking triples here. With Campag, we are restricted to
    39T for the middle and it's inconvenient to keep shifting to the granny.

    You can still have a plenty of useable middle gears AND more than one low gear. One good way of
    doing that is to make a sacrifice at the top end.

    13T can be a waste if one already has a large big chainring or/and doesn't mind not having a
    high top gear.

    > By starting with the 13 as the small cog, I can actually use the 14 tooth cog with the inner
    > chainring. I would be very unhappy if my highest gear was restricted to the 15 cog as with the
    > Veloce 14-28 cassette. And I run a 42 chainring. Those running a 39 chainring would quickly run
    > out of usable gears on the inner chainring with a 39x15 as the high with the Veloce 14-28
    > cassette.

    Not that quickly I don't because I spin quite fast, and in any case shifting up to the 50T outer
    ring is good with this cassette. The 14-28 or 14-30 is better suited to slower/heavier riders/bikes
    or riders who spin faster than you do. I use a 14-30 on my tourer (with Campag gears). I'm not
    suggesting it for the fastest cycling - that's not what this thread is about.

    Also, using a smaller than 42T ring makes a big difference because the larger cogs are used
    less often.

    > As for the Marchisio combinations, the 13-27 has no usability.

    No usability? Got to be joking, it's highly useable. You may not like the idea, that's fine, but it
    certainly is a neat solution for me on my road bike, and I can't be alone in liking the 21-24-27 end
    because that's popular with many Shimano users. I'm sure many Campag users would also like that end-
    combo if only it were comonly available.

    > My 13-28 custom has a more useful 23 cog than the 24 cog in the Marchisio. And my 28 cog is lower
    > than the 27 cog in the Marchisio. I don't know why anyone would buy this 13-27 combination when
    > they could get my 13-28 custom.

    24T is very useful when 23 is just a little too small - as is so often the case on moderate climbs,
    I find. I use it a lot with my 39T middle ring and the jump up from 21 is ok (although wouldn't be
    so good for you with your larger ring). And 27T can be large enough when you have a small granny
    ring. If I do ever need a larger cog on this bike, I might fit a 28T but then that would be all the
    more reason to have a 24T between the 21 and 28 to bridge the gap.

    I used 21-23-26 previously and very often found the 23 not to be enough of a difference. Again,
    using it with a 39T middle ring means this gear is used at lower speeds than you would with a larger
    ring so the difference can naturally be larger.

    I can imagine not needing a low "2nd" gear if most riding was on flat roads but then had the
    occasional very steep long climb, but that's not how climbing is for a lot of us in the world. For
    more undulating and variable landscape, more than one granny gear really helps.

    > The 14-30 would be useful if I wanted lower gears. The 30 would be nice occassionally. But to get
    > it I have to sacrifice the 13 and replace it with the 27. I would end up with two or maybe three
    > low gears if the 24 tooth is counted. I only really need one low gear
    > (28) on a road racing bike, not two or three (24-27-30).

    I agree - for fast racing bikes. Don't forget Campagnolo doesn't have to mean that always.

    By the way, my "Marchisio" cassettes are actually mainly made up of Veloce sprockets, it's just the
    funny sizes at the big end that are Marchisios.

    I've done a lot of experimentation with gears, just as I'm sure you have. We've just arrived at
    different solutions for different problems. Probably different weights, powers, cadences,
    chainlines, gradients, weather, countries!, not to mention preferences.

    ~PB
     
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