Cancellara's sprint win...a little too convenient and easy?



Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
win ahead of the sprinters?

Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
or also really want a stage win?

Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."



- Corey
 
F

Fred Pan

Guest
<[email protected]> wrote in message >
> Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
> detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."
>
>
>
> - Corey
>


Are suggesting that the group of pro cyclist that can't even get together
and agree to save their on asses from the UCI and WADA would agree to
something like letting Cancellara win? I don't see it. But then I don't
buy into any other conspiracy theories either.


Fred
 
R

RicodJour

Guest
On Jul 11, 11:56 am, [email protected] wrote:
> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> win ahead of the sprinters?
>
> Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
> And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
> are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
> or also really want a stage win?
>
> Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
> detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."


You should never think out, lout. ;)
Cancellara wasn't on his home turf.
Photogenic...? "Cancellara looks smashing in yellow. Let's let him
have it today!" Ummm...no.
It wasn't expected as it was highly unusual, so that does make it a
little odd.
Cancellara has a huge engine and, it seems, excellent timing.

A lot of things could have happened. Only one thing did.
Cancellara executed a beautiful smack down.

R
 
On Jul 11, 5:56 pm, [email protected] wrote:
> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> win ahead of the sprinters?
>
> Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
> And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
> are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
> or also really want a stage win?
>
> Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
> detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."
>
> - Corey


In my opinion, what looked "easy" was actually a subtle point made by
Cancellara, that is, by sprinting up to the remains of the breakaway,
he confused the sprinters teams who found it much harder to compute
Cancellara's speed when he was in the midst of these other riders, and
to adjust their speed accordingly. If the break hadn't been there,
then his move would have had much less chance of working.

Such moves work very rarely, Ekimov won this way in 1991 and failed in
dozens of subsequent attempts. Cancellara was not previously marked
for such attacks, I believe, but it will now be even harder for him to
win this way. He has had some good field sprint results, he finished
2nd in one in this year's Tour of Switzerland.

-ilan
 
K

Kurgan Gringioni

Guest
On Jul 11, 9:19 am, [email protected] wrote:
> On Jul 11, 5:56 pm, [email protected] wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> > too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> > win ahead of the sprinters?

>
> > Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> > that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
> > And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
> > are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
> > or also really want a stage win?

>
> > Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> > Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
> > detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> > changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> > watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."

>
> > - Corey

>
> In my opinion, what looked "easy" was actually a subtle point made by
> Cancellara, that is, by sprinting up to the remains of the breakaway,
> he confused the sprinters teams who found it much harder to compute
> Cancellara's speed when he was in the midst of these other riders, and
> to adjust their speed accordingly. If the break hadn't been there,
> then his move would have had much less chance of working.
>
> Such moves work very rarely, Ekimov won this way in 1991 and failed in
> dozens of subsequent attempts. Cancellara was not previously marked
> for such attacks, I believe, but it will now be even harder for him to
> win this way. He has had some good field sprint results, he finished
> 2nd in one in this year's Tour of Switzerland.




Dumbass -


There was some kilo specialist in 89(?) that attacked 800m from the
finish in 2 stages in the TdF and it worked for him both times. I
don't have the encyclopaedic memory like Benjo so . . .

As for Ekimov - I think he lacked the pure speed for that move to work
in his later years. He probably kept trying it because what else is he
going to do?


thanks,

K. Gringioni.
 
K

Kurgan Gringioni

Guest
On Jul 11, 8:56 am, [email protected] wrote:
> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> win ahead of the sprinters?





Dear Newbie -


Please go away.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.
 
S

Simon Brooke

Guest
in message <[email protected]>,
[email protected] (' [email protected]') wrote:

> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> win ahead of the sprinters?
>
> Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?


So let's get this straight. He's a specialist on prologues, and he's a
specialist on classics, and he's a specialist on cobbles. What is this
paragon not a specialist on?

> And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
> are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
> or also really want a stage win?
>
> Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> Cancellara wins on "home turf"


He wasn't on home turf, or even near it.

Boonen is a sprinter who was quite near home turf and familiar with
cobbles. And it popular, charismatic and photogenic.

> and provides an uplifting story to
> detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."


Nothing odd about it. The only thing odd is that people keep looking at
Cancellara and saying 'oh, but he's just a specialist at <insert whatever
the peloton is doing today>'. Cancellara isn't a specialist. He isn't
necessarily the best all round cyclist in the peloton, either - his
weakness may show in the mountains. But he is one of the best all round
cyclists in the peloton. What we say yesterday is that, as a strong man
which excellent bike handling skills, he's capable of being an opportunist
on an uphill finish on cobbles.

We've also seen, over the past three days, that the big sprint teams aren't
very flexible and are vulnerable to opportunists.

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Q: Whats a webmaster?
A: Like a spider, but nowhere near as intelligent.
 
M

mimoso

Guest
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]

> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> win ahead of the sprinters?


first this is the beginning of TdF, second he's not a thread for GC,
thus he's not the most marked man.

> Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?


he seized the moment, sometimes it's all they need win.
 
B

benjo maso

Guest
"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> On Jul 11, 9:19 am, [email protected] wrote:
>> On Jul 11, 5:56 pm, [email protected] wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
>> > too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
>> > win ahead of the sprinters?

>>
>> > Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
>> > that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
>> > And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
>> > are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
>> > or also really want a stage win?

>>
>> > Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
>> > Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
>> > detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
>> > changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
>> > watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."

>>
>> > - Corey

>>
>> In my opinion, what looked "easy" was actually a subtle point made by
>> Cancellara, that is, by sprinting up to the remains of the breakaway,
>> he confused the sprinters teams who found it much harder to compute
>> Cancellara's speed when he was in the midst of these other riders, and
>> to adjust their speed accordingly. If the break hadn't been there,
>> then his move would have had much less chance of working.
>>
>> Such moves work very rarely, Ekimov won this way in 1991 and failed in
>> dozens of subsequent attempts. Cancellara was not previously marked
>> for such attacks, I believe, but it will now be even harder for him to
>> win this way. He has had some good field sprint results, he finished
>> 2nd in one in this year's Tour of Switzerland.

>
>
>
> Dumbass -
>
>
> There was some kilo specialist in 89(?) that attacked 800m from the
> finish in 2 stages in the TdF and it worked for him both times. I
> don't have the encyclopaedic memory like Benjo so . . .



It was my fellow-countryman Jelle Nijdam. I didn't need a memory for that:
the Dutch commentator on TV screamed: "But he is doing a Jelle Nijdam!"

Benjo
 
B

Bill C

Guest
On Jul 11, 12:53 pm, Kurgan Gringioni <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 8:56 am, [email protected] wrote:
>
> > Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> > too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> > win ahead of the sprinters?

>
> Dear Newbie -
>
> Please go away.
>
> thanks,
>
> K. Gringioni.


C'mon with Lance gone all we've got left is the racing, pretty much. A
few came back for Flandis last year. This year it's a slim crop at
best. Luckily we've had good stages so far.
Have to wonder how McEwan is doing physically and how the hell Boonen
managed to miss todays sprint so badly?
Bill C
 
J

John Forrest Tomlinson

Guest
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 08:56:31 -0700, [email protected] wrote:

>
>Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
>Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
>detract from all the negative press of the moment?


No.

--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************
 
J

John Forrest Tomlinson

Guest
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 09:51:39 -0700, Kurgan Gringioni
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>There was some kilo specialist in 89(?) that attacked 800m from the
>finish in 2 stages in the TdF and it worked for him both times. I
>don't have the encyclopaedic memory like Benjo so . . .


Nijdam?

--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************
 
S

samson

Guest
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> win ahead of the sprinters?
>
> Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
> And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
> are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
> or also really want a stage win?
>
> Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
> detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."
>
>
>
> - Corey


Are you kidding? Four guys can't even get together
and go for a stage win.

S.
 
On Jul 11, 6:51 pm, Kurgan Gringioni <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 9:19 am, [email protected] wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 11, 5:56 pm, [email protected] wrote:

>
> > > Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
> > > too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
> > > win ahead of the sprinters?

>
> > > Yes, he's a specialist of the cobbles, but where there so many cobbles
> > > that they would be a deciding factor in the sprint?
> > > And, couldn't it be said that other folks (Boonen, Hincapie, et al)
> > > are equally talented on cobbles and either have strong sprint support
> > > or also really want a stage win?

>
> > > Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> > > Cancellara wins on "home turf" and provides an uplifting story to
> > > detract from all the negative press of the moment? Could money have
> > > changed hands? I know nothing and am just thinking out lout, but as I
> > > watched it yesterday I just though "huh...that's a little odd..."

>
> > > - Corey

>
> > In my opinion, what looked "easy" was actually a subtle point made by
> > Cancellara, that is, by sprinting up to the remains of the breakaway,
> > he confused the sprinters teams who found it much harder to compute
> > Cancellara's speed when he was in the midst of these other riders, and
> > to adjust their speed accordingly. If the break hadn't been there,
> > then his move would have had much less chance of working.

>
> > Such moves work very rarely, Ekimov won this way in 1991 and failed in
> > dozens of subsequent attempts. Cancellara was not previously marked
> > for such attacks, I believe, but it will now be even harder for him to
> > win this way. He has had some good field sprint results, he finished
> > 2nd in one in this year's Tour of Switzerland.

>
> Dumbass -
>
> There was some kilo specialist in 89(?) that attacked 800m from the
> finish in 2 stages in the TdF and it worked for him both times. I
> don't have the encyclopaedic memory like Benjo so . . .
>
> As for Ekimov - I think he lacked the pure speed for that move to work
> in his later years. He probably kept trying it because what else is he
> going to do?
>
> thanks,
>
> K. Gringioni.


Well, just because it worked twice in one year doesn't mean it works
often. Another person who tried numerous times with at least one
success was Jesper Skibby.

-ilan
 
M

Mikko J Virtanen

Guest
[email protected] writes:

> Well, just because it worked twice in one year doesn't mean it works
> often. Another person who tried numerous times with at least one
> success was Jesper Skibby.


Bertogliati, stage 1 2002, perhaps. On Zabel's birthday, it seems.

> -ilan


MJ;


--
..signature necesse est
 
S

Simon Brooke

Guest
in message <[email protected]>, mimoso ('[email protected]')
wrote:

> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>
>> Was there anyone else who thought it was strangely straightforward and
>> too "good a story" that the most marked man in the pack soloed to a
>> win ahead of the sprinters?

>
> first this is the beginning of TdF, second he's not a threat for GC,


No?

I agree he's not yet a very serious threat. But I also think he's
under-rated. He stands a good chance of being stage winner on Stage 13 and
Stage 20, since they're both CLMs and he is one of the best
time-triallists in the peloton. However, you typically only gain seconds
on CLM stages, and I expect he will lose minutes on some of the mountain
stages, so I don't expect him to win this year. However, it depends to
some extent on how much support the team give him - unlikely to be much,
because Schleck and Sastre should be much better in the mountains. But if
Sastre has a crash and CSC concentrate on getting Cancellara through the
mountains...

I don't expect he'll win this year, although if I could get a bet at the
odds he was on last week, it would be worth a punt. But he'll be a serious
GC contender within three years.

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Conservatives are not necessarily stupid,
;; but most stupid people are conservatives -- J S Mill
 
S

Simon Brooke

Guest
in message <[email protected]>, Bill C
('[email protected]') wrote:

> Have to wonder how McEwan is doing physically and how the hell Boonen
> managed to miss todays sprint so badly?


I told you: God loves him. God so loves Tom Boonen that He smote Mark
Cavendish and Robbie McEwan on Sunday with the Holy Pump in the Spokes.
God so loves Tom Boonen that He smote all the other sprinters on Monday
with the Wayward Pedal of Zabel. God so loves Tom Boonen that he
miraculously turned the finish straight on Tuesday to cobbles.

With God on your side, how /can/ you lose?

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

The Conservative Party is now dead. The corpse may still be
twitching, but resurrection is not an option - unless Satan
chucks them out of Hell as too objectionable even for him.
 
D

Donald Munro

Guest
corey wrote:
> Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> Cancellara wins on "home turf"


Why hasn't CNN reported the invasion of France by Switzerland ?
 
R

RicodJour

Guest
On Jul 11, 3:55 pm, Donald Munro <[email protected]> wrote:
> corey wrote:
> > Could there have been an peloton agreement that photogenic, popular
> > Cancellara wins on "home turf"

>
> Why hasn't CNN reported the invasion of France by Switzerland ?


Ummm, I think they call it the EU. There are no borders. They are
all brothers. Your turf is my turf. Everybody hold hands now.
Kumbaya, Kumbaya!

Everybody now!

R
 
B

benjo maso

Guest
"Mikko J Virtanen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> [email protected] writes:
>
>> Well, just because it worked twice in one year doesn't mean it works
>> often. Another person who tried numerous times with at least one
>> success was Jesper Skibby.

>
> Bertogliati, stage 1 2002, perhaps. On Zabel's birthday, it seems.



One of the greatest specialists of making a breakaway in the last kilometer
was ***** Teirlinck. That was the way he won 5 TdF stages: three in 1972,
one in 1973 and 1976.

Benjo
 

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