Cannondale Six13 or Synapse?

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Anabolicholic, Feb 24, 2006.

  1. vascdoc

    vascdoc New Member

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    There are a lot of reviews of the six thirteen. My personal experience is that the descents is one of the bikes strongest properties. It is like a train on railroad tracks. It is that stable. There is a decent that on my old bike 1977 Medici steel frame. I would take it at 30-32 miles per hour. I now routinely take it at 36 miles/hour or more and the bike could easily do better. I am the limiting factor.
     


  2. bluecann

    bluecann New Member

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    Whenever i read posts comparing the synapse to the six13 i find it funny that some think the synapse is a comfort bike with relaxed geometry. Sure it's marketed that way but if you take the time to compare the geometry numbers on cannondales website the differences are so nominal that there really is no difference. For example, head tube length. A popular claim is that the synapse has a taller head tube giving it a more relaxed riding position but the difference between the synapse & the six13 is 8mm. That's this much [....], not a very noticable difference in my book and if you think your back is going to be saved by that 8mm, it isn't. Another claim is the six13 being so much stiffer than the synapse. below are some numbers from the german Tour Magazin testing "light framesets", sub 1500g frames & forks (synapse missed the mark by 82g). When you compare the stiffness numbers of the synapse it fits in the list somewhere between the Isaac, the Scott, & the Cube. The synapse test results are below the list.

    Manufacturer/Model | Fork | Pts | Head Tube Lateral stiffness | BB stiffness | lateral stiffness of the fork | weight frame+headset(!)/fork | comfort
    Canyon Ultimate F10 Limited SL Smolik Motivation Race 71Pts 114Nm/° 131Nm/° 54N/mm 1179g/305g 3
    Cérvelo R3 Cérvelo 67Pts 92Nm/° 122Nm/° 47N/mm 975g/376g 2
    Storck Scenario CD 1.0 Stiletto Light UMS 63Pts 83Nm/° 106Nm/° 48N/mm 1205g/286g 3
    Red Bull X-Lite 8000 Red Bull 60Pts 89Nm/° 103Nm/° 43N/mm 1068g/424g 2
    Isaac Sonic LTD. Isaac 58Pts 74Nm/° 93Nm/° 48N/mm 1048g/406g 1
    Scott CR1 Team Issue Scott CR1 56Pts 89Nm/° 101Nm/° 42N/mm 1001g/406g 1
    Cube Litening GTC "SCR Edition" THM Scapula SP 54Pts 82Nm/° 99Nm/° 37N/mm 1224g/273g 3
    Look KG 585 Ultra "Crédit Agricole" Look HSC5 SL 53Pts 67Nm/° 98Nm/° 43N/mm 1168g/327g 2
    Time VXRS Ulteam Time Avant Ulteam Safe+ 52Pts 61Nm/° 88Nm/° 47N/mm 1098g/360g 1
    Felt F1C Carbon Easton EC90-SLX 50Pts 63Nm/° 94Nm/° 34N/mm 1064g/283g 4
    KTM Strada LC Prime KTM LC 49Pts 83Nm/° 92Nm/° 31N/mm 1163g/337g 4
    Storck Scenario C 0.9 "10th Anniversary" Stiletto Light 47Pts 66Nm/° 92Nm/° 38N/mm 1181g/292g 2
    Poison Speed Easton EC90 SLX 39Pts 48Nm/° 85Nm/° 33N/mm 1186g/282g 4
    Santana Stylus Easton EC90 SLX 39Pts 59Nm/° 72Nm/° 33N/mm 1213g/287g 4

    Cannondale Synapse Carbon Carbon S.A.V.E. 64Pts 71Nm/° 99Nm/° 50Nm/° 1184g/398g 7

    the only information i could find on the six13 is when the caad7 frame was tested but i'll put it up anyway. i have read that the newer caad8 frame is supposed to be lighter than the caad7 frame but i can't find any stiffness numbers. cannondales website has the new six13 frame weight at 1190g & the synapse at 1090g.

    Cannondale Six/13 premium carbon 60Pts 68Nm/° 91Nm/° 44Nm/° 1340g/326g 7


    whew. now with all that said, i own a synapse and i rode the six/13 and the r5000 caad8 before buying my synapse (back to back, 15 miles each, exact same route). truthfully i couldnt tell much af a difference between any of them. i wanted carbon, i liked the way the black synapse looked so i went with it. just dont be fooled by the relaxed/comfort claims.
     
  3. shokhead

    shokhead New Member

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    Dont know what your seeing but compared to a classic geometery frame it is a more relaxed geometery. Not as much as a Roubaix{that why i got one instead of the Synapse}but it is.
     
  4. bluecann

    bluecann New Member

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    i thought the thread was comparing the synapse to the six13.

    comparing the same sizes of the synapse & the six13 there are differences but they are minute. if one had never ridden either bike and could ride blindfolded i doubt the differences could be felt. i know i couldn't tell, just my opinion. ;)

    frame size 58cm

    seat tube degree - same 73°
    head tube degree - synapse, .5° less, 73° to 73.5°
    top tube length - same 57.5cm
    chainstay length - synapse .5cm longer, 41cm to 40.5cm
    fork rake - same 4.5cm
    bottom bracket height - synapse .2cm shorter, 26.8cm to 27cm
    wheelbase - synapse .9cm longer, 100.5cm to 99.6cm
    standover heighth - synapse .2cm shorter, 81.3cm to 81.5cm
    bottom bracket drop - synapse .2cm taller, 6.9cm to 6.7cm
    front center distance - synapse .4cm longer, 60.5cm to 60.1cm
    headtube length - synapse .7cm longer, 18cm to 17.3cm
     
  5. shokhead

    shokhead New Member

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    You seem to be saying that the Synapse isnt a relaxed geometry bike,compared to the 6/13 or not. I just see it as a relaxed geometery compared to classic geometery. Lets face it,you couldnt go wrong with either. If i raced at all i'd go with the 6/13 and if i liked just riding with some longer rides and i was abit up there in age i'd go for the more relaxed Synaspe.
     
  6. vascdoc

    vascdoc New Member

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    Somehow with the emphasis on the geometry the materials have been ignored. I have taken both out for extended rides. The six thirteen is more lively. A significant portion of the bike is CAAD 8. The Synapse is all carbon fiber. I liked both bikes but rejected the feeling of all carbon fiber bikes that I tested including Trek and Cafee.
     
  7. bluecann

    bluecann New Member

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    what is this classic geometry you speak of? i took a few minutes and looked at some of the bikes i listed in my previous post (scott, canyon, cervelo, isaac, look, felt), i picked out their "team" bikes and couldnt find any major differences in the numbers between them & the synapse.



    thats a matter of personal preference. some people like carbon & some don't. when i compare my synapse to my caad5 aluminum, it's night & day. where the caad5 would beat you to death, the synapse would still allow you to feel the offending bumps or cracks but dampen them, allowing a longer faster less painful ride. i'm not sure what you mean by "more lively".

    both the synapse & the six13 are very nice bikes and you can't go wrong either way. test ride them, decide what material you like, and go with what your mind feels better on. ;)
     
  8. shokhead

    shokhead New Member

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  9. vascdoc

    vascdoc New Member

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    What I mean by "lively" relates to the feel on the road. The six thirteen has more road feel than the synapse or other carbon fiber bikes I have tried. It is not as harsh as I expected an aluminum bike might feel. On a steep down hill section, it hugs the curves like a rail. The Trek Madone 5.2 felt completely dead on this same road and the Synapse was somewhere between the two.
     
  10. shokhead

    shokhead New Member

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    Its a muting feel. Makes for a more comfy ride. I have a steel and carbon. I feel the same bumbs as the steel but they are more muted. I feel a lot better after a long ride.
     
  11. Lawguy661

    Lawguy661 New Member

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    I just want to chime in on the down hill handling of the Six13. I just did an extended climb this past weekend, and I can confirm that in my opinion, the Six13 handles very well down hill. I didn't feel at all unstable, and I was comfortable at 40 mph +.
     
  12. vascdoc

    vascdoc New Member

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    Actually the six thirteen is amazing on long rides. I rode over 3 thousand miles from May to mid August last summer. During that time I also rode three centuries. It was very comfortable. I think the K-Wing handlebars had something to do with it.
     
  13. dstratto

    dstratto New Member

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    **I own caad 5 and recently bought a synapse and agree completely with this assessment. Zero buzz on the synapse. Test ride on the six13 was not as painless.

    As far as "lively" goes, synapse stiffness translates the same. I could not detect any less power transfer with the lack of aluminum.

    Key ingredient IMHO is rider weight. I'm 160. Maybe a heavier rider would do better with six13, but its just a guess. Also, fit for me on synapse was 58cm vs. 56cm on caad5 and six 13. Be aware, unless you like that long seat post / stem look.
     
  14. Jaguar27

    Jaguar27 New Member

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    I've been riding my Six13 Team (Record) for almost exactly two years now, it's been a lovely Bike....I've only ridden a Synapse (full Carbon) for a couple of miles...the Synapse, to me, goes further into the Comfort Zone, it dampens the road very well.....it's more of an all day bike ..."zero buzz" sums up the Syn nicely...

     
  15. sogood

    sogood New Member

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    Let me throw another one in given the Cannondale comparison. How does SystemSIX fit into the range? Seemed to be an extension of Six13. Anyone have any comments?
     
  16. Jaguar27

    Jaguar27 New Member

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    I don't know, but I'd like to ride a system...I've never even seen one in real life...

    By the way, I just read my previous post on the Synapse and it read like I didn't like it, I do like it a LOT in fact, I was looking for a Century/Long Distance Bike for..erm...Centuries and long distances...and the Synapse was at the top of my list but I've decided on a Seven id8....

     
  17. Luke Schierts

    Luke Schierts New Member

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    Between the synapse & the six13 I liked the six13 much better. The synapse felt like it transfered power just as well, but I felt like it just wanted to go straight. the six13 seemed more agile & responsive

    I've ridden a system6 and I'm hooked. The six13 is a very nice bike (basically a cadd8 frame geometry with carbon fiber top & down tubes) but the system6 is almost in another catagory. The frame is stiffer than the six13 but the full carbon front end takes up the bumps very well. Power transfer is almost magical, the bike absolutly flys. I tried to tell myself that the extra $1000 for the system6 wouldnt be worth it but I'll give it a test ride anyway. Long story short I'm putting off buying a bike till spring to save some$$$ It will be mine
     
  18. sogood

    sogood New Member

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    Yes, that's what I understand, SystemSIX is one hot frame with unique characteristics. I've examined the frame in a store carefully but have not ridden one. May try to get to a test ride session organized by the LBS in the coming months.
     
  19. Luke Schierts

    Luke Schierts New Member

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    !!!!!!!!WARNING!!!!!!!!!

    If you ride.......you will want to buy!
    Because you can't put a price on love (ok so its in the neighborhood of $3500)
     
  20. sogood

    sogood New Member

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    I am already liking the frame just looking at it. It's beautifully constructed.

    One interesting comparison will be to Bianchi's 928 2007. Fortunately this LBS stocks both and both will be on demo.
     
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