Can't find good info on Alcohol-Cancer research

Discussion in 'Health and medical' started by Woody, Dec 16, 2003.

  1. Woody

    Woody Guest

    I've been searching the web for information concerning the link
    between alcohol consumption and oral cancer, but I'm not finding much
    truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the following two
    statements from an oral cancer information website:

    "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with oral
    cancer frequently consume alcohol."

    First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is consumed,
    or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)

    Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent drinkers
    are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and cigarettes very
    often go hand in hand.)

    This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-cancer
    reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink anywhere from
    moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a much lower oral
    cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research to back this up?

    Thanks for your input.
     
    Tags:


  2. Woody wrote:

    > I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    > oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the following
    > two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    >
    > "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with
    > oral cancer frequently consume alcohol."
    >
    > First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is
    > consumed, or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)
    >
    > Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent drinkers
    > are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and cigarettes very
    > often go hand in hand.)
    >
    > This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-
    > cancer reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink
    > anywhere from moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a
    > much lower oral cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research to
    > back this up?
    >
    > Thanks for your input.

    Don't have the answers at my fingertips. There is however lots of epidemiological evidence
    linking alcohol to potentiation of carcinogenesis from tobacco use. The evidence of cancer risk
    from alcohol alone is much less clear. One concern is that the high alcohol content of mouth
    washes makes them a cancer risk. I remember seeing a study recently that found no association of
    mouthwash use and cancer. The strongest oral cancer association are lip and pipe smoking, and
    other oral cancers and cigars and smokeless tobacco. But anyone who has seen many oral cancer
    patients are both heavy smokers and heavy drinkers.

    Steve

    --
    Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
    Brooklyn, NY
    718-258-5001
    http://www.dentaltwins.com
     
  3. Vaughn Simon

    Vaughn Simon Guest

    "Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    > oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the following
    > two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    >
    If you haven't already, start your research here: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/PubMed/ . Try
    entering various search terms into the box until you get what you are looking for. You should
    be able to find all the citations and abstracts you can handle.

    Vaughn
     
  4. Marcus

    Marcus Guest

    100% of people breathe 100% of people die

    Q.E.D. Breathing is the cause of death ?,

    No quite the opposite really !!!.

    --
    Regards Marcus
     
  5. Linda

    Linda Guest

    Hi Woody: My understanding is that there is not much evidence linking alcohol consumption to oral
    cancer, but there IS evidence linking smoking to oral cancer. Even moreso though, is the smoking &
    drinking combination. Apparently, these people have quite a higher incidence of oral cancer than the
    previous two groups. There is some type of synergistic (sp?) thing going on. Linda (hygienist)

    "Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    > oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the following
    > two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    >
    > "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with
    > oral cancer frequently consume alcohol."
    >
    > First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is
    > consumed, or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)
    >
    > Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent drinkers
    > are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and cigarettes very
    > often go hand in hand.)
    >
    > This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-
    > cancer reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink
    > anywhere from moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a
    > much lower oral cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research to
    > back this up?
    >
    > Thanks for your input.
     
  6. Mark Tarka

    Mark Tarka Guest

    [email protected] (Woody) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    > oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the following
    > two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    >
    > "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with
    > oral cancer frequently consume alcohol."
    >
    > First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is
    > consumed, or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)
    >
    > Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent drinkers
    > are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and cigarettes very
    > often go hand in hand.)
    >
    > This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-
    > cancer reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink
    > anywhere from moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a
    > much lower oral cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research to
    > back this up?
    >
    > Thanks for your input.

    If you're focussed on "oral" cancer, this little bit of insight: Alcohol alone could cause problems
    with oral, esophagal, and stomach tissues if it is of high proof (stick to 7% or less); tobacco use
    alone could cause problems with oral and lung tissue if smoked and inhaled, with oral tissue if
    smoked or used in leaf form ("snuff", chewing tobacco....).

    Beer drinkers who smoke or chew seem likely candidates for oral and/or lung cancer. Whiskey drinkers
    who don't smoke or chew are likely candidates for oral, esophagal, or stomach (even brain) cancer.

    The research, I suspect, is so broad, that you need to specify exactly what you want to look at.
    Even then, since all the research is done via people who volunteer information rather then by
    "scientists" doing "controlled" research, the results you find will be in general terms. You don't
    go out do controlled studies on people, asking them to consume alcohol and tobacco and submit to
    interviews, medical exams, and autopsies.

    So, if you want facts, try this...people consuming more than two liters of 70 proof or greater
    beverages a day will die, whether they use tobacco or not, and people consuming two or more packs of
    cigarettes a day will die, whether they drink or not.

    All of this, personal opinion only.

    Mark (Do neither, and the government and/or your wife will probably do you in :)
     
  7. Jp

    Jp Guest

    Maybe you'll find it on: http://www.xtrasharponline.com/forum/

    J.Pare

    "Woody" <[email protected]> a √©crit dans le message de
    news:[email protected]...
    > I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    > oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the following
    > two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    >
    > "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with
    > oral cancer frequently consume alcohol."
    >
    > First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is
    > consumed, or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)
    >
    > Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent drinkers
    > are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and cigarettes very
    > often go hand in hand.)
    >
    > This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-
    > cancer reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink
    > anywhere from moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a
    > much lower oral cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research to
    > back this up?
    >
    > Thanks for your input.
     
  8. Marcus wrote:

    > 100% of people breathe 100% of people die
    >
    > Q.E.D. Breathing is the cause of death ?,
    >
    > No quite the opposite really !!!.
    >
    > --
    > Regards Marcus

    I figure you're being facetious, but you imply to me a valid point; association is not
    causation. In dentistry, much has been made lately of the association of periodontal disease
    with cardiovascular and cerebrovascular disease. Smoking is associated with both; therefore it
    is a confounding factor when studying the relationship of perio d. with the other two
    conditions. Some clinical studies claim to adjust for "confounding factors". Similarly, alcohol
    use and tobacco use might conceivably be associated with another behavior that in reality is
    responsible for the apparent relationship between alcohol and tobacco use on the one hand, and
    oral and pharyngeal cancer on the other. But there is so much independent research (and so much
    in vitro evidence) that I think it's safe to conclude that alcohol and tobacco are in fact risks
    for development of oropharyngeal cancer.

    Steve

    --
    Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
    Brooklyn, NY
    718-258-5001
    http://www.dentaltwins.com
     
  9. Dave King

    Dave King Guest

    On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 00:31:36 GMT, "Linda"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Hi Woody: My understanding is that there is not much evidence linking alcohol consumption to oral
    >cancer, but there IS evidence linking smoking to oral cancer.

    both lead to cancers, some far away from the oral cavity.

    >Even moreso though, is the smoking & drinking combination. Apparently, these people have quite a
    >higher incidence of oral cancer than the previous two groups. There is some type of synergistic
    >(sp?) thing going on. Linda (hygienist)

    The true carcinogens arise from the combustion of the cigarette. Much less likely to develope a
    cancer from smokeless tobacco. Alcohol helps make the carcinogens much more penetrable to the cell
    membrane. Therefore, a concentration vs. length of time affect occurs with bad results. Bottomline:
    Alcohol and/or nicotine cause mutagenic affects of the basilar cells but the progression to a cancer
    relies on the mutations to be nonlethal to the cell. Generally believed to require 5-6 mutations
    prior to leading to a carcinoma.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    David A. King, D.M.D. Diplomate, American Board of OMS Fellow, American Association of OMS
    HTTP://WWW.DEOMFS.COM

    >
    >"Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    >> oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the
    >> following two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    >>
    >> "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with
    >> oral cancer frequently consume alcohol."
    >>
    >> First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is
    >> consumed, or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)
    >>
    >> Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent
    >> drinkers are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and
    >> cigarettes very often go hand in hand.)
    >>
    >> This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-
    >> cancer reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink
    >> anywhere from moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a
    >> much lower oral cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research to
    >> back this up?
    >>
    >> Thanks for your input.
     
  10. Carabelli

    Carabelli Guest

    "Mark Tarka" <[email protected]> wrote,,,,,,

    > So, if you want facts, try this...people consuming more than two liters of 70 proof or greater
    > beverages a day will die, whether they use tobacco or not, and people consuming two or more packs
    > of cigarettes a day will die, whether they drink or not.
    >
    > All of this, personal opinion only.
    >
    >
    > Mark (Do neither, and the government and/or your wife will probably do you in :)

    People that have never touched alcohol or tobacco will probably eventually die also.

    carabelli
     
  11. Dr Steve

    Dr Steve Guest

    I have a patient who was admitted to the hospital yesterday for a maxilectomy secondary to Squamous
    Ca. History of Tobacco and alcohol in the past. A very nice person who now gets to learn all about
    obturators.

    --
    ~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA DrSteve Q Mancusodds.com {change
    the center letter to "at" (and drop two spaces) for email}
    ....................................................

    This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion
    of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a
    dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will
    affect your health. ...................... Please ignore j..d... and convince j...e.... to get help
    ~~~~``````````#####----

    "Dave King" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 00:31:36 GMT, "Linda" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >Hi Woody: My understanding is that there is not much evidence linking alcohol consumption to oral
    > >cancer, but there IS evidence linking smoking to oral cancer.
    >
    > both lead to cancers, some far away from the oral cavity.
    >
    > >Even moreso though, is the smoking & drinking combination. Apparently,
    these
    > >people have quite a higher incidence of oral cancer than the previous two groups. There is some
    > >type of synergistic (sp?) thing going on. Linda (hygienist)
    >
    > The true carcinogens arise from the combustion of the cigarette. Much less likely to develope a
    > cancer from smokeless tobacco. Alcohol helps make the carcinogens much more penetrable to the cell
    > membrane. Therefore, a concentration vs. length of time affect occurs with bad results.
    > Bottomline: Alcohol and/or nicotine cause mutagenic affects of the basilar cells but the
    > progression to a cancer relies on the mutations to be nonlethal to the cell. Generally believed to
    > require 5-6 mutations prior to leading to a carcinoma.
    >
    > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    > David A. King, D.M.D. Diplomate, American Board of OMS Fellow, American Association of OMS
    > HTTP://WWW.DEOMFS.COM
    >
    > >
    > >"Woody" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > >news:[email protected]...
    > >> I've been searching the web for information concerning the link between alcohol consumption and
    > >> oral cancer, but I'm not finding much truly useful information. To explain, I'll use the
    > >> following two statements from an oral cancer information website:
    > >>
    > >> "90% of patients with oral cancer use tobacco." "Approximately 75% to 80% of all patients with
    > >> oral cancer frequently consume alcohol."
    > >>
    > >> First, what does "frequently" mean in this context? Does it refer to how often alcohol is
    > >> consumed, or the quantity consumed? (Thye're related but not the same.)
    > >>
    > >> Second, and more importantly, I can't tell from these two statements whether the frequent
    > >> drinkers are also regular smokers. (And they probably are; it's no secret that alcohol and
    > >> cigarettes very often go hand in hand.)
    > >>
    > >> This is quite typical of the information I've been finding. Does anybody know of any alcohol-
    > >> cancer reseach or other information that controls for smoking? There are people who drink
    > >> anywhere from moderately to heavily but don't smoke at all. I believe these people would have a
    > >> much lower oral cancer incidence rate than people who smoke. Does anybody know of any research
    > >> to back this up?
    > >>
    > >> Thanks for your input.
     
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