Carbo loading before a race?

[Roger Zoul]

DRS wrote:
:: "curt" <[email protected]> wrote in message
:: news:[email protected]
::: I have been low carbing for a while to lose a few, but
::: now I do eat carbs before I take rides over 30 miles. I
::: find if I don't I hit a wall and did get a bit dizzy
::: once. That was enough of that. I find for me YMMV, that
::: if I eat a balanced meal with good carbs the night
::: before and during the ride eat a banana or some granola
::: or something, I feel fine. If I am just going to ride
::: like 25 miles I don't pay attention to what I eat much,
::: just make sure I drink enough water. I think this would
::: be different for everyone. I have heard people starting
::: to carbo load 3-4 days in advance. I am not sure why
::: because it takes something like 24 hours for you to
::: digest food you eat +-.
::
:: True carb loading is basically for powerlifters who want
:: that 101% lift on competition day. Essentially you go low
:: carb a week or so before the competition and lift like
:: crazy to deplete your muscle glycogen. Of course, at this
:: point you feel like **** and are as weak as a kitten
:: because you've got no energy, but then a couple of days
:: before the competition you go stupid on the carbs and if
:: you time it right you can achieve a temporary overloading
:: of muscle glycogen right on competition day. However,
:: it's of sod all benefit for endurance activities like
:: cycling. Going stupid on the carbs the night before a
:: race or whatever is just building up your fat reserves
:: but you don't notice that because you work it off the
:: next day.

Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a PL
will just get you water logged and make you heavier for your
ride (assuming you were LCing before hand). IMO, it is
better to consume carbs right before and during your ride,
you can you burn them as they land and avoid water logging.

 

[Thomas Reynolds]

"jb" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Anyone here do this? What exactly do you eat, and when??

I'm a bit surprised at the replies. Let me recommend a book:

Sports Nutrition for Endurance Athletes by Monique Ryan

published by Velo Press and available at Amazon, etc.

The book is also very good at describing what is good
nutrition in general.

Tom

 

[Badger_south]

On Thu, 13 May 2004 04:23:49 +1000, "DRS" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>"Badger_South" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]
>> On Tue, 11 May 2004 23:50:04 -0300, "KB"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> hmmm....can't say I disagree with you since I really
>>> don't know the answer for sure, but I know that I have
>>> recently read in textbooks that carbo loading helps
>>> store glycogen in muscles, and that for prolonged
>>> efforts, if your muscles run out of glycogen, cramping
>>> etc. will occur... I too am interested to hear what
>>> others here do..
>>
>> The trick is this...
>>
>> Eat the carbs, by themselves (i.e., not with fat or
>> protein) and eat them just before or just after the
>> exercise. This will cause a rise in insulin, but because
>> of the needs of the body going into or finishing
>> exercise, the nutrients will be used to build muscle, and
>> will not go into fat storage.
>
>That's not possible. Muscles are built from protein. Carbs
>are the body's prime source of glucose. You take simple
>carbs immediately after exercise to spike your insulin,
>replenish muscle glycogen and inhibit cortisol production.
>The insulin will enhance muscle uptake of protein, thereby
>aiding protein synthesis, as well as uptake of supplements
>like creatine. Therefore, to optimise the post-exercise
>window (which, BTW, is greatest after anaboloic exercise),
>you want whey protein, because it is highly absorbent, and
>a 50:50 mix of dextrose (glucose) and maltodextrin, because
>together they promote the highest stimulation of the
>transport mechanisms in the intestinal lumen resulting in
>the most efficient absorbtion of macro- and micronutrients
>into the blood stream.

I agree with this, and I take whey protein for just
this effect.

>> In between exercise, it's better for those predisposed to
>> gain weight (fat), to eat higher protein and good fat.
>>
>> Works for me.
>
>What's actually happening is that your body's energy
>buffering mechanisms are coping with your retarded
>eating habits.

Might be, but it got me from 270lbs to a muscular 200 in
about 7-8 months, with very little exercise (had an injury)
and when nothing else would.

>> Just before a ride I will eat some small amt of carbs
>> (couple pieces of chocolate?), and finish with some
>> diluted OJ. Then about two hours later I'll eat the
>> protein meal. Two or three hours after that, and just
>> before or after the next exercise period, I repeat.
>>
>> I have found that even sugar free drinks or chewing gum
>> will often suffice. I think in some ppl, the sweet taste
>> can cause a rise in insulin, and thus movement of
>> nutrient into muscles.
>
>Insulin is produced as a result of increased blood
>sugar levels.

Insulin is produced in the pancreas. It is -released- by a
variety of stimuli, one of them being blood sugar.

>> Obviously, the converse is true. Beware of eating sweet-
>> tasting things along with fat, b/c you might be one of
>> those that has an insulin rise just to the taste, even in
>> the absence of digestible carbs/glucose.
>
>That's just nonsense. No sugars, no insulin.

Nope. I've read a couple studies that suggest that 'sweet
tasting' sugar free drinks can cause an insulin spike due to
the sweet taste.

In addition I believe things like caffeine can also
spike insulin.

-B

 

[Curt]

> Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a PL
> will just get
you
> water logged and make you heavier for your ride (assuming
> you were LCing before hand). IMO, it is better to consume
> carbs right before and during your ride, you can you burn
> them as they land and avoid water logging.

Generally Roger I would agree, from what we have read and
maybe your own experiences. I will say, I don't retain water
if I eat carbs for a day. I don't go out and eat a whole
pizza....well usually not, but I don't seem to have that
effect of retaining water. Not sure why.

I really think carb loading may work for some people and
eating carbs while riding works for some and whatever. You
really need to do things and find what works for you as an
individual. I think most people should eat some carbs if
they are going to do a longer ride. I road 45 miles today
and am on low carb and did okay today. I was cranky at the
end. I could have used a Cliff bar or something.

I tend to eat sushi the night before and eat protein and
some carbs for breakfast and I like a banana or a Cliff bar
or something while I ride. I don't like to eat too much
while riding however.

Curt

 

[Badger_south]

On Wed, 12 May 2004 20:09:29 GMT, "curt" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>> Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a PL
>> will just get
>you
>> water logged and make you heavier for your ride (assuming
>> you were LCing before hand). IMO, it is better to consume
>> carbs right before and during your ride, you can you burn
>> them as they land and avoid water logging.
>
>Generally Roger I would agree, from what we have read and
>maybe your own experiences. I will say, I don't retain
>water if I eat carbs for a day. I don't go out and eat a
>whole pizza....well usually not, but I don't seem to have
>that effect of retaining water. Not sure why.
>
>I really think carb loading may work for some people and
>eating carbs while riding works for some and whatever. You
>really need to do things and find what works for you as an
>individual. I think most people should eat some carbs if
>they are going to do a longer ride. I road 45 miles today
>and am on low carb and did okay today. I was cranky at the
>end. I could have used a Cliff bar or something.
>
>I tend to eat sushi the night before and eat protein and
>some carbs for breakfast and I like a banana or a Cliff bar
>or something while I ride. I don't like to eat too much
>while riding however.
>
>Curt

Within reason, this is the crux, IMO. Experiment if you must
but find what works for you.

Lots of nutritional tinkering works for me that doesn't work
for others. I do really well on a LC diet, when many get
headaches and/or feel bad.

-B

 

[Curt]

> >Generally Roger I would agree, from what we have read and
> >maybe your own experiences. I will say, I don't retain
> >water if I eat carbs for a day.
I
> >don't go out and eat a whole pizza....well usually not,
> >but I don't seem
to
> >have that effect of retaining water. Not sure why.
> >
> >I really think carb loading may work for some people and
> >eating carbs
while
> >riding works for some and whatever. You really need to do
> >things and
find
> >what works for you as an individual. I think most people
> >should eat some carbs if they are going to do a longer
> >ride. I road 45 miles today and
am
> >on low carb and did okay today. I was cranky at the end.
> >I could have
used
> >a Cliff bar or something.
> >
> >I tend to eat sushi the night before and eat protein and
> >some carbs for breakfast and I like a banana or a Cliff
> >bar or something while I ride.
I
> >don't like to eat too much while riding however.
> >
> >Curt
>
> Within reason, this is the crux, IMO. Experiment if you
> must but find what works for you.
>
> Lots of nutritional tinkering works for me that doesn't
> work for others. I do really well on a LC diet, when many
> get headaches and/or feel bad.
>
> -B

Interesting you mention LC diet and headaches. I confess, I
get a headache for about three days when I restart LC on
about day 2 or 3 through day 4 or 5 and I really don't feel
all that great. Then it goes away and I start really feeling
good. I suspect that many people start feeling bad for a
couple of days and go off the diet and say...I hate LC. The
reason I say this is because I have seen what people do on
diets. They are not very strict and they look for an excuse
to quite. I should know, I was one of them for years.

On the other hand, I am sure there are people that don't do
well on LC. There is no doubt people are different. Curt

 

[Curt]

> >Generally Roger I would agree, from what we have read and
> >maybe your own experiences. I will say, I don't retain
> >water if I eat carbs for a day.
I
> >don't go out and eat a whole pizza....well usually not,
> >but I don't seem
to
> >have that effect of retaining water. Not sure why.
> >
> >I really think carb loading may work for some people and
> >eating carbs
while
> >riding works for some and whatever. You really need to do
> >things and
find
> >what works for you as an individual. I think most people
> >should eat some carbs if they are going to do a longer
> >ride. I road 45 miles today and
am
> >on low carb and did okay today. I was cranky at the end.
> >I could have
used
> >a Cliff bar or something.
> >
> >I tend to eat sushi the night before and eat protein and
> >some carbs for breakfast and I like a banana or a Cliff
> >bar or something while I ride.
I
> >don't like to eat too much while riding however.
> >
> >Curt
>
> Within reason, this is the crux, IMO. Experiment if you
> must but find what works for you.
>
> Lots of nutritional tinkering works for me that doesn't
> work for others. I do really well on a LC diet, when many
> get headaches and/or feel bad.
>
> -B

Interesting you mention LC diet and headaches. I confess, I
get a headache for about three days when I restart LC on
about day 2 or 3 through day 4 or 5 and I really don't feel
all that great. Then it goes away and I start really feeling
good. I suspect that many people start feeling bad for a
couple of days and go off the diet and say...I hate LC. The
reason I say this is because I have seen what people do on
diets. They are not very strict and they look for an excuse
to quite. I should know, I was one of them for years.

On the other hand, I am sure there are people that don't do
well on LC. There is no doubt people are different. Curt

 

[Zoot Katz]

Thu, 13 May 2004 04:37:31 +1000, <[email protected]>,
"DRS" <[email protected]> wrote:

>Essentially you go low carb a week or so before the
>competition and lift like crazy to deplete your muscle
>glycogen. Of course, at this point you feel like **** and
>are as weak as a kitten because you've got no energy, but
>then a couple of days before the competition you go stupid
>on the carbs and if you time it right you can achieve a
>temporary overloading of muscle glycogen right on
>competition day.

http://www.poweringmuscles.com/running.asp?article_number=7
. . . Researchers at the University of Western Australia
have therefore devised another refinement to the carbo-
loading strategy. This one combines depletion and loading
and condenses them into a one-day time frame. In an
experiment, the researches had athletes perform a short-
duration, high-intensity workout consisting of 150
seconds at 130% of VO2 max followed by a 30-second
sprint. During the next 24 hours, the athletes consumed
12 grams of carbohydrate per kilogram of lean muscle
mass. This resulted in a 90 percent increase in muscle
glycogen storage.
. . .
--
zk

 

[Badger_south]

On Wed, 12 May 2004 21:45:50 GMT, "curt" <[email protected]> wrote:

>> Within reason, this is the crux, IMO. Experiment if you
>> must but find what works for you.
>>
>> Lots of nutritional tinkering works for me that doesn't
>> work for others. I do really well on a LC diet, when many
>> get headaches and/or feel bad.
>>
>> -B
>
>Interesting you mention LC diet and headaches. I confess, I
>get a headache for about three days when I restart LC on
>about day 2 or 3 through day 4 or 5 and I really don't feel
>all that great. Then it goes away and I start really
>feeling good. I suspect that many people start feeling bad
>for a couple of days and go off the diet and say...I hate
>LC. The reason I say this is because I have seen what
>people do on diets. They are not very strict and they look
>for an excuse to quite. I should know, I was one of them
>for years.
>
>On the other hand, I am sure there are people that don't do
>well on LC. There is no doubt people are different. Curt

I remember years ago reading about how bodybuilders got
'cut' for competition, and wondering how in the world they
were able to eat boiled chicken, rinsed tunafish, and
protein drinks and little else.

At the time, I was ruled by the food, and felt I was weak
for not being able to lose weight, or diet, or cut the
subcutaneous fat, etc.

It was surprising as hell to discover the trick was to do
what the Atkins ppl call 'induction' where you go on a
mostly protein diet for about 6-10 days to purge the carbs
out of your system.

It was amazing. After about day 7 or 8 I no longer had -any-
desire to eat carbs, and _I_ controlled the diet. I decided
intellectually (duh) what to eat, and could fast or do
whatever the heck I wanted to and the fat weight just came
flying off. At this point I decided I was a carb addict, and
it was the endorphin rush and the use of food as a drug that
had me hooked. I had hated that. I went for about 6 months
eating no overt carbs. Of course you get a fair amount of
'hidden', or non-obvious carbs; in milk, in cheese, in
processed meat and soforth, but I'm pretty sure I kept it
below 20grams per day.

It's really a 'high' for me. I need less sleep, don't get
tired or sleepy during the day, and have a lot of energy.
People say that's nuts, you need carbs and whatever, but in
my case I seemed to thrive. What I really liked was being in
'control' of the food, and not the other way around.

Now I'm at a point where I 'decide' to have some carbs,
usually fruit drinks and soforth to help me on bike rides
over 45 minutes, and I'll occasionally eat dark chocolate,
or munch on some sweet tarts before or after exercise, but
mostly survive on turkey, salmon and green beans. My wife
says she thinks I'm some kind of mutant. heh.

Anyway, your body, your science experiment I always say. ;-)

-B

 

[Terry Morse]

Rick Onanian wrote:

> Carbohydrates are a necessary part of a healthy diet. An
> unhealthy diet that's missing important parts can cause
> weight loss, which is why no-carb or no-
> [protein+fat+whatever] diets can result in lost weight.

Actually, the no-carb, etc. diets result in lost weight
because they reduce the number of calories a person eats
daily. Any weight loss diet is essentially a gimmick to get
you to eat fewer calories.
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

 

[Bill]

I am late on this thread too so.... Logic would seem to
indicate eating a lot of protein right after a race so your
body could build the muscles with it. Eating a lot of carbs
the night before would seem to trigger your body into trying
to convert the excess calories into fat, not exactly the
intent. Eating a huge, high calorie, high carb breakfast a
few hours before a race would put all that carb energy into
your bloodstream at about the time it was needed. This seems
to work for me, although I must repeat that I am 55 and
hardly traing for the TDF, but morning carbs, along with a
gallon of Orange juice in a backpack (not a camelback), and
some food, energy bars or whatever, makes a 70 mile plus
ride a whole lot easier. My take, but again I am just a semi-
addicted rider and not a trainer. Just 45 years of riding
experience. Bill

 

[Roger Zoul]

curt wrote:
::: Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a
::: PL will just get you water logged and make you heavier
::: for your ride (assuming you were LCing before hand).
::: IMO, it is better to consume carbs right before and
::: during your ride, you can you burn them as they land and
::: avoid water logging.
::
:: Generally Roger I would agree, from what we have read and
:: maybe your own experiences. I will say, I don't retain
:: water if I eat carbs for a day. I don't go out and eat a
:: whole pizza....well usually not, but I don't seem to have
:: that effect of retaining water. Not sure why.

Well, I generally weight train and do strict low-carb
and get all glycogen depleted...so when I carb up, I go
carb stupid...not just eating a pizza, many many
carbs...and when I do, I can gain 10 lbs in at two
days...I did that last weekend...went out for a 41-mile
ride, and could tell straight off that I was carrying
extra weight...for bicycling, that's not good. Of
course, those carbs helped me because I didn't have low
blood glucose aftwards (see below).

::
:: I really think carb loading may work for some people and
:: eating carbs while riding works for some and whatever.
:: You really need to do things and find what works for you
:: as an individual. I think most people should eat some
:: carbs if they are going to do a longer ride. I road 45
:: miles today and am on low carb and did okay today. I was
:: cranky at the end. I could have used a Cliff bar or
:: something.

Well, you can eat carbs or not...but the point about carb
loading, and where it really makes sense, is if you plan to
exercise intensely...so, for a race, carbing up makes
sense...for an endurance event like riding 45 miles, extra
carbs MAY not be necessary. In my case, I was experiencing
low blood glucose after my rides, so I've started trying to
increase carbs. So, this morning, I had 40g of carbs before
my ride...that seemed to help. I'm going to try to increase
carbs just on the day of the ride and NOT do major weight-
lifting style carb ups for bicycling...

::
:: I tend to eat sushi the night before and eat protein and
:: some carbs for breakfast and I like a banana or a Cliff
:: bar or something while I ride. I don't like to eat too
:: much while riding however.

That sounds very reasonable to me....and if it works for
you, I'd certainly suggest you keep doing it. I need to see
what a Cliff bar is...that might be good for me once I get
over 50-miles.

 

[Terry Morse]

In article <[email protected]>,
"Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a PL
> will just get you water logged and make you heavier for
> your ride (assuming you were LCing before hand). IMO, it
> is better to consume carbs right before and during your
> ride, you can you burn them as they land and avoid water
> logging.

Carbo loading works for multi-hour endurance events, there
are studies to back it up:

"It's reasonably clear that a high-fat diet followed by
carbohydrate loading is better than a high-carbohydrate diet
for ultra-endurance.  In a crossover study (#291), seven
competitive cyclists had either 6 d of high fat and 1 d of
high carbohydrate or 7 d of high carbohydrate.  On fat with
carbo-loading they went 5% further (equivalent to an 11%
increase in mean power) in a 1-h time trial on a cycle
ergometer after 4 h at moderate intensity. The conditions
(breakfast, supplements, exercise intensities) were more
realistic than in previous studies, and a P value of 0.11
for the effect is equivalent to chances of 94.5% that the
true effect was positive. The mechanism?  Probably glycogen
sparing resulting from fat adaptation, coupled with the
extra glycogen from the day of carbo-loading, because
oxidation of fat during the performance test was still high
after fat with carbo-loading (#292)." -- Athletic
Performance at the 2001 ACSM Meeting

--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
In Excelsis Escendo

 

[Terry Morse]

In article <[email protected]>,
"Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a PL
> will just get you water logged and make you heavier for
> your ride (assuming you were LCing before hand). IMO, it
> is better to consume carbs right before and during your
> ride, you can you burn them as they land and avoid water
> logging.

Carbo loading works for multi-hour endurance events, there
are studies to back it up:

"It's reasonably clear that a high-fat diet followed by
carbohydrate loading is better than a high-carbohydrate diet
for ultra-endurance.  In a crossover study (#291), seven
competitive cyclists had either 6 d of high fat and 1 d of
high carbohydrate or 7 d of high carbohydrate.  On fat with
carbo-loading they went 5% further (equivalent to an 11%
increase in mean power) in a 1-h time trial on a cycle
ergometer after 4 h at moderate intensity. The conditions
(breakfast, supplements, exercise intensities) were more
realistic than in previous studies, and a P value of 0.11
for the effect is equivalent to chances of 94.5% that the
true effect was positive. The mechanism?  Probably glycogen
sparing resulting from fat adaptation, coupled with the
extra glycogen from the day of carbo-loading, because
oxidation of fat during the performance test was still high
after fat with carbo-loading (#292)." -- Athletic
Performance at the 2001 ACSM Meeting

--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
In Excelsis Escendo

 

[Roger Zoul]

DRS wrote:
:: "Rick Onanian" <[email protected]> wrote in message
:: news:[email protected]
::: On Wed, 12 May 2004 02:28:55 GMT, "carbo_jim"
::: <[email protected]> wrote:
:::: It is a know fact that carbs are poisonous to humans,
:::: hence the atkins revolution.
:::
::: This propaganda is unfortunately foisted on those whose
::: ignorance will allow it.
:::
::: Carbohydrates are a necessary part of a healthy diet.
::
:: Complex carbohydrates are a necesary part of a healthy
:: diet. It's possible to live quite well without simple
:: sugars.
::
::: An unhealthy diet that's missing important parts can
::: cause weight loss, which is why no-carb or no-
::: [protein+fat+whatever] diets can result in lost weight.
::
:: Er, no. Weight loss only occurs when energy out > energy
:: in. The reason Atkins and similar diets work is primarily
:: because high protein diets suppress appetite more than
:: other kinds, so even though people are theoretically
:: allowed to eat as much as they want (within reason) they
:: simply end up reducing their calorific intake below their
:: maintenance levels naturally.

Atkins is not a high protein diet...it is a high fat diet.
The lack of carbs is what suppresses appetite, not protein.

 

[Roger Zoul]

DRS wrote:
:: "Rick Onanian" <[email protected]> wrote in message
:: news:[email protected]
::: On Wed, 12 May 2004 02:28:55 GMT, "carbo_jim"
::: <[email protected]> wrote:
:::: It is a know fact that carbs are poisonous to humans,
:::: hence the atkins revolution.
:::
::: This propaganda is unfortunately foisted on those whose
::: ignorance will allow it.
:::
::: Carbohydrates are a necessary part of a healthy diet.
::
:: Complex carbohydrates are a necesary part of a healthy
:: diet. It's possible to live quite well without simple
:: sugars.
::
::: An unhealthy diet that's missing important parts can
::: cause weight loss, which is why no-carb or no-
::: [protein+fat+whatever] diets can result in lost weight.
::
:: Er, no. Weight loss only occurs when energy out > energy
:: in. The reason Atkins and similar diets work is primarily
:: because high protein diets suppress appetite more than
:: other kinds, so even though people are theoretically
:: allowed to eat as much as they want (within reason) they
:: simply end up reducing their calorific intake below their
:: maintenance levels naturally.

Atkins is not a high protein diet...it is a high fat diet.
The lack of carbs is what suppresses appetite, not protein.

 

[Roger Zoul]

Terry Morse wrote:
:: In article <[email protected]>,
:: "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote:
::
::: Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a
::: PL will just get you water logged and make you heavier
::: for your ride (assuming you were LCing before hand).
::: IMO, it is better to consume carbs right before and
::: during your ride, you can you burn them as they land and
::: avoid water logging.
::
:: Carbo loading works for multi-hour endurance events,
:: there are studies to back it up:

Your study is talking about greater intensity, which is what
I'm talking about. If you're racing or trying to finish
faster, then carbs help. If you're not concerned about time,
then you don't necessarily need those carbs...

::
:: "It's reasonably clear that a high-fat diet followed by
:: carbohydrate loading is better than a high-carbohydrate
:: diet for ultra-endurance. In a crossover study (#291),
:: seven competitive cyclists had either 6 d of high fat and
:: 1 d of high carbohydrate or 7 d of high carbohydrate. On
:: fat with carbo-loading they went 5% further (equivalent
:: to an 11% increase in mean power) in a 1-h time trial on
:: a cycle ergometer after 4 h at moderate intensity. The
:: conditions (breakfast, supplements, exercise intensities)
:: were more realistic than in previous studies, and a P
:: value of 0.11 for the effect is equivalent to chances of
:: 94.5% that the true effect was positive. The mechanism?
:: Probably glycogen sparing resulting from fat adaptation,
:: coupled with the extra glycogen from the day of carbo-
:: loading, because oxidation of fat during the performance
:: test was still high after fat with carbo-loading (#292)."
:: -- Athletic Performance at the 2001 ACSM Meeting
::
:: --
:: terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/ In
:: Excelsis Escendo

 

[Roger Zoul]

Terry Morse wrote:
:: In article <[email protected]>,
:: "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote:
::
::: Actually, for cycling, going stupid on the carb like a
::: PL will just get you water logged and make you heavier
::: for your ride (assuming you were LCing before hand).
::: IMO, it is better to consume carbs right before and
::: during your ride, you can you burn them as they land and
::: avoid water logging.
::
:: Carbo loading works for multi-hour endurance events,
:: there are studies to back it up:

Your study is talking about greater intensity, which is what
I'm talking about. If you're racing or trying to finish
faster, then carbs help. If you're not concerned about time,
then you don't necessarily need those carbs...

::
:: "It's reasonably clear that a high-fat diet followed by
:: carbohydrate loading is better than a high-carbohydrate
:: diet for ultra-endurance. In a crossover study (#291),
:: seven competitive cyclists had either 6 d of high fat and
:: 1 d of high carbohydrate or 7 d of high carbohydrate. On
:: fat with carbo-loading they went 5% further (equivalent
:: to an 11% increase in mean power) in a 1-h time trial on
:: a cycle ergometer after 4 h at moderate intensity. The
:: conditions (breakfast, supplements, exercise intensities)
:: were more realistic than in previous studies, and a P
:: value of 0.11 for the effect is equivalent to chances of
:: 94.5% that the true effect was positive. The mechanism?
:: Probably glycogen sparing resulting from fat adaptation,
:: coupled with the extra glycogen from the day of carbo-
:: loading, because oxidation of fat during the performance
:: test was still high after fat with carbo-loading (#292)."
:: -- Athletic Performance at the 2001 ACSM Meeting
::
:: --
:: terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/ In
:: Excelsis Escendo

 

[Roger Zoul]

Terry Morse wrote:
:: Rick Onanian wrote:
::
::: Carbohydrates are a necessary part of a healthy diet. An
::: unhealthy diet that's missing important parts can cause
::: weight loss, which is why no-carb or no-
::: [protein+fat+whatever] diets can result in lost weight.
::
:: Actually, the no-carb, etc. diets result in lost weight
:: because they reduce the number of calories a person eats
:: daily. Any weight loss diet is essentially a gimmick to
:: get you to eat fewer calories.

Not a gimmick....also, the diets aren't no-carb...

:: --
:: terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

 

[Terry Morse]

Roger Zoul wrote:

> Terry Morse wrote:
> ::
> :: Actually, the no-carb, etc. diets result in lost weight
> :: because they reduce the number of calories a person
> :: eats daily. Any weight loss diet is essentially a
> :: gimmick to get you to eat fewer calories.
>
> Not a gimmick....also, the diets aren't no-carb...

Yes, a gimmick. All diets are ruses to get people to reduce
their calorie intake. It doesn't matter what the diet is
called: no-carb, low-carb, low-fat, asparagus, Pritiken,
Atkins, South Beach. Nor does it matter what types of food
you eat. If you reduce your calorie intake, you lose weight.
Plain and simple, even if the $40 billion diet industry
wants you to think otherwise.
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
In Excelsis Escendo