Carbon, Alloy or Alliance Roadbike?

[gusrider]

Hello,

I bought a hybrid about 6 months ago after having not ridden for about 25 years and have been gradually building up my rides and loving it. I live near the beach in Melbourne and so join all the lycra-clads on a sunday morning and ride down our wonderful beach road. I am looking to progress on to a roadbike (the hybrid will not go to waste as i have 2 young boys who i will go on more casual rides with on the bike paths). I'm looking for something to ride on 50-75km rides with the occasional longer rides such as round the bay, etc. I preferably don't want a bike that i will be looking to upgrade in a year or so, budget of $2,000 +/- a bit.

Does anyone know much about the Learsport bikes in particular the 8500? I am also presently considering Giant bikes - OCR Alliance Comp (2008), TCR Alliance 1 or 2 (2008) and the TCR C2. I believe that the Learsport bike is an alloy bike, what are the advantages / disadvantages of all alloy, composite carbon or a mixture of both such as the Giant Alliance? The other question being is there a big difference between the Shimano 105 groupset to the Ultegra?

If anyone has any suggestions of any other bikes in this sort of range, i'd appreciate it.

thanks

 

[Raleighroader]

I bought my $2000 road bike a year ago, so I am still reasonably up to date on some of those issues. Let's start with Ultegra vs. 105. The bike shop mechanics tell me there is little or no difference in how long each lasts, or in how well they shift. Ultegra is simply lighter, and that's what you are paying for. If someone has tried both, and thinks there is a difference, I will defer.

As to frame materials, by "alloy" I assume you mean steel, and are trying to compare to aluminum and carbon. Steel and carbon are both said to be more reslient to vibration (such as you get from chip and seal pavement) than aluminum is, but not all steels and carbons are created the same. I rode a lot of bikes to get at this issue, and ultimately went from an aluminum bike (my old one) to a carbon bike.

Even if steel is as comfortable as carbon, I didn't want to pay a one or two pound weight penalty to get steel, and that's what it would have been. But did I really improve my comfort level very much? That's hard to say. I ride both of my road bikes on 25c tires, inflated to 105 lbs, and there is darn little difference in their comfort levels, even though one is aluminum with carbon fork, and the other is entirely carbon, but there is a slight difference.

A friend bought a Trek 2200, which is aluminum with carbon fork and seat stays, and it is very hard to say it is less comfortable than an all carbon bike. We are talking about micro differences here.

In general, I would say, keep it as light as possible, get something that looks good to you, make sure the fit is right, and go from there.

 

[gusrider]

Thanks Raleighroader. Well after a weekend of research, yes i have to agree with you light is good and in the same vane i have had good advice to concentrate more on the frame than the groupsets at this stage. I went into a couple of shops and was blown away when lifting a fully carbon bike on how light they are (I realise they get even lighter the more thousands you pay). So at this stage i've narrowed it down to a fully carbon frame bike and at least the 105 groupset which unfortunately puts me more in the $2,500 bracket. The bike i've got my eye on at the moment is the Azzurri Uno carbon which fits that bill and has the Shimano WH-500 wheels and retails around that figure. Does anyone have any experience of this bike or can recommend any alternatives of similar specification?

 

[Raleighroader]

After my first post I read a little more about Giant's Alliance frames. They are similar in concept to other combined carbon and aluminum bikes, such as the Trek 2200 and the Lemond "spine" series bikes.

The notion is that carbon has too much give in the bottom bracket, so stay stiff there, but get the benefit of carbon elsewhere in the frame. Frankly, if you are a good enough rider to need more stiffness in your bottom bracket than a typical carbon bike provides, then you should be buying a $5000 bike and racing on the tour.

I don't think you need to be at the $2500 level to get all carbon with 105 compentry, though. Raleigh, Giant, Trek and Lemond all have fully carbon frames with 105 shifters for closer to $2000. Usually the combined aluminum/carbon framed bikes are three or four hundred dollars less.

If price was an issue, I wouldn't hesitate to get the combined frame bikes, because I just don't think you will notice the difference, except when your buddies are playing one-upsmanship on how upscale their bikes are.

I don't know anything about Learsport or Azzurri bikes.

 

[gusrider]

I'm talking aussie dollars when i say $2,500, are you thinking US dollars? I must admit i haven't seen any all carbon bikes with 105 for $2,000. $2,500 aussie would be around the $1,900 US. The Azzurri is an Aussie bike company based in Sydney with frames coming from Taiwan.

 

[robalert]

I'm talking aussie dollars when i say $2,500, are you thinking US dollars? I must admit i haven't seen any all carbon bikes with 105 for $2,000. $2,500 aussie would be around the $1,900 US. The Azzurri is an Aussie bike company based in Sydney with frames coming from Taiwan.

so has anyone ridden a TCR alliance, can't find a review!

 

[Raleighroader]

I'm talking aussie dollars when i say $2,500, are you thinking US dollars? I must admit i haven't seen any all carbon bikes with 105 for $2,000. $2,500 aussie would be around the $1,900 US. The Azzurri is an Aussie bike company based in Sydney with frames coming from Taiwan.

Sorry, Gus. Yes, I was talking U.S. dollars.

 

[Gaz from Oz]

About $2500 is the cheapest carbon fibre in Oz. When I did all my research in March I came up with the same model as being the cheapest. But I didn't have a bike shop in the area and couldn't ride one. However I ended up paying a bit more and got a Felt which had Ultegra and some dura ace for around $3000. I recommend going to the LBS and buying rather than purchasing online. Make sure they can fit you out for it. When properly set up it really makes a difference

 

[gusrider]

Thanks Gaz, when you say you were looking at the same bike do you mean the Azzurri? Sounds like you went for the Felt F4, a friend from work just got one and yes, a very nice bike but a little exie for me, i think its a few hundred over the $3000 mark. I'm shifting towards the azzurri primo which has full Ultegra set and now the 2008 version has Mavic Aksium wheels but still researching as i'm finding it hard to get any feedback on the Azzurri bikes.

 

[Gaz from Oz]

Thanks Gaz, when you say you were looking at the same bike do you mean the Azzurri? Sounds like you went for the Felt F4, a friend from work just got one and yes, a very nice bike but a little exie for me, i think its a few hundred over the $3000 mark. I'm shifting towards the azzurri primo which has full Ultegra set and now the 2008 version has Mavic Aksium wheels but still researching as i'm finding it hard to get any feedback on the Azzurri bikes.

Yes I did buy the F4C. I can't recall which model of Azzuri I was looking at but I thought they looked okay. I started with a budget of $2000 but ended up spending a lot more but have never regretted the decision. I liked the Azzuri but the shop were not helpful. Only a couple of weeks after I purchsed they went out of business. Maybe they were trying to tell me without wanting to say we won't be there. No matter what you buy get a fit to your size. You will not believe the difference it makes. I used to ride a bike that was too big for me but once I got a bike to my size - absolute magic. Good luck with whatever you buy.

 

[Gaz from Oz]

Thanks Gaz, when you say you were looking at the same bike do you mean the Azzurri? Sounds like you went for the Felt F4, a friend from work just got one and yes, a very nice bike but a little exie for me, i think its a few hundred over the $3000 mark. I'm shifting towards the azzurri primo which has full Ultegra set and now the 2008 version has Mavic Aksium wheels but still researching as i'm finding it hard to get any feedback on the Azzurri bikes.

Yes I did buy the F4C. I can't recall which model of Azzuri I was looking at but I thought they looked okay. I started with a budget of $2000 but ended up spending a lot more but have never regretted the decision. I liked the Azzuri but the shop were not helpful. Only a couple of weeks after I purchsed they went out of business. Maybe they were trying to tell me without wanting to say we won't be there. No matter what you buy get a fit to your size. You will not believe the difference it makes. I used to ride a bike that was too big for me but once I got a bike to my size - absolute magic. Good luck with whatever you buy.

 

[gusrider]

Thanks for the advice Gaz. I made the big decision today and after hearing that you went for the more expensive bike and have not regretted it i've done the same and gone for the Azzurri Primo monocoque carbon frame with full Ultegra groupset - a very nice bike. I managed to get the deal i wanted and from the local Bike Shop and have been measured up today for a full bike fitting on friday - cann't wait for the w/e!
Like you, i started with a budget of about $2k and have spent a lot more. I didn't want to think in 6 month stime that i wished I'd gone for the Primo - my other alternative was a giant TCR C2 with 105 which on sale was about $500 cheaper.

Cheers

 

[Gaz from Oz]

Congratulations on your buy. May you enjoy many great and safe hours on the road. I am up in Townsville so I won't see you on the road but I am sure you will not regret your decision.

 

[Silvagni1]

Thanks for the advice Gaz. I made the big decision today and after hearing that you went for the more expensive bike and have not regretted it i've done the same and gone for the Azzurri Primo monocoque carbon frame with full Ultegra groupset - a very nice bike. I managed to get the deal i wanted and from the local Bike Shop and have been measured up today for a full bike fitting on friday - cann't wait for the w/e!
Like you, i started with a budget of about $2k and have spent a lot more. I didn't want to think in 6 month stime that i wished I'd gone for the Primo - my other alternative was a giant TCR C2 with 105 which on sale was about $500 cheaper.

Cheers

Hi Gus ,

Congratulations on your new purchase. We are looking for a new road bike for my wife and are interested in the Azzuri Primo (carbon) however do not really rate the Shimano hoops. Like you, we do not want to upgrade in a few years time and am thinking Ultegra gruppo as a minimum and a full carbon frame. Did you get the 2008 model with the Mavic Aksiums. If so, or based on what you know about the 2008 range, do you know the frame colours, RRP.
Also, for info, what made you decide on carbon (ride quality, price) as opposed to the Alliance or aluminium framer with carbon stays.

Appreciate your help.

Kind regards

 

[soretaint]

Hi guys,

Just for comparison, I've been riding an Alliance with Ultegra and the Aksiums for the past 10 months or so. Cost about $2500 AU and has been a good ride (2,500 km to date). Only real gripes are bar shape - the "anatomic" drops are too steep for my taste, and Aksiums are pretty heavy - fine for training though. The handling at speed is a bit fluffy, but no big deal.

Generally the bike's components are excellent, and frame seems a nice all-rounder. Only mod I've made to date is putting a Velocity Fusion on the back, and relegated the Aksium to the indoor trainer. Surprised there aren't more Alliance's on the roads, as it seems a good package. Will have 15,000 other bikes for company next weekend in the Around The Bay, so might spot a few!

Cheers,

S.

 

[gusrider]

Hello Silvagni,

Yes i did get the 2008 Azzuri Primo which has the mavic aksiums. The frame colours are very similar to the 2007s except they have more white in them now so the Primo is majority grey carbon weave with white and then flashes of red - in my opinion nicer than the 2007 version which was more just red and grey and looked to "Essendon Bomberish". I chose carbon in the end for weight (i recon the primo would be a good 2kg lighter than the alliance bikes that i was looking at) and from what i've heard the carbon absorbs the road bumps better than an aluminium bike. I didn't want to buy a bike that after only a year i'd want to upgrade. I'm very happy with my choice, i did a lot of research and found the primo to be extremely good value. A work colleague of mine did reseach as well and i pointed him in the direction of the Primo and he too decided that bang for buck it was hard to beat so he picked his up last saturday. Funnily enough they had built his with the Forza frame which is exactly the same frame as the Primo but blue instead of red (the Forza is the Dura-Ace groupset model). The Azzuri Uno (105), Primo (Ultegra) and Forza (Dura-Ace) are all the same frames and i think some bike shops just build them up with whatever frames they have in stock, when i was looking one shop i visited had a Primo frame with 105 groupset. The RRP for the Primo 2008 is $2,899 but there's always the negotiation. I'm very pleased with it so far.
Hope this helps, good luck
cheers,
Gus

Hi Gus ,

Congratulations on your new purchase. We are looking for a new road bike for my wife and are interested in the Azzuri Primo (carbon) however do not really rate the Shimano hoops. Like you, we do not want to upgrade in a few years time and am thinking Ultegra gruppo as a minimum and a full carbon frame. Did you get the 2008 model with the Mavic Aksiums. If so, or based on what you know about the 2008 range, do you know the frame colours, RRP.
Also, for info, what made you decide on carbon (ride quality, price) as opposed to the Alliance or aluminium framer with carbon stays.

Appreciate your help.

Kind regards