Cervelo - what's all the fuss about?

[Jono L]

Idiots. Hmm. That's a bit harsh, don't you think, especially as the whole bike thing is personal choice and preference? Is there an idiot scale? Maybe everyone should ride the same, cheap bikes. We can do a Chairman Mao kind of thing and use, say, your bike as the model, paint it gray, and sell it to everyone.

Idiots. And people wonder why roadies are considered elitists and snobs.

FYI, those "idiots" help make your bike possible.

Actually, back for round 2.

The preconception of roadies being elitist snobs is usually born out of perceived exclusionary behaviour against those that don't have the latest equipment.

And for chrissakes talk about drawing a long bow with your freakin communist rant. What do you work for FOX news or something? Give it a break

 

[alienator]

Geez, and you wonder why you get in so many arguments

Quit playing the grumpy card you crotchety old bugger.

There is plenty of bull when it come to marketing and R+D, you know it, I know it.

There are also plenty of people who lap it up and buy the latest thing etc.

Being a chump for bullsh!t marketing is different from wanting a bit of choice and variation in products.

Sorry, I don't buy it. I mean, I know you're the local hero and all, but that really doesn't mean, well, ****.

I'm not playing the grumpy card as you so eloquently say. Neither did I deny that there's a lot of marketing BS. That wasn't even the argument, so please try to stay on topic. R&D is R&D. It's not BS arena. What managers and marketers do with it is something else entirely.

And be careful that you don't bite one of the hands feeding you. Those people buying latest and greatest things are one of the reasons you got to go to China and rub your face on the pavement, or don't you understand where the sponsors and equipment providers get their money? Besides? What's wrong with people buying the latest and greatest? What does it matter to you what someone else rides? More importantly, what does it matter to you why someone chooses to ride what they ride or spend money on what they do? Frankly, it's not really any of your business.

And lest you drown in your own BS any further, take stroll back through history. Marketeers are around for and have always been around for the same reason: to do what it takes to sell product. You do understand that simple idea, don't you, Jono?

Try bringing some substance and a dash of objectivity to your arguments. What you've brought so far is empty.

 

[alienator]

Actually, back for round 2.

The preconception of roadies being elitist snobs is usually born out of perceived exclusionary behaviour against those that don't have the latest equipment.

And for chrissakes talk about drawing a long bow with your freakin communist rant. What do you work for FOX news or something? Give it a break

Communist? Wow. You really didn't get far with your education, did you? Pairing communism and Fox news.......that's a whopper.

 

[Jono L]

Communist? Wow. You really didn't get far with your education, did you? Pairing communism and Fox news.......that's a whopper.

Oh come now.

I am not saying your rant was equivalent to that of a communist, you were accusing whathisname of some kind of socialist agenda by striking up Chairman Mao and equating his distaste for every new gimmick to come off the shelf as some kind of socialist desire for everyone to wear grey and ride the same bike. Hence equating you to someone from Fox news...

 

[Jono L]

R&D is R&D. It's not BS arena. What managers and marketers do with it is something else entirely.
.

Let me re-phrase, there is a lot of bull in marketing.

And be careful that you don't bite one of the hands feeding you. Those people buying latest and greatest things are one of the reasons you got to go to China and rub your face on the pavement

You neglected to mention they helped me get to Italy, Thailand, Indonesia and all round Oz-traya, and thanks to those people I'll get to do it all over the world next year

You could join me, but I think you'll be busy getting angry at people at cyclingforums.com

Don't get me wrong, I love anyone supporting the bike industry. That's why if you read my post you'd see I never there was anything wrong with being a "chump for marketing", hell, that's why things sell. Again you just love drawing your own conclusion. Just merely mooting your insistence that being against 'creative marketing' was somehow a secret commie plot

Besides? What's wrong with people buying the latest and greatest? What does it matter to you what someone else rides? More importantly, what does it matter to you why someone chooses to ride what they ride or spend money on what they do? Frankly, it's not really any of your business.
.

OK, let's play a game; it's called, let's not draw conclusions about people from one measly sentence they have scribed in a forum post.

I said there was bull in marketing. There is.
I said there are chumps willing to lap it up. There are.
I made the differentiation between people wanting some variety in products and consumerism based on questionable marketing. I never voiced any opinion on what I thought was good, bad or indifferent. I simply pointed out that you went a bit over the top in your retaliation to Feltski.

Marketeers are around for and have always been around for the same reason: to do what it takes to sell product. You do understand that simple idea, don't you, Jono?
.

I also like asking simple questions that need no answer to sound patronising, don't you?

 

[Jono L]

Just needed too add.

I bought a Cervelo P3SL a few years back. Don't know if it was 33% more rigid than the one before, or more vertically compliant while being horizontally stiff. Just dunno. But it was bloody quick. Dam quick and dam fun. That's all the marketing I need

 

[swampy1970]

Is it the fact that it's so fast that it's causing you to fall off all the time?



In jest of course...

 

[Jono L]

Is it the fact that it's so fast that it's causing you to fall off all the time?
.

That's the one bike I haven't fallen off


Yet....

 

[alienator]

Let me re-phrase, there is a lot of bull in marketing.


You neglected to mention they helped me get to Italy, Thailand, Indonesia and all round Oz-traya, and thanks to those people I'll get to do it all over the world next year

You could join me, but I think you'll be busy getting angry at people at cyclingforums.com

Don't get me wrong, I love anyone supporting the bike industry. That's why if you read my post you'd see I never there was anything wrong with being a "chump for marketing", hell, that's why things sell. Again you just love drawing your own conclusion. Just merely mooting your insistence that being against 'creative marketing' was somehow a secret commie plot



OK, let's play a game; it's called, let's not draw conclusions about people from one measly sentence they have scribed in a forum post.

I said there was bull in marketing. There is.
I said there are chumps willing to lap it up. There are.
I made the differentiation between people wanting some variety in products and consumerism based on questionable marketing. I never voiced any opinion on what I thought was good, bad or indifferent. I simply pointed out that you went a bit over the top in your retaliation to Feltski.



I also like asking simple questions that need no answer to sound patronising, don't you?

Why, jono, you cycling god, you're quite fond of drawing conclusions yourself that you can't support. Your efforts at being funny and offhand are, uhm, entertaining for some, but really that's about it, isn't it? You're the one that's gone a bit over the top. In fact, you even come back for more by your own admission. I'd say the chumps are the people labeling chumps. To me, it's not worth the effort as I'm not so emotionally invested in chump identification as you are. Perhaps it helps you with self-validation.

 

[Jono L]

Why, jono, you cycling god, .

Finally you've been enlightened.

My job is done.

 

[swampy1970]

That's the one bike I haven't fallen off


Yet....

Is that because you mistook the common phrase "training wheels" to mean those two little wheels either side of the rear wheel rather than a set of 32 hole Mavic Open 4's?

 

[Gretzky1]

Pretty funny. The Cervelo and Scott 'may' be made in the same asian factory. Just different designs.

I think it's like buying a Acura or a Lexus. Or a Alfa Romero if European.

Well if the frame is carbon fibre, there are only 2 or 3 factories in the world where these come from, and yes they are all in china.
But unfortunately, what i have learnt from someone who used to work at Bianchi, my "italian made" bike is not really italian made, the frame was made in china, but painted & stickers put on & all that in italy. According to the laws, the bike only needs to be made 50% in a country to be able to say it was made in that country.\

So anyone who says they have a such & such country made carbon fibre bike, just laugh & tell them it really come from china.

As for the old Steel, Alu or Titanium ones. Well thats a different story

 

[toomanybikes]

Every year it amazes me on rides like the Death Ride, that countless dozens of people seem to be on the latest hyper priced bike with additional fancy carbon and titanium bits. Apparently to these folks owning the top of the line Pinarello or Colnago equiped with Campag Super Record isn't enough - you gotta have the Zipp carbon cranks and zero gravity brakes.

I think I might dig out the old 653 frame, find some old super record brake levers, with exposed cables from the early 80's and ride the event on that and pass them all. If only I could find some slotted cleats for my Specialized shoes so I could use the ol' toe clips and straps.

You can get those at Yellow Jersey.

yellowjersey.org - if memory serves right. It's a shop in Madison, Wisc.

 

[alienator]

Well if the frame is carbon fibre, there are only 2 or 3 factories in the world where these come from, and yes they are all in china.
But unfortunately, what i have learnt from someone who used to work at Bianchi, my "italian made" bike is not really italian made, the frame was made in china, but painted & stickers put on & all that in italy. According to the laws, the bike only needs to be made 50% in a country to be able to say it was made in that country.\

So anyone who says they have a such & such country made carbon fibre bike, just laugh & tell them it really come from china.

As for the old Steel, Alu or Titanium ones. Well thats a different story

Hmmm. No. There are factories in Taiwan and China. Time makes almost all of its frames at its factory in France. France makes frames at its factory in Tunisia and one in France, with, I think, one frame coming from the far East. Trek still makes a lot of frames in Wisconsin. I don't have a list, but there are frames still being manufactured in Italy. Aegis is making frames in Canada. I don't know if Argon 18 frames are made in Canada or just painted there. I believe they're made there. Cyfac frames are made in France. That's just a small sampling, and it's just made up of mass produced frames. If you include custom builders--Crumpton, Parlee, Spin, and others--the list of frames made in places outside of the Far East grows.

No doubt there are a lot of frames made in the Far East, but it's wrong to say that all are made there. Moreover, it's certainly wrong to assume that if two companies' frames are made in the same factory, they are made the same.

 

[toomanybikes]

Hmmm. No. There are factories in Taiwan and China. Time makes almost all of its frames at its factory in France. France makes frames at its factory in Tunisia and one in France, with, I think, one frame coming from the far East. Trek still makes a lot of frames in Wisconsin. I don't have a list, but there are frames still being manufactured in Italy. Aegis is making frames in Canada. I don't know if Argon 18 frames are made in Canada or just painted there. I believe they're made there. Cyfac frames are made in France. That's just a small sampling, and it's just made up of mass produced frames. If you include custom builders--Crumpton, Parlee, Spin, and others--the list of frames made in places outside of the Far East grows.

No doubt there are a lot of frames made in the Far East, but it's wrong to say that all are made there. Moreover, it's certainly wrong to assume that if two companies' frames are made in the same factory, they are made the same.

Nope.

Argon18 frames are made in the far east. China. They come out of the same factory as the BMC's. Can't remember the name of it, but the people there hate the BMC's as the rejection rate on those CNC'd "skeleton joints" is HUGE and the resultant cost of manufacture per unit is higher.

 

[alienator]

Nope.

Argon18 frames are made in the far east. China. They come out of the same factory as the BMC's. Can't remember the name of it, but the people there hate the BMC's as the rejection rate on those CNC'd "skeleton joints" is HUGE and the resultant cost of manufacture per unit is higher.

Alright, that's one that was wrong. Still don't see how "all" frames are made in the Far East. Absolute statement quite frequently end up being wrong.

I'll substitute Guru for Argon 18, since Guru frames are made in Canada.

 

[toomanybikes]

Alright, that's one that was wrong. Still don't see how "all" frames are made in the Far East. Absolute statement quite frequently end up being wrong.

I'll substitute Guru for Argon 18, since Guru frames are made in Canada.

Yes they are, just outside Montreal ( If it can be argued that Montreal is part of Canada ..... ...)

 

[maander`]

regardless of who designed your frame, im willing to bet more than half the people on here have a frame that was assembled in china, myself included.

Me too. XACD.COM titanium.

 

[nurul]

Every year it amazes me on rides like the Death Ride, that countless dozens of people seem to be on the latest hyper priced bike with additional fancy carbon and titanium bits. Apparently to these folks owning the top of the line Pinarello or Colnago equiped with Campag Super Record isn't enough - you gotta have the Zipp carbon cranks and zero gravity brakes.

I think I might dig out the old 653 frame, find some old super record brake levers, with exposed cables from the early 80's and ride the event on that and pass them all. If only I could find some slotted cleats for my Specialized shoes so I could use the ol' toe clips and straps.

Hheheheh!! I sometimes pull out my aluminium cannondale and people look at it in shock..like it is a 653 Reynolds...

 

[Vanquish]

Cervelo..
I have one and since owning it have turned into a massive fan, then you get the kit, then you turn your head at any other Cervelo to see what he/she has...

If you didnt like your bike you wouldnt have spent $X on it, and if the price tag denoted talent then we wouldnt be able to overtake someone riding the latest Pinarello with a heftier price tag. Fortunately all kinds of riders buy bikes and it means you can smile as you blow past the 'lawyer' on his $10+k toy. So enjoy the surprise!!

Cervelos are certainly not the most expensive, but you have to admit there is something about them, branding and image is a huge part but a Bike manufacturer sponsoring a team, a team with some awesome talent!! ( See if BMC gets the same response this year)makes them accssible to follow and builds more of a fan base.

I love the way my Cervelo is so responsive, but sales explanations are best saved for LBS to fill you with.

But I guess it really boils down to if your not passionate about what your riding then your probably:
A: Riding a Giant
B: Havent found IT yet
C Be better off jogging.