Ch9 anti cyclist on Southbank report

Discussion in 'Australia and New Zealand' started by flyingdutch, Oct 6, 2005.

  1. flyingdutch

    flyingdutch New Member

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    Interview of some middle-aged-worry-wort 'Ron-someone'
    telling about a collision he had with a cyclist
    He said they collided, cyclsit went to ground "And that's when i started swearing"
    Whilst i dont want to jump to conclusions , I cant help wondering how he remained standing, cyclist went down without him hitting the cyclist, ie lining him up with shoulder? (he actually referred to his shoulder as the way the contact was made. strangely enuff he dropped/moved forward shoulder gestured for camera as he told of the incident!)

    On the other hand, I personally think Southbank is dangerous at peak hour due to alrge numbers of both riders and peds. The area near the walkbridge in particular! Cyclists do tend to fly/race along there a bit too much IMHO.
    The dismounting signs, apaprt from being almost invisible, are very impractical.

    Comments anyone? suggestions for a solution?
    Have always thought it kind of strange that the lower/waterside promenade hasnt been allocated as a cyclist path (with relevant ramps etc at either end)

    i guess you can expect council staff and verbal abuse in that area over the coming days :(
    (aka what happened on Bitch Rd after last media spinjob)
     
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  2. alison_b

    alison_b New Member

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    Southbank is *awful* at any busy time - I would love to see a cyclist path along there (or even one accessible the other side of the river). If the peds don't get you the chance of a lobotomy from a boat being carried across the path a little further on will! :eek:

    More signs pointing out the shared nature of the space might help (ok, call me an optimist :D ) but people really don't know that they can expect a bike there - even a slow moving bike can spook a nervous pedestrian. That said, I don't really know why the mum had to push her pram *at* me last time I ventured there through peak hour. What is it with parents using their babies as weapons??

    The cyclist dismount signs need a time span on them - for example when the market is on. I rode through there this morning around 6.15 and there was hardly a soul in sight. I have seen a cyclist get irate about not being able to spin through the market crowd though :rolleyes:

    One night last week I rode through there and had my attention caught by 3 cycle police bumping down the stairs on the garden end of the market area... they didn't see the dismount signs as they turned into the market area either :)

    When you get elected you could give this area some attention maybe? ;)

    cheers,
    ali
     
  3. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    Southbank is part of the Capital City Trail, and the seemingly lack of adequate signage doesn't help one iota.
    http://www.dpi.vic.gov.au/dse/nrenrt.nsf/FID/-F5A76A35CBB4E46E4A25679A002C45B5?OpenDocument

    Contact DSE or MelbBUG for followup on this?
     
  4. NoZX6R

    NoZX6R Guest

    flyingdutch wrote:
    > Interview of some middle-aged-worry-wort 'Ron-someone'
    > telling about a collision he had with a cyclist
    > He said they collided, cyclsit went to ground "And that's when i
    > started swearing"
    > Whilst i dont want to jump to conclusions , I cant help wondering how
    > he remained standing, cyclist went down without him hitting the
    > cyclist, ie lining him up with shoulder? (he actually referred to his
    > shoulder as the way the contact was made. strangely enuff he
    > dropped/moved forward shoulder gestured for camera as he told of the
    > incident!)
    >
    > On the other hand, I personally think Southbank is dangerous at peak
    > hour due to alrge numbers of both riders and peds. The area near the
    > walkbridge in particular! Cyclists do tend to fly/race along there a
    > bit too much IMHO.
    > The dismounting signs, apaprt from being almost invisible, are very
    > impractical.
    >
    > Comments anyone? suggestions for a solution?
    > Have always thought it kind of strange that the lower/waterside
    > promenade hasnt been allocated as a cyclist path (with relevant ramps
    > etc at either end)
    >
    > i guess you can expect council staff and verbal abuse in that area over
    > the coming days :(
    > (aka what happened on Bitch Rd after last media spinjob)
    >
    >


    I think the solution is simply that people riding along Southbank should
    slow down and give way to pedestrians.

    --
    Nick
     
  5. Bleve

    Bleve Guest

    NoZX6R wrote:

    > >

    >
    > I think the solution is simply that people riding along Southbank should
    > slow down and give way to pedestrians.



    Agreed 100%. I ride through southbank almost daily, and it's
    not somewhere to ride at anything more than walking pace through.
     
  6. aeek

    aeek New Member

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    and tommorrow being Walk to Work Day there will hopefully be many more,
    and more without a clue than usual.
     
  7. Euan

    Euan Guest

    >>>>> "flyingdutch" == flyingdutch <[email protected]> writes:

    flyingdutch> On the other hand, I personally think Southbank is
    flyingdutch> dangerous at peak hour due to alrge numbers of both
    flyingdutch> riders and peds. The area near the walkbridge in
    flyingdutch> particular! Cyclists do tend to fly/race along there a
    flyingdutch> bit too much IMHO. The dismounting signs, apaprt from
    flyingdutch> being almost invisible, are very impractical.

    As luck would have it I felt decidedly disenchanted about my usual
    Ferrars Street up to Nepean yadeyada so went on a journey hunt. Start
    of it was Southbank.

    I'm not experienced on shared paths, I've probably got less than 100kms
    under my belt, so maybe peak hour Southbank was a bit much for my
    level of experience. Obviously I must have been doing something wrong
    'cause I'm sure I was one of the slowest cyclists on Southbank. Must be
    this old fashioned thing about giving way to pedestrians.

    All sarcasm aside I was frankly quite alarmed at the speed some of the
    cyclists were travelling at. I don't think there'd be a problem if
    people accepted their duty of care to pedestrians but unfortunately some
    don't.

    My experience wasn't much better on the shared path down by the Yarra.
    Sure many pedestrians stayed well left but that doesn't excuse speeds in
    excess of 30km/h 6 inches from a ped IMO.

    I enjoyed my journey hunt overall, turning 30kms in to 50, but today
    just confirmed my low opinion of shared paths. Peds and cyclists just
    don't mix very well.
    --
    Cheers | ~~ [email protected]
    Euan | ~~ _-\<,
    Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)
     
  8. alison_b

    alison_b New Member

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    Agreed... giving way to pedestrians is matter of course. At times it is so busy I just join them and walk :) Safer for everybody! (ok, not so good on the cleats...)

    ali
     
  9. dave

    dave Guest

    NoZX6R wrote:
    > flyingdutch wrote:
    >
    >> Interview of some middle-aged-worry-wort 'Ron-someone'
    >> telling about a collision he had with a cyclist
    >> He said they collided, cyclsit went to ground "And that's when i
    >> started swearing"
    >> Whilst i dont want to jump to conclusions , I cant help wondering how
    >> he remained standing, cyclist went down without him hitting the
    >> cyclist, ie lining him up with shoulder? (he actually referred to his
    >> shoulder as the way the contact was made. strangely enuff he
    >> dropped/moved forward shoulder gestured for camera as he told of the
    >> incident!)
    >>
    >> On the other hand, I personally think Southbank is dangerous at peak
    >> hour due to alrge numbers of both riders and peds. The area near the
    >> walkbridge in particular! Cyclists do tend to fly/race along there a
    >> bit too much IMHO.
    >> The dismounting signs, apaprt from being almost invisible, are very
    >> impractical.
    >>
    >> Comments anyone? suggestions for a solution?
    >> Have always thought it kind of strange that the lower/waterside
    >> promenade hasnt been allocated as a cyclist path (with relevant ramps
    >> etc at either end)
    >>
    >> i guess you can expect council staff and verbal abuse in that area over
    >> the coming days :(
    >> (aka what happened on Bitch Rd after last media spinjob)
    >>
    >>

    >
    > I think the solution is simply that people riding along Southbank should
    > slow down and give way to pedestrians.
    >

    Sure
    Mind you any ped who doesnt expect to see cyclists there is blind.

    Walking pace only along there tho.,. I agree, Fast walking pace tho.
     
  10. dave

    dave Guest

    aeek wrote:
    > NoZX6R Wrote:
    >
    >>I think the solution is simply that people riding along Southbank
    >>should
    >>slow down and give way to pedestrians.
    >>

    >
    >
    > and tommorrow being Walk to Work Day there will hopefully be many
    > more,
    > and more without a clue than usual.
    >
    >


    Yeah and thanks to the guy in the coffee jersey on the roadbike who
    shoved past Kathy on the way home. Did wonders for her confidence that
    did.

    Mind you when she discovered she could stay with you up the next hill :)
     
  11. ritcho

    ritcho New Member

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    I couldn't agree more - this is the reason that I don't think about trying to 'beat' my best time for my commute. Apart from traffic lights, one of the big sources of variation is the amount of pedestrian traffic across Pyrmont Bridge (for non-Syd people, this bridge is 100% pedestrians and closed to motorised traffic... it also means commuters and tourists wander across it like brown's cows).

    My response? Slow down - there is no value in racing through crowds.

    Ritch
     
  12. ghostgum

    ghostgum New Member

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    Are you allowed to ride along southbank (slowly for safety), or is there a section where you must dismount? I rarely visit that area, but will be
    passing through on the way to Docklands next weekend.
     
  13. EuanB

    EuanB New Member

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    There is a section where cyclists must dismount. I did and at the time I was the only cyclist who had.

    Two years ago I used southbank and was walking through the `cyclists must dismount' bit, an elderly couple applauded me saying `goodness, a cyclist who can read.' Not a lot I could say to that.
     
  14. dave

    dave Guest

    EuanB wrote:
    > ghostgum Wrote:
    >
    >>Are you allowed to ride along southbank (slowly for safety), or is there
    >>a section where you must dismount? I rarely visit that area, but will be
    >>
    >>passing through on the way to Docklands next weekend.

    >
    > There is a section where cyclists must dismount. I did and at the
    > time I was the only cyclist who had.
    >
    > Two years ago I used southbank and was walking through the `cyclists
    > must dismount' bit, an elderly couple applauded me saying `goodness, a
    > cyclist who can read.' Not a lot I could say to that.
    >
    >


    yeah that section pisses me off. I ride thru there far slower than
    walking speed. Walking in cleats is no joy. THo with kaths new
    pedals.. it may be easier :) I have no problem being slow (and polite)
    but cyclists must walk is one of those statements :)

    Ummmmm did you say ¨ä motorist with feet¨ or is that too deep.

    Strikes me that that bit is safer than most of the rest of southbank too.
     
  15. Bleve

    Bleve Guest

    Euan wrote:
    > >>>>> "flyingdutch" == flyingdutch <[email protected]> writes:

    >


    > I'm not experienced on shared paths, I've probably got less than 100kms
    > under my belt, so maybe peak hour Southbank was a bit much for my
    > level of experience. Obviously I must have been doing something wrong
    > 'cause I'm sure I was one of the slowest cyclists on Southbank. Must be
    > this old fashioned thing about giving way to pedestrians.


    It spooks me how a significant number of cyclists ride very
    .... recklessly ... through Southbank. I ride it most days, at just
    over
    walking pace and I *really* pay attention to wandering peds,
    kids, skateboarders etc ... and then some dickhead goes flying past.
    *shrug*


    > My experience wasn't much better on the shared path down by the Yarra.
    > Sure many pedestrians stayed well left but that doesn't excuse speeds in
    > excess of 30km/h 6 inches from a ped IMO.


    Te most dangerous thing on that path is rowing coaches.
     
  16. ghostgum

    ghostgum New Member

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    Is it clear where this starts and ends? Or is just the start well marked
    and the end unmarked? I vaguely remember seeing a dismount sign
    under Princes Bridge.
     
  17. coowoowoo

    coowoowoo New Member

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    I use the southbank on a regular basis. It depends on where you come on to southbank as to whether you see the sign or not. I have heard of the sign but never seen it.

    Unless someone decides to construct a seperate path along the riverfront then this problem will never be fixed. There will always be the majority of smart folk that slow down as they pedal through the obstacle course and there will always be the minority of dickheads that fly through scaring the bejesus out of peds who are not aware that southbank is the continuation of a bike trail.

    You cant blame pedestrians, both local and tourists,for not being aware of this if there is no signage. You could put up a dozen signs saying that cyclists must dismount but i am afraid that they would be ignored. Who wants to get off and walk their bike at 6.30am along southbank when its clear? No one.. It wouldnt be enforced by the police anyway. Logistally its not cost effective for them to do it all day every day.
     
  18. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    It's a tad nebulous. Who's up for a solution, like contacting Melb Council, BV, MelbBUG or DSE? Designated marked lane on Southbank? Other worthy suggestions? Or should we all attempt to emphasise the importance of slowing down - via word of mouth?

    Personally the behaviour of some cyclists on Southbank really sh*ts me. It's not a feckin pinball game of *cane around the peds*. Mind you though, I hit the deck (hard!) four years ago outside Clown after tightly swerving around a clueless ped. Cuts both ways.
     
  19. coowoowoo

    coowoowoo New Member

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    I think the word of mouth is one of the best ways. I have a few friends who try to fly through and i always remind them to slow down and think about bigger picture of upholding good cycling reputations.

    I spoke to an engineer at Melb city council once about why they had painted on and then removed the bike lane on princes bridge. It was a total waste of time trying to get them to do anything. The upshot was that more peds had whinged about a few near misses than cyclists had complained about their near misses whilst riding on the road instead of the path.

    So, having said that, i would imagine that the same philosophy will apply. If enough peds complain to council, then they will ban us from cycling there. But if enough cyclists complain about the lack of path, they wont do jack.

    Interestingly, Mayor So still seems intent on trying to promote a central bike hub thing for cyclists to store bikes and shower etc. He seems to think that we are on a par with amsterdam. If he invested more time in addressing the current cdb concerns (like southbank) rather than inventing ones that will not be considered by the majority of cyclists, then maybe we could get something done about the whole southbank issue.
     
  20. EuanB

    EuanB New Member

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    You are NOT kidding!
     
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