Chafing chamois seam

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by OughtFour, Jun 19, 2008.

  1. OughtFour

    OughtFour Guest

    Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation where the
    seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.

    I've never had this problem before but now I wonder how I ever avoided it. I
    wonder if there is some characteristic I should be looking for in my hunt
    for the right saddle, or counterintuitive saddle-positioning trick.

    I know saddles are personal and subjective, but at this point would be
    grateful for any advice, personal stories, whatever.

    I put about 1000 miles on my first replacement saddle, wondering all the
    time if it was right, before the saddle settled the question for me during a
    century ride by really hurting me. This was a Bontrager saddle somewhat like
    the Serfas that had failed.

    I decided to try something really different next and got a Forte Pro SLX (
    http://tinyurl.com/m9d3l ), a racy saddle from Performance. When that
    flunked the ride test I got a Forte Pro RS1 ( http://tinyurl.com/4jll74 ),
    an Arione knock-off. Again, ouch.

    As you can see, these are very different saddles. However, in every case the
    problem was chaffing along the seam that stitches the chamois to the shorts.
    Otherwise these saddles were all fine, though I'm not sure how suitable the
    SLX would be for a century ride.

    I own three pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages, and all chaff. I
    don't think the problem is the shorts. The stitching on all of them seems to
    be in good shape.

    I like to do long rides and have been looking at saddles that seem to offer
    good support. Should I try something with more padding? Is there something I
    am missing?

    Thanks for whatever light you can shed.
     
    Tags:


  2. smokey

    smokey Guest

    On Jun 19, 7:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    > replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation where the
    > seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.
    >
    > I've never had this problem before but now I wonder how I ever avoided it.. I
    > wonder if there is some characteristic I should be looking for in my hunt
    > for the right saddle, or counterintuitive saddle-positioning trick.
    >
    > I know saddles are personal and subjective, but at this point would be
    > grateful for any advice, personal stories, whatever.
    >
    > I put about 1000 miles on my first replacement saddle, wondering all the
    > time if it was right, before the saddle settled the question for me during a
    > century ride by really hurting me. This was a Bontrager saddle somewhat like
    > the Serfas that had failed.
    >
    > I decided to try something really different next and got a Forte Pro SLX (http://tinyurl.com/m9d3l), a racy saddle from Performance. When that
    > flunked the ride test I got a Forte Pro RS1 (http://tinyurl.com/4jll74),
    > an Arione knock-off. Again, ouch.
    >
    > As you can see, these are very different saddles. However, in every case the
    > problem was chaffing along the seam that stitches the chamois to the shorts.
    > Otherwise these saddles were all fine, though I'm not sure how suitable the
    > SLX would be for a century ride.
    >
    > I own three pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages, and all chaff. I
    > don't think the problem is the shorts. The stitching on all of them seemsto
    > be in good shape.
    >
    > I like to do long rides and have been looking at saddles that seem to offer
    > good support. Should I try something with more padding? Is there something I
    > am missing?
    >
    > Thanks for whatever light you can shed.


    Have you tried making adjustments to your saddle height and tilt? I've
    put on new saddles that chafed and found that if I lowered them a
    fraction of an inch it took some of the pressure off my crotch. If the
    nose of your saddle is too high, that can also cause chafing. The
    usual recommendation is to start with a level saddle and go from
    there.

    Smokey
     
  3. Bill Sornson

    Bill Sornson Guest

    [email protected] wrote:
    > On Jun 19, 9:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> Thanks for whatever light you can shed.

    >
    > http://www.antimonkeybutt.com/
    >
    > Instead of wet, try dry.
    >
    > Just make sure you get the _Anti_ MBP, not the other stuff. --D-y


    Finally, some helpful advice around here...

    Bill "gonna miss this place if RR drops Usenet" S.
     
  4. On Jun 19, 10:55 am, "Bill Sornson" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > [email protected] wrote:
    > > On Jun 19, 9:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >
    > >> Thanks for whatever light you can shed.

    >
    > >http://www.antimonkeybutt.com/

    >
    > > Instead of wet, try dry.

    >
    > > Just make sure you get the _Anti_ MBP, not the other stuff.  --D-y

    >
    > Finally, some helpful advice around here...
    >
    > Bill "gonna miss this place if RR drops Usenet" S.


    You're welcome, Bill.

    Forgot to mention: use tons of it and don't worry about ignorant
    comments-- although I haven't heard any and due to a long-running
    problem that has kept me off the bike at times, my seat bag is AMBP-
    colored.

    Oddly enough, I never had a real problem until I started using Assos
    Lancecreme, and that udder stuff that comes in the green can, a few
    years ago. No fun at all, the AMBP helps tremendously.

    Available in finer motorcycle stores (and Whole Foods, too). --D-y
     
  5. On Jun 19, 8:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    > replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation where the
    > seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.
    >
    > I've never had this problem before but now I wonder how I ever avoided it. I
    > wonder if there is some characteristic I should be looking for in my hunt
    > for the right saddle, or counterintuitive saddle-positioning trick.
    >
    > I know saddles are personal and subjective, but at this point would be
    > grateful for any advice, personal stories, whatever.
    >
    > I put about 1000 miles on my first replacement saddle, wondering all the
    > time if it was right, before the saddle settled the question for me during a
    > century ride by really hurting me. This was a Bontrager saddle somewhat like
    > the Serfas that had failed.
    >
    > I decided to try something really different next and got a Forte Pro SLX (http://tinyurl.com/m9d3l), a racy saddle from Performance. When that
    > flunked the ride test I got a Forte Pro RS1 (http://tinyurl.com/4jll74),
    > an Arione knock-off. Again, ouch.
    >
    > As you can see, these are very different saddles. However, in every case the
    > problem was chaffing along the seam that stitches the chamois to the shorts.
    > Otherwise these saddles were all fine, though I'm not sure how suitable the
    > SLX would be for a century ride.
    >
    > I own three pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages, and all chaff. I
    > don't think the problem is the shorts. The stitching on all of them seems to
    > be in good shape.
    >
    > I like to do long rides and have been looking at saddles that seem to offer
    > good support. Should I try something with more padding? Is there something I
    > am missing?
    >
    > Thanks for whatever light you can shed.


    The best thing is diaper rash ointment. It is essentially zinc oxide
    cream that doesn't break down while riding. Apply liberal amounts to
    your chamois. Actually, apply very liberal amounts. You can get it at
    your local pharmacy. A big tub of it is about $12.00.
     
  6. On Jun 19, 12:25 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > On Jun 19, 8:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    > > replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation wherethe
    > > seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.

    >
    > > I've never had this problem before but now I wonder how I ever avoided it. I
    > > wonder if there is some characteristic I should be looking for in my hunt
    > > for the right saddle, or counterintuitive saddle-positioning trick.

    >
    > > I know saddles are personal and subjective, but at this point would be
    > > grateful for any advice, personal stories, whatever.

    >
    > > I put about 1000 miles on my first replacement saddle, wondering all the
    > > time if it was right, before the saddle settled the question for me during a
    > > century ride by really hurting me. This was a Bontrager saddle somewhatlike
    > > the Serfas that had failed.

    >
    > > I decided to try something really different next and got a Forte Pro SLX (http://tinyurl.com/m9d3l), a racy saddle from Performance. When that
    > > flunked the ride test I got a Forte Pro RS1 (http://tinyurl.com/4jll74),
    > > an Arione knock-off. Again, ouch.

    >
    > > As you can see, these are very different saddles. However, in every case the
    > > problem was chaffing along the seam that stitches the chamois to the shorts.
    > > Otherwise these saddles were all fine, though I'm not sure how suitablethe
    > > SLX would be for a century ride.

    >
    > > I own three pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages, and all chaff.. I
    > > don't think the problem is the shorts. The stitching on all of them seems to
    > > be in good shape.

    >
    > > I like to do long rides and have been looking at saddles that seem to offer
    > > good support. Should I try something with more padding? Is there something I
    > > am missing?

    >
    > > Thanks for whatever light you can shed.

    >
    > The best thing is diaper rash ointment. It is essentially zinc oxide
    > cream that doesn't break down while riding. Apply liberal amounts to
    > your chamois. Actually, apply very liberal amounts. You can get it at
    > your local pharmacy. A big tub of it is about $12.00.


    This company sells replacement pads for shorts, very hi-tech, perhaps
    what goes into the best, or the most expensive shorts today.

    http://store.aerotechdesigns.com/prrecrpad.html

    For just the top layer, I somewhere saw a stock of just the true
    chamois, european cut and sewn. Just $5 each. Velo-Orange,
    Melpintoimports?

    Harry Travis
     
  7. OughtFour

    OughtFour Guest

    "smokey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]m...

    >Have you tried making adjustments to your saddle height and tilt? I've

    put on new saddles that chafed and found that if I lowered them a
    fraction of an inch it took some of the pressure off my crotch. If the
    nose of your saddle is too high, that can also cause chafing. The
    usual recommendation is to start with a level saddle and go from
    there.

    Thanks. Nose down as much as I could tolerate did seem to help a little on
    my test rides. Also, counterintuitively, seat forward. I'll fiddle with
    height, though I'm afraid it may already be on the low side.

    Thanks for your advice.
     
  8. On Jun 19, 11:25 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > On Jun 19, 8:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    > > replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation wherethe
    > > seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.

    >
    > > I've never had this problem before but now I wonder how I ever avoided it. I
    > > wonder if there is some characteristic I should be looking for in my hunt
    > > for the right saddle, or counterintuitive saddle-positioning trick.

    >
    > > I know saddles are personal and subjective, but at this point would be
    > > grateful for any advice, personal stories, whatever.

    >
    > > I put about 1000 miles on my first replacement saddle, wondering all the
    > > time if it was right, before the saddle settled the question for me during a
    > > century ride by really hurting me. This was a Bontrager saddle somewhatlike
    > > the Serfas that had failed.

    >
    > > I decided to try something really different next and got a Forte Pro SLX (http://tinyurl.com/m9d3l), a racy saddle from Performance. When that
    > > flunked the ride test I got a Forte Pro RS1 (http://tinyurl.com/4jll74),
    > > an Arione knock-off. Again, ouch.

    >
    > > As you can see, these are very different saddles. However, in every case the
    > > problem was chaffing along the seam that stitches the chamois to the shorts.
    > > Otherwise these saddles were all fine, though I'm not sure how suitablethe
    > > SLX would be for a century ride.

    >
    > > I own three pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages, and all chaff.. I
    > > don't think the problem is the shorts. The stitching on all of them seems to
    > > be in good shape.

    >
    > > I like to do long rides and have been looking at saddles that seem to offer
    > > good support. Should I try something with more padding? Is there something I
    > > am missing?

    >
    > > Thanks for whatever light you can shed.

    >
    > The best thing is diaper rash ointment. It is essentially zinc oxide
    > cream that doesn't break down while riding. Apply liberal amounts to
    > your chamois. Actually, apply very liberal amounts. You can get it at
    > your local pharmacy. A big tub of it is about $12.00.


    Well, I tried the diaper rash ointment, too. Didn't seem to work for
    me, not to say it won't for others.

    If you look, you should be able to find Zwitsal, a Dutch product. My
    mother-in-law brought some to the US for us, by test it works a lot
    better than most of the grocery/drug store stuff found in the USA.
    Babies R Us?

    There is one other superior product that is "medical", not common but
    available and having failed to trip my memory, I'll re-post when the
    name pops up. Both it and the Zwitsal were "emergency" use with our
    kids when they were in diapers-- notwithstanding "it's just zinc
    oxide". --D-y
     
  9. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    > replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation where
    > the seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.


    http://www.excelsports.com/new.asp?...l+Saddle&vendorCode=SANMARCO&major=1&minor=18

    The San Marco Concor is also OK but it has a more limited seating position
    where it is comfortable. The Regal has a lot greater positioning error where
    it is still comfortable.
     
  10. oughtfour

    oughtfour Guest

    Just want to say thanks for all the suggestions of powders and ointments
    and such. I suppose it may come to that, at least for really long rides,
    though I'm hoping (still) to find the right saddle & position to
    minimize the burn first. At this point 40 miles is about all I can get
    away with! I did better than that on the Bontrager.

    Thanks again, and keep it coming if there is more!
     
  11. Pat

    Pat Guest

    "oughtfour" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]
    > Just want to say thanks for all the suggestions of powders and ointments
    > and such. I suppose it may come to that, at least for really long rides,
    > though I'm hoping (still) to find the right saddle & position to minimize
    > the burn first. At this point 40 miles is about all I can get away with! I
    > did better than that on the Bontrager.
    >
    > Thanks again, and keep it coming if there is more!


    Just wondering--is it your shorts? Are they slipping around a bit? Worn out
    and too loose?
     
  12. On Jun 19, 9:51 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Since the leather on my old saddle failed


    OK, start over: what kind of saddle was that? --D-y
     
  13. OughtFour wrote:
    > Since the leather on my old saddle failed, I have tried three different
    > replacements and experienced the same problem, painful irritation where the
    > seam of my shorts rubs and chafes my tender flesh.


    Dumb question: why can't you get a new version of your old saddle?


    --
    Paul M. Hobson
    ..:change the f to ph to reply:.
     
  14. On Thu, 19 Jun 2008 20:07:48 GMT, oughtfour <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >Just want to say thanks for all the suggestions of powders and ointments
    >and such. I suppose it may come to that, at least for really long rides,
    >though I'm hoping (still) to find the right saddle & position to
    >minimize the burn first. At this point 40 miles is about all I can get
    >away with! I did better than that on the Bontrager.
    >
    >Thanks again, and keep it coming if there is more!


    From the counter-intuitive camp, you might try tilting back, saddle
    lower and forward so that you rest on the wide part of the saddle more
    fully.
     
  15. OughtFour

    OughtFour Guest

    "Pat" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]>
    > Just wondering--is it your shorts? Are they slipping around a bit? Worn
    > out and too loose?


    Thanks. I own 3 pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages. I get the
    chafing with all of them. The fit seems OK.

    Seem to me the hunt for the "right" shorts could be at least as frustrating
    as that for the right saddle, with the added bonus of not being able to
    return the shorts that don't work.
     
  16. On Jun 20, 8:18 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > "Pat" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >
    > news:[email protected]>
    >
    > > Just wondering--is it your shorts? Are they slipping around a bit? Worn
    > > out and too loose?

    >
    > Thanks. I own 3 pair of shorts of varying makes and vintages. I get the
    > chafing with all of them. The fit seems OK.
    >
    > Seem to me the hunt for the "right" shorts could be at least as frustrating
    > as that for the right saddle, with the added bonus of not being able to
    > return the shorts that don't work.


    Again, since you didn't have a problem until the old saddle died,
    let's get back to that old saddle...

    My sputtering ESP seems to be telling me that this saddle is thought
    to be irreplaceable due to age, not being in production any longer, or
    maybe it was one of those all-leather models that got wet and turned
    into an ass-hatchet that was (as ass-hatchets are well known for) very
    uncomfortable in ways other than chafing. ffft zzztt ssssszzz

    And the brand/model of the old, at least semi-comfortable saddle
    was...? --D-y
     
  17. OughtFour

    OughtFour Guest

    <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...

    >Again, since you didn't have a problem until the old saddle died,

    let's get back to that old saddle...

    It was a Serfas Cosmos, something like this http://tinyurl.com/4pvuzx .
    That's a conventional-looking saddle with (or so I thought at the time) just
    a tad more padding than I actually needed. But no chafing issues, despite
    being wider than any of the replacements.

    No cuttout either--I've never had that problem.

    I didn't run out and get another one because I thought I could do better. I
    didn't think I needed quite so much padding and the saddle itself was built
    a little lopsided. (VERY little, but you still notice things like that.)

    The Bontrager I first replaced it with was of the same ilk but gave a little
    better support, one thing I liked about it.

    Do you think I should return to something a little more cush? I'd miss the
    support, but obviously need to find something I can live with.

    Thanks.

    >My sputtering ESP seems to be telling me that this saddle is thought

    to be irreplaceable due to age, not being in production any longer, or
    maybe it was one of those all-leather models that got wet and turned
    into an ass-hatchet that was (as ass-hatchets are well known for) very
    uncomfortable in ways other than chafing. ffft zzztt ssssszzz

    And the brand/model of the old, at least semi-comfortable saddle
    was...? --D-y
     
  18. On Jun 20, 10:41 am, "OughtFour" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > It was a Serfas Cosmos, something like thishttp://tinyurl.com/4pvuzx.
    > That's a conventional-looking saddle with (or so I thought at the time) just
    > a tad more padding than I actually needed. But no chafing issues, despite
    > being wider than any of the replacements.


    Bingo. Wider.

    Conventional?

    <http://saddlemuseum.blogspot.com/2006/01/selle-italia-turbo-
    special.html>

    Well, those used to be "conventional", but the shape is what is of
    interest.

    > No cuttout either--I've never had that problem.


    No cutout, but a mighty deep valley, compared to "conventional",
    flatter saddles. It was a shape that worked so well you didn't even
    notice! <g>

    > I didn't run out and get another one because I thought I could do better. I
    > didn't think I needed quite so much padding and the saddle itself was built [oops, he said a little crooked].


    > Do you think I should return to something a little more cush? I'd miss the
    > support, but obviously need to find something I can live with.


    If you still have the old one, take measurements for remote buying, or
    take it with you to the bicycle store and get the very closest thing
    you can IRT shape, and width, "cush", everything and maybe even color.
    If they have one that is slightly lop-sided the way your old one was,
    go for it.

    Meanwhile, treat your sore place. IME what works is alcohol rubs. A
    fair number per day, and it's good to run around uncovered while the
    stuff evaporates completely. Kills some germs at least, helps toughen
    the skin (like guitar players have known for many years).

    Others have good results from ointments, etc. but I tried all that and
    if anything, anything moist (incl. Assos, the saddle creme of
    champions) made it worse.

    (bear with me dept.): Make sure your shorts are clean. Tide Free or
    Arm and Hammer "dermatologist tested" Free work for me, I air dry
    because it's the dryer mostly, not the washer, that kills lycra. Put
    them chamois-out in the bright sun (UV rays for germ killing) for a
    half-hour or so, lycra under the padding so it doesn't get sunburnt.
    This is to head off the next problem you might encounter with ongoing
    irritation, a saddle sore.

    The Anti-Monkey Butt Powder works. It's got calamine and talc for
    moisture absorption (like with poison ivy) and dry lubrication.

    Your integument is compromised, you need to fix that as well as go
    back to what worked.

    Think about your posture while you ride, and if you're rubbing, get up
    off of that thing!

    You may have simply changed your saddle height and/or tilt when you
    replaced the old saddle enough to "find" a setup that was wrong,
    wrong, wrong. Putting a duplicate on there, in the same position,
    might just fix things. Good luck! --D-y
     
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