Chain keeps falling off on Gary Fisher Cake 2 DLX



G

Greg Tokarski

Guest
Hi all.

I got GaryFisher Cake 2dlx like 3 months ago. Well, I did not have a
chance to ride it much for the 1st month, but by now I am having all
sorts of problems with shifting and chain falling off.
The chain usually falls off when climbing and when I hit some kind of
little bump... Oh, and I have to be on the mid or smallest ring in the
front - which of course is always the case while climbing.
Sometimes the chain falls off (always towards the frame - left, which
I am sure everybody guessed) when I am going down hill - usually when
I am not pedaling, but just going down and hit a bump.
I am pretty sure it's the full suspension that's doing it.

At this point the place I got the bike at worked with me a lot, but
without actually one of them taking the bike on the trail I doubt if
they figure it out. We just replaced front derailleur with XT (used to
be LX) - that certainly improved shifting (had problems shifting to
the bigger ring on the front) and adjusting tension of the chain (by
shortening it and adjusting the spring) helped a lot.. but.. still I
loose the chain, useally when it's really very inconvenient.

I do realize that my skill is maybe not that great, but if I pay that
kind of $ for a bike, it certainly should not have issues that my old
(8+ yrs) Novara did not have.

Does anyone have ideas or suggestion? Could there be an actual issue
with this specific GF bike? I did not talk to GF people yet.. I think
I might have to as well, but I think you pple may have a lot of good
input too.

Any ideas will be very much appreciated.

Thx.

Greg T.

[email protected]
 
"Greg Tokarski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi all.
>
> I got GaryFisher Cake 2dlx like 3 months ago. Well, I did not have a
> chance to ride it much for the 1st month, but by now I am having all
> sorts of problems with shifting and chain falling off.


snip
>
> Does anyone have ideas or suggestion? Could there be an actual issue
> with this specific GF bike? I did not talk to GF people yet.. I think
> I might have to as well, but I think you pple may have a lot of good
> input too.
>
> Any ideas will be very much appreciated.
>
> Thx. Greg T.
>



Keeping the cogs and rings clean and the chain properly lubed is a priority
with my Klein Adept.

It has a similar design and is prone to chain suck.

-
DTW .../\.../\.../\...

I've spent most of my money on mountain biking and windsurfing.
The rest I've just wasted.
 
"Greg Tokarski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi all.
>
> I got GaryFisher Cake 2dlx like 3 months ago. Well, I did not have a
> chance to ride it much for the 1st month, but by now I am having all
> sorts of problems with shifting and chain falling off.
> The chain usually falls off when climbing and when I hit some kind of
> little bump... Oh, and I have to be on the mid or smallest ring in the
> front - which of course is always the case while climbing.
> Sometimes the chain falls off (always towards the frame - left, which
> I am sure everybody guessed) when I am going down hill - usually when
> I am not pedaling, but just going down and hit a bump.
> I am pretty sure it's the full suspension that's doing it.
>
> At this point the place I got the bike at worked with me a lot, but
> without actually one of them taking the bike on the trail I doubt if
> they figure it out. We just replaced front derailleur with XT (used to
> be LX) - that certainly improved shifting (had problems shifting to
> the bigger ring on the front) and adjusting tension of the chain (by
> shortening it and adjusting the spring) helped a lot.. but.. still I
> loose the chain, useally when it's really very inconvenient.
>
> I do realize that my skill is maybe not that great, but if I pay that
> kind of $ for a bike, it certainly should not have issues that my old
> (8+ yrs) Novara did not have.
>
> Does anyone have ideas or suggestion? Could there be an actual issue
> with this specific GF bike? I did not talk to GF people yet.. I think
> I might have to as well, but I think you pple may have a lot of good
> input too.
>
> Any ideas will be very much appreciated.
>


Like others have said, it's mostly because of the craptacular Bontrager
crank. It's also partially a problem in the Cake's design - they've not
proven to be the best bikes. You can get a RaceFace Prodigy model for like
$70 on Nashbar now - you won't get any better for under $100.

That being said, don't let this get you down...especially after you hear all
the anti-GF propaganda that's sure to come your way. You can still totally
ride that bike for years and enjoy every bit of it.

Chris
 
On Mon, 17 May 2004 14:30:58 -0700, Greg Tokarski wrote:

> Hi all.
>
> I got GaryFisher Cake 2dlx like 3 months ago. Well, I did not have a
> chance to ride it much for the 1st month, but by now I am having all
> sorts of problems with shifting and chain falling off.
> The chain usually falls off when climbing and when I hit some kind of
> little bump... Oh, and I have to be on the mid or smallest ring in the
> front - which of course is always the case while climbing.
> Sometimes the chain falls off (always towards the frame - left, which
> I am sure everybody guessed) when I am going down hill - usually when
> I am not pedaling, but just going down and hit a bump.
> I am pretty sure it's the full suspension that's doing it.


Unlike what others have told you, this is not a chainsuck issue and is
unlikely to have anything to do with your crankset. It's a knee-jerk
thing: Gary Fisher bike + chain issues = chainsuck caused by Bontrager
cranks.

The symptoms you describe are usually caused by having too much chain.
This may be compounded when the suspension compresses and gives you even
more slack.

Firstly, I would check the length of your chain - it sounds like it may be
too long. Wrap the chain round the largest ring at the front and the
largest at the rear and pull the derailleur tight. If you can remove links
then do so.

Secondly, check there are no bent links in the chain or bent teeth on the
chainrings that could be knocking the chain off.

And finally, adjust your technique for the downhills. The less chain on
the rings / cogs at any one time means more chain slack, less tension and
the more likely the chain is to jump off. So, don't descend in the small
ring, use the large ring if possible.

--
a.m-b FAQ: http://www.j-harris.net/bike/ambfaq.htm

a.bmx FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/bmx_faq.htm
 
Thx for all the replies.

I've done much more research.. I wish I've done it right before buying
the bike.. but then again, GF did feel right - I guess if I can
resolve this issue I may be happy after all...

Anyhow, on the web (and here) I found that replacing the crankset may
be the way to go.. I do have to say I do not quite understand how that
will resolve the problem.. but obviously it might help.
There's an antisuck device from GF, but I've read it's pretty useless.
I've also read somewhere that just replacing the bottom bracket may
help a lot and is cheaper than replacing the whole crankset....
Personally, I am noticing how the tentioner on the rear derailleur is
living the chain a bit loose after a bump.. I wonder if maybe one with
a better spring it'd do better by responding a bit faster to loosing
tention?

So.. if anyone has any thought on these issues, especially with
specific suggestions - like what sort of crankset or whatever, may be
worht investing into, I'd appreciate it. I think I'll talk to the pple
at the bike shop (again:) on Wed... I am thinking about calling GF,
but then again, I wander what is the point anyhow. BTW the bike shop
replaced my front derailleur from LX to XT - that sure helped a lot
with shifting; but I still loose the chain from time to time when I
climb (and have a bump; or really crank to loosen the load and shift
to a lower gear for example)....

On a downhill I am learning to not go on the lowest front chainring
and I lost my chain on a downhill only 1ce since the XT change.

Well, once again, any more ideas would be appreciated; especially the
specific ones I can bring up to either GF or my bike store... (they
gave me "lifetime of adjustment" with a new bike... so far all of this
has been adjustments to make the bike work right... :)

[email protected]
 
"Greg Tokarski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Thx for all the replies.
>

.... I am thinking about calling GF,
> but then again, I wander what is the point anyhow.


I would make a free phone call before I spent any money on a brand new bike.

Good Luck
 
TM <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Greg Tokarski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Thx for all the replies.
>>

> ... I am thinking about calling GF,
>> but then again, I wander what is the point anyhow.

>
> I would make a free phone call before I spent any money on a brand
> new bike.
>
> Good Luck


Amen! My '01 Trek Fuel 90 had chain suck issues (new model
year) so I kept calling/e-mailing Trek, sending them links from
folks who had similar problems. They attributed it to a long BB,
so they changed mine from a 73x113mm to 73x110mm under
warranty. Never had chain suck for 2.5 years now...

--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)
 
Greg Tokarski wrote:
> Thx for all the replies.
>
> I've done much more research.. I wish I've done it right before buying
> the bike.. but then again, GF did feel right - I guess if I can
> resolve this issue I may be happy after all...
>
> Anyhow, on the web (and here) I found that replacing the crankset may
> be the way to go.. I do have to say I do not quite understand how that
> will resolve the problem.. but obviously it might help.


Read Bombas reply again. You don't have any chainsuck problems, at least not
that you have described.

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.
 
i dont' have the chain falling off issue, but i have chainsuck problems.
it often happens shifting to the small ring up front. and near the end
of my ride...typically when things are a bit dirty.

that space between the crank and the swingarm is so small that I can't
believe that a chain can get through there. well, my friends, it can,
and it takes a whole lot of aluminum with it.

my swingarm is gouged to hell from 6 instances of chain suck. that's 12
passes of my chain between the crank and swingarm. it's killer.

i replaced the crank to xt and even had a new chain put on cuz the last
chainsuck destroyed my chain by bending a link.

since then, i've had 2 more incidences of chainsuck. i'm sure there's
more to come, but i have been assured by my bike shop and fisher that my
swing arm will be replaced under warranty should this affect the
structural integrity of the swingarm.

at this rate, it won't be long until i get a replacement.


:mad:



--
 
nuker wrote:
> i dont' have the chain falling off issue, but i have chainsuck
> problems. it often happens shifting to the small ring up front. and
> near the end of my ride...typically when things are a bit dirty.


I noticed that my chainsuck problems were due to some grades on the small
chainring. I could feel them when I ran my fingers around the chairing and
solved the problem with a round file and some sandpaper. No chainsuck since
then.

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.
 
nuker <[email protected]> wrote:
> i dont' have the chain falling off issue, but i have chainsuck
> problems. it often happens shifting to the small ring up front. and
> near the end of my ride...typically when things are a bit dirty.
>
> that space between the crank and the swingarm is so small that I can't
> believe that a chain can get through there. well, my friends, it can,
> and it takes a whole lot of aluminum with it.
>
> my swingarm is gouged to hell from 6 instances of chain suck. that's
> 12 passes of my chain between the crank and swingarm. it's killer.
>
> i replaced the crank to xt and even had a new chain put on cuz the
> last chainsuck destroyed my chain by bending a link.
>
> since then, i've had 2 more incidences of chainsuck. i'm sure there's
> more to come, but i have been assured by my bike shop and fisher that
> my swing arm will be replaced under warranty should this affect the
> structural integrity of the swingarm.
>
> at this rate, it won't be long until i get a replacement.
>
>
>> mad:

>
>
>
> --


Have you contacted GF on this issue?

--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)
 
"nuker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> i dont' have the chain falling off issue, but i have chainsuck problems.
> it often happens shifting to the small ring up front. and near the end
> of my ride...typically when things are a bit dirty.
>
> that space between the crank and the swingarm is so small that I can't
> believe that a chain can get through there. well, my friends, it can,
> and it takes a whole lot of aluminum with it.
>
> my swingarm is gouged to hell from 6 instances of chain suck. that's 12
> passes of my chain between the crank and swingarm. it's killer.
>
> i replaced the crank to xt and even had a new chain put on cuz the last
> chainsuck destroyed my chain by bending a link.
>
> since then, i've had 2 more incidences of chainsuck. i'm sure there's
> more to come, but i have been assured by my bike shop and fisher that my
> swing arm will be replaced under warranty should this affect the
> structural integrity of the swingarm.
>
> at this rate, it won't be long until i get a replacement.
>
>
> :mad:


My '02 Sugar used to do the same thing - chain comes up from the bottom-back
of the chainrings, wedges between the stay and the ring, and thoroughly
pisses me off. One day, amid a flurry of upgrades, I switched the Bontrager
cranks and LX bb for Race Face parts. Also, I switched the front derailleur
to XTR. Since then, not one chainsuck.

Who knows why. I think I got the chainline a little farther out - shifting
was better than ever though. There is a nice gouge on the swingarm from the
couple 'o chainsucks, though. No big deal for me; it's a mountain bike, not
a piece of art.

FWIW, everyone I know that gets rid of the Bontrager stuff finds their
problem solved. Maybe your setup is a bit off, like mine was. Has your LBS
checked the chainline?

Chris
 
nuker wrote:
> i've brought it in a few times and they are amazed at the damage it
> causes. they contacted GF for me and i will be taken care of under
> warranty. it's just a matter of how long i want to wait to get a new
> swing arm.
> perhaps for '05 they will have solved the problem. if that is the case,
> my LBS says they will replace my swingarm with the '05.
> if the bike changes beyond the swingarm, then i'm replacing it with the
> '04, and selling it so i can buy a (hopefully fixed) '05 cake. i like
> the bike. it's just that chainsuck driving me nuts!




As many have mentioned, what you're experiencing is specifically not
chainsuck. It may be an alignment problem, it may be that you're chain
is still too long. It may be that you didn't and still don't have your
front DR adjusted properly but you are not chain sucking.

Ken



--
 
i've brought it in a few times and they are amazed at the damage it
causes. they contacted GF for me and i will be taken care of under
warranty. it's just a matter of how long i want to wait to get a new
swing arm.

perhaps for '05 they will have solved the problem. if that is the case,
my LBS says they will replace my swingarm with the '05.

if the bike changes beyond the swingarm, then i'm replacing it with the
'04, and selling it so i can buy a (hopefully fixed) '05 cake. i like
the bike. it's just that chainsuck driving me nuts!



--
 

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