Chain Length Question. Attention all mechanics!

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Me, Mar 19, 2003.

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  1. Me

    Me Guest

    Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain on a buddy's mtb?

    I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear cog
    and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could and from
    that point adding a link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually would
    shift into it.

    OK heres the prob,

    My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an xt long mech.

    But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small combo.
    Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there isn't
    any tension.

    So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big combo by shortening the
    chain or will there always be loads of slack in the small / small combo?

    Give me some advice please! Cheers,
     
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  2. Dax

    Dax Guest

    On Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:18:04 -0000, "Me" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain on a buddy's mtb?
    >
    >I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear cog
    >and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could and
    >from that point adding a link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually
    >would shift into it.
    >
    >OK heres the prob,
    >
    >My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an xt long mech.
    >
    >But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small combo.
    >Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there isn't
    >any tension.
    >
    >So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big combo by shortening the
    >chain or will there always be loads of slack in the small / small combo?
    >
    >Give me some advice please! Cheers,
    >

    are you using a long-cage rear derailleur? - Ъ×
     
  3. Pete Geurds

    Pete Geurds Guest

    dax [email protected] wrote:
    >>So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big
    combo by shortening the chain or will there always be loads of slack in the
    >>small / small combo?
    >>

    I would use the method that insures not wrecking the drivetrain. I always run enough chain to use
    the large-large combination. There's no real reason to use the small-small combination so I don't
    worry about that. As you move up from the smallest cog where does the chain come under tension?
    second or third cog? I'd make that my limit when in the granny gear. The small-small really crosses
    up the chain. This assumes a long cage derailleur in proper working order.

    Pete Geurds Douglassville, PA
     
  4. no-<< But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small
    combo. Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there
    isn't any tension.

    Enough chain for big big combo? Is it really tight or can ya take out a link or two?

    Using a sram snap link really helps this process...

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  5. Me

    Me Guest

    Yes, I'm using a Long cage Derailler and it seems to pick up tension around the Third cog in
    the back up.

    Think I should shorten it more?

    I'll be interest in hearing more.

    I've read the article on the Park site about choosing chain length and I've found it all quite
    confusing.

    Is there any one, sure fire method?

    cheers,

    "Pete Geurds" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > dax [email protected] wrote:
    > >>So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to
    big
    > combo by shortening the chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    the
    > >>small / small combo?
    > >>
    >
    > I would use the method that insures not wrecking the drivetrain. I always run enough chain to use
    > the large-large combination. There's no real reason to use the small-small combination so I don't
    > worry about that. As you move up from the smallest cog where does the chain come under
    tension?
    > second or third cog? I'd make that my limit when in the granny gear. The small-small really
    crosses
    > up the chain. This assumes a long cage derailleur in proper working order.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Pete Geurds Douglassville, PA
     
  6. You can test for a too-short chain by doing the following-

    With the chain in the largest rear, middle (on a triple) front- must be able to shift from the
    middle front to large without binding the rear derailleur.

    With the chain in the second-largest rear and largest front- must be able to shift to the largest
    rear without binding the derailleur.

    *Both* tests have to pass; sometimes one will work and not the other. If that's the case, the
    chain's too short. You don't want to assume you'll never shift that combo, because sometimes it's
    hot, you're tired, and you just reach for that next gear, not realizing where you are, and BAM,
    you've wrecked a derailleur, possibly your dropout as well, and could possibly even toss the whole
    mess into the spokes. No fun.

    --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

    "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain on
    a
    > buddy's mtb?
    >
    > I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear
    > cog and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could
    > and from that point adding
    a
    > link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually would shift into it.
    >
    > OK heres the prob,
    >
    > My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an xt long mech.
    >
    > But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small combo.
    > Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there isn't any
    > tension.
    >
    > So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big combo by shortening the
    > chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    the
    > small / small combo?
    >
    > Give me some advice please! Cheers,
     
  7. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain on
    a
    > buddy's mtb?
    >
    > I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear
    > cog and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could
    > and from that point adding
    a
    > link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually would shift into it.
    >
    > OK heres the prob,
    >
    > My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an xt long mech.
    >
    > But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small combo.
    > Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there isn't any
    > tension.
    >
    > So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big combo by shortening the
    > chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    the
    > small / small combo?
    >
    > Give me some advice please! Cheers,
    >
    I generally use one of two ways to size a chain, Peter explained the small/small method, the other
    is big/big. Don't run the chain through the rear derailleur, bring the two ends of the chain
    together, then add two links. Either method will work.

    Mike
     
  8. Dax

    Dax Guest

    "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Yes, I'm using a Long cage Derailler and it seems to pick up tension around the Third cog in the
    > back up.
    >
    > Think I should shorten it more?
    >
    > I'll be interest in hearing more.
    >
    > I've read the article on the Park site about choosing chain length and I've found it all quite
    > confusing.
    >
    > Is there any one, sure fire method?
    >
    > cheers,
    >
    >
    > "Pete Geurds" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > dax [email protected] wrote:
    > > >>So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to
    > big
    > > combo by shortening the chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    > the
    > > >>small / small combo?
    > > >>
    > >
    > > I would use the method that insures not wrecking the drivetrain. I always run enough chain to
    > > use the large-large combination. There's no real reason to use the small-small combination so I
    > > don't worry about that. As you move up from the smallest cog where does the chain come under
    > tension?
    > > second or third cog? I'd make that my limit when in the granny gear. The small-small really
    > crosses
    > > up the chain. This assumes a long cage derailleur in proper working order.
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > Pete Geurds Douglassville, PA

    I usually set it up so that in small-small, the chain is JUST tight - in other words, the top jockey
    wheel is almost kissing the chain in its bottom run as it leaves the lower jockey... generally with
    a long-cage derailleur that ALSO means it will allow big/big without expensive crunching... with
    most derailleurs the only combo that might give grief would be something like a 52/34 big with 24/11
    small ... Ъ×
     
  9. Me

    Me Guest

    Hi I'm the origional poster (or poser)

    Thanks for all the recommendations so far.

    Just to answer a few questionsm, Its long enough for big big no prob. So its just a matter of
    cutting it down. Unfortunately, Its a shimano chain so I've been going through extra connectore pins
    like crazy.

    Park recommended this Big Big and not in the derailler method. Does this give a dif measurement than
    feeding it though the derailler and adding one link.

    I might try it, but when you say add two links does that really mean 4 segments? Hope this
    makes sense.

    -cheers

    "Mike S." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > > Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain
    on
    > a
    > > buddy's mtb?
    > >
    > > I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big
    front
    > > ring and the big rear cog and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain
    > > together as tight as I could and from that point
    adding
    > a
    > > link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually would shift into it.
    > >
    > > OK heres the prob,
    > >
    > > My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an
    xt
    > > long mech.
    > >
    > > But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in
    the
    > > small / small combo. Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the
    > > mech as there isn't any tension.
    > >
    > > So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to
    big
    > > combo by shortening the chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    > the
    > > small / small combo?
    > >
    > > Give me some advice please! Cheers,
    > >
    > I generally use one of two ways to size a chain, Peter explained the small/small method, the other
    > is big/big. Don't run the chain through the rear derailleur, bring the two ends of the chain
    > together, then add two links. Either method will work.
    >
    > Mike
     
  10. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi I'm the origional poster (or poser)
    >
    > Thanks for all the recommendations so far.
    >
    > Just to answer a few questionsm, Its long enough for big big no prob. So
    its
    > just a matter of cutting it down. Unfortunately, Its a shimano chain so
    I've
    > been going through extra connectore pins like crazy.
    >
    > Park recommended this Big Big and not in the derailler method. Does this give a dif measurement
    > than feeding it though the derailler and adding one link.
    >
    > I might try it, but when you say add two links does that really mean 4 segments? Hope this
    > makes sense.

    Two links are two outer and two inner segments, yes.

    Two final words: Sachs chains. Love that connector!

    Mike

    >
    > -cheers
    >
    >
    > "Mike S." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > > "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > > Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain
    > on
    > > a
    > > > buddy's mtb?
    > > >
    > > > I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big
    > front
    > > > ring and the big rear cog and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain
    > > > together as tight as I could and from that point
    > adding
    > > a
    > > > link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never
    actually
    > > > would shift into it.
    > > >
    > > > OK heres the prob,
    > > >
    > > > My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and
    an
    > xt
    > > > long mech.
    > > >
    > > > But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in
    > the
    > > > small / small combo. Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that
    the
    > > > chain drags around the mech as there isn't any tension.
    > > >
    > > > So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to
    > big
    > > > combo by shortening the chain or will there always be loads of slack
    in
    > > the
    > > > small / small combo?
    > > >
    > > > Give me some advice please! Cheers,
    > > >
    > > I generally use one of two ways to size a chain, Peter explained the small/small method, the
    > > other is big/big. Don't run the chain through
    the
    > > rear derailleur, bring the two ends of the chain together, then add two links. Either method
    > > will work.
    > >
    > > Mike
    > >
    >
     
  11. another method not mentioned is big ring front, small gear back, imaginary line drawn through center
    of derailleur pulley bolts should be perpendicular to the ground.

    "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain on
    a
    > buddy's mtb?
    >
    > I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear
    > cog and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could
    > and from that point adding
    a
    > link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually would shift into it.
    >
    > OK heres the prob,
    >
    > My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an xt long mech.
    >
    > But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small combo.
    > Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there isn't any
    > tension.
    >
    > So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big combo by shortening the
    > chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    the
    > small / small combo?
    >
    > Give me some advice please! Cheers,
     
  12. David Kunz

    David Kunz Guest

    Mike S. wrote:
    > "Me" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    >>Hi, can someone give me some advice for setting up a new shimano chain on
    >
    > a
    >
    >>buddy's mtb?
    >>
    >>I've always used the medthod of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear
    >>cog and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could
    >>and from that point adding
    >
    > a
    >
    >>link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually would shift into it.
    >>
    >>OK heres the prob,
    >>
    >>My buddys got a new deore 44 t front chainring and a 32 rear cog and an xt long mech.
    >>
    >>But when I use the above method I get loads of extra chain when I'm in the small / small combo.
    >>Enough chain slack that in that gear combo that the chain drags around the mech as there isn't any
    >>tension.
    >>
    >>So my quesstion is, which way is correct? Should I lock out the big to big combo by shortening the
    >>chain or will there always be loads of slack in
    >
    > the
    >
    >>small / small combo?
    >>
    >>Give me some advice please! Cheers,
    >>
    >
    > I generally use one of two ways to size a chain, Peter explained the small/small method, the other
    > is big/big. Don't run the chain through the rear derailleur, bring the two ends of the chain
    > together, then add two links. Either method will work.
    >
    > Mike
    >
    >
    For my bike, it's big-big outside the DR + 1/2 link (one link piece). It's still shiftable into the
    big-big (night riding -- the noise lets me know right away :)), and I can get out the the small-2nd
    smallest before running out of chain tension (only the small-small isn't tensioned enough to ride it
    -- and I don't).

    If it's a full suspension, make sure that you're doing this at the point where the suspension needs
    the most chain!

    David
     
  13. Jack

    Jack Guest

    "Frank Jaworski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > another method not mentioned is big ring front, small gear back, imaginary line drawn through
    > center of derailleur pulley bolts should be perpendicular to the ground.

    I add:

    This is the method reccomended by Shimano. Works for me...

    Cheers and safe riding,

    -Jack
     
  14. Mike Demicco

    Mike Demicco Guest

    On Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:18:04 +0000, Me wrote:

    > I've always used the method of putting the new chain up on the big front ring and the big rear cog
    > and then feeding through the deriallers and bringing the chain together as tight as I could and
    > from that point adding a link so that gear combo was theorectally usable -though I never actually
    > would shift into it.

    The part you got wrong is you don't feed it through the deraillers.
     
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