Changing Shimano to Campy

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Bikeridindude, Nov 6, 2006.

  1. Bikeridindude

    Bikeridindude New Member

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    I currently have 2 road bikes, one with Campy components (10 spd double) and a Trek triple (9 spd) with Shimano 105. I would like to have them both the same so's as to not accidentally forget how to shift the current bike I'm on. Also I want to get rid of the triple and have interchangeable wheels. I'm new to the wrench turning end of this bidness, so I'm wondering if there's any potential problems I may run into or incompatibility issues with the Trek frame. I'm assuming the bottum bracket has English threads, don't yet have the tools to pull it off. And, weight issues aside, will the Veloce group give me a lot of years usage? Thanks.
     
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  2. Eastway82

    Eastway82 New Member

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    You shouldn't have a problem, so long as you get the right diameter front mech, and the right thread BB (check this before ordering, obviously). Veloce is fine - robust, well made, quite nicely finished. I'd consider upgrading to Centaur Shifters though. There are some really good deals at the minute because '07 is an upgrade year and there are lots of '06 components still in the system.
    Bear in mind that you'll need a new rear wheel, or at least a new freehub (depends on what wheels you're currently running in the Trek). and most Campag cassettes don't come with a lockring, so make sure you get one with the wheel or freehub.
    Oh, two other potential things to watch for.
    1: Does your frame have barrel adjusters on the downtube cable stops? If not, try and install some, as there's no other adjustment 'on the fly' with the Campag setup.
    2: Have your handlebars got double cable grooves? If not you might want to get some new double groove bars to make a neat installation. You need to be VERY careful about cable routing and lengths, so don't commit to cutting a cable outer until you're sure it's right, and if there's any doubt, leave it slightly longer - you can always shorten it later if needs be.
     
  3. PeterF

    PeterF New Member

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    I just converted from Ultegra 9 to Campy 10 on my B-bike (my primary already had record 10). My reason was the Ultegra stuff was old and the Shimano compatible wheels I had were less than round and true. I had two sets of Campy wheels, and wanted to have some interchangeablility (is that a word?) so I could switch wheels back and forth without having to change the freehub body each time. For about $300 I chainged my Ultegra to a combination of Centaur (shifters and rear der), Chorus (front der and calipers) and Record cranks and BB. I had the extra Crankset since I upgraded my A bike to a carbon crank and I had a spare BB. I can honestly say that the only difference I notice with the shifters is the carbon levers on the Record vs the alloy centaur ones. Both perform flawlessly and now I can use my Proton wheels that were gathering dust last year. Good deals can be found on '06 Campy. I would take a look at Centaur which is Campy's version of Ultegra. Good stuff.

    FWIW, my b-bike has a Ritchey bar (one deep cable groove in the front) and my A bike has a 3TTT (dual cable grooves). They both work fine, but the 3TTT is a slightly neater look (IMHO). Plenty of pro riders have the single groove bars with Campy and they don't cause a performance issue. Saunier Duval (Ritchey bars) and Lotto (FSA bars) come to mind.
    Also, I never got around to replacing the cable adjusters that were left over from the Shimano. They don't offer the micro adjustments of the barrels, but they seem to work ok. At some point I'll get around to switching them, but it's my winter beater bike so it's not a high priority.
     
  4. Bikeridindude

    Bikeridindude New Member

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    The "deals" I've been finding aren't half as good as your prices! I've looked at quite a few places too. But anyway, thanks for the suggestions. I'm jumping in!
     
  5. Bikeridindude

    Bikeridindude New Member

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    A couple of other questions: Veloce, Centaur, Chorus, Record, is there major functional/durability differences between the groups, or is it just because of weight. I'm kind of wanting to get by as cheap as I can, but if it's going to last longer, I'll splurge for an upgrade. Again, I don't care if Veloce weighs a kilo more, as long as it functions dependably. Also, on the site I'm looking at purchasing the groupset from it has cage sizes of short, medium, large for the rear der., is there such a thing as large? 72.5MM is the axle to axle length of on my other bike which I need because I run a 13-29. Thanks.
     
  6. Eastway82

    Eastway82 New Member

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    It's mostly weight and finish. I've got Mirage kit that's been in constant service for six years in all weathers and still works perfectly. I'd say put your money into the shifters (Centaur or Chorus - I actually prefer my Centaur shifters to my - admittedly elderly - Record carbon) and go Veloce for the derailleurs. You should be able to use your existing chainset, although Campag will tell you you must use a 10spd specific or risk getting the narrower chain caught between the rings. Prices: I've seen Centaur triple chainsets for £60 sterling this week, doubles for £40, Veloce doubles £30. Centaur shifters/cables £69.99, Veloce £53. Centaur rear der £40, Veloce rear £30.
    These were online from Ribble in the UK: www.ribblecycles.co.uk

    Short cage Campag rear der is 55mm between jockey wheel centres, medium cage is 73mm, long cage is 90mm (all approx - just measured out in the shed). I'm running a medium cage on my training bike, with 30/42/53 front and 13/26 rear. It's a bit marginal at the extremes, but works ok. Wife's bike has 30/42/52 front, 13/26 rear and long cage mech, and there's no problem with chain wrap/tension, but I reckon the shifting's not as precise.

    On the single groove thing - if it's a deep groove at the front of the bar, the Campag design allows you to put both cables into the one groove rather than putting one at the front, one at the back, but I find that puts a really tight curve into the outer gear cable right by the shifter, which I'm not too keen on.
     
  7. alfeng

    alfeng Well-Known Member

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    FIRST, the easiest way "to get rid of the triple" is to simply remove the granny ring. You will need an 8-mm Allen wrench (to remove the crank bolts), a crank puller designed for Octalink/ISIS cranks, and a 5-mm Allen wrench (to remove the granny's chainring bolts AND almost everything else). If you already have an OLDER crank puller, then put one-or-two sacrificial pennies (or, whatever coin/slug fits) in crank's bolt-recess before threading the puller on ...

    You will, of course, need to adjust the front derailleur's stop ... you would have to do this if you got a new double crank, too.

    I'm a big fan of Campy shifters ... I have mixed Campy shifters with my otherwise Shimano drivetrains on several bikes.

    However, recently, I've encountered a minor problem which may have been present in the past; but, ... (that's another story!) ...

    Regardless, the EASIEST and LEAST EXPENSIVE change is to get a set of 10-speed ERGO shifters (the most commonly available, now) + a standard-pull (eg., 950/952) XTR rear derailleur and use the hubbub.com alternate anchor position for the rear derailleur cable (i.e., at 3 o'clock):


    Subjectively, this works the best ...

    You can/will continue to use your 9-speed Shimano wheels, etc.

    FWIW. I also used the hubbub.com anchor position when mating a 9-speed ERGO shifter & 9-speed 6503 Ultegra rear derailleur ...

    Others have employed the JTEK Shiftmate to facilitate accurate indexing ... I'm too cheap to go this route.
     
  8. wugga

    wugga New Member

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    In the Campy lineup, a 72.5 equals a medium cage RD. If you plan on running any casette larget than a Campy 13-26, the max for a short cage RD, you will need a medium rear DR for a 13-29.

    IMHO, Veloce is a notch above Shitmano 105, good and durable. Centaur, in my opinion, is better than 10sp Ultegra, my two cents. Maybe check out some online shops for Campy Groupos, even 07 Centaur is at decent prices.


     
  9. Fignon le Grand

    Fignon le Grand New Member

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    Veloce and Centaur are both good especially if its your second bike. Currently Id say Chorus is DuraAce level and Record is out of the park (not for actually working but materials used) I have a record 9 speed and a DuraAce 10 speed. I really like the hoods on DA for resting but I much prefer the campag clunk for shifting much more positive and I really feel the Record brakes are better.

    You shouldnt have any problems moving over to Campag the frame is the same for all of them. ANd you dont need to buy a new wheel changing the body for the cassette is quick and easy. Or quick and cheap if you get a LBS to do it. And as the other guy said you can get lots of bargains at them mo. If you are brave and have the time you should really check out the european Ebay sites where you can get loads of new campag for really cheap. Im english live in holland and speak a bit of German. Ebay germany is super cheap.
    As far as Im concerned the only thing I dont reccomend for a 2nd bike is too much of the campag carbon bits, stay with Ali for durability. My 9 speaad levers are frankly a bit wobbly and have aplastic feel, altho technically they work great. And Veloce weighs about 4oogms more at most some of the ali chainsets are lighter than there carbon equivalents. If you want to upgrade anything do it where you save the most weight ie Bottom bracket, rear hub and watch out for cheapy heavy seatposts.
     
  10. alfeng

    alfeng Well-Known Member

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    Veloce, Centaur & Mirage/Xenon use a bushing to support the shifter's central shaft -- Chorus & Record use a ball bearing.

    There is a slight break-in period with the bushing ... the break-in is negligible/shorter with the Chorus & Record AND the ball bearing will remain true longer whereas the bushing will eventually experience slightly uneven wear.

    ALL the Campagnolo shifters will undoubtedly be going strong long after you have a desire to upgrade/update them.

    BTW. There are no guarantees, but I did a quick test (workstand, only) with a Shimano 10-speed rear derailleur (Ultegra 6600 GS), and it appears to have the same indexing as a Campagnolo rear derailleur ... your results may vary. I mention this because Shimano components are generally more readily available than Campagnolo components AND less expensive (I suppose some would say, "disposable").

    There are at least two brands of Shimano-to-Campagnolo cassettes ... I have a Wheels Manufacturing 10-speed cassette which clearly began life as an Ultegra 9-speed cassette.
     
  11. carpediemracing

    carpediemracing New Member

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    You can buy just 10s Campy levers for your Trek triple.

    I have a similar setup on my tandem, which is Shimano equiped (my two road bikes are Campy equiped). I can't use STI to save my life so I put on 10s Ergo levers (Veloce I think). Going 10s wasn't appealing for the tandem because of doubts of shifting performance and chain strength - and it would cost a lot!

    There is a cable hack for the rear derailleur so a Shimano 9s works with a Campy 10s Ergo. The front derailleur won't need a hack since Campy's Ergo lever is not indexed. It works very well on my tandem, even with the seemingly mile long cables.

    No other changes are necessary!

    I don't have a link but I can find it if you need it.

    cdr

    *edit* oops didn't see the bit about getting rid of the triple and interchangeable wheelsets. if you want an interim solution, the 10s Ergo hack would work.
     
  12. alfeng

    alfeng Well-Known Member

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    Always worth repeating because it is such a great adaptation -- the hubbub.com rear derailleur cable anchoring position:

     
  13. JTE83

    JTE83 Member

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    I'd rather change Campagnolo to Shimano. Just bought a CF Soloist from ebay with Campy Chorus and I noticed the resale value of chorus on ebay sucks so I'll just have to live with this setup.
     
  14. PeterF

    PeterF New Member

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    Well, I had the crank and bb already, so their not included in the price. I paid $160 for the shifters, $75 for the rear der, $20 for the front der and $45 for the calipers. The calipers and front der were fairly used, but the shifters and rear derailleur were brand new. I already had a chain and cassette too.
     
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