Cippolini the gentlman

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by John Forrest To, Mar 23, 2003.

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  1. From http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/mar03/mar24news

    "I must congratulate the team for the optimal work they carried out in the race: Bennati and
    Ongarato, for example, made a big effort to bring back the break after the Cipressa. But Quick Step
    was super today. I can not be disappointed. I prepared perfectly for this Milan-Sanremo, but I had
    too many riders to control. In the sprint I demonstrated I was the strongest. It's an important
    Sanremo for me, I have shown that at 36 years old, I can stay with the strongest. I am very happy
    for Bettini, as I have not forgotten what he did for me in the World Championships in Zolder. "

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  2. easyrider

    easyrider New Member

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    Agreed. There are few things that an athlete can say in defeat that make them look really good. Excuses certainly don't cut it.

    This is a great response.
     
  3. "John Forrest Tomlinson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > From http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/mar03/mar24news
    >
    > "I must congratulate the team for the optimal work they carried out in the race: Bennati and
    > Ongarato, for example, made a big effort to bring back the break after the Cipressa. But Quick
    > Step was super today. I can not be disappointed. I prepared perfectly for this Milan-Sanremo, but
    > I had too many riders to control.

    That's the statement right there: "I had too many riders to control"

    At world's last year, the Spanish, Germans and Australians all had the idea they had a sprinter who
    could win and played right into the Italians hands by helping keep the race together, thereby
    allowing the Italians a full complement of leadout riders at the end. It seems as if at least some
    have got the right idea now: that Cipo can't be readily beaten with a good leadout. Friere is going
    away in breakaways.

    There's also the factor that Domina Vacanze-Elitron team doesn't quite have the riders to control
    a WC race.

    Cipo still has the speed at 37 years old. Just think, if he was a US citizen, he could have won
    those masters stars'n'stripes jerseys for the last 7 years, Museeuw even longer.

    Zabel seems like he's lost his top end. If he can't at least win stages in the minor stage races,
    the title of UCI #1 points holder will be going to someone else.

    And McEwen in 30th place? So far doesn't seem to be the rider he was last year.

    Finally, how did Di Luca get dropped on the descent? (I don't get OLN) Not that he could have done
    anything about Bettini.
     
  4. Bart

    Bart Guest

    Mc Ewen burned himself in a desperate solo counter at the end. McEwen and Cipo were both in the
    first 15-20 on top of the Poggio which shows how strong they were. The Cipo train only works on the
    flat, with some more allround folks next to him, they might have been able to organise.

    Di Luca got completely cooked up the Poggio, he was so exhausted he didnt have the sharpness anymore
    to keep touch in the razor descent. Kurgan , I like your Furlan etc analysis, the days one could
    attack at the foot of the Poggio and keep a full bunch off seem over. BTW before halfway the climb
    Di Luca had to brake in a turn, the same where that happens almost every year. But some people here
    never believe that.

    Bettini was letting go on the Poggio already, when Paolini came to fire him up "everybody's cooked,
    Cipo's mates are fading, let's go". He brought Bettini to the front and just carried on, amazing.
     
  5. Ilan Vardi

    Ilan Vardi Guest

    And after the race he punched FDJ rider Bernhard Eisel in the face, apparently mistaking him for
    Baden Cooke. Cipollini was upset with Cooke for not letting him take Zabel's wheel in preparation
    for the final sprint.

    -ilan

    "John Forrest Tomlinson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > From http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/mar03/mar24news
    >
    > "I must congratulate the team for the optimal work they carried out in the race: Bennati and
    > Ongarato, for example, made a big effort to bring back the break after the Cipressa. But Quick
    > Step was super today. I can not be disappointed. I prepared perfectly for this Milan-Sanremo, but
    > I had too many riders to control. In the sprint I demonstrated I was the strongest. It's an
    > important Sanremo for me, I have shown that at 36 years old, I can stay with the strongest. I am
    > very happy for Bettini, as I have not forgotten what he did for me in the World Championships in
    > Zolder. "
     
  6. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    Part of the reason solos tend not to work as well is probably partly due to moving the finish an
    extra kilo or two further down the Via Roma. The finish used to be right near the bottom of the
    Poggio, so all you needed was 10 seconds or so and a good descent.

    In '92 Kelly simply rode away from the peleton on the descent to catch Argentin, and then beat him
    in a two-up sprint. The finish was so close to the Poggio that nobody else had a chance to catch
    up. I used to have the video and it was one of the most impressive displays of descending I've
    ever seen.

    "Bart" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Mc Ewen burned himself in a desperate solo counter at the end. McEwen and Cipo were both in the
    > first 15-20 on top of the Poggio which shows how strong they were. The Cipo train only works on
    > the flat, with some more allround folks next to him, they might have been able to organise.
    >
    > Di Luca got completely cooked up the Poggio, he was so exhausted he didnt have the sharpness
    > anymore to keep touch in the razor descent. Kurgan , I like your Furlan etc analysis, the days one
    > could attack at the foot of the Poggio and keep a full bunch off seem over. BTW before halfway the
    > climb Di Luca had to brake in a turn, the same where that happens almost every year. But some
    > people here never believe that.
    >
    > Bettini was letting go on the Poggio already, when Paolini came to fire him up "everybody's
    > cooked, Cipo's mates are fading, let's go". He brought Bettini to the front and just carried on,
    > amazing.
     
  7. Kenny

    Kenny Guest

    >Cippolini the gentleman

    I've read that he should have punched Baden Cooke because Cooke didn't want to give up his position
    in Zabel rear wheel for Cipo.

    > And McEwen in 30th place? So far doesn't seem to be the rider he was last year.

    He made a big mistake in leading the chase in the descent of the poggio. It wasn't his job to do
    that work. He said he was very nervous because the leaders were getting away. The team directors
    said his place should have been in Cipo's wheel, not in front of the group.

    > Finally, how did Di Luca get dropped on the descent? (I don't get OLN) Not that he could have done
    > anything about Bettini.

    Because Di Luca isn't that great young rider like everybody sais. He doesn't have the engine to win
    major clssics like bettini does. I know he won the tour of lombardy but i still need to see the
    comfirmation. He has problems in races of 250 km or more. You could see that in the HEW in Hamburg
    last year where he had problems just to follow the rythm of the leading group of Museeuw. He also
    isn't the rider to win the Giro or Tour. I'm affraid that despite of his talent ( he surely has
    talent) his doesn't fit in the category of classic riders but neither in the category of
    tour-riders.
     
  8. Bart

    Bart Guest

    Kenny wrote:

    > Because Di Luca isn't that great young rider like everybody sais. He doesn't have the engine to
    > win major clssics like bettini does. I know he won the tour of lombardy but i still need to see
    > the comfirmation. He has problems in races of 250 km or more.

    well I saw him attack after 280 kms last Saturday. The attack was ill-timed and over-stepping
    himself, but 90% of the world class peloton behind him there can't even think of ever getting away
    there. Do they all suffer from a small engine ?

    His failed attack does not degrade him. It just suits the good Sanremo tradition that patience
    earns. You can't do it solo from the foot with a full and 'fresh' peloton behind you. I remember
    Bartoli in one of his best years, taking off halfway (after Van Petegem) and not getting very far.

    As to confirmation.... what age is he, 26? can you instantly mention any other rider of that age or
    younger who has also won one of the classic monuments ? True one might have expected him to win more
    already, but the rise of peak age for the classics is a phenomenon which doesn't pass by on him.

    groeten Bart
     
  9. Brian Roth

    Brian Roth Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message >
    > Cipo still has the speed at 37 years old. Just think, if he was a US citizen, he could have won
    > those masters stars'n'stripes jerseys for the last 7 years, Museeuw even longer.
    >
    Saturday was 'only' his 36th birthday, so that would be 6 jerseys.
     
  10. Tc Rider

    Tc Rider Guest

    Bart <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Kenny wrote:
    >
    > > Because Di Luca isn't that great young rider like everybody sais. He doesn't have the engine to
    > > win major clssics like bettini does. I know he won the tour of lombardy but i still need to see
    > > the comfirmation. He has problems in races of 250 km or more.
    >
    > well I saw him attack after 280 kms last Saturday. The attack was ill-timed and over-stepping
    > himself, but 90% of the world class peloton behind him there can't even think of ever getting away
    > there. Do they all suffer from a small engine ?
    >
    > His failed attack does not degrade him. It just suits the good Sanremo tradition that patience
    > earns. You can't do it solo from the foot with a full and 'fresh' peloton behind you. I remember
    > Bartoli in one of his best years, taking off halfway (after Van Petegem) and not getting very far.
    >
    > As to confirmation.... what age is he, 26? can you instantly mention any other rider of that age
    > or younger who has also won one of the classic monuments ? True one might have expected him to
    > win more already, but the rise of peak age for the classics is a phenomenon which doesn't pass
    > by on him.
    >
    > groeten Bart

    I agree, DiLuca is one to watch for the future. I was impressed last year by his strength in the
    hilly stages of the Vuelta and by how far he had come since he was picked as the "next great hope of
    Italian cycling." In a year or two, he will know better; it would have been interesting to see him
    go wait and go with Bettini.

    By most accounts, Di Luca works hard and his head on straight. But then, I think Rebellin too, so...

    TC
     
  11. "Ilan Vardi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > And after the race he punched FDJ rider Bernhard Eisel in the face, apparently mistaking him for
    > Baden Cooke. Cipollini was upset with Cooke for not letting him take Zabel's wheel in preparation
    > for the final
    sprint.

    Ahhhh Cipollini.

    the gentlman.
     
  12. Kenny

    Kenny Guest

    Don't get me wrong, Bart. I do think he's a great rider and a spectacular one. It's true that most
    of the riders saturday didn't think of attacking on the poggio nevertheless he did it. I like
    attacking riders. But I still have the feeling that he's capable to do much more than what we've
    seen from him till now. He's a big talent but now on the age of 27 i don't see the results that a
    man of his calibre should have. Lombardy, stages in Vuelta, Giro and Tirreno but that's about it.
    It's true that most of the riders don't even win that but he's not a regular rider. I hope he
    becomes more constant in his results. Don't you agree a man with his talent should belong in the UCI
    top 10? But since that isn't the reality he still has a way to go to become a big one like every
    cyclingfan expected him to become.
     
  13. On 24 Mar 2003 02:03:31 -0800, Ilan Vardi wrote:
    >And after the race he punched FDJ rider Bernhard Eisel in the face, apparently mistaking him for
    >Baden Cooke. Cipollini was upset with =
    Cooke=20
    >for not letting him take Zabel's wheel in preparation for the final =
    sprint.

    =46rom www.baden-cooke.com
    2003-03-22 La guerre avec Cipo Baden a termin=E9 14=E8 de son premier Milan-San Remo. Ce qui n'est
    pas mal, d'autant que son =E9quipe Fdjeux.com r=E9alise un tir group=E9 avec Bernhard Eisel 12=E8 et
    Matt Wilson 16=E8. Mais il esp=E9rait mieux. = "J'ai mont=E9 la Cipressa les doigts dans le nez,
    raconte-t-il. A ce moment de la course, j'=E9tais convaincu que j'allais gagner. Mais =E7a m'a un
    peu lach=E9 dans les 20 derniers kilom=E8tres. J'ai fini avec des crampes." Toute la journ=E9e,
    Baden a =E9t=E9 victime de harc=E8lement de la part = de Mario Cipollini et ses co=E9quipiers meme
    lorsqu'il ne se passait rien dans le peloton. Mais dans le dernier kilom=E8tre, Baden n'a pas
    laiss=E9 sa position au champion du monde qui a ensuite agress=E9 un coureur de la Fdjeux.com
    aussitot apr=E8s l'arriv=E9e. Croyant s'en prendre au sprinter australien, le Roi Lion l'a confondu
    avec Bernhard Eisel, pris par le coup et frapp=E9 =E0 la tete! Droles de m=E9thodes d'un = suppos=E9
    porte-drapeau du cyclisme...

    Google says: 2003-03-22 The war with Cipo Baden finished 14=E8 of its first Milan-San Remo. What is
    not badly, the more so as its Fdjeux.com team carries out a shooting grouped with Bernhard Eisel
    12=E8 and Matt Wilson 16=E8. But it hoped better. "I assembled Cipressa the fingers in the nose,
    tells it. At this time of the race, I was convinced that I was going to gain. But that a little
    released me in the last 20 kilometers. I finished with cramps." All the day, Baden was victim of
    harassing on behalf of Mario Cipollini and its fellow-members same when it did not occur anything in
    the group. But in the last kilometer, Baden did not leave its position to the champion of the world
    which then attacked a runner of Fdjeux.com at once after the arrival. Believing to be caught some to
    the Australian sprinter, King Lion confused with Bernhard Eisel, taken by the blow and struck with
    the tete! Droles of methods of one supposed carry-flag of cycling...
     
  14. "Bart" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Mc Ewen burned himself in a desperate solo counter at the end. McEwen and Cipo were both in the
    > first 15-20 on top of the Poggio which shows how strong they were. The Cipo train only works on
    > the flat, with some more allround folks next to him, they might have been able to organise.
    >
    > Di Luca got completely cooked up the Poggio, he was so exhausted he didnt have the sharpness
    > anymore to keep touch in the razor descent. Kurgan , I like your Furlan etc analysis, the days one
    > could attack at the foot of the Poggio and keep a full bunch off seem over. BTW before halfway the
    > climb Di Luca had to brake in a turn, the same where that happens almost every year. But some
    > people here never believe that.

    Because they never have to brake in a turn going uphill. The wannabee pro syndrome. People win $20
    primes and some get the illusion that they are nearing the level of the professionals, not realizing
    that with each successive level the jump to the next one gets bigger.

    > Bettini was letting go on the Poggio already, when Paolini came to fire him up "everybody's
    > cooked, Cipo's mates are fading, let's go". He brought Bettini to the front and just carried on,
    > amazing.

    Excuse my ignorance, but what is his history? I'd never heard his name till last weekend. He towed
    Bettini to the top of the Poggio?
     
  15. Austria, Australia... a predictable Cipo confusion

    "Ewoud Dronkert" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]... On 24 Mar 2003 02:03:31 -0800, Ilan
    Vardi wrote:
    >And after the race he punched FDJ rider Bernhard Eisel in the face, apparently mistaking him for
    >Baden Cooke.
     
  16. > "Bart" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...

    > > BTW before halfway the climb Di Luca had to brake in a turn, the same where that happens almost
    > > every year. But some people here never believe that.

    it's obvious the uphill sprint over the Poggio requires braking in the hairpins. Nobody who saw De
    Luca practically crashing into a fence portal halfway up would question that. I think the
    incredulity you refer to concerned Pantani's claims that he was braking at certain points of the
    Alpe d'Huez ascent.

    greets Alexander
     
  17. "Kenny" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Don't get me wrong, Bart. I do think he's a great rider and a spectacular one. It's true that most
    > of the riders saturday didn't think of attacking on the poggio nevertheless he did it. I like
    > attacking riders. But I still have the feeling that he's capable to do much more than what we've
    > seen from him till now. He's a big talent but now on the age of 27 i don't see the results that a
    > man of his calibre should have. Lombardy, stages in Vuelta, Giro and Tirreno but that's about it.
    > It's true that most of the riders don't even win that but he's not a regular rider. I hope he
    > becomes more constant in his results. Don't you agree a man with his talent should belong in the
    > UCI top 10? But since that isn't the reality he still has a way to go to become a big one like
    > every cyclingfan expected him to become.

    DiLuca (i gather it's him we're talking about here) has progressed in leaps. I remember marvelling
    at his staying with the top dogs in a Giro or Vuelta in the high mountains recently, having
    categorized him a "puncheur"... I think the discretion as to whether he can convert himself into a
    true 3-week tour contender is still his. We've seen more astonishing metamorphoses: anybody wonder
    about Honchar's sudden climbing forte? or how Jalabert won the TT worlds a few years ago? He may not
    be a future TdF contender, but the Vuelta is well within his ropes IMO. After all, Kelly and
    Jalabert won that one, too.

    Alexander
     
  18. Tony

    Tony Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...

    >
    > Excuse my ignorance, but what is his history? I'd never heard his name till last weekend. He towed
    > Bettini to the top of the Poggio?

    He was the Under 23 World Champion silver medalist in 99. Neo-pro with Mapei in 2000 and won a stage
    at the Tour de l'Avenir.

    The next year, he had some nice results in mostly smaller stage races and had a good showing at the
    Paris-Tours World Cup (11th). Last year, he won the Giro del Piemonte and took 2nd in the Tour of
    the Walloon Region and at a Tour Down Under stage.

    This year so far, in addition to his podium finish at La Primavera on Saturday, he had a second
    place in a Tirreno stage and finished 9th overall, finished third in 2 Ruta del Sol and a Tour Down
    Under stages.
     
  19. Brother,

    Cippo is the real deal, let me assure you of that. When he's in shape and hard, he can really stick
    it to you from behind. I saw him blow right by another cyclist once. He keep coming and coming until
    he exploded with force. Needless to say, he's my hero.

    Fr. Guido
     
  20. Cramden

    Cramden Guest

    "Father Guido Sarducci" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Brother,
    >
    > Cippo is the real deal, let me assure you of that. When he's in shape and hard, he can really
    > stick it to you from behind. I saw him blow right by another cyclist once. He keep coming and
    > coming until he exploded with force. Needless to say, he's my hero.

    WHAT IN THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? Cip may be gay but he definitely ain't no fag. The only
    thing he ever stuck from behind was his front fork. You ever been forked from behind? ,,,,,I thought
    so,,,, step into my office cause YOU"RE FIRED?

    Ralph

    >
    > Fr. Guido
     
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