citrus degreaser

[Katharine & Paul]

Hello all!!

Just a quick question.

Can the citrus degreaser as sold in hardware shops be safely used on bikes?

I'm just wondering if it is any different to the very expensive Finish Line
citrus degreaser sold in bike shops

Paul

 

[John Doe]

"Katharine & Paul" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hello all!!
>
> Just a quick question.
>
> Can the citrus degreaser as sold in hardware shops be safely used on
bikes?
>
> I'm just wondering if it is any different to the very expensive Finish
Line
> citrus degreaser sold in bike shops
>
> Paul
>
>

You have to be careful not to get any degreaser on plastics. Doesnt matter
where you bought it. Apart from that I see no problem using degreasers from
a hardware shop.

Pete

 

[Ken]

"Katharine & Paul" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> Can the citrus degreaser as sold in hardware shops be safely used on bikes?

Yes, but make sure you thoroughly rinse it off with clean water. If not
washed off, citrus degreasers can cause corrosion, especially to aluminum.
They can also cause premature wear to moving parts like chains or bearings.

 

[Richard Ney]

Katharine & Paul writes:

> Can the citrus degreaser as sold in hardware shops be safely used on
> bikes?
>
> I'm just wondering if it is any different to the very expensive
> Finish Line citrus degreaser sold in bike shops

The citrus degreasers I've bought from Home Depot and their ilk are a
diluted version of what I've seen from the bike shops.

In my experience, Gunk Engine Brite (an emulsifying degreaser) does a
superior job. Auto parts stores sometimes carry, and will usually
order, Engine Brite in 1 quart bottles (part #EB-2A).

Try it. It's relatively cheap and highly effective.

 

[Werehatrack]

On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 00:34:52 GMT, "Katharine & Paul"
<[email protected]> may have said:

>Hello all!!
>
>Just a quick question.
>
>Can the citrus degreaser as sold in hardware shops be safely used on bikes?
>
>I'm just wondering if it is any different to the very expensive Finish Line
>citrus degreaser sold in bike shops

In my opinion, the only way to be sure is to test it on a bit of your
paintwork that you don't mind risking. The chances are good that it
will not cause a problem in most areas.

If you have an SRAM chain, I'd advise against using it on that part
because it will strip the factory-installed Gleitmo lubricant from
inside the links. (The same caution applies to solvents, and other
harsh detergents and degreasing agents.)

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

 

[Jack Russell]

>In my opinion, the only way to be sure is to test it on a bit of your
>paintwork that you don't mind risking. The chances are good that it
>will not cause a problem in most areas.
>
>If you have an SRAM chain, I'd advise against using it on that part
>because it will strip the factory-installed Gleitmo lubricant from
>inside the links. (The same caution applies to solvents, and other
>harsh detergents and degreasing agents.)
>
>
So how do you clean SRAM chains, I have been doing mine in petrol and
have not noticed any problems but ....

TIA

Jack Russell

 

[Werehatrack]

On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:25:32 +1100, Jack Russell
<[email protected]> may have said:

>>If you have an SRAM chain, I'd advise against using it on that part
>>because it will strip the factory-installed Gleitmo lubricant from
>>inside the links. (The same caution applies to solvents, and other
>>harsh detergents and degreasing agents.)
>>
>>
>So how do you clean SRAM chains, I have been doing mine in petrol and
>have not noticed any problems but ....

Several months back, one of the regulars on rec.bicycles.tech did a
running test comparison of cleaning regimens for chains, and the
rather surprising result seemed to indicate that solvent cleaning of
an SRAM chain was a bad idea. SRAM advises just using a brush to get
the external crud off, and then applying oil. They use a rather
costly and apparently quite persistent lubricant during assembly, and
they advise against the use of degrasing cleaners on their chain.
Given the results of the (admittedly not extensive) test that was run,
it appears that the Gleitmo lube is best left in place; the chain from
which it was stripped wore *faster* than the one that was just lubed
as per their instructions. I concluded that they really aren't
kidding when they say to just brush it and re-lube. Once the Gleitmo
has been removed, though, there is no longer any reason not to use
solvent cleaning methods for subsequent maintenance.

I checked on the price of the Gleitmo lube. It runs about $24 for a
400 ml can. That's comparable to the costliest boutique chain lubes,
and would probably be worth it if it was not for the fact that it has
to be bought by the case...of 12 cans.

Until that surprising test, I'd been solvent-washing all of my chains.
I still do, for the ones that either are not SRAM or which have
already been stripped by a prior degreasing or solvent cleaning...but
I've decided that any new SRAMS I install going forward will be
cleaned as per the SRAM spec.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

 

[Jose Rizal]

Werehatrack:

> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:25:32 +1100, Jack Russell
> <[email protected]> may have said:
>
> >>If you have an SRAM chain, I'd advise against using it on that part
> >>because it will strip the factory-installed Gleitmo lubricant from
> >>inside the links. (The same caution applies to solvents, and other
> >>harsh detergents and degreasing agents.)
> >>
> >>
> >So how do you clean SRAM chains, I have been doing mine in petrol and
> >have not noticed any problems but ....
>
> Several months back, one of the regulars on rec.bicycles.tech did a
> running test comparison of cleaning regimens for chains, and the
> rather surprising result seemed to indicate that solvent cleaning of
> an SRAM chain was a bad idea.

There was no such conclusion arising from that thread. If anything, the
test itself was badly controlled and the results ambiguous at best.

> SRAM advises just using a brush to get
> the external crud off, and then applying oil. They use a rather
> costly and apparently quite persistent lubricant during assembly, and
> they advise against the use of degrasing cleaners on their chain.
> Given the results of the (admittedly not extensive) test that was run,
> it appears that the Gleitmo lube is best left in place; the chain from
> which it was stripped wore *faster* than the one that was just lubed
> as per their instructions. I concluded that they really aren't
> kidding when they say to just brush it and re-lube.

There's nothing magical about Gleitmo. The test that you mention
doesn't show even remotely conclusively that it's Gleitmo that was the
decisive factor in wear, since controls for the "test" weren't very
good.

> Once the Gleitmo
> has been removed, though, there is no longer any reason not to use
> solvent cleaning methods for subsequent maintenance.

Gleitmo (and any other lubricant) only lasts for a specific amount of
time without replenishment, which I daresay is only a small proportion
of the chain's useful lifetime. In terms of the latter, it doesn't seem
worthwhile worrying about keeping it in place instead of cleaning by
solvent and re-oiling.

> I checked on the price of the Gleitmo lube. It runs about $24 for a
> 400 ml can. That's comparable to the costliest boutique chain lubes,
> and would probably be worth it if it was not for the fact that it has
> to be bought by the case...of 12 cans.

The power of marketing is what's selling these.

 

[Henry Hilton]

I have found Mobil 1 engine oil to be the best chain lube
I wash the chain with white spirits
Then I put the chain into the Mobil 1 and pull a vacuum on the system
overnight.
Never had chains that perform so smoothly

--


"Jose Rizal" <_@_._> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Werehatrack:
>
> There was no such conclusion arising from that thread. If anything, the
> test itself was badly controlled and the results ambiguous at best.
>
> There's nothing magical about Gleitmo. The test that you mention
> doesn't show even remotely conclusively that it's Gleitmo that was the
> decisive factor in wear, since controls for the "test" weren't very
> good.
>
> The power of marketing is what's selling these.

 

[Carl Fogel]

Jose Rizal <_@_._> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Werehatrack:
>
> > On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:25:32 +1100, Jack Russell
> > <[email protected]> may have said:
> >
> > >>If you have an SRAM chain, I'd advise against using it on that part
> > >>because it will strip the factory-installed Gleitmo lubricant from
> > >>inside the links. (The same caution applies to solvents, and other
> > >>harsh detergents and degreasing agents.)
> > >>
> > >>
> > >So how do you clean SRAM chains, I have been doing mine in petrol and
> > >have not noticed any problems but ....
> >
> > Several months back, one of the regulars on rec.bicycles.tech did a
> > running test comparison of cleaning regimens for chains, and the
> > rather surprising result seemed to indicate that solvent cleaning of
> > an SRAM chain was a bad idea.
>
> There was no such conclusion arising from that thread. If anything, the
> test itself was badly controlled and the results ambiguous at best.
>
> > SRAM advises just using a brush to get
> > the external crud off, and then applying oil. They use a rather
> > costly and apparently quite persistent lubricant during assembly, and
> > they advise against the use of degrasing cleaners on their chain.
> > Given the results of the (admittedly not extensive) test that was run,
> > it appears that the Gleitmo lube is best left in place; the chain from
> > which it was stripped wore *faster* than the one that was just lubed
> > as per their instructions. I concluded that they really aren't
> > kidding when they say to just brush it and re-lube.
>
> There's nothing magical about Gleitmo. The test that you mention
> doesn't show even remotely conclusively that it's Gleitmo that was the
> decisive factor in wear, since controls for the "test" weren't very
> good.
>
> > Once the Gleitmo
> > has been removed, though, there is no longer any reason not to use
> > solvent cleaning methods for subsequent maintenance.
>
> Gleitmo (and any other lubricant) only lasts for a specific amount of
> time without replenishment, which I daresay is only a small proportion
> of the chain's useful lifetime. In terms of the latter, it doesn't seem
> worthwhile worrying about keeping it in place instead of cleaning by
> solvent and re-oiling.
>
> > I checked on the price of the Gleitmo lube. It runs about $24 for a
> > 400 ml can. That's comparable to the costliest boutique chain lubes,
> > and would probably be worth it if it was not for the fact that it has
> > to be bought by the case...of 12 cans.
>
> The power of marketing is what's selling these.

Dear Jack, Werehatrack, and Jose,

Here's the start of the thread, which did indeed raise
exciting questions, some of them about chain cleaning:

http://groups.google.com/[email protected]

or

http://tinyurl.com/2gwm2

It would be interesting to discover whether Gleitmo's
claimed lubricating efficiency depends on anything more
than its its scorn for the orthographic i-before-e
rule-of-thumb.

It's not, after all, as if bicycle chains subject their
lubricants to incredible temperatures, pressures, or
chemical contamination.

Does anyone know of any reasonably well-controlled tests
for any chain lubes?

Carl Fogel

 

[John Henderson]

"Henry Hilton" wrote:

> I have found Mobil 1 engine oil to be the best chain lube
> I wash the chain with white spirits
> Then I put the chain into the Mobil 1 and pull a vacuum on the
> system overnight.
> Never had chains that perform so smoothly

I agree - my variations are fairly minor.

Mobil 1 is available in several "flavours". I use the very thin,
high lubricity 0W40 grade (which can be hard to find).

I wash the chains in mineral turpentine (turps). The first few
washings are done in decanted used turps, with a final washing in
fresh clean turps.

Then I dry the chain in the sun for a day, before "soaking" in
Mobil 1 for a day.

I then wrap the chain in a clean rag until it's time to use it
again (I keep 2 chains in circulation for each bike). I find the
amount of oil that remains within the rollers is good for a
couple of thousand km in reasonable weather.

Years ago, I re-oiled chains without removing or cleaning them.
The increase in chain life now is remarkable.

John

 

[Zebee Johnstone]

In aus.bicycle on Sun, 14 Mar 2004 06:42:50 +1100
John Henderson <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Years ago, I re-oiled chains without removing or cleaning them.
> The increase in chain life now is remarkable.
>

Motorcycle experience is that chains with gunge on them attract grit and
wear out more. Chains with old gunge on them with new gunge added are
worse....

Zebee

 

[David L. Johnson]

On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 02:12:51 +0000, Richard Ney wrote:

> Katharine & Paul writes:
>
>> Can the citrus degreaser as sold in hardware shops be safely used on
>> bikes?
>>
>> I'm just wondering if it is any different to the very expensive
>> Finish Line citrus degreaser sold in bike shops
>
> The citrus degreasers I've bought from Home Depot and their ilk are a
> diluted version of what I've seen from the bike shops.
>
> In my experience, Gunk Engine Brite (an emulsifying degreaser) does a
> superior job. Auto parts stores sometimes carry, and will usually
> order, Engine Brite in 1 quart bottles (part #EB-2A).
>
> Try it. It's relatively cheap and highly effective.

It is also volatile. The advantage of citrus degreasers is that they are
safer and less toxic. Don't use Gunk without good ventilation.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | And what if you track down these men and kill them, what if you
_`\(,_ | killed all of us? From every corner of Europe, hundreds,
(_)/ (_) | thousands would rise up to take our places. Even Nazis can't
kill that fast. -- Paul Henreid (Casablanca).