"City Bike" Hot New Category at Bicycle Industry Show



Tim McNamara wrote:

> You keep saying that over and over and over, as if mere repetition
> constitutes proof.


See "http://nordicgroup.us/s78/experts.html".
 
> SMS <[email protected]> wrote:

>> The problem with most of the dynamo lights is they are a _big_
>> compromise in terms of optics. They illuminate a very limited area
>> very well, but don't have sufficient peripheral illumination. They do
>> the best they can with the limited available power from the dynamo.


Tim McNamara wrote:
> You keep saying that over and over and over, as if mere repetition
> constitutes proof. But your claim is simple ********. It would seem
> from your many posts that you ought to be seeing an ophthalmologist
> about your vision problem.


But Tim, can't he see you about the attitude problem?
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
 
In article <[email protected]>,
landotter <[email protected]> writes:
> On Sep 30, 3:22 am, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> SMS <[email protected]> writes:
>>
>>
>>
>> > Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

>>
>> >>> Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
>> >>> that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
>> >>> fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
>> >>> electric card shufflers, etc.

>>
>> >> Actually electric toothbrushes can be useful as they generally will do a
>> >> better job then you can do by hand. One thing that is useless, like the
>> >> other two you list, is electric can openers. And then maybe electric
>> >> knives, though I've never used one.

>>
>> >> Don <www.donwiss.com> (e-mail link at home page bottom).

>>
>> > Electric knives are useful when cutting up things like turkeys or large
>> > roasts. Also good for cutting homemade bread without destroying the loaf.

>>
>> It seems you don't know how to sharpen a kitchen carving knife,
>> nor the cooling stage at which to carve or cut cooked stuff.
>> It's an ancient, time-honoured skill which predates electric
>> gadgetry.
>>

> Nah, electric knives are the bomb! And I own several fancy sharpening
> stones and knives which you can literally shave with. The electric
> knife is good for filleting fish, carving up whole salamis, and
> slicing hams. It's for folks that want a deli slicer, but won't use it
> enough. Thrift stores always have one for $2 or so.


I downright refuse to assault a roast turkey or
cross-rib or leg of lamb with a de-glorified
hedge-trimmer/chainsaw.

And I'm not a Luddite. I'm all for technological
advance. What I'm against is technological
trivialization and gadgetification. Imposing those
on bicycles is particularly egregious.


cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
I'm really at:
tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca
 
On Sep 30, 4:59 pm, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> landotter <[email protected]> writes:
>
>
>
> > On Sep 30, 3:22 am, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
> >> In article <[email protected]>,
> >> SMS <[email protected]> writes:

>
> >> > Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

>
> >> >>> Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
> >> >>> that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
> >> >>> fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
> >> >>> electric card shufflers, etc.

>
> >> >> Actually electric toothbrushes can be useful as they generally will do a
> >> >> better job then you can do by hand. One thing that is useless, like the
> >> >> other two you list, is electric can openers. And then maybe electric
> >> >> knives, though I've never used one.

>
> >> >> Don <www.donwiss.com> (e-mail link at home page bottom).

>
> >> > Electric knives are useful when cutting up things like turkeys or large
> >> > roasts. Also good for cutting homemade bread without destroying the loaf.

>
> >> It seems you don't know how to sharpen a kitchen carving knife,
> >> nor the cooling stage at which to carve or cut cooked stuff.
> >> It's an ancient, time-honoured skill which predates electric
> >> gadgetry.

>
> > Nah, electric knives are the bomb! And I own several fancy sharpening
> > stones and knives which you can literally shave with. The electric
> > knife is good for filleting fish, carving up whole salamis, and
> > slicing hams. It's for folks that want a deli slicer, but won't use it
> > enough. Thrift stores always have one for $2 or so.

>
> I downright refuse to assault a roast turkey or
> cross-rib or leg of lamb with a de-glorified
> hedge-trimmer/chainsaw.
>
> And I'm not a Luddite. I'm all for technological
> advance.


Yeah, right. I heard the story about you, the pork loin, the twin, and
the shellac. Ugly stuff. You'll think differently next time you go to
the deli, come home and get "salami arm" from the manual method.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
A Muzi <[email protected]> wrote:

> > SMS <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> >> The problem with most of the dynamo lights is they are a _big_
> >> compromise in terms of optics. They illuminate a very limited area
> >> very well, but don't have sufficient peripheral illumination. They
> >> do the best they can with the limited available power from the
> >> dynamo.

>
> Tim McNamara wrote:
> > You keep saying that over and over and over, as if mere repetition
> > constitutes proof. But your claim is simple ********. It would
> > seem from your many posts that you ought to be seeing an
> > ophthalmologist about your vision problem.

>
> But Tim, can't he see you about the attitude problem?


LOL!
 
On Sep 30, 3:59 pm, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>
> I downright refuse to assault a roast turkey or
> cross-rib or leg of lamb with a de-glorified
> hedge-trimmer/chainsaw.
>
> And I'm not a Luddite. I'm all for technological
> advance. What I'm against is technological
> trivialization and gadgetification. Imposing those
> on bicycles is particularly egregious.
>
> cheers,
> Tom


Dear Tom,

You _roast_ the turkey before you eat it?

Hmmm . . . I'll have to chew that technology over a bit.

Cheers,

Carl Fogel
 
Tom Keats wrote:
<snip>
> I /won't/ make fun of no-draft windows on cars, nor
> manual chokes. Those relics were actually practical.
>

<snip>
>
> cheers,
> Tom
>

Manual chokes are very practical - if you have a carburetor.
I'll stick with my modern, more reliable fuel-injected engine. Thank you
very much. ;-)

--

Paul D Oosterhout
I work for SAIC (but I don't speak for SAIC)
 
Tom Keats wrote:

>
> I downright refuse to assault a roast turkey or
> cross-rib or leg of lamb with a de-glorified
> hedge-trimmer/chainsaw.


Even Alton Brown, geek extraordinare uses an electric knife for certain
things. According to his book, the first electric knife was sold by
sporting goods stores for cleaning fish.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alton_Brown
 
Gooserider wrote:

> Cheaper is better for a dedicated commuter, I think. Of course, that depends
> on the type of commute. But for something that may be locked to a rack all
> day, or will be used for stops at the grocery store on the way home from
> work---yes. They're making a big deal about the dynohub lights, but I don't
> know how bright these lights will be. I know that there are good generator
> lights(Lumotec, etc), but are these cheap ones good?


Many of the so-called commuter bikes lack a chain guard. This is an
omission you'd never see on a commuter bike in the Netherlands or in
China. It's nearly impossible to add a chain guard after the fact. Hebie
in Germany sells some, but you can't easily buy them.
"http://www.hebie.de/pdf/hebie_web_katalog_en.pdf" page 30-51).

A multi-speed bicycle that you can just get on and ride, in your regular
clothes, to the market or to a friend's house, that costs less than
$400. The components don't have to be top of the line, and it doesn't
have to weigh 20 pounds. When you take it home from the store, it
already has the fenders, rack, and chain guard installed, they are not
retail priced add-ons that add $75-100 to the price.

The lights are an issue as the cheaper dyno lights aren't all that
great, and even the expensive ones aren't bright enough for a lot of
commute situations. But you can always supplement the included dynohub
lights with more powerful lights if the situation demands it.

Performance has done well, apparently, with their Schwinn World Avenue,
which is $325-500 depending on when you buy it. At least it's sold well
enough that some sizes are often out of stock.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> "Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email protected]> writes:
> >> At least it doesn't have slidy-outy coffee cup holders.

> >
> > You can make fun of cup holders all you want,

>
> Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
> that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
> fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
> electric card shufflers, etc. But Western Civilization
> really hit the skids with the advent of cable TV and handheld
> remote controls, so people could watch such pap as infomercials
> about auto-shifting bicycles.


The right electric toothbrush is a boon. I can get
better results with less effort, the results measured
by my dentists reports. The electric toothbrush gives
me much better results, and I was doing good with the
(properly chosen) manual toothbrush.

I had always wanted an electric pencil sharpener, and
the day I got it made me very happy. To this day using
it makes me happy. Well worth it for me.

--
Michael Press
 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> Ryan Cousineau <[email protected]> writes:
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > Don Wiss <donwiss@no_spam.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
> >>
> >> >Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
> >> >that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
> >> >fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
> >> >electric card shufflers, etc.
> >>
> >> Actually electric toothbrushes can be useful as they generally will do a
> >> better job then you can do by hand.

>
> That's a crock o' you-know-what, and you know it.


No, it is not. I am good with a manual toothbrush
and better with the electric toothbrush. This is
not about convenience, it is my health.

I work at brushing my teeth and discuss technique
with my dentist all the time.

--
Michael Press
 
In article
<[email protected]>,
Tim McNamara <[email protected]> wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> Don Wiss <donwiss@no_spam.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 29 Sep 2007, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
> >
> > >Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones that
> > >slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make fun of
> > >electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers, electric card
> > >shufflers, etc.

> >
> > Actually electric toothbrushes can be useful as they generally will
> > do a better job then you can do by hand.

>
> I looked this up once and found that most of the research indicated that
> a standard Oral-B toothbrush worked as well or better than electric
> toothbrushes, once the test subjects were taught proper brushing
> technique.


Depends on the user's dedication. I am dedicated, quite good
with a manual toothbrush, better with an electric; and I have
my dentist's reports to work with. I used the Oral B with
the thick grippy grip and the longer bristles at the far end
of the brush; the best manual I could find, and I looked.
The Braun electric's characteristics makes it easier to do a
good job, and does a better job with equal effort.

--
Michael Press
 
On Oct 1, 11:23 am, vey <[email protected]> wrote:
> Tom Keats wrote:
>
> > I downright refuse to assault a roast turkey or
> > cross-rib or leg of lamb with a de-glorified
> > hedge-trimmer/chainsaw.

>
> Even Alton Brown, geek extraordinare uses an electric knife for certain
> things. According to his book, the first electric knife was sold by
> sporting goods stores for cleaning fish.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alton_Brown


OMG, He's a Baptist! How the heck did he get roped into that ****? He
always struck me as a pantheist. Oh, Alton, how dare you!!
 
Paul O wrote:
>
> Manual chokes are very practical - if you have a carburetor.
> I'll stick with my modern, more reliable fuel-injected engine. Thank you
> very much. ;-)


On a fuel injected engine, it's called a "fast idle knob" and it's
just about as useful. Many diesel trucks still have them.

Chalo
 
Michael Press wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> "Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email protected]> writes:
>>>> At least it doesn't have slidy-outy coffee cup holders.
>>> You can make fun of cup holders all you want,

>> Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
>> that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
>> fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
>> electric card shufflers, etc. But Western Civilization
>> really hit the skids with the advent of cable TV and handheld
>> remote controls, so people could watch such pap as infomercials
>> about auto-shifting bicycles.

>
> The right electric toothbrush is a boon. I can get
> better results with less effort, the results measured
> by my dentists reports. The electric toothbrush gives
> me much better results, and I was doing good with the
> (properly chosen) manual toothbrush.
>
> I had always wanted an electric pencil sharpener, and
> the day I got it made me very happy. To this day using
> it makes me happy. Well worth it for me.
>

If an electric pencil sharpener makes you happy then an electric pencil
eraser will bring you to a state of ecstasy.

Back in the days when young dinosaurs (like myself) roamed the earth, I
had a job working as a mechanical technician and a machinist. I often
worked closely with the designer/draftsmen and I always found it amusing
that the people on the drawings boards used motorized pencil erasers. I
mean, how lazy do you have to be to need a electric eraser?

Later, I moved inside and became a designer/draftsman my self. I quickly
found out that a draftsman (especially one who is low on the totem pole)
spends more time changing and revising existing drawings than working on
new drawings. That is when I learned the real value of having a good
electric eraser (and an eraser shield and a rosin bag).

I miss my trusty old Staedtler-Mars electric eraser. I wonder where it
is now?

--

Paul D Oosterhout
I work for SAIC (but I don't speak for SAIC)
 
On Oct 1, 11:56 am, Michael Press <[email protected]> wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > Ryan Cousineau <[email protected]> writes:
> > > In article <[email protected]>,
> > > Don Wiss <donwiss@no_spam.com> wrote:

>
> > >> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:

>
> > >> >Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
> > >> >that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
> > >> >fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
> > >> >electric card shufflers, etc.

>
> > >> Actually electric toothbrushes can be useful as they generally will do a
> > >> better job then you can do by hand.

>
> > That's a crock o' you-know-what, and you know it.

>
> No, it is not. I am good with a manual toothbrush
> and better with the electric toothbrush. This is
> not about convenience, it is my health.
>
> I work at brushing my teeth and discuss technique
> with my dentist all the time.
>
> --
> Michael Press- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -


I gotta say, this is about the least-surprising thing I've ever heard
you say.

I don't doubt your veracity for a second; it just sounds like a very
Michael Press thing to say. :)
 
In article
<[email protected]>,
Hank Wirtz <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Oct 1, 11:56 am, Michael Press <[email protected]> wrote:
>> In article <[email protected]>,
>> [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>>> In article <[email protected]>,
>>> Ryan Cousineau <[email protected]> writes:
>>>> In article <[email protected]>,
>>>> Don Wiss <donwiss@no_spam.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 29 Sep 2007, [email protected] (Tom Keats) wrote:
>>>>>>Thank you, I will. At least, the mechanised/motorized ones
>>>>>>that slide out like a CD player tray. I also like to make
>>>>>>fun of electric toothbrushes, electric backscratchers,
>>>>>>electric card shufflers, etc.

>>
>>>>> Actually electric toothbrushes can be useful as they generally will do a
>>>>> better job then you can do by hand.

>>
>>> That's a crock o' you-know-what, and you know it.

>>
>> No, it is not. I am good with a manual toothbrush
>> and better with the electric toothbrush. This is
>> not about convenience, it is my health.
>>
>> I work at brushing my teeth and discuss technique
>> with my dentist all the time.

>
> I gotta say, this is about the least-surprising thing I've ever heard
> you say.


It is good to hear that I keep it fresh.

> I don't doubt your veracity for a second; it just sounds like a very
> Michael Press thing to say. :)


Thanks.

--
Michael Press
 
On Oct 1, 5:16 pm, Paul O <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
> I miss my trusty old Staedtler-Mars electric eraser. I wonder where it
> is now?


Well, I actually have one. NOS. Not sure about the brand, though.

If you're _really_ interested, let me know.

- Frank Krygowski
 
On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 09:24:25 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
wrote:

>The lights are an issue as the cheaper dyno lights aren't all that
>great, and even the expensive ones aren't bright enough for a lot of
>commute situations.


You prove how dim you are every time you denigrate the lighting
systems that have been in constant use since before you were born.

Grow up.
--
zk
 
Zoot Katz wrote:
> On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 09:24:25 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> The lights are an issue as the cheaper dyno lights aren't all that
>> great, and even the expensive ones aren't bright enough for a lot of
>> commute situations.

>
> You prove how dim you are every time you denigrate the lighting
> systems that have been in constant use since before you were born.
>
> Grow up.


Very creative snipping to change the context. When you have something
useful to say, without taking things completely out of context, get back
to us.

The complete statement was: "The lights are an issue as the cheaper dyno
lights aren't all that great, and even the expensive ones aren't bright
enough for a lot of commute situations. But you can always supplement
the included dynohub lights with more powerful lights if the situation
demands it."

I don't know _anyone_ that would disagree with that statement, at least
not in the U.S..