Cleaning Glue off of Tire Sidewalls?

[[email protected]]

If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on your
tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?

Also, I have this habitual problem where I end up really struggling to
get the last section of the tire over the rim (this is what causes the
mess). I stretch the tires before I put them on. How can I prevent
this problem?

 

[[email protected]]

Eric Lambi writes:

> If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on your
> tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?

Your rim glue should be dry by the time you install the tire so it
shouldn't "get all over the place". Road glues are tacky when dry and
are designed to accept a spare tire on the road if you get a flat.

If you don't believe the tire is on securely enough, you can try to
lift it off after riding a mile or so. Just braking on a short
descent heats the rim enough to make rim glue re-flow anyway.

> Also, I have this habitual problem where I end up really struggling
> to get the last section of the tire over the rim (this is what
> causes the mess). I stretch the tires before I put them on. How
> can I prevent this problem?

Did you previously mount the tire on a clean rim and inflate hard?
That is a way of easing that first stretch. Just the same, the bias
ply of the tire casing causes it to constrict on the rim when
inflated. Initial tightness on installation is not an indication of a
tire that may or may not stay on the rim better in use. Inflation
constriction is the main holding force, rim glue reduces tire creep
and is mainly a backup retention in a crash.

You'll notice that the tire will creep forward on hard descending from
melting rim glue and braking traction. This is apparent because the
valve stem will be angled, something that can be corrected on the
front wheel by reversing it.

[email protected]

 

[[email protected]]

[email protected] wrote:
> Eric Lambi writes:
>
> > If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on
your
> > tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?
>
> Your rim glue should be dry by the time you install the tire so it
> shouldn't "get all over the place". Road glues are tacky when dry
and
> are designed to accept a spare tire on the road if you get a flat.

I always learned to put on tubulars by putting a couple layers of glue
on the rim and letting them dry. And a layer on the tire and letting
it dry. Then putting a fresh layer on the rim and putting the tire on
before it dries.

Now you're saying to just put the glue on and let it dry completely,
since it dries tacky, before doing anything. Hmmmmmm.

 

[Calvin Jones]

Glue on the sidewalls is ugly but should not be a issue for use. Leave
it alone. You can pick it off by hand to some degree. If you use a
solvent, it is likely to attack the sidewall as well as the glue.

When you apply the last coat of glue to the rim, you should mount the
tire during the "green time." This is when the glue will allow
movement and alignment for truing up the tire. If the rim glue is
almost dry, it can be very difficult to adjust the tire after mounting.


If you are struggling, try to begin with more tension when mounting. In
other words, pull the tire tight as you lay it on the rim, right from
the beginning at the valve. Pull on both sides with as much force as
you can muster. Tires are made a bit smaller then the rim, so it can
be tough to get some on. If there is any kind of pressure in the tire,
let it out. However, a completely flat tire can get messy, and you are
back to problem #1 in your note. Leave only enough air in the tire to
have it keep it round.

 

[[email protected]]

Russell Seaton writes:

>>> If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on
>>> your tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?

>> Your rim glue should be dry by the time you install the tire so it
>> shouldn't "get all over the place". Road glues are tacky when dry
>> and are designed to accept a spare tire on the road if you get a
>> flat.

> I always learned to put on tubulars by putting a couple layers of
> glue on the rim and letting them dry. And a layer on the tire and
> letting it dry. Then putting a fresh layer on the rim and putting
> the tire on before it dries.

I don't know what type of base tape your tubulars have but dry tape
(bare cloth) was meant for track glue and needs to be coated.
Rubberized base tape doesn't need any prep to be seated on road glue
because that glue is semi mobile even when dried tacky.

> Now you're saying to just put the glue on and let it dry completely,
> since it dries tacky, before doing anything. Hmmmmmm.

Don't worry, it will conform to the base tape and stick well enough.
The real tire retention is inflation constriction. This was learned
by descending with riders who had changes to a spare tire that had no
glue on it while the remains on the rim were sparse. When we got home
and pulled off the tire, it was loose and did not stick. This
happened a couple of times showing that hard cornering does not roll
at tire, lift off in cornering and subsequent side impact does.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/mounting-tubulars.html
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/tubular-repair.html

[email protected]

 

[[email protected]]

Russell Seaton writes:

>>> If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on
>>> your tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?

>> Your rim glue should be dry by the time you install the tire so it
>> shouldn't "get all over the place". Road glues are tacky when dry
>> and are designed to accept a spare tire on the road if you get a
>> flat.

> I always learned to put on tubulars by putting a couple layers of
> glue on the rim and letting them dry. And a layer on the tire and
> letting it dry. Then putting a fresh layer on the rim and putting
> the tire on before it dries.

I don't know what type of base tape your tubulars have but dry tape
(bare cloth) was meant for track glue and needs to be coated.
Rubberized base tape doesn't need any prep to be seated on road glue
because that glue is semi mobile even when tacky dry.

> Now you're saying to just put the glue on and let it dry completely,
> since it dries tacky, before doing anything. Hmmmmmm.

Don't worry, it will conform to the base tape and stick well enough.
The real tire retention is inflation constriction. This was learned
by descending with riders who had changed to a spare tire that had no
glue on it while the remaining glue on the rim was sparse. When we
got home and pulled off the tire, it was loose and did not stick.
This happened a couple of times showing that hard cornering is not
what rolls a tire while lift off in a curve and subsequent side impact
does.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/mounting-tubulars.html
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/tubular-repair.html

[email protected]

 

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on your
> tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?

Depending on the glue, you might try masking tape. Yes, garden-variety
masking tape, sold everywhere. Just tack it onto the area and pull it off.
You can sometimes get amazing results with this technique, primarily on the
"white" or clear glues (Tubasti, for example). This technique also works
great on clothing.

> Also, I have this habitual problem where I end up really struggling to
> get the last section of the tire over the rim (this is what causes the
> mess). I stretch the tires before I put them on. How can I prevent
> this problem?

When I glue on tires, I put a layer of glue on the rim, a layer of glue on
the tire, and let them sit apart for several hours (or perhaps overnight).
Then when I mount the tire onto the rim, instead of being gooey, it's like
contact cement. No mess. Since I'm paranoid, I then lift up the tire from
the rim, a bit at a time, and get a bit of fresh glue underneath it.

For getting the last part onto the rim, very important to make sure that,
starting at the valve, (and working downward from it in both directions) you
pull/stretch the tire along the rim. This can free up quite a bit of slack
to work with, and make it a lot easier getting that last part on.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

 

[[email protected]]

Calvin Jones wrote:

> When you apply the last coat of glue to the rim, you should mount the
> tire during the "green time." This is when the glue will allow
> movement and alignment for truing up the tire. If the rim glue is
> almost dry, it can be very difficult to adjust the tire after
mounting.

Here's something else: it seems to me from my experience that if you
mount the tire when all the glue is more or less completely dry it does
not stick nearly as well. When I mount a tire where the rim glue
(Vittoria Mastik One) is still somewhat wet (about as long as it takes
to go around the rim spreading the glue) it can be very, very hard to
remove the tire without a tire lever or something to pry it up to get
started pulling the tire off.

I will add that the idea that inflation is the primary holding force
with contemporary rim glue is completely ridiculous, and can easily be
shown as such experimentally. A tire properly glued on with Vittoria
Mastik can be nearly impossible to remove without tools at any tire
pressure, including after a flat, but a tubular pumped up to 110 psi
can be rolled off by hand on a rim without glue.

Furthermore, the experimental evidence is that VM does retain
significant strength (more than many other glues have at their optimal
operating temperature) on a rim that is too hot to touch, which casts
doubt on the assertion that there is any significant re-flowing after
braking enough to heat up the rim.

> If you are struggling, try to begin with more tension when mounting.
In
> other words, pull the tire tight as you lay it on the rim, right from
> the beginning at the valve. Pull on both sides with as much force as
> you can muster. Tires are made a bit smaller then the rim, so it can
> be tough to get some on. If there is any kind of pressure in the
tire,
> let it out. However, a completely flat tire can get messy, and you
are
> back to problem #1 in your note. Leave only enough air in the tire
to
> have it keep it round.

The tire needs to be thoroughly stretched before mounting. Try test
mounting it on an unglued rim. If it is hard to mount without glue, it
is not going to be any easier after you start getting glue all over
your hands trying to pry it onto the rim.

Personally, I accept that the gluing process is going to be a little
messy but I don't have to do it that often and I get over it quickly.

 

[Mike Krueger]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

> When I glue on tires, I put a layer of glue on the rim, a layer of
glue on
> the tire, and let them sit apart for several hours (or perhaps
overnight).
> Then when I mount the tire onto the rim, instead of being gooey, it's
like
> contact cement. No mess. Since I'm paranoid, I then lift up the tire
from
> the rim, a bit at a time, and get a bit of fresh glue underneath it.

I'm trying to visualize how you do this without struggling with the
mounted tire and making an even bigger mess with the glue. It sounds
like an awkward and less effective way to achieve the same end result
as mounting the tire the traditional way: one coat on the base tape and
two thin coats on the rim allowed to dry completely, and then another
thin coat on the rim, mount and center the tire while the glue is still
tacky, inflate to riding pressure, and allow everything to dry
overnight.
If someone is smearing wet glue all over the tire sidewalls, they are
simply using too much glue. You want to coat the rim bed completely,
but with as little cement as possible. Use Vittoria Mastik One or
Continental rim cement for the best results.
Continental tubular tires fit very tightly and can be difficult at best
to stretch onto rims. On the other hand, cotton tires like Vittoria,
Veloflex, and Clement should not be relatively easy to mount even when
new.
If you do get a little glue on the braking surface of the rim, you can
remove it with a paper towel dampened with lacquer thinner. Do not use
this on the tire itself. A little glue on the sidewalls is best left
alone.

 

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

>> contact cement. No mess. Since I'm paranoid, I then lift up the tire
> from
>> the rim, a bit at a time, and get a bit of fresh glue underneath it.
>
> I'm trying to visualize how you do this without struggling with the
> mounted tire and making an even bigger mess with the glue.

You're just lifting up a bit of the tire at a time, and putting glue onto
the rim. There's no smearing involved, because you're lifting the tire up
off the rim, not squirting glue in-between (which might have been how I made
it sound).

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA

"Mike Krueger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
>> When I glue on tires, I put a layer of glue on the rim, a layer of
> glue on
>> the tire, and let them sit apart for several hours (or perhaps
> overnight).
>> Then when I mount the tire onto the rim, instead of being gooey, it's
> like
>> contact cement. No mess. Since I'm paranoid, I then lift up the tire
> from
>> the rim, a bit at a time, and get a bit of fresh glue underneath it.
>
> I'm trying to visualize how you do this without struggling with the
> mounted tire and making an even bigger mess with the glue. It sounds
> like an awkward and less effective way to achieve the same end result
> as mounting the tire the traditional way: one coat on the base tape and
> two thin coats on the rim allowed to dry completely, and then another
> thin coat on the rim, mount and center the tire while the glue is still
> tacky, inflate to riding pressure, and allow everything to dry
> overnight.
> If someone is smearing wet glue all over the tire sidewalls, they are
> simply using too much glue. You want to coat the rim bed completely,
> but with as little cement as possible. Use Vittoria Mastik One or
> Continental rim cement for the best results.
> Continental tubular tires fit very tightly and can be difficult at best
> to stretch onto rims. On the other hand, cotton tires like Vittoria,
> Veloflex, and Clement should not be relatively easy to mount even when
> new.
> If you do get a little glue on the braking surface of the rim, you can
> remove it with a paper towel dampened with lacquer thinner. Do not use
> this on the tire itself. A little glue on the sidewalls is best left
> alone.
>

 

[[email protected]]

Peter Chisholm writes:

>> If you screw up gluing your tires on and get a bunch of glue on
>> your tire sidewalls, is there any easy way to get this off?

>> Also, I have this habitual problem where I end up really struggling
>> to get the last section of the tire over the rim (this is what
>> causes the mess). I stretch the tires before I put them on. How
>> can I prevent this problem?

> Acetone

> Tip, when gluing on, use a 'solvent' brush, a little metal handles
> brush available at your hardware store. Glue carefully, just on the
> base tape. Use a few layers, thin, instead of one thick one. Glue
> in this order... tire, rim, tire, rim, tire, rim... put on, letting
> glue dry a wee bit between applications, except for the last rim
> one. Pull on the tire, ya can get your fingers onto the tire(glue
> dry-ish on the tire, remember?) and the wet glue on the rim will
> allow it to be centered.

> clean off with acetone.

> Essential you stretch the tires also. I have 4-5 stretching in my
> garage all the time.

> Put new tire onto old wheel or rim, even a clincher rim/wheel,
> inflate to maximum, let sit.

> If the garage is warmish, good thing... 'cured' tubies last longer.

Oh! I thought we got over "steel frames getting soft" and "tubular
tires getting more durable with age". Please explain what improves
when the volatile parts of the tire elastomers evaporate that makes
them better.

These storied were ones that enabled bicycle shops to sell tubulars
and racing bicycles in winter when demand was near zero. That's old
hat. Any good bicycle shop has bicycles for all seasons these days
and doesn't need to tell fables for sales.

[email protected]

 

[Qui si parla Campagnolo]

[email protected] wrote:
> Peter Chisholm writes:
>
>
> > If the garage is warmish, good thing... 'cured' tubies last longer.
>
> Oh! I thought we got over "steel frames getting soft" and "tubular
> tires getting more durable with age". Please explain what improves
> when the volatile parts of the tire elastomers evaporate that makes
> them better.
>
> These storied were ones that enabled bicycle shops to sell tubulars
> and racing bicycles in winter when demand was near zero. That's old
> hat. Any good bicycle shop has bicycles for all seasons these days
> and doesn't need to tell fables for sales.
>
> [email protected]

Geee Jobst, you are so predictable..
The little 'smiley' at the bottom was for YOU. I can mention tying and
soldering and Delta brakes and can almost predict how long it will take
you to 'respond'!!


I was KIDDIING!!!!

Geeez, go ride yer bike.

 

[[email protected]]

Peter Chisholm writes:

>>> If the garage is warmish, good thing... 'cured' tubies last longer.

>> Oh! I thought we got over "steel frames getting soft" and "tubular
>> tires getting more durable with age". Please explain what improves
>> when the volatile parts of the tire elastomers evaporate that makes
>> them better.

>> These stories were ones that enabled bicycle shops to sell tubulars
>> and racing bicycles in winter when demand was near zero. That's old
>> hat. Any good bicycle shop has bicycles for all seasons these days
>> and doesn't need to tell fables for sales.

> Geee Jobst, you are so predictable...
> The little 'smiley' at the bottom was for YOU. I can mention tying
> and soldering and Delta brakes and can almost predict how long it
> will take you to 'respond'!!

> I was KIDDIING!!!!

If you humor requires symbols and tea leaves to discover, it is
missing its goal. With the amount of standard bicycle beliefs you put
forth on occasions, some of the quips seem consistent with the rest of
the things you post. If you get misunderstood, maybe you should
review your writing rather than push it off to reader error. Aging
tubulars falls in the same category as belief in tread patterns
(directional no less) for road tires. I don't believe all the
supporters of that subject are joking either.

[email protected]

 

[[email protected]]

[email protected] wrote:
> If you humor requires symbols and tea leaves to discover, it is
> missing its goal. With the amount of standard bicycle beliefs you put
> forth on occasions, some of the quips seem consistent with the rest of
> the things you post. If you get misunderstood, maybe you should
> review your writing rather than push it off to reader error. Aging
> tubulars falls in the same category as belief in tread patterns
> (directional no less) for road tires. I don't believe all the
> supporters of that subject are joking either.
>
> [email protected]

Regardless of the tread pattern, I always mount my tubulars with the
decals on the drive side.

Greg Hall

 

[Bill Sornson]

Qui si parla Campagnolo wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>> Peter Chisholm writes:
>>
>>>>>
>>
>> If you humor requires symbols and tea leaves to discover, it is
>> missing its goal. With the amount of standard bicycle beliefs you
>> put forth on occasions, some of the quips seem consistent with the
>> rest of the things you post. If you get misunderstood, maybe you
>> should review your writing rather than push it off to reader error.
>> Aging tubulars falls in the same category as belief in tread patterns
>> (directional no less) for road tires. I don't believe all the
>> supporters of that subject are joking either.
>>
>> [email protected]
>
> sigh...............

Bingo.

 

[[email protected]]

[email protected] wrote:
Big snip
> This happened a couple of times showing that hard cornering does not
> roll at tire, lift off in cornering and subsequent side impact does.

> [email protected]

(Gulp)I hate to argue with Jobst, but on one occasion at the velodrome
I chose to ride a properly inflated tubular tire with no glue - or
rather, I tried to ride it. I forget what I was trying to prove (apart
from my having some sort of death wish), but the fact is I got no more
than one quarter of the way around the track before the bike started
sounding strange and handling unpredictably. I stopped - the first
sensible thing I had done that day - and looked at the non-glued tire
on the front wheel. It had turned itself nearly inside out for most of
the circumference of the wheel so that you could see most of the rim
tape. I went home at this point and have never felt like repeating the
experiment.

Perhaps riding on the steeply canted track is not like normal riding?
Does it put an unusual side load on the wheels? If not, what caused
the tire to roll?

Nigel Grinter
Well-Spoken Wheels Inc.
www.wellspokenwheels.com

 

[[email protected]]

Greg Hall writes:

>> If your humor requires symbols and tea leaves to discover, it is
>> missing its goal. With the amount of standard bicycle beliefs you
>> put forth on occasions, some of the quips seem consistent with the
>> rest of the things you post. If you get misunderstood, maybe you
>> should review your writing rather than push it off to reader error.
>> Aging tubulars falls in the same category as belief in tread
>> patterns (directional no less) for road tires. I don't believe all
>> the supporters of that subject are joking either.

> Regardless of the tread pattern, I always mount my tubulars with the
> decals on the drive side.

That's interesting because I put the label of clinchers on the left
side of rear wheels so that when changing tubes for a flat, I can see
where on the tire the perforation occurred. I mount rear tires from
the left side to avoid involvement with grimy sprockets.

What is the reason for your choice?

[email protected]

 

[[email protected]]

Nigel Grinter writes:

>> This happened a couple of times showing that hard cornering does
>> not roll at tire, lift off in cornering and subsequent side impact
>> does.

> On one occasion at the velodrome I chose to ride a properly inflated
> tubular tire with no glue - or rather, I tried to ride it. I forget
> what I was trying to prove (apart from my having some sort of death
> wish), but the fact is I got no more than one quarter of the way
> around the track before the bike started sounding strange and
> handling unpredictably. I stopped - the first sensible thing I had
> done that day - and looked at the non-glued tire on the front wheel.
> It had turned itself nearly inside out for most of the circumference
> of the wheel so that you could see most of the rim tape. I went
> home at this point and have never felt like repeating the
> experiment.

I you snipped off the part where I said that glue prevents creep while
the tire holds itself in place by constriction. Your tire crept from
the asymmetric load. Drawing a diagram of a tubular on a rim, you'll
see that at 45 degree lean the center of pressure still lies safely
within the bounds of tire-to-rim contact. Had you ridden a course
with left and right bends, the tire may have crept slightly but it
would not have rolled over or come off.

> Perhaps riding on the steeply canted track is not like normal riding?
> Does it put an unusual side load on the wheels? If not, what caused
> the tire to roll?

There is no difference except that one does not ride in fast circles
on roads so that a 30+ degree lean is constantly to one side... as it
might be riding down a spiral parking garage ramp (which is a helix).

[email protected]

 

[Yuji Sakuma]

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> Greg Hall writes:
>
>>> If your humor requires symbols and tea leaves to discover, it is
>>> missing its goal. With the amount of standard bicycle beliefs you
>>> put forth on occasions, some of the quips seem consistent with the
>>> rest of the things you post. If you get misunderstood, maybe you
>>> should review your writing rather than push it off to reader error.
>>> Aging tubulars falls in the same category as belief in tread
>>> patterns (directional no less) for road tires. I don't believe all
>>> the supporters of that subject are joking either.
>
>> Regardless of the tread pattern, I always mount my tubulars with the
>> decals on the drive side.
>
> That's interesting because I put the label of clinchers on the left
> side of rear wheels so that when changing tubes for a flat, I can see
> where on the tire the perforation occurred. I mount rear tires from
> the left side to avoid involvement with grimy sprockets.
>
> What is the reason for your choice?
>
> [email protected]

I am sure Greg can answer for himself but one possible reason occurs to me;
bicycles are always admired, photographed, etc. from the drive side. Maybe
he is proud of his tire choice and wants to show it off. This is of course,
irrelevant for anyone only interested in technical matters and hard riding
but it is harmless. Personally, I don't pay any attention to the label when
I mount tires (I use tubulars) and some of my wheels have the labels on one
side and some on the other.

Yuji Sakuma

 

[Robin Hubert]

[email protected] wrote:
> Greg Hall writes:
>
>
>>>If your humor requires symbols and tea leaves to discover, it is
>>>missing its goal. With the amount of standard bicycle beliefs you
>>>put forth on occasions, some of the quips seem consistent with the
>>>rest of the things you post. If you get misunderstood, maybe you
>>>should review your writing rather than push it off to reader error.
>>>Aging tubulars falls in the same category as belief in tread
>>>patterns (directional no less) for road tires. I don't believe all
>>>the supporters of that subject are joking either.
>
>
>>Regardless of the tread pattern, I always mount my tubulars with the
>>decals on the drive side.
>
>
> That's interesting because I put the label of clinchers on the left
> side of rear wheels so that when changing tubes for a flat, I can see
> where on the tire the perforation occurred. I mount rear tires from
> the left side to avoid involvement with grimy sprockets.

Strange. I might be daft but I must ask, how is the direction of tire
mounting affected by the sprockets? Regardless of which side from which
I've mounted tires, the sprockets have never been involved.

>
> What is the reason for your choice?
>
> [email protected]

Robin Hubert