Congestion Charge: Guardian Article

Discussion in 'UK and Europe' started by Toby Barrett, Feb 18, 2003.

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  1. Toby Barrett

    Toby Barrett Guest

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  2. Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > Worth reading and summed up by this quote for those who don't have the means/time:
    >
    > "And there you have it, in a nutshell, the cast-iron and immutable reason why urban car drivers
    > can never act collectively - they are all bastards, not by coincidence, but by definition."

    Do you really believe this or share this opinion?

    If so, you're a sad person.

    Do you ever drive in an urban area?

    If so, does this make you a bastard?
    --
    Michael MacClancy
     
  3. Just Zis Guy

    Just Zis Guy Guest

    Michael MacClancy wrote:
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    >> Worth reading and summed up by this quote for those who don't have the means/time:

    >> "And there you have it, in a nutshell, the cast-iron and immutable reason why urban car drivers
    >> can never act collectively - they are all bastards, not by coincidence, but by definition."

    > Do you really believe this or share this opinion? If so, you're a sad person. Do you ever drive in
    > an urban area? If so, does this make you a bastard?

    Not half as sad as someone who can't laugh at such a lovely piece of satire.

    The following also made me laugh out loud: "The "sodders" had issued some protest guidelines, which
    included, "Do not cause an obstruction by trying to impede moving vehicles". Now, I find myself
    morally chary of mocking protesters of any stamp, but come on - the whole point of protest is the
    impediment of moving vehicles. That is the defining feature of a march; it's what distinguishes
    protesting from having a large picnic with some like-minded strangers."

    And especially: "I wouldn't necessarily advocate a tax on selfishness (it sounds a bit like
    socialism for the under-fives), but it is amusing to watch the implacably self-seeking try and act
    in the wider interest. They can't trust their politicians, believing them also to be selfish; they
    can't be bothered to take to the streets; they can't make even a minor impact on the traffic,
    believing too vigorously in the convenience of the individual; they can't do anything illegal, since
    none of them will take the rap for anyone else; they can't even be nice to each other, if there's
    any sign of weakness (like an L-plate)."

    --
    Guy
    ===
    I wonder if you wouldn't mind piecing out our imperfections with your thoughts; and while you're
    about it perhaps you could think when we talk of bicycles, that you see them printing their proud
    wheels i' the receiving earth; thanks awfully.

    http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/09.shtml#103 http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/09.shtml#104
     
  4. Stephen \

    Stephen \ Guest

    "Michael MacClancy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > > Worth reading and summed up by this quote for those who don't have the means/time:
    > >
    > > "And there you have it, in a nutshell, the cast-iron and immutable reason why urban car drivers
    > > can never act collectively - they are all bastards, not by coincidence, but by definition."
    >
    > Do you really believe this or share this opinion?
    >
    > If so, you're a sad person.
    >
    > Do you ever drive in an urban area?
    >
    > If so, does this make you a bastard?
    > --

    But by definition car driving is selfish (therefore bastards in this case) and therefore cannot
    organise a collective protest (in this case). Read the article. Very good.
     
  5. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > > Worth reading and summed up by this quote for those who don't have the means/time:
    > >
    > > "And there you have it, in a nutshell, the cast-iron and immutable reason why urban car drivers
    > > can never act collectively - they are all bastards, not by coincidence, but by definition."
    >
    > Do you really believe this or share this opinion?

    It's a piece of humour, though the article as a whole has a point.
    >
    > If so, you're a sad person.

    I do laugh from time to time. Are you a sad person?

    > Do you ever drive in an urban area?

    No.

    Colin
     
  6. Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > It's a piece of humour, though the article as a whole has a point.

    Stop trying to weasel your way out of a difficult position. You didn't make the original post
    because of the article's humour, you posted an excerpt out of context because it says that car
    drivers are bastards. You never mentioned how funny it was. How on earth is someone reading your
    'summary' going to know that the original piece was funny? Or is urban car drivers being bastards
    just a joke that goes right over my head?
    --
    Michael MacClancy
     
  7. Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > FFS lighten up. I'm not in a difficult position. I'm sat at a comfy desk
    at work typing,

    That made me giggle. :)

    > was funny? Or is urban car drivers being bastards just a joke that
    >> goes right over my head?
    >
    > Obviously the answer is yes.
    >

    Obviously there _are_ things that we can both laugh at but calling anyone a bastard isn't one of
    them, particularly when you present something so blatantly out of context. Next time you do us the
    'service' of summarising something I'll ignore your assistance.

    --
    Michael MacClancy
     
  8. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > > It's a piece of humour, though the article as a whole has a point.
    >
    > Stop trying to weasel your way out of a difficult position.

    FFS lighten up. I'm not in a difficult position. I'm sat at a comfy desk at work typing,

    > You didn't make the original post because of the article's humour, you posted an excerpt out of
    > context because it says that car drivers are bastards. You never mentioned how funny it was. How
    > on earth is someone reading your 'summary' going to know that the original piece was funny? Or is
    > urban car drivers being bastards just a joke that goes right over my head?

    Obviously the answer is yes.

    Colin
     
  9. Tony W

    Tony W Guest

    "Michael MacClancy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > > It's a piece of humour, though the article as a whole has a point.
    >
    > Stop trying to weasel your way out of a difficult position. You didn't
    make
    > the original post because of the article's humour, you posted an excerpt
    out
    > of context because it says that car drivers are bastards. You never mentioned how funny it was.
    > How on earth is someone reading your
    'summary'
    > going to know that the original piece was funny? Or is urban car drivers being bastards just a
    > joke that goes right over my head?

    get a life.

    This bastard regularly drives in cities. Mostly it is not a fun experience. If Colin wants to call
    me a bastard and selfish i can take it.

    And I'm not offended by the article -- nor, I expect are many others.

    T
     
  10. Michael MacClancy wrote:
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    >
    >>It's a piece of humour, though the article as a whole has a point.
    >
    >
    > Stop trying to weasel your way out of a difficult position. You didn't make the original post
    > because of the article's humour, you posted an excerpt out of context because it says that car
    > drivers are bastards. You never mentioned how funny it was. How on earth is someone reading your
    > 'summary' going to know that the original piece was funny? Or is urban car drivers being bastards
    > just a joke that goes right over my head?
    > --
    > Michael MacClancy
    >
    >

    Here here. The article is offensive. Why tar those born out of wedlock with the cagers in the
    cities.;-)

    --
    Chris dot Gerhard at btclick dot com.
     
  11. Just Zis Guy

    Just Zis Guy Guest

    Michael MacClancy wrote:
    > Colin Blackburn wrote:
    >> It's a piece of humour, though the article as a whole has a point.

    > Stop trying to weasel your way out of a difficult position. You didn't make the original post
    > because of the article's humour

    Then why the smiley? You did see the smiley, didn't you?

    > is urban car drivers being bastards just a joke that goes right over my head?

    Clearly :)

    --
    Guy
    ===
    I wonder if you wouldn't mind piecing out our imperfections with your thoughts; and while you're
    about it perhaps you could think when we talk of bicycles, that you see them printing their proud
    wheels i' the receiving earth; thanks awfully.

    http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/09.shtml#103 http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/09.shtml#104
     
  12. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...

    > This bastard regularly drives in cities. Mostly it is not a fun experience. If Colin wants to call
    > me a bastard and selfish i can take it.

    You selfish bastard!

    I'm glad I got that off my chest.

    Colin
     
  13. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]_btclick.com says...

    > Here here. The article is offensive. Why tar those born out of wedlock with the cagers in the
    > cities.;-)

    Is it born out of wedlock or conceived out of wedlock. Just wondered :-(

    Colin
     
  14. Colin Blackburn wrote:
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]_btclick.com says...
    >
    >
    >>Here here. The article is offensive. Why tar those born out of wedlock with the cagers in the
    >>cities.;-)
    >
    >
    > Is it born out of wedlock or conceived out of wedlock. Just wondered :-(
    >
    > Colin

    In the back of a cage in the grid lock? :)

    --
    Chris dot Gerhard at btclick dot com.
     
  15. Just Zis Guy

    Just Zis Guy Guest

    "Michael MacClancy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...

    > > Then why the smiley? You did see the smiley, didn't you?

    > Yes, I did thank you. But the presence on a smiley doesn't really tell
    you
    > anything about what he's laughing at, does it?

    Yes it does - it's a nice piece of satire. I like satire. I especially liked that piece of satire -
    it was very well written.

    > He could have written something along the lines of, "I don't think all
    urban
    > car drivers are bastards, myself, but the article is still pretty hilarious".

    Why would you do that? It sounds like someone who is about to tell a racist joke saying "I really
    like black people myself, but...." - and in this case there's nothign wrong with laughing at
    gridlocked cagers because we have almost all *been* gridlocked cagers ourselves at some point, and
    many of us still are. It's funny because it's true - driving a car in a town *is* selfish. The
    degree of selfishness varies, but it is still fundamentally selfish.

    > It's not my fault that he wrote something that is unnecessary and objectionable to many people in
    > the context he presented it.

    Um - only one person as far as I can make out :-/
     
  16. Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
    >
    > Then why the smiley? You did see the smiley, didn't you?

    Yes, I did thank you. But the presence on a smiley doesn't really tell you anything about what he's
    laughing at, does it? And the use of smilies (should that be smileys?) is inconsistent (just like
    'cager' and 'driver' etc). I assume we all know that it is pretty difficult to convey humour via a
    NG because it is so easy to genuinely misconstrue what has been written, unless put properly into
    context. Colin couldn't be bothered to do that. He could have written something along the lines of,
    "I don't think all urban car drivers are bastards, myself, but the article is still pretty
    hilarious". He didn't and left the impression that he shares the author's opinion. The smiley could
    indicate laughter at any one of several things, including his agreement with the author.

    It's not my fault that he wrote something that is unnecessary and objectionable to many people in
    the context he presented it.

    I think that it's revealing that he hasn't disassociated himself from the sentiment that urban car
    drivers are bastards.
    --
    Michael MacClancy
     
  17. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
    > >
    > > Then why the smiley? You did see the smiley, didn't you?
    >
    > Yes, I did thank you. But the presence on a smiley doesn't really tell you anything about what
    > he's laughing at, does it? And the use of smilies (should that be smileys?) is inconsistent (just
    > like 'cager' and 'driver' etc). I assume we all know that it is pretty difficult to convey humour
    > via a NG because it is so easy to genuinely misconstrue what has been written, unless put properly
    > into context. Colin couldn't be bothered to do that. He could have written something along the
    > lines of, "I don't think all urban car drivers are bastards, myself, but the article is still
    > pretty hilarious". He didn't and left the impression that he shares the author's opinion.

    I share the author's opinion and sense of humour. Happy now?

    Colin
     
  18. Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

    >
    > Um - only one person as far as I can make out :-/

    There have been several comments about the strong anti-motorist bias of this NG and not just from
    me. If you choose not to read them or to forget them that's not my fault.

    Anyway, I can feel my head slowly being pushed under the surface of the waters by a bunch of people
    who can't appreciate that others might have legitimate but different views. I'm obviously going the
    way of predecessors who appealed for reasoned debate or didn't even enter the discussion for fear of
    being mobbed.
    --
    Michael MacClancy
     
  19. Colin Blackburn wrote:
    >
    > I share the author's opinion and sense of humour. Happy now?
    >
    > Colin

    I'm perfectly happy, always am.

    I wonder how someone with your anger could ever be happy though. It's never necessary to call
    someone a 'bastard'. Think about it with a nice calming cup of tea.
    --
    Michael MacClancy
     
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