Contador vs. Pantani and other greats



sopas

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Who do you think is the best climber, Contador or Pantani?
Pantani holds the record in Alpe H'uez , could Contador climb that fast? What do you think?

Another questions: How do you think Contador would do against other greats on their prime, such as Indurain or Armstrong? We all know Alberto can climb but I dont think he can TT like Indurain did.

Comments?
 

limerickman

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Jan 5, 2004
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sopas said:
Who do you think is the best climber, Contador or Pantani?
Pantani holds the record in Alpe H'uez , could Contador climb that fast? What do you think?

Another questions: How do you think Contador would do against other greats on their prime, such as Indurain or Armstrong? We all know Alberto can climb but I dont think he can TT like Indurain did.

Comments?

I think Contadors performance in this TDF stands with the great riders.

Is Contador a better climber than Pantani?
Hard one to judge.
I think pantani is the most exceptional climber I have ever seen.
Some say that Pantani was not as good as Bahamontes/Gaul.
I never saw either of those two riders so I cannot say.

As regard TT'ing.
Indurain for me is the best ITT I have ever seen.
Ullrich wasn't far off but Indurain for me is the best ITT'ist.
Contador is good but I dont think he near Ullrich and/or Indurain.
 

sopas

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THanks for your replies.

Regarding TT, I asked mainly because I am amazed how Contador has improved. He was good in TT, but this year he was great. It is incredible because usually small and light riders like him are not very good in TTs.
I agree Indurain/Ullrich/Armstrong in their primes were better TTers than contador though. However, who knows what will happen in the next few years. Alberto is still 26 and is still improving.

About his climbing ability, I think Contador has more initial punch than Pantani, he gets out of the saddle with more power, but Pantani had more consitence.
 

limerickman

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You hit the nail on the head.
Contador is only 26.
He has years of improvement ahead of him.

If he keep going the way he is going, then he will end up with a palmares as great as Hinault, Coppi, Indurain.
 

ilpirata

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Aug 19, 2004
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sopas said:
Who do you think is the best climber, Contador or Pantani?
Pantani holds the record in Alpe H'uez , could Contador climb that fast? What do you think?

Another questions: How do you think Contador would do against other greats on their prime, such as Indurain or Armstrong? We all know Alberto can climb but I dont think he can TT like Indurain did.

Comments?

Contador is an ecceptional climber and with his being a superb time trialist as well he is the most complete rider I have ever seen and I would say the best. Although I don't think it is fair to compare riders of different eras. The sport evolves, the equipment evolves, equipment and technologies ehem advance.
That said as far as pure climbing, Pantani was in a category of his own. 1995 he was smoothest and 1999 he was strongest. In 98, 99, and 2000 his climbing style was different than in 1994 and 1995. Return from the serious leg fractures of 1995 he had one leg shorter than the other. He then adopted a lower grip on the handlebars that apparently gave him a more even push from each leg. But you can see that he had always a lean to one side with his hips when off the saddle. It hard to imagination how good he might have been if not for the injury and the other impediments that were thrown at him.
 

jhuskey

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Oct 6, 2003
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I had a conversation about this the same subject this morning comparing Pantani to Contador, Basso, Rasmussen etc.
It is hard to judge but on particular stages I don't think there is anyone that could have stayed with Pantani. On other days and stages, yes.
 

poulidor

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In great climbers we can put too: Van Impe, Herrera.
Difficult to compare with Pantani and Contador who are not eating the same food, but no doubt they are build to climb.
 

limerickman

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ilpirata said:
Contador is an ecceptional climber and with his being a superb time trialist as well he is the most complete rider I have ever seen and I would say the best. Although I don't think it is fair to compare riders of different eras. The sport evolves, the equipment evolves, equipment and technologies ehem advance.
That said as far as pure climbing, Pantani was in a category of his own. 1995 he was smoothest and 1999 he was strongest. In 98, 99, and 2000 his climbing style was different than in 1994 and 1995. Return from the serious leg fractures of 1995 he had one leg shorter than the other. He then adopted a lower grip on the handlebars that apparently gave him a more even push from each leg. But you can see that he had always a lean to one side with his hips when off the saddle. It hard to imagination how good he might have been if not for the injury and the other impediments that were thrown at him.

For sure Pantani was the best climber I have ever seen.
I was fortunate to see him at two stages of the 1995 TDF and what he did at D'Huez and Guize Niege, was just phenomenal.
But to see it in reality was just stupendous.
He literally destroyed both fields : guys like Zulle, who was a great rider, could not live with him.
Even Indurain was bursting a gut to try to contain the damage he inflicted on the peloton that year.
 

sopas

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One thing I have noticed is that Contador does not use the drops at all, while Pantani almost always used the handlebar drops and was very low in the bike. I don't think I have ever seen Pantani out of the saddle with his hands on the hoods like Contador or Armstrong do. Am I right?
 

Andrija

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sopas said:
Who do you think is the best climber, Contador or Pantani?
Pantani holds the record in Alpe H'uez , could Contador climb that fast? What do you think?

Another questions: How do you think Contador would do against other greats on their prime, such as Indurain or Armstrong? We all know Alberto can climb but I dont think he can TT like Indurain did.

Comments?
I think Contador will beat Pantani's d'Huez record. Wait till next Tour edition, there will be Alpe d' Huez stage, and I think Contador just can't wait it to make a statement.
If he's not busted before... That's regarding his TTing.
 

TheDangerMan

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Andrija said:
I think Contador will beat Pantani's d'Huez record. Wait till next Tour edition, there will be Alpe d' Huez stage, and I think Contador just can't wait it to make a statement.
If he's not busted before... That's regarding his TTing.

I don't think anyone could beat Pantani's Alpe H'uez record in this day and age. It will be like concord.
 

steve

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Aug 12, 2001
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TheDangerMan said:
I don't think anyone could beat Pantani's Alpe H'uez record in this day and age. It will be like concord.

Pantani was far more exciting to watch.
 

ilpirata

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sopas said:
One thing I have noticed is that Contador does not use the drops at all, while Pantani almost always used the handlebar drops and was very low in the bike. I don't think I have ever seen Pantani out of the saddle with his hands on the hoods like Contador or Armstrong do. Am I right?
As I was trying to say in the previous post, in 1994 and 1995 he had the more traditional climbers position. But Pantani, after his the accident had to change his style, gripping lower on the "drops", as you say. This is because the leg with the breaks, upon healing had become shorter than the other. Watch a youtube video of Courcheval 2000 or anything from 1998 and you will see that his hips must go over to one side more that the other to get that good push off the shorter leg.
 

leerobbs

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How soon we forget. Remember just last year when the young great Italian rider Ricardo Rico climbed like a billy goat. He lifted and just left everyone in his dust. He had two incredible mountain stages and then...busted. Whatever happened to him? What was the name of his team...I can't remember but they some really cool yellow and white kits.
 

gtm

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Riccio rode for Saunier-Duval who needless to say washed their hands of pro cycling soon after his bust. His ban ends next year.
 

TheDangerMan

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gtm said:
Riccio rode for Saunier-Duval who needless to say washed their hands of pro cycling soon after his bust. His ban ends next year.

Earlier cycling news said his ban runs out in March. Now they say it won't be until July, after the tour has started. That sucks.
 

gtm

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No great loss - he's a obnoxious little twerp & I doubt he'll be able to do anything interesting without a gallon of CERA coursing through his veins.
 

DV1976

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TheDangerMan said:
Earlier cycling news said his ban runs out in March. Now they say it won't be until July, after the tour has started. That sucks.
I thought you didnt like dopers :p
Oh but I forget. You are a Lance fan. So you love them after all. :D
 

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