"Contaminated" OPV vax. Caught out in genocide

Discussion in 'Health and medical' started by John, Mar 9, 2004.

  1. John

    John Guest

    'Our Polio Test Was Conclusive' - DR Haruna Kaita

    Weekly Trust (Kaduna) INTERVIEW March 6, 2004 Posted to the
    web March 8, 2004 Kaduna
    http://allafrica.com/stories/200403080104.html

    Dr. Haruna Kaita is the JNI scientists who conducted the
    test on the polio vaccines in India, and he is also the
    Dean, Faculty of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Ahmadu Bello
    University Zaria. He spoke to Musa Umar Kazaure of our
    Kano Bureau on the outcome of their test shortly after
    he defended the result before the federal government
    experts in Kaduna. Excerpts. WT:You are among the JNI
    scientists who went to India to conduct various tests on
    the controversial OPV which was alleged to have
    contaminants. What was the outcome of your tests? Dr
    Kaita: Well, let me start first by thanking JNI for
    giving me the opportunity to serve humanity because what
    we did was not for the Muslim alone or the Christian
    alone, but for the generality of Nigerians who are prone
    to having these vaccines. Now on the Polio vaccine test
    result, I want to tell you that when I left Nigeria to
    India to conduct those test, I was praying and hoping
    that the tests will come out negative, that the vaccines
    were actually safe for our children. I prayed that I
    found no contaminants in them because I know how
    sensitive it will be if there is any contaminant
    especially with the posture of the government and some
    of my colleagues who are in league with government for
    obvious reasons. I spent about 23 days in India mostly
    in laboratories conducting analysis on the samples of
    oral Polio vaccines I took along, using some of the most
    sophisticated laboratory equipments in the world which
    were even cited and recommended by WHO as number one. It
    is WHO that said GC-MS is the best equipment for
    discovering contaminants in drugs because of its
    sensitivity and its is state of the art in the world. So
    I used that machine and used Radio-Immuno assay in
    conducting the tests. WT: What was the result you got
    from the tests. Dr Kaita: The results were very
    interesting because I and some other professional
    colleagues who are Indians who were in the Lab could not
    believe the discovery. I thought at first that something
    was wrong with my calculations, them we repeated it
    again and again, and again, it kept giving us the same
    results of contaminants. Some of the Indian scientists
    who were in the lab also wondered how come a polio
    vaccine had such contaminants that were not suppose to
    be there. Some of the things we discovered in the
    vaccines are harmful, toxic; some have direct effect on
    human reproductive system. But I was surprised when one
    of the federal government doctors was telling me
    something contrary to what I have learnt, studied,
    taught and is the common knowledge of all pharmaceutical
    scientist, that estrogen cannot induce anti-fertility
    response on human. That is the most absurd thing I ever
    heard from a learned person who said he is a professor.
    I am a professional in my chosen field, I am a
    professional pharmacist, I am an authority when it comes
    to drug, and here is somebody telling me that I don't
    know the biological or pharmacological effect of a drug
    substance in human body. I found that argument very
    disturbing and ridiculous. WT: Why should the
    manufacturers of these vaccines include these substances
    when they know that it could easily be detected. Dr
    Kaita: That is the problem. Number one, these
    manufacturers or promoters of these harmful things have
    a secret agenda which only further research can reveal.
    Secondly they have always taken us in the third world
    for granted, thinking we don't have the capacity,
    knowledge and equipments to conduct test that would
    reveal such contaminants. And very unfortunately they
    also have people to defend their atrocities within our
    mist, and worst still some of these are suppose to be
    our own professionals who we stomach rely on to protect
    our interest. WT: Were the government team not satisfied
    with the procedure you used in the test or what was
    their problem with your result. Dr Kaita: My
    presentation before the JNI enlarged committee was
    purely academic, because WHO representatives were there,
    UNICEF, and all stakeholders, we invited everybody, we
    did not hide our report as they did to their
    (government's) own, we circulated it to everybody for
    further analysis because we were sure of our results.
    Let anybody interested go and vet the protocol we used,
    all the substances we discovered we gave them
    photocopies, to NAFDAC, WHO,UNICEF, USAID and all the
    stakeholders. Unlike their own which they continue to
    keep secret from the public because they know it is the
    same with ours. WT: But after your presentation, were
    you able to convince them of the authenticity of your
    tests result. Dr Kaita: Well, finally I had to define to
    them what a fake drug is, and concluded that the Oral
    Polio Vaccine is nothing but a fake drug too, and what
    do NAFDAC do to fake drugs, they burn them and prosecute
    those who import them into the country. So this has even
    strengthen our resolve that those who imported this fake
    drug in the name of Polio Vaccines must be prosecuted
    like any other criminals apprehended by NAFDAC. We are
    no more calling for their stoppage but for their
    prosecution because they are importing into Nigeria fake
    drugs in the guise of polio vaccine because they contain
    substances which are not suppose to be in them, and that
    is what amounts to fake drug. They don't have NAFDAC
    batch numbers, and they are contaminated with toxic
    substances. WT: So would you say the meeting endorsed
    your result even though the federal government team
    still ask for another test in conjunction with your team
    of scientist. Dr Kaita: Our own test is conclusive, we
    are sure of our results, they can go to anywhere in the
    world to verify it if they like. When I made my
    presentation before all the stakeholders, they asked all
    the questions they want to ask, and I defended the
    results, and it was agreed by all the people present,
    including the federal government team for the first
    time, that the vaccines contained contaminants. They
    only argue that all those batches of vaccine that were
    contaminated have been exhausted, and that new ones have
    been ordered by the federal government, so any state
    that wishing to still verify the safety or otherwise of
    the new ones should go to the cold stores of NPI at
    designated places in the states to collect them for
    testing. So now they agreed that the vaccines they have
    been giving to our children for the past 4years when the
    polio campaign started were contaminated, but what is
    the government going to do about those who have been
    trying to bury that fact from the people. Would the
    importers of such contaminated be left to go free? What
    plans has the government put in place to help the
    children who have given these toxic and contaminated
    vaccines in case they start reacting to them? Are we
    going to allow this to be swept again under the carpet
    like the Kano MININGITIS Trovan test just because the
    children involved are from poor parents? God will not
    leave the perpetrators of this crime against children in
    Nigeria to go free if the government refuses to act. WT:
    Dr. Kaita, as a pharmaceutical scientist, what do you
    make of these vaccines generally, because this polio
    discovery has thrown a blanket suspicion on virtually
    all the vaccines administered on our children Dr Kaita:
    Let me make something clear, I am not against
    vaccination per se because there are genuine vaccines
    that help prevents diseases, but when a fake drug is
    brought in disguised as a vaccine, we have obligation to
    kick against it. Professor Emiritus Shehu himself will
    bare witness to this if he recall the incidence of CSM
    (Meningitis) immunization campaign in an area called
    Mayobelwa in former Gongola State . The communities were
    given vaccines for protection against the CSM, but what
    happened? After just a few weeks, there was a massive
    outbreak unprecedented in the history of the country
    there, and it was mostly those who were given the
    vaccines that were affected in that out break. Even
    himself, the Professor, said at that time that he could
    not explain the phenomenon, but we know now from recent
    discoveries that those vaccines were carrying a virulent
    that induced the disease in those vaccinated. There are
    other instances in other third world countries like
    Philippines, Mexico and so on. This is what is casting
    doubts on the vaccines brought for immunization on
    people in the third world. And for your information,
    even America has stopped the use of OPV, and many
    western countries have also stopped it because they
    discovered that it causes the polio that it is suppose
    to protect people from.
     
    Tags:


  2. john wrote:
    > 'Our Polio Test Was Conclusive' - DR Haruna Kaita
    >
    > Weekly Trust (Kaduna) INTERVIEW March 6, 2004 Posted to
    > the web March 8, 2004 Kaduna
    > http://allafrica.com/stories/200403080104.html
    >
    > Dr. Haruna Kaita is the JNI scientists who conducted the
    > test on the polio vaccines in India, and he is also
    > the Dean, Faculty of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Ahmadu
    > Bello University Zaria. He spoke to Musa Umar Kazaure
    > of our Kano Bureau on the outcome of their test
    > shortly after he defended the result before the
    > federal government experts in Kaduna. Excerpts. WT:You
    > are among the JNI scientists who went to India to
    > conduct various tests on the controversial OPV which
    > was alleged to have contaminants. What was the outcome
    > of your tests? Dr Kaita: Well, let me start first by
    > thanking JNI for giving me the opportunity to serve
    > humanity because what we did was not for the Muslim
    > alone or the Christian alone, but for the generality
    > of Nigerians who are prone to having these vaccines.
    > Now on the Polio vaccine test result, I want to tell
    > you that when I left Nigeria to India to conduct those
    > test, I was praying and hoping that the tests will
    > come out negative, that the vaccines were actually
    > safe for our children. I prayed that I found no
    > contaminants in them because I know how sensitive it
    > will be if there is any contaminant especially with
    > the posture of the government and some of my
    > colleagues who are in league with government for
    > obvious reasons. I spent about 23 days in India mostly
    > in laboratories conducting analysis on the samples of
    > oral Polio vaccines I took along, using some of the
    > most sophisticated laboratory equipments in the world
    > which were even cited and recommended by WHO as number
    > one. It is WHO that said GC-MS is the best equipment
    > for discovering contaminants in drugs because of its
    > sensitivity and its is state of the art in the world.
    > So I used that machine and used Radio-Immuno assay in
    > conducting the tests. WT: What was the result you got
    > from the tests. Dr Kaita: The results were very
    > interesting because I and some other professional
    > colleagues who are Indians who were in the Lab could
    > not believe the discovery. I thought at first that
    > something was wrong with my calculations, them we
    > repeated it again and again, and again, it kept giving
    > us the same results of contaminants. Some of the
    > Indian scientists who were in the lab also wondered
    > how come a polio vaccine had such contaminants that
    > were not suppose to be there. Some of the things we
    > discovered in the vaccines are harmful, toxic; some
    > have direct effect on human reproductive system. But I
    > was surprised when one of the federal government
    > doctors was telling me something contrary to what I
    > have learnt, studied, taught and is the common
    > knowledge of all pharmaceutical scientist, that
    > estrogen cannot induce anti-fertility response on
    > human. That is the most absurd thing I ever heard from
    > a learned person who said he is a professor. I am a
    > professional in my chosen field, I am a professional
    > pharmacist, I am an authority when it comes to drug,
    > and here is somebody telling me that I don't know the
    > biological or pharmacological effect of a drug
    > substance in human body. I found that argument very
    > disturbing and ridiculous. WT: Why should the
    > manufacturers of these vaccines include these
    > substances when they know that it could easily be
    > detected. Dr Kaita: That is the problem. Number one,
    > these manufacturers or promoters of these harmful
    > things have a secret agenda which only further
    > research can reveal. Secondly they have always taken
    > us in the third world for granted, thinking we don't
    > have the capacity, knowledge and equipments to conduct
    > test that would reveal such contaminants. And very
    > unfortunately they also have people to defend their
    > atrocities within our mist, and worst still some of
    > these are suppose to be our own professionals who we
    > stomach rely on to protect our interest. WT: Were the
    > government team not satisfied with the procedure you
    > used in the test or what was their problem with your
    > result. Dr Kaita: My presentation before the JNI
    > enlarged committee was purely academic, because WHO
    > representatives were there, UNICEF, and all
    > stakeholders, we invited everybody, we did not hide
    > our report as they did to their (government's) own, we
    > circulated it to everybody for further analysis
    > because we were sure of our results. Let anybody
    > interested go and vet the protocol we used, all the
    > substances we discovered we gave them photocopies, to
    > NAFDAC, WHO,UNICEF, USAID and all the stakeholders.
    > Unlike their own which they continue to keep secret
    > from the public because they know it is the same with
    > ours. WT: But after your presentation, were you able
    > to convince them of the authenticity of your tests
    > result. Dr Kaita: Well, finally I had to define to
    > them what a fake drug is, and concluded that the Oral
    > Polio Vaccine is nothing but a fake drug too, and what
    > do NAFDAC do to fake drugs, they burn them and
    > prosecute those who import them into the country. So
    > this has even strengthen our resolve that those who
    > imported this fake drug in the name of Polio Vaccines
    > must be prosecuted like any other criminals
    > apprehended by NAFDAC. We are no more calling for
    > their stoppage but for their prosecution because they
    > are importing into Nigeria fake drugs in the guise of
    > polio vaccine because they contain substances which
    > are not suppose to be in them, and that is what
    > amounts to fake drug. They don't have NAFDAC batch
    > numbers, and they are contaminated with toxic
    > substances. WT: So would you say the meeting endorsed
    > your result even though the federal government team
    > still ask for another test in conjunction with your
    > team of scientist. Dr Kaita: Our own test is
    > conclusive, we are sure of our results, they can go to
    > anywhere in the world to verify it if they like. When
    > I made my presentation before all the stakeholders,
    > they asked all the questions they want to ask, and I
    > defended the results, and it was agreed by all the
    > people present, including the federal government team
    > for the first time, that the vaccines contained
    > contaminants. They only argue that all those batches
    > of vaccine that were contaminated have been exhausted,
    > and that new ones have been ordered by the federal
    > government, so any state that wishing to still verify
    > the safety or otherwise of the new ones should go to
    > the cold stores of NPI at designated places in the
    > states to collect them for testing. So now they agreed
    > that the vaccines they have been giving to our
    > children for the past 4years when the polio campaign
    > started were contaminated, but what is the government
    > going to do about those who have been trying to bury
    > that fact from the people. Would the importers of such
    > contaminated be left to go free? What plans has the
    > government put in place to help the children who have
    > given these toxic and contaminated vaccines in case
    > they start reacting to them? Are we going to allow
    > this to be swept again under the carpet like the Kano
    > MININGITIS Trovan test just because the children
    > involved are from poor parents? God will not leave the
    > perpetrators of this crime against children in Nigeria
    > to go free if the government refuses to act. WT: Dr.
    > Kaita, as a pharmaceutical scientist, what do you make
    > of these vaccines generally, because this polio
    > discovery has thrown a blanket suspicion on virtually
    > all the vaccines administered on our children Dr
    > Kaita: Let me make something clear, I am not against
    > vaccination per se because there are genuine vaccines
    > that help prevents diseases, but when a fake drug is
    > brought in disguised as a vaccine, we have obligation
    > to kick against it. Professor Emiritus Shehu himself
    > will bare witness to this if he recall the incidence
    > of CSM (Meningitis) immunization campaign in an area
    > called Mayobelwa in former Gongola State . The
    > communities were given vaccines for protection against
    > the CSM, but what happened? After just a few weeks,
    > there was a massive outbreak unprecedented in the
    > history of the country there, and it was mostly those
    > who were given the vaccines that were affected in that
    > out break. Even himself, the Professor, said at that
    > time that he could not explain the phenomenon, but we
    > know now from recent discoveries that those vaccines
    > were carrying a virulent that induced the disease in
    > those vaccinated. There are other instances in other
    > third world countries like Philippines, Mexico and so
    > on. This is what is casting doubts on the vaccines
    > brought for immunization on people in the third world.
    > And for your information, even America has stopped the
    > use of OPV, and many western countries have also
    > stopped it because they discovered that it causes the
    > polio that it is suppose to protect people from.

    More of the same but different
    j.

    Verification committee okays polio vaccine

    By Tina Anthony Monday, March 01, 2004

    ABUJA—THE all inclusive final verification committee on the
    safety of oral polio vaccine has ruled that the vaccine is
    safe. The committee reached the conclusion after travelling
    to South Africa, Indonesia and India. In its final report,
    the committee said "based on all the evidence before us,
    including interactions held with professionals and
    scientists in various countries it is the considered opinion
    of the committee that the oral polio vaccine when used as
    recommended in the polio eradication programme in Nigeria is
    safe. The committee’s report has been boosted by the Jamaa
    'tu Nasril Islam Verification Committee which has moved to
    convince the Kano State government to accept the
    immunization exercise in the state.

    Chairman of the committee, Sheik Umar El-Kanemi, who
    disclosed this after a meeting with Governor Ibrahim
    Shekarau said the visit was in connection with the polio
    vaccine. Sheik El-Kanemi explained that they were in the
    state to solicit the state government's cooperation on the
    immunization, adding that though some states had accepted to
    allow the immunization exercise, they were still waiting for
    federal government's report. The cleric said Bauchi, Niger,
    Kaduna and Jigawa states had already decided to have their
    children immunized, adding that they would not allow any
    state in the north to be left out since the report from the
    federal government team had shown the vaccine to be safe.
    "We are still waiting for the official report from the
    federal government verification team, which they said will
    be ready by Sunday, and if that is cleared we will make it
    public for the benefit of doubting Thomases."

    Report confirms safety of polio vaccine

    Meanwhile, the report of the verification team states: The
    All Inclusive Final Verification Committee on OPV Safety
    returned to the country on 20th February 2004. The committee
    left Nigeria on 8th February 2004 to undertake the national
    assignment of verifying the safety of the Oral Polio
    Vaccine. During the course of its assignment, the committee
    travelled to Pretoria, South Africa; Jakarta, Indonesia; and
    New Delhi, India.

    The committee was guided by the resolution adopted at its
    first meeting in Abuja on February 7, 2004, which
    outlined the various aspects of its assignment. In
    accordance with the resolutions outlining its assignment,
    the committee undertook the following: Samples of the OPV
    taken for verification were collected by the committee
    from (a) samples earlier tested by the Kano State
    Committee on OPV (b) the National Programme on
    Immunisation Strategic stock of recently delivered OPV
    (c) NAFDAC quarantine. Later it received three batches
    sent by Dr. Haruna Kaita through a member of the
    committee who attested to this effect in writing.

    The methodologies adopted for the verification tests are the
    Gas Chromatography Mass Spectrometry used in tests conducted
    in Pretoria, South Africa and High Performance Thin Layer
    Chromatography and GC/MS for tests conducted in New Delhi,
    India. In Indonesia, no tests were conducted because the
    vaccine manufacturing firm visited had no experience and
    would have needed to summon a team of experts to consider
    the possibility of conducting the tests. However, there was
    an understanding that the committee could send samples for
    testing if the country’s regulatory authorities so approve.

    Protocols were discussed thoroughly in Pretoria, South
    Africa and New Delhi, India, as reflected in the results
    issued. Discussions covered type of equipment to be used,
    equipment sensitivity and detection limits as well as the
    suitability of the equipment for detection of suspected anti-
    fertility hormones and other possible contaminants. Base
    line validation of protocols was achieved in Pretoria, South
    Africa for the GC/MS and in New Delhi, India for the HPTLC.
    The committee is awaiting the GC/MS results from India whose
    validation procedure required more time being the first time
    such a test had been requested.

    The committee went to the three countries suggested and
    agreed upon as well as the proposed laboratories.
    Interpretation of results was done by a combined team of
    stakeholders in the committee and the laboratory scientists
    involved in the tests at every stage. The committee was able
    to conclude the exercise within the time frame set plus two
    days due to flight schedule problems.

    Conducting the tests

    The first test, GC/MS, was conducted at the University of
    Pretoria Chemical Pathology Department with six members of
    the committee remaining with the laboratory scientists to
    observe procedure.

    A total of 12 batches were submitted for testing. Analysis
    for estradiol and progesterone and details of the
    experimental procedure are as contained in the analytic
    report submitted by the laboratory. Results of the tests
    were presented to the entire members of the committee and
    two expert associates— Messrs J.P. de Coning of the Nuclear
    Energy Corporation of South Africa and J.H. Spies of the
    University of Pretoria.

    Similarly, the results of the tests conducted in New Delhi
    on six of the 15 samples first released were discussed with
    the Director of the Shriram Institute for Industrial
    Research, Dr. R.K. Khandal and his colleagues.

    The committee has studied the results released and taken
    into consideration their interpretation discussed by expert
    opinion and members of the committee. It makes the following
    submissions: There was no evidence of previous testing of
    vaccines for steroids in OPV in the past before the
    controversy. Since the controversy, various methodologies
    have been used to analyse OPV within Nigeria and outside
    Nigeria at the instance of Nigerians.

    The various methodologies using different types of equipment
    with different levels of sensitivity and detection limits
    were used in these processes both in Nigeria and abroad.
    Although the World Health Organisation, which sets the
    standards for analytic protocols has not established a
    standard protocol for analysing OPV for steroids, the WHO
    considers the following as the most relevant methodologies
    for such analysis in descending order or preference (a) GCMS
    (b) HPLC (3) Radio Immuno Assay.

    The committee has utilised GCMS, which is considered the
    Gold Standard by WHO and also the HPTLC, which is also one
    of the latest technologies. GCMS was used at the University
    of Pretoria, South Africa and HPTLC at the Shriram Institute
    for Industrial Research, New Delhi, India.

    Analysis of the vaccine samples by this committee using GCMS
    in one centre indicated. The equipment showed that 6 samples
    out of 12 samples had trace levels of estradiol above
    Minimum Quantifiable Level. The equipment showed that 3 s
    amples have trace of estradiol above detection limit but
    below quantifiable level. The equipment showed that 3
    samples had no detectable levels of progesterone. The
    equipment showed that all 12 samples had no detectable
    levels of progesterone. Fifteen batches of vaccine samples
    were tested for estradiol and progesterone using HPTLC at
    the Shriram Institute for Industrial Research.

    The equipment could not detect any estradiol or progesterone
    in any of the 15 samples tested.

    Interpretation of results

    All members of the committee participated in discussing the
    significance of these results with the scientists both in
    South Africa and India. Although tests were not carried out
    in Indonesia, the committee members were able to visit a
    vaccine production company involved in production of OPV
    among others and also held discussions with scientists at
    the factory. In addition there was interaction with the Drug
    Regulatory Agency officials in Indonesia and India. From
    these discussions and interaction it is the view of the
    committee that:

    (k) Trace amounts of estradiol were found in some samples
    analysed by GCMS. The sensitivity of this equipment is
    very high to the level of one part in a hundred
    billion parts.

    (l) No trace of progesterone was detected in any of the
    vaccine samples.

    (m) The trace amounts of estradiol in question is much less
    than what is found in recycled drinking water in several
    developed countries. Also calf blood (serum) is used to
    help the growth of the polio virus during the production
    process for OPV by some production centres. These trace
    levels of estradiol might very well be physiological
    residues from serum.

    Conclusion

    Based on all the evidence before us, including interactions
    held with professionals and scientists in various countries,
    it is the considered opinion of the committee that the Oral
    Polio Vaccine, when used as recommended in the Polio
    Eradication Programme in Nigeria is safe.
     
  3. John

    John Guest

    just follow the trail....

    first you have OPV approval.....

    http://allafrica.com/stories/200402270531.html

    Jigawa Govt Backs Polio Vaccination Daily Trust (Abuja)
    February 27, 2004 Posted to the web February 27, 2004 Amidst
    the controversy over the safety of the polio vaccine in some
    states in the Northern part of the country, the Jigawa State
    government has approved its administration on children.
    Information commissioner, Abba Kukuma, said the approval was
    to allay fears among the people about the safety of the
    vaccine and ensure smooth conduct of the current
    immunisation in the state. He said the measure was
    imperative in enhancing health care delivery in Jigawa.
    Kukuma said the government has not rejected the ongoing
    polio immunisation, noting that efficient campaign
    strategies had been employed to sensitise the grass roots.
    "Already government officials have been drafted to local
    government areas to explain to the people the importance of
    the exercise," he said, pledging that government would
    prevail on the people to embrace the exercise. The
    commissioner harped on the need for advocacy campaign to
    raise people's awareness on the safety of the vaccine.

    then you read OPV inserts:

    http://home.intekom.com/pharm/biovac/polioral.html POLIORAL

    DESCRIPTIVE/ NAME OF MEDICINE: Poliomyelitis Vaccine, Live,
    Oral, Trivalent (Sabin Strains)

    COMPOSITION: Polioral is an aqueous preparation of
    attenuated, live, poliovirus type 1, 2 and 3 grown in
    cultures of monkey kidney tissue. The virus concentrations
    per dose (2 drops) are as follows: 1 000 000 C.C.I.D.50 of
    Type 1 (strain L Sc 2 ab) 100 000 C.C.I.D.50 of Type 2
    (strain P 712, Ch 2 ab) 600 000 C.C.I.D.50 of Type 3 (strain
    Leon 12 a1 b) The vaccine is stabilised with 1 M MgCl2.

    CONTRA-INDICATIONS: Pregnancy. Immunosupression resulting
    from treatment or disease. Should not be given to contacts
    of immunosuppressed patients. Administration of Polioral
    should be delayed in persons suffering acute febrile
    illnesses, debilitating ailment, abdominal pain, diarrhoea
    or other intestinal disorders. Diarrhoea should not be
    considered a contra-indication to OPV, but to ensure full
    protection, doses given to children with diarrhoea should
    not be counted as part of the series and the child should be
    given another dose at the first available opportunity.
    Warning: Do not administer parenterally. The vaccine should
    not be used if turbidity is noted on thawing or standing.

    DOSAGE AND DIRECTIONS FOR USE: Trivalent oral polio vaccine
    is given at birth, 6-. 10-, 14-weeks and 18 months. A
    booster dose is given at 5 years (pre-school age).
    Administration: OPV must be administered orally. Thaw and
    shake well before using. Two drops are delivered directly
    into the mouth from the multi-dose dispenser. Care should be
    taken not to contaminate a multi-dose dropper with saliva of
    the vaccinee. Once a dispenser has been opened, it should be
    used the same day, and then only if it has been maintained
    between 0°C and +8°C. Instruction for use: Turn the wing
    shaped cap in a clock-wise direction to perforate the
    plastic dispenser. Unscrew the cap, hold the dispenser
    vertically downwards and squeeze it to expel the vaccine
    drop by drop.

    SIDE EFFECTS AND SPECIAL PRECAUTIONS: Fever, Malaise and
    headache and allergic reactions may occur. Measures to treat
    anaphylaxis including adrenalin must always be available.

    Vaccine-associated poliomyelitis has been reported in a
    small number of recipients of oral polio vaccine and in
    contacts of recipients. Contacts of recently immunized
    babies and infants should be advised of the need for
    strict personal hygiene, particularly hand washing after
    napkin changing.

    then read a bit more about polio itself...
    http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/p/polio/complic.htm
    Complications of Polio

    About complications: Complications of Polio are secondary
    conditions, symptoms, or other disorders that are caused by
    Polio. In many cases the distinction between symptoms of
    Polio and complications of Polio is unclear or arbitrary.

    Complications list for Polio: The list of complications that
    have been mentioned in various sources for Polio includes:
    Meningitis - the infection that may result in paralysis.
    Paralytic poliomyelitis - the name for polio when it
    progresses to cause paralysis. Respiratory paralysis
    Permanent muscle weakness (see Muscle weakness) Permanent
    paralysis Permanent nerve damage (see Nerve symptoms)
    Permanent spinal cord damage Permanent brain damage (type of
    Brain damage) Postpolio syndrome - usually occurring many
    years later

    and, as if by magic, see what happens....

    http://www.news24.com/News24/Africa/News/0,,2-11-
    1447_1501198,00.html

    Meningitis kills dozens
    20/03/2004 19:13 - (SA) Kano, Nigeria - An epidemic of
    meningitis has killed dozens of people and infected
    hundreds more in northern Nigeria, health officials
    and residents said Saturday. The exact number of
    fatalities in northern Jigawa state was unknown, but
    "up to fifty" people have died and hundreds more were
    receiving medical treatment, state official Habibu
    Kila told reporters. The epidemic was first reported
    on Monday to local health authorities. Kila said the
    outbreak was under control. Ubale Zubairu, a resident
    who fled to Jigawa's capital, Dutse, from one affected
    district, Jahun, said between 50 and 100 people have
    died from the disease. Meningitis - an infection of
    the spinal fluid near the brain caused by either virus
    or bacteria - seasonally affects swathes of West
    Africa, aided by dry, hot weather and the poorly
    ventilated habitats of the region's mainly
    impoverished inhabitants. Edited by Trisha Shannon

    did you notice that the Oral Polio Vaccine can cause
    polio and did you notice that meningitis is a noted
    complication of polio?

    well done....

    21/20
     
  4. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    john <[email protected]> wrote:
    >just follow the trail....
    >
    >first you have OPV approval.....
    >
    >
    >http://allafrica.com/stories/200402270531.html
    >
    >Jigawa Govt Backs Polio Vaccination Daily Trust (Abuja)
    >February 27, 2004 Posted to the web February 27, 2004

    John is very unhappy about this, as he would like to see
    more children get polio whenever possible.

    >SIDE EFFECTS AND SPECIAL PRECAUTIONS: Fever, Malaise and
    >headache and allergic reactions may occur. Measures to
    >treat anaphylaxis including adrenalin must always be
    >available.
    >
    >Vaccine-associated poliomyelitis has been reported in a
    >small number of recipients of oral polio vaccine and in
    >contacts of recipients. Contacts of recently immunized
    >babies and infants should be advised of the need for strict
    >personal hygiene, particularly hand washing after napkin
    >changing.

    Notice: "a small number of recipients."

    >Complications list for Polio: The list of complications
    >that have been mentioned in various sources for Polio
    >includes: Meningitis - the infection that may result in
    >paralysis.

    But you have to get polio for meningitis to be a
    complication.

    >and, as if by magic, see what happens....
    >
    >http://www.news24.com/News24/Africa/News/0,,2-11-
    >1447_1501198,00.html
    >
    >Meningitis kills dozens
    >20/03/2004 19:13 - (SA) Kano, Nigeria - An epidemic of
    > meningitis has killed dozens of people and infected
    > hundreds more in northern Nigeria, health officials
    > and residents said Saturday.

    Of course, if people get polio because they weren't
    vaccinated (and then they get meningitis), John really
    couldn't care less.

    >Meningitis - an infection of the spinal fluid near the
    >brain caused by either virus or bacteria - seasonally
    >affects swathes of West Africa, aided by dry, hot weather
    >and the poorly ventilated habitats of the region's mainly
    >impoverished inhabitants. Edited by Trisha Shannon

    >did you notice that the Oral Polio Vaccine can cause polio
    >and did you notice that meningitis is a noted complication
    >of polio?

    Did you notice that meningitis affects things in this area
    on a periodic basis, and the article says nothing about
    anyone getting polio and then meningitis?

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were
    standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
     
  5. Anth

    Anth Guest

    Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an common
    argument on the polio sites, about polio being misreported
    at meningitus. Anth

    "john" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > just follow the trail....
    >
    > first you have OPV approval.....
    >
    >
    > http://allafrica.com/stories/200402270531.html
    >
    > Jigawa Govt Backs Polio Vaccination Daily Trust (Abuja)
    > February 27, 2004 Posted to the web February 27, 2004
    > Amidst the controversy over the safety of the polio
    > vaccine in some states in the Northern part of the
    > country, the Jigawa State government has approved its
    > administration on children. Information commissioner, Abba
    > Kukuma, said the approval was to allay fears among the
    > people about the safety of the vaccine and ensure smooth
    > conduct of the current immunisation in the state. He said
    > the measure was imperative in enhancing health care
    > delivery in Jigawa. Kukuma said the government has not
    > rejected the ongoing polio immunisation, noting that
    > efficient campaign strategies had been employed to
    > sensitise the grass roots. "Already government officials
    > have been drafted to local government areas to explain to
    > the people the importance of the exercise," he said,
    > pledging that government would prevail on the people to
    > embrace the exercise. The commissioner harped on the need
    > for advocacy campaign to raise people's awareness on the
    > safety of the vaccine.
    >
    > then you read OPV inserts:
    >
    > http://home.intekom.com/pharm/biovac/polioral.html
    > POLIORAL
    >
    > DESCRIPTIVE/ NAME OF MEDICINE: Poliomyelitis Vaccine,
    > Live, Oral, Trivalent (Sabin Strains)
    >
    > COMPOSITION: Polioral is an aqueous preparation of
    > attenuated, live, poliovirus type 1, 2 and 3 grown in
    > cultures of monkey kidney tissue. The virus
    > concentrations per dose (2 drops) are as follows: 1 000
    > 000 C.C.I.D.50 of Type 1 (strain L Sc 2 ab) 100 000
    > C.C.I.D.50 of Type 2 (strain P 712, Ch 2 ab) 600 000
    > C.C.I.D.50 of Type 3 (strain Leon 12 a1 b) The vaccine is
    > stabilised with 1 M MgCl2.
    >
    > CONTRA-INDICATIONS: Pregnancy. Immunosupression resulting
    > from treatment or disease. Should not be given to contacts
    > of immunosuppressed patients. Administration of Polioral
    > should be delayed in persons suffering acute febrile
    > illnesses, debilitating ailment, abdominal pain, diarrhoea
    > or other intestinal disorders. Diarrhoea should not be
    > considered a contra-indication to OPV, but to ensure full
    > protection, doses given to children with diarrhoea should
    > not be counted as part of the series and the child should
    > be given another dose at the first available opportunity.
    > Warning: Do not administer parenterally. The vaccine
    > should not be used if turbidity is noted on thawing or
    > standing.
    >
    > DOSAGE AND DIRECTIONS FOR USE: Trivalent oral polio
    > vaccine is given at birth, 6-. 10-, 14-weeks and 18
    > months. A booster dose is given at 5 years (pre-school
    > age). Administration: OPV must be administered orally.
    > Thaw and shake well before using. Two drops are delivered
    > directly into the mouth from the multi-dose dispenser.
    > Care should be taken not to contaminate a multi-dose
    > dropper with saliva of the vaccinee. Once a dispenser has
    > been opened, it should be used the same day, and then only
    > if it has been maintained between 0°C and +8°C.
    > Instruction for use: Turn the wing shaped cap in a clock-
    > wise direction to perforate the plastic dispenser. Unscrew
    > the cap, hold the dispenser vertically downwards and
    > squeeze it to expel the vaccine drop by drop.
    >
    > SIDE EFFECTS AND SPECIAL PRECAUTIONS: Fever, Malaise and
    > headache and allergic reactions may occur. Measures to
    > treat anaphylaxis including adrenalin must always be
    > available.
    >
    > Vaccine-associated poliomyelitis has been reported in a
    > small number of recipients of oral polio vaccine and in
    > contacts of recipients. Contacts of recently immunized
    > babies and infants should be advised of the need for
    > strict personal hygiene, particularly hand washing after
    > napkin changing.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > then read a bit more about polio itself...
    > http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/p/polio/complic.htm
    > Complications of Polio
    >
    > About complications: Complications of Polio are secondary
    > conditions, symptoms, or other disorders that are caused
    > by Polio. In many cases the distinction between symptoms
    > of Polio and complications of Polio is unclear or
    > arbitrary.
    >
    > Complications list for Polio: The list of complications
    > that have been mentioned in various sources for Polio
    > includes: Meningitis - the infection that may result in
    > paralysis. Paralytic poliomyelitis - the name for polio
    > when it progresses to cause paralysis. Respiratory
    > paralysis Permanent muscle weakness (see Muscle weakness)
    > Permanent paralysis Permanent nerve damage (see Nerve
    > symptoms) Permanent spinal cord damage Permanent brain
    > damage (type of Brain damage) Postpolio syndrome - usually
    > occurring many years later
    >
    >
    > and, as if by magic, see what happens....
    >
    > http://www.news24.com/News24/Africa/News/0,,2-11-
    > 1447_1501198,00.html
    >
    > Meningitis kills dozens
    > 20/03/2004 19:13 - (SA) Kano, Nigeria - An epidemic of
    > meningitis has killed dozens of people and infected
    > hundreds more in northern Nigeria, health officials
    > and residents said Saturday. The exact number of
    > fatalities in northern Jigawa state was unknown, but
    > "up to fifty" people have died and hundreds more
    > were receiving medical treatment, state official
    > Habibu Kila told reporters. The epidemic was first
    > reported on Monday to local health authorities. Kila
    > said the outbreak was under control. Ubale Zubairu,
    > a resident who fled to Jigawa's capital, Dutse, from
    > one affected district, Jahun, said between 50 and
    > 100 people have died from the disease. Meningitis -
    > an infection of the spinal fluid near the brain
    > caused by either virus or bacteria - seasonally
    > affects swathes of West Africa, aided by dry, hot
    > weather and the poorly ventilated habitats of the
    > region's mainly impoverished inhabitants. Edited by
    > Trisha Shannon
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > did you notice that the Oral Polio Vaccine can cause polio
    > and did you notice that meningitis is a noted complication
    > of polio?
    >
    > well done....
    >
    > 20/20
     
  6. "Anth" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an common
    >argument on the polio sites, about polio being misreported
    >at meningitus. Anth

    Where are the iron lungs? Where are the leg calipers?

    Where are the morals and consciences of the people telling
    such lies?

    The last question is rhetorical, as the anti-vaccination
    liars have no consciences and possess no morals.

    --
    Peter Bowditch
    The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
    The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
    and The New Improved Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
     
  7. Anth

    Anth Guest

    So Mr Bowditch, why are these people not getting the Salk
    vaccine, when it was testified by Salk that the OPV was
    actually responsible for polio outbreaks? Anth

    "Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > "Anth" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an common
    > >argument on the
    polio
    > >sites, about polio being misreported at meningitus. Anth
    >
    > Where are the iron lungs? Where are the leg calipers?
    >
    > Where are the morals and consciences of the people telling
    > such lies?
    >
    > The last question is rhetorical, as the anti-vaccination
    > liars have no consciences and possess no morals.
    >
    > --
    > Peter Bowditch The Millenium Project
    > http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles The Green Light
    > http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight and The New Improved
    > Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and
    C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    > To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
     
  8. Anth

    Anth Guest

    ..and also why did the cases of polio in the UK drop by a
    huge amount before the introduction of the vaccine? If you
    can answer that I will believe you. Anth

    "Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
     
  9. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Anth <[email protected]> wrote:
    >Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an common
    >argument on the polio sites, about polio being misreported
    >at meningitus.

    It's nothing of the sort, and John's interpretation of the
    story makes absolutely no sense (except to John).

    If it makes sense to you, I give up.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were
    standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

    >"john" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> just follow the trail....
    >>
    >> first you have OPV approval.....
    >>
    >>
    >> http://allafrica.com/stories/200402270531.html
    >>
    >> Jigawa Govt Backs Polio Vaccination Daily Trust (Abuja)
    >> February 27, 2004 Posted to the web February 27, 2004
    >> Amidst the controversy over the safety of the polio
    >> vaccine in some states in the Northern part of the
    >> country, the Jigawa State government has approved its
    >> administration on children. Information commissioner,
    >> Abba Kukuma, said the approval was to allay fears among
    >> the people about the safety of the vaccine and ensure
    >> smooth conduct of the current immunisation in the state.
    >> He said the measure was imperative in enhancing health
    >> care delivery in Jigawa. Kukuma said the government has
    >> not rejected the ongoing polio immunisation, noting that
    >> efficient campaign strategies had been employed to
    >> sensitise the grass roots. "Already government officials
    >> have been drafted to local government areas to explain to
    >> the people the importance of the exercise," he said,
    >> pledging that government would prevail on the people to
    >> embrace the exercise. The commissioner harped on the need
    >> for advocacy campaign to raise people's awareness on the
    >> safety of the vaccine.
    >>
    >> then you read OPV inserts:
    >>
    >> http://home.intekom.com/pharm/biovac/polioral.html
    >> POLIORAL
    >>
    >> DESCRIPTIVE/ NAME OF MEDICINE: Poliomyelitis Vaccine,
    >> Live, Oral, Trivalent (Sabin Strains)
    >>
    >> COMPOSITION: Polioral is an aqueous preparation of
    >> attenuated, live, poliovirus type 1, 2 and 3 grown in
    >> cultures of monkey kidney tissue. The virus
    >> concentrations per dose (2 drops) are as follows: 1 000
    >> 000 C.C.I.D.50 of Type 1 (strain L Sc 2 ab) 100 000
    >> C.C.I.D.50 of Type 2 (strain P 712, Ch 2 ab) 600 000
    >> C.C.I.D.50 of Type 3 (strain Leon 12 a1 b) The vaccine is
    >> stabilised with 1 M MgCl2.
    >>
    >> CONTRA-INDICATIONS: Pregnancy. Immunosupression resulting
    >> from treatment or disease. Should not be given to
    >> contacts of immunosuppressed patients. Administration of
    >> Polioral should be delayed in persons suffering acute
    >> febrile illnesses, debilitating ailment, abdominal pain,
    >> diarrhoea or other intestinal disorders. Diarrhoea should
    >> not be considered a contra-indication to OPV, but to
    >> ensure full protection, doses given to children with
    >> diarrhoea should not be counted as part of the series and
    >> the child should be given another dose at the first
    >> available opportunity. Warning: Do not administer
    >> parenterally. The vaccine should not be used if turbidity
    >> is noted on thawing or standing.
    >>
    >> DOSAGE AND DIRECTIONS FOR USE: Trivalent oral polio
    >> vaccine is given at birth, 6-. 10-, 14-weeks and 18
    >> months. A booster dose is given at 5 years (pre-school
    >> age). Administration: OPV must be administered orally.
    >> Thaw and shake well before using. Two drops are delivered
    >> directly into the mouth from the multi-dose dispenser.
    >> Care should be taken not to contaminate a multi-dose
    >> dropper with saliva of the vaccinee. Once a dispenser has
    >> been opened, it should be used the same day, and then
    >> only if it has been maintained between 0°C and +8°C.
    >> Instruction for use: Turn the wing shaped cap in a clock-
    >> wise direction to perforate the plastic dispenser.
    >> Unscrew the cap, hold the dispenser vertically downwards
    >> and squeeze it to expel the vaccine drop by drop.
    >>
    >> SIDE EFFECTS AND SPECIAL PRECAUTIONS: Fever, Malaise and
    >> headache and allergic reactions may occur. Measures to
    >> treat anaphylaxis including adrenalin must always be
    >> available.
    >>
    >> Vaccine-associated poliomyelitis has been reported in a
    >> small number of recipients of oral polio vaccine and in
    >> contacts of recipients. Contacts of recently immunized
    >> babies and infants should be advised of the need for
    >> strict personal hygiene, particularly hand washing after
    >> napkin changing.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> then read a bit more about polio itself...
    >> http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/p/polio/complic.htm
    >> Complications of Polio
    >>
    >> About complications: Complications of Polio are secondary
    >> conditions, symptoms, or other disorders that are caused
    >> by Polio. In many cases the distinction between symptoms
    >> of Polio and complications of Polio is unclear or
    >> arbitrary.
    >>
    >> Complications list for Polio: The list of complications
    >> that have been mentioned in various sources for Polio
    >> includes: Meningitis - the infection that may result in
    >> paralysis. Paralytic poliomyelitis - the name for polio
    >> when it progresses to cause paralysis. Respiratory
    >> paralysis Permanent muscle weakness (see Muscle weakness)
    >> Permanent paralysis Permanent nerve damage (see Nerve
    >> symptoms) Permanent spinal cord damage Permanent brain
    >> damage (type of Brain damage) Postpolio syndrome -
    >> usually occurring many years later
    >>
    >>
    >> and, as if by magic, see what happens....
    >>
    >> http://www.news24.com/News24/Africa/News/0,,2-11-
    >> 1447_1501198,00.html
    >>
    >> Meningitis kills dozens
    >> 20/03/2004 19:13 - (SA) Kano, Nigeria - An epidemic of
    >> meningitis has killed dozens of people and infected
    >> hundreds more in northern Nigeria, health officials
    >> and residents said Saturday. The exact number of
    >> fatalities in northern Jigawa state was unknown,
    >> but "up to fifty" people have died and hundreds
    >> more were receiving medical treatment, state
    >> official Habibu Kila told reporters. The epidemic
    >> was first reported on Monday to local health
    >> authorities. Kila said the outbreak was under
    >> control. Ubale Zubairu, a resident who fled to
    >> Jigawa's capital, Dutse, from one affected
    >> district, Jahun, said between 50 and 100 people
    >> have died from the disease. Meningitis - an
    >> infection of the spinal fluid near the brain caused
    >> by either virus or bacteria - seasonally affects
    >> swathes of West Africa, aided by dry, hot weather
    >> and the poorly ventilated habitats of the region's
    >> mainly impoverished inhabitants. Edited by Trisha
    >> Shannon
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> did you notice that the Oral Polio Vaccine can cause
    >> polio and did you notice that meningitis is a noted
    >> complication of polio?
    >>
    >> well done....
    >>
    >> 20/20
     
  10. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Anth <[email protected]> wrote:
    >So Mr Bowditch, why are these people not getting the Salk
    >vaccine, when it was testified by Salk that the OPV was
    >actually responsible for polio outbreaks?

    It wasn't responsible for polio outbreaks, it was
    responsible for the handful of cases that have occurred in
    the US over the last 20 years.

    "Outbreak" is totally wrong. Anth, you are a disappointment.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were
    standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)


    >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> "Anth" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >> >Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an common
    >> >argument on the
    >polio
    >> >sites, about polio being misreported at meningitus. Anth
    >>
    >> Where are the iron lungs? Where are the leg calipers?
    >>
    >> Where are the morals and consciences of the people
    >> telling such lies?
    >>
    >> The last question is rhetorical, as the anti-vaccination
    >> liars have no consciences and possess no morals.
    >>
    >> --
    >> Peter Bowditch The Millenium Project
    >> http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles The Green Light
    >> http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight and The New Improved
    >> Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and
    >C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    >> To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
     
  11. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Anth <[email protected]> wrote:
    >..and also why did the cases of polio in the UK drop by a
    >huge amount before the introduction of the vaccine? If you
    >can answer that I will believe you.

    I can answer it. They did NOT drop a "huge amount" before
    the introduction of the vaccine. They didn't drop at all.
    I think we've been over this before. You've obviously
    learned nothing.

    And yes, I've been over the raw data.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were
    standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

    >Anth
    >
    >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
     
  12. Anth

    Anth Guest

    They did drop I graphed it. Anth

    "David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article
    > <[email protected]>, Anth
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >..and also why did the cases of polio in the UK drop by a
    > >huge amount
    before
    > >the introduction of the vaccine? If you can answer that I
    > >will believe you.
    >
    > I can answer it. They did NOT drop a "huge amount" before
    > the introduction of the vaccine. They didn't drop at all.
    > I think we've been over this before. You've obviously
    > learned nothing.
    >
    > And yes, I've been over the raw data.
    >
    > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    > opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    > have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    > were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > >Anth
    > >
    > >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in
    > >message
    > >news:[email protected]...
    > >
    >
     
  13. Anth

    Anth Guest

    You are pissing at words David, why did Salk testify that
    the OPV vaccine was causing cases polio? Why are these
    people not getting the Salk vaccine? Anth

    "David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article
    > <[email protected]>, Anth
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >So Mr Bowditch, why are these people not getting the Salk
    > >vaccine, when
    it
    > >was testified by Salk that the OPV was actually
    > >responsible for polio outbreaks?
    >
    > It wasn't responsible for polio outbreaks, it was
    > responsible for the handful of cases that have occurred in
    > the US over the last 20 years.
    >
    > "Outbreak" is totally wrong. Anth, you are a
    > disappointment.
    >
    > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    > opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    > have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    > were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in
    > >message
    > >news:[email protected]...
    > >> "Anth" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an common
    > >> >argument on the
    > >polio
    > >> >sites, about polio being misreported at meningitus.
    > >> >Anth
    > >>
    > >> Where are the iron lungs? Where are the leg calipers?
    > >>
    > >> Where are the morals and consciences of the people
    > >> telling such lies?
    > >>
    > >> The last question is rhetorical, as the anti-
    > >> vaccination liars have no consciences and possess no
    > >> morals.
    > >>
    > >> --
    > >> Peter Bowditch The Millenium Project
    > >> http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles The Green Light
    > >> http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight and The New Improved
    > >> Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and
    > >C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    > >> To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
    > >
    >
     
  14. Anth

    Anth Guest

    What gets me about you is that have your side and everyone
    else is wrong. I can post the graph if you wish and again
    you will maintain that the rates didn't drop despite the
    graph showing that they did. The Salk vaccine was introduced
    in the UK in 1956, and the OPV in 1962,after that the curve
    continues downward trends to baseline. I'm reporting what I
    see and I stick to that. Anth

    > "David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > In article
    > > <[email protected]>, Anth
    > > <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > >..and also why did the cases of polio in the UK drop by
    > > >a huge amount
    > before
    > > >the introduction of the vaccine? If you can answer that
    > > >I will believe you.
    > >
    > > I can answer it. They did NOT drop a "huge amount"
    > > before the introduction of the vaccine. They didn't drop
    > > at all. I think we've been over this before. You've
    > > obviously learned nothing.
    > >
    > > And yes, I've been over the raw data.
    > >
    > > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are
    > > my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    > > "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because
    > > giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson,
    > > MIT)
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > >Anth
    > > >
    > > >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in
    > > >message
    > > >news:[email protected]...
    > > >
    > > >
    > >
    >
     
  15. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Anth <[email protected]> wrote:
    >They did drop I graphed it.

    Yes, Anth, some years they dropped. And some years they went
    up. And they didn't start to really crash and stay there
    until vaccination came in. I graphed it too.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were
    standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

    >"David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> In article
    >> <[email protected]>, Anth
    >> <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> >..and also why did the cases of polio in the UK drop by
    >> >a huge amount
    >before
    >> >the introduction of the vaccine? If you can answer that
    >> >I will believe you.
    >>
    >> I can answer it. They did NOT drop a "huge amount" before
    >> the introduction of the vaccine. They didn't drop at all.
    >> I think we've been over this before. You've obviously
    >> learned nothing.
    >>
    >> And yes, I've been over the raw data.
    >>
    >> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These
    >> are my opinions only, but they're almost always
    >> correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is
    >> because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal
    >> Abelson, MIT)
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> >Anth
    >> >
    >> >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in
    >> >message
    >> >news:[email protected]...
    >> >
    >> >
    >>
    >
     
  16. David Wright

    David Wright Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Anth <[email protected]> wrote:
    >You are pissing at words David, why did Salk testify that
    >the OPV vaccine was causing cases polio?

    Because it was true. But you made it sound like some major
    epidemic, which it wasn't. It wasn't even a minor epidemic.

    >Why are these people not getting the Salk vaccine?

    Because the Sabin vaccine is much better for giving
    secondary immunity, and it's much easier to administer.
    People are afraid of needles.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were
    standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)


    >"David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> In article
    >> <[email protected]>, Anth
    >> <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> >So Mr Bowditch, why are these people not getting the
    >> >Salk vaccine, when
    >it
    >> >was testified by Salk that the OPV was actually
    >> >responsible for polio outbreaks?
    >>
    >> It wasn't responsible for polio outbreaks, it was
    >> responsible for the handful of cases that have occurred
    >> in the US over the last 20 years.
    >>
    >> "Outbreak" is totally wrong. Anth, you are a
    >> disappointment.
    >>
    >> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These
    >> are my opinions only, but they're almost always
    >> correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is
    >> because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal
    >> Abelson, MIT)
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in
    >> >message
    >> >news:[email protected]...
    >> >> "Anth" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> >>
    >> >> >Thanks John, although not conclusive this is an
    >> >> >common argument on the
    >> >polio
    >> >> >sites, about polio being misreported at meningitus.
    >> >> >Anth
    >> >>
    >> >> Where are the iron lungs? Where are the leg calipers?
    >> >>
    >> >> Where are the morals and consciences of the people
    >> >> telling such lies?
    >> >>
    >> >> The last question is rhetorical, as the anti-
    >> >> vaccination liars have no consciences and possess no
    >> >> morals.
    >> >>
    >> >> --
    >> >> Peter Bowditch The Millenium Project
    >> >> http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles The Green Light
    >> >> http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight and The New Improved
    >> >> Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and
    >> >C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    >> >> To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
    >> >
    >> >
    >>
    >
     
  17. Anth

    Anth Guest

    What irritates me is that the OPV although causes immunity
    in the 'herd' wasn't introduced into the UK until 1962, by
    which time the p polio cases were 212 (Which was long after
    the Salk vaccine was introduced in 1956) So IPV (Salk)
    carries no risk of VAPP, whereas the OPV does, and this is
    what is being reported in the foreign countries- all for a
    cheaper vaccine. Anth
     
  18. Anth

    Anth Guest

    "David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article
    > <[email protected]>, Anth
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >You are pissing at words David, why did Salk testify that
    > >the OPV vaccine was causing cases polio?
    >
    > Because it was true. But you made it sound like some major
    > epidemic, which it wasn't. It wasn't even a minor
    > epidemic.
    >
    > >Why are these people not getting the Salk vaccine?
    >
    > Because the Sabin vaccine is much better for giving
    > secondary immunity, and it's much easier to administer.
    > People are afraid of needles.

    There's talk of secondary immunity, there were 212 cases of
    pp in the UK when OPV was introduced. The assumptions are
    that major epidemic was already over before the vaccination
    started, or that the vaccines halted the epidemic. Both are
    assumptions which I am not going to agree with. Anth

    (no because Sabin is cheaper and they can keep on
    administering it forever)

    > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    > opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    > have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    > were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
     
  19. Anth

    Anth Guest

    Yep which is just my point it based on an assumption which
    you are guilty of glorifying. Point being you don't know
    what the hell would have happened if the vaccine wasn't put
    in place, and since the curves were on a clear downward
    trend, something which you cannot refute. Anth

    "David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In article
    > <[email protected]>, Anth
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >They did drop I graphed it.
    >
    > Yes, Anth, some years they dropped. And some years they
    > went up. And they didn't start to really crash and stay
    > there until vaccination came in. I graphed it too.
    >
    > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
    > opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I
    > have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    > were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > >"David Wright" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > >news:[email protected]...
    > >> In article
    > >> <[email protected]>, Anth
    > >> <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >> >..and also why did the cases of polio in the UK drop
    > >> >by a huge amount
    > >before
    > >> >the introduction of the vaccine? If you can answer
    > >> >that I will believe you.
    > >>
    > >> I can answer it. They did NOT drop a "huge amount"
    > >> before the introduction of the vaccine. They didn't
    > >> drop at all. I think we've been over this before.
    > >> You've obviously learned nothing.
    > >>
    > >> And yes, I've been over the raw data.
    > >>
    > >> -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are
    > >> my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    > >> "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because
    > >> giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson,
    > >> MIT)
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >> >Anth
    > >> >
    > >> >"Peter Bowditch" <[email protected]> wrote in
    > >> >message
    > >> >news:[email protected]...
    > >> >
    > >> >
    > >>
    > >>
    > >
    >
     
  20. Anth

    Anth Guest

    My thoughts :-

    A lot that had been written about the polio vaccine isn't
    accurate, you can't say that the Salk vaccine was totally
    ineffective, nor can you say that is totally effective
    (which is what you lot seem to like to spin from the fact
    that there's very little cases of wild polio recorded, or
    there's no iron lungs which is what Bowditch parrots) It has
    been shown that the vaccine was effective to a degree in
    diminishing the incidence of the disease via clinical
    studies how effective you can't quantify, so imo its success
    is overrated.

    Ask yourself a question "Do you agree with vaccination?"
    Then ask yourself "Do you agree with introducing a live
    virus into the population that is known to paralyse people?"
    or "Do you agree with an antibody vaccine, which is not
    known to paralyse people"

    Now ask yourself

    "When can I stop vaccinating people with a live virus?"
    (With polio I doubt you ever will) "Do I need to keep
    vaccinating people, to immunise against this live virus that
    I introduced into the population a while back"

    All this rubbish could have been halted with the use of
    Salk. There's money to be made in vaccinating people with
    live vaccines so they can make money out of vaccinating more
    people with more vaccines.. and on and on...

    It's circular, so I don't agree with the polio live vaccines
    because it kills people, they are cheap alternatives to
    vaccines which don't kill people.

    So now David ask yourself how effective is the vaccine at
    halting the epidemic? 100%, 100% of what? You don't know, so
    the argument is futile.

    As for my votes, I vote no live polio vaccines, and
    given the choice of my children, they would get the
    antibody vaccine and booster shots if they decided later
    in life. Anth
     
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