Continentals

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none
of which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and
suffering side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Well, availability is an issue at least here in Minnesota. Avocet
slicks are available in zero bike shops around here AFAIK- the only
place that stocked (Osell's) them went out of business when the owner
retired. The invert-tread car tire for bikes that Avocet makes is
often available in ones or twos, but that tire is like riding uphill
all day long.

Continentals are available everywhere. IME the Ultra 2000 700 x 28
works very well and lasts as long as an Avocet of the same size. They
seem to mount just fine on an MA2. And I can get 'em easily, although
they *are* $30 which seems excessive. The usual alternatives are
Michelin's multicolored "silly-ca" rubber tires.

Until Avocet becomes much more dealer-friendly, their market share
will continue to be restricted. Not just their tires, but their
computers as well. I haven't seen an Avocet computer for sale in a
bike shop in years. I'm a little amazed that the Avocet brass hasn't
figured this out for themselves.

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none
of which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and
suffering side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Well, availability is an issue at least here in Minnesota. Avocet
slicks are available in zero bike shops around here AFAIK- the only
place that stocked (Osell's) them went out of business when the owner
retired. The invert-tread car tire for bikes that Avocet makes is
often available in ones or twos, but that tire is like riding uphill
all day long.

Continentals are available everywhere. IME the Ultra 2000 700 x 28
works very well and lasts as long as an Avocet of the same size. They
seem to mount just fine on an MA2. And I can get 'em easily, although
they *are* $30 which seems excessive. The usual alternatives are
Michelin's multicolored "silly-ca" rubber tires.

Until Avocet becomes much more dealer-friendly, their market share
will continue to be restricted. Not just their tires, but their
computers as well. I haven't seen an Avocet computer for sale in a
bike shop in years. I'm a little amazed that the Avocet brass hasn't
figured this out for themselves.

In article <[email hidden]>, dvt <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none of
which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and suffering
side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Despite the frequent rumblings on this newsgroup, I can't find many
low-cost, decent quality tyres at my LBS. Once upon a time I bought
Avocets from Sheldon since my LBS was unwilling to do business with
Avocet. Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the higher prices at Avocet,
I haven't found a suitable replacement. Any suggestions?

I rode the Avocet Duro (28-622) for general purpose and commuting, and I
used the Avocet Criterium (23-622) on my race bike. Note that my
dimensions are smaller than the advertised dimensions since Avocet
seemed to exaggerate the tyre size back in the old days.

Why buy expensive Avocets when you can get basically the same tire sold
as the IRC Triathlon, available at Bike Nashbar and others for about
$13? I put 2000 miles on an IRC Triathlon 700x25 duro on the rear, which
is incredible mileage for me, and there is still rubber left.

--
Mike DeMicco <[email hidden]>
(Remove the REMOVE_THIS from my email address to reply.)

Mike DeMicco said:

In article <[email hidden]>, dvt <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none of
which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and suffering
side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Despite the frequent rumblings on this newsgroup, I can't find many
low-cost, decent quality tyres at my LBS. Once upon a time I bought
Avocets from Sheldon since my LBS was unwilling to do business with
Avocet. Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the higher prices at Avocet,
I haven't found a suitable replacement. Any suggestions?

I rode the Avocet Duro (28-622) for general purpose and commuting, and I
used the Avocet Criterium (23-622) on my race bike. Note that my
dimensions are smaller than the advertised dimensions since Avocet
seemed to exaggerate the tyre size back in the old days.

Why buy expensive Avocets when you can get basically the same tire sold
as the IRC Triathlon, available at Bike Nashbar and others for about
$13? I put 2000 miles on an IRC Triathlon 700x25 duro on the rear, which
is incredible mileage for me, and there is still rubber left.

Doesn't tire mileage depend mostly on the type of braking you do? If
you do most of your rides in the country you can anticipate and coast
to a stop. In the city where there is a lot of traffic you are lucky
if you don't flat spot your tires the first week.

dvt said:

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none of
which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and suffering
side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Despite the frequent rumblings on this newsgroup, I can't find many
low-cost, decent quality tyres at my LBS. Once upon a time I bought
Avocets from Sheldon since my LBS was unwilling to do business with
Avocet. Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the higher prices at Avocet,
I haven't found a suitable replacement. Any suggestions?

Avocet don't supply directly to anyone in the UK and I ai'nt
a dealer mate... At least that is wot they informed me
when wot I contacted them in proper England and all that!
Any UK dealers out thar willing to bite the bullet or at
least get some IRC's in?

Gwan, gwan, gwan!

dvt said:

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none of
which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and suffering
side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Despite the frequent rumblings on this newsgroup, I can't find many
low-cost, decent quality tyres at my LBS. Once upon a time I bought
Avocets from Sheldon since my LBS was unwilling to do business with
Avocet. Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the higher prices at Avocet,
I haven't found a suitable replacement. Any suggestions?

Look again. The price hikes seem to have been rolled back at the few
shops/internet sites that carry them.

Quoted message said:

I rode the Avocet Duro (28-622) for general purpose and commuting, and I
used the Avocet Criterium (23-622) on my race bike. Note that my
dimensions are smaller than the advertised dimensions since Avocet
seemed to exaggerate the tyre size back in the old days.

That has been rectified, and the tire width is close to the nominal size.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | And what if you track down these men and kill them, what if you
_`\(,_ | killed all of us? From every corner of Europe, hundreds,
(_)/ (_) | thousands would rise up to take our places. Even Nazis can't
kill that fast. -- Paul Henreid (Casablanca).

dsr said:

Doesn't tire mileage depend mostly on the type of braking you do?

No. Front tires rarely wear significantly on road bikes, and it is the
front wheel that does the vast majority of the stopping.

If

Quoted message said:

you do most of your rides in the country you can anticipate and coast to
a stop. In the city where there is a lot of traffic you are lucky if
you don't flat spot your tires the first week.

Well, that's not what I'd consider as an indication of wear, but of damage.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | ...nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or
_`\(,_ | property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person
(_)/ (_) | within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. --
Fourteenth Amendment to the U. S. Constitution.

Quoted message said:

Mike DeMicco said:

In article <[email hidden]>, dvt
<[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
> How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it.
> What's the appeal? There are other well known brands on the
> market, none of which are regularly mentioned as being hard to
> mount and suffering side wall ruptures. Most of these tires
> also cost less.

Despite the frequent rumblings on this newsgroup, I can't find
many low-cost, decent quality tyres at my LBS. Once upon a time I
bought Avocets from Sheldon since my LBS was unwilling to do
business with Avocet. Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the
higher prices at Avocet, I haven't found a suitable
replacement. Any suggestions?

Carbon-12 is marketspeak for the same rubber they've been using, at
least according to prior discussions. Since most bike stuff is about
fashion and hype, and not about actual performance, I suppose Avocet
felt they had to come up with something to put on the side of the
tires that sounded impressive. I would have preferred something like
"Avocet Carbon SORT" (for "Same Old Rubber Technology"😉. Or "JRTDT"
for "Just Ride The Dang Things."

<snip>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Why buy expensive Avocets when you can get basically the same tire
sold as the IRC Triathlon, available at Bike Nashbar and others for
about $13? I put 2000 miles on an IRC Triathlon 700x25 duro on the
rear, which is incredible mileage for me, and there is still rubber
left.

IIRC the Avocet tire uses a specific compound that IRC does not use in
the manufacture of other tires besides the Avocets. I don't know if
that's still true. Also, the Avocets have no siping or other
decorative faux tread features- AFAIK only some Michelin tires and the
Specialized FatBoy are "slicks" like the Avocets.

Quoted message said:

Doesn't tire mileage depend mostly on the type of braking you do?
If you do most of your rides in the country you can anticipate and
coast to a stop. In the city where there is a lot of traffic you
are lucky if you don't flat spot your tires the first week.

Riders who do long climbs find the rear tire wears out much quicker
than riders in flatter areas.

Tim McNamara said:

Carbon-12 is marketspeak for the same rubber they've been using, at
least according to prior discussions.

tim, you are so polite.

personally, i think it's about high time they started using Carbon-60 (aka
buckminsterfullerene) or perhaps Carbon-14 which has a half-life of 5,730
years.
--
david reuteler
[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

dvt said:

Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the higher prices at Avocet,
I haven't found a suitable replacement. Any suggestions?

David L. Johnson said:

Look again. The price hikes seem to have been rolled back at the few
shops/internet sites that carry them.

I just looked via google and qbike.com. the lowest price I found was $40
per tire with a free tube included. That was at:
http://www.worldclasscycles.com/clincher-tires2.htm

The price for the new Avocets doesn't seem to be dropping. Maybe I'm
looking in the wrong places.

I'd be interested in the old-style Avocets, but when I tried to place an
order with Harris Cyclery last year, it was apparently lost in the mail.
I couldn't seem to get through to anyone via email so I ended up getting
some tires at the LBS. I paid too much, got no improvement over the old
standard tires, and they're now worn out.

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

Wort said:

Quoted message said:

I think Continental are getting a bit unreliable in this respect. The last
GP300 I had - 23mm, kevlar bead - I could not fit even with tyre levers.
I've never had any difficulty with any tyre fitting before.

The Conti fit may well depend on the wheel rim that you are mounting
it on.

Indeed, but I've mounted earlier GP3000s on the same rim - an MA3. They're
tight, but not unfeasible. This one, conversely, is as I say the only tyre
I've ever been unable to fit.
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> Distortion Field!

Matt O'Toole said:

This seems to be a common complaint. Sidewall cuts and fabric coming apart
seems to be a problem with Contis too. So why do people keep buying them?

I haven't had those problems, and they're the only quasi-slick tyres my
LBS carries.

Yes, yes, forward planning, I know...
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> Distortion Field!

Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

How does Continental have such a following? I don't get it. What's
the appeal? There are other well known brands on the market, none
of which are regularly mentioned as being hard to mount and
suffering side wall ruptures. Most of these tires also cost less.

Well, availability is an issue at least here in Minnesota. Avocet
slicks are available in zero bike shops around here AFAIK- the only
place that stocked (Osell's) them went out of business when the owner
retired. The invert-tread car tire for bikes that Avocet makes is
often available in ones or twos, but that tire is like riding uphill
all day long.

Continentals are available everywhere. IME the Ultra 2000 700 x 28
works very well and lasts as long as an Avocet of the same size. They
seem to mount just fine on an MA2. And I can get 'em easily, although
they *are* $30 which seems excessive. The usual alternatives are
Michelin's multicolored "silly-ca" rubber tires.

Until Avocet becomes much more dealer-friendly, their market share
will continue to be restricted. Not just their tires, but their
computers as well. I haven't seen an Avocet computer for sale in a
bike shop in years. I'm a little amazed that the Avocet brass hasn't
figured this out for themselves.

Price counts too. I just ordered from Peter White. I got folding
Ultra 2k's for $28/tire. The Avocets were $35/tire. Ultimately that
was the little bit of tilt Conti needed for the sale.

I just wore out a pair of Conti Grand Sport tires, which are no longer
made. They seemed to have an excellent lifetime, and had infrequent
flats. They were also 240g for a true 25c tire -- which is about
right for training tires.

I have not yet used the U2k's, but you say they last well, which I
suppose I had anticipated, since the black tread Grand Prix's have a
relatively decent lifetime if one doesn't cut the sidewall. I presume
they didn't entirely reinvent the wheel, or tire in this case.

I really like the Avocet Carbon 12's -- they are excellent in pretty
much every way (some "pure" race tires are lighter). That is what is
on my racing wheels. For training or just tooling around, I am a
little more price sensitive. If the sidewalls cut I'll probably
conclude the $7/tire difference was not "worth it." But I have to
try...

As for Avocet's distribution and marketing, I think the company is
utterly clueless. Too bad, because the tires themselves are
outstanding.

g white wrote in part:

<< I got folding
Ultra 2k's for $28/tire >>

Let us know when the sidewalls spontaneously unravel.

Robert

dvt said:

Quoted message said:

dvt said:

Since the advent of "Carbon-12" and the higher prices at Avocet,
I haven't found a suitable replacement. Any suggestions?

David L. Johnson said:

Look again. The price hikes seem to have been rolled back at the few
shops/internet sites that carry them.

I just looked via google and qbike.com. the lowest price I found was $40
per tire with a free tube included. That was at:
http://www.worldclasscycles.com/clincher-tires2.htm

The price for the new Avocets doesn't seem to be dropping. Maybe I'm
looking in the wrong places.

You had mentioned Harris Cyclery later. But they have several Avocet
sizes at $24.95. (no, not kevlar bead, nor belt). If you are talking
$40, it seems you are looking at kevlar bead, which I doubt you get with a
$25 Conti, either. In fact, Sheldon has Conti 2000s for sale at $35, no
kevlar. Ah, kevlar for the same price.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | Do not worry about your difficulties in mathematics, I can assure
_`\(,_ | you that mine are all greater. -- A. Einstein
(_)/ (_) |

Daniel Wilcox <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
<snip>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm not familiar with that size.

20" 1 1/8

Not quite correct.
20 x 1 1/8" is roughly ISO size 451-28.
20 x 1.125" is 406-28. Continental Grand Prix only comes in the
latter size. Schwalbe Stelvio comes in both.

Jeff (getting picky again, I know)

[email hidden] (R15757) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

g white wrote in part:

<< I got folding
Ultra 2k's for $28/tire >>

Let us know when the sidewalls spontaneously unravel.

Is this a new feature? I've never had a "sidewall unravel," whatever
that is. That includes Contis and any other tire.

g. white wrote:

<< > Let us know when the sidewalls spontaneously unravel.

Is this a new feature? I've never had a "sidewall unravel," whatever
that is. That includes Contis and any other tire. >>

My kingdom for a digital camera.

David L. Johnson said:

dvt said:

The price for the new Avocets doesn't seem to be dropping. Maybe I'm
looking in the wrong places.

Quoted message said:

You had mentioned Harris Cyclery later. But they have several Avocet
sizes at $24.95.

Yeah, but I'm still waiting for the order I placed at about this time
last year. My credit card wasn't billed, so I'm not complaining too much.

Quoted message said:

If you are talking
$40, it seems you are looking at kevlar bead, which I doubt you get with a
$25 Conti, either.

I was talking about the *new* Avocets (with or without Kevlar) for $40.
The *old* Avocet FasGrip tires are still available via Harris at $25,
but see the previous paragraph on that topic.

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

Jeff Wills said:

Not quite correct.
20 x 1 1/8" is roughly ISO size 451-28.
20 x 1.125" is 406-28. Continental Grand Prix only comes in the
latter size. Schwalbe Stelvio comes in both.

Jeff (getting picky again, I know)

Ok, but Continental describe their 406-28 as 20" 1 1/8 and Schwalbe
describe both 451-28 and 406-28 as 20" 1 1/8. Whats going on?

http://www.schwalbe.com/index.pl?bereich=produkte&einsatzbereich=2&produktgruppe=3&produkt=122
http://www.conti-online.com/generator/www/de/en/continental/bicycle/themes/tires/race/grand_prix/grand_prix_en.html