converting record threadless headset to threaded

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by Brad Keeter, May 5, 2003.

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  1. Brad Keeter

    Brad Keeter Guest

    Is it possible? It is a current model Campagnolo Record 1 inch threadless headset that I would like
    to convert. Thanks
     
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  2. brad-<< Is it possible? It is a current model Campagnolo Record 1 inch threadless headset that I
    would like to convert.

    Yep, everything below the top race and seal is the same for both. Need HS-RE-012(threaded top cap)
    and HS-RE-109(locknut) to convert, we may have these or can get them. Not cheap tho-may be cheaper
    to buy a HS complete.

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  3. Dan Baker

    Dan Baker Guest

    "Brad Keeter" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > Is it possible? It is a current model Campagnolo Record 1 inch threadless headset that I would
    > like to convert. Thanks
    -------
    certainly possible, but why? I would think you want to stick with the lighter and easier
    threadless setup???

    d
     
  4. Brad Keeter

    Brad Keeter Guest

    I prefer the look and ergonomics of an adjustable quill stem on a lugged, steel frameset.

    "dan baker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > "Brad Keeter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > > Is it possible? It is a current model Campagnolo Record 1 inch
    threadless
    > > headset that I would like to convert. Thanks
    > -------
    > certainly possible, but why? I would think you want to stick with the lighter and easier
    > threadless setup???
    >
    > d
     
  5. botfood-<< certainly possible, but why? I would think you want to stick with the lighter and easier
    threadless setup???

    here we go again. Lighter?Not really if you take all into account including the extra steerer of the
    fork. Easier? I wish people would stop mucking with their HS...with a 4 or 5mm allen, they goon with
    it, and we see a lot of killed HS because of it.

    Remember why forks went to threadless, and it wasn't cuz they were 'lighter' or 'easier'...Also
    remember that carbon and aluminum steerers didn't exist when threadless started...

    Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
     
  6. Bluto

    Bluto Guest

    [email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote:

    > Remember why forks went to threadless, and it wasn't cuz they were 'lighter' or 'easier'...

    No, it's because whatever size you needed was 'out of stock', especially if you rode a tall or
    short frame.

    Doesn't hurt that threadless is stiffer, stronger, simpler, and easier to work on, though.

    > Also remember that carbon and aluminum steerers didn't exist when threadless started...

    Though that's not because nobody wanted them then!

    Chalo Colina

    better is better
     
  7. Bluto

    Bluto Guest

    [email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote:

    > << Doesn't hurt that threadless is stiffer, stronger, simpler, and easier to work on, though
    >
    > Stiffer/stronger? balderdash..please cite the study that concluded this, please omit the ones from
    > fork makers...

    I don't need a study to know that a 25.4 or 28.6mm steer tube is stiffer than a 22.2mm stem
    quill, do you?

    And forgive me if I observe that any tube is stronger *without* threads cut into it! You do remember
    back in the day, that forks used to break off? (At the threads, of course.) Sometimes it was due to
    too-high stem adjustment, but sometimes it was just because there were 3" of threads in there (a
    side effect of a system that required a different length of fork threading for every size frame).

    I don't miss the bad old days, and I don't think that the piddly inch of adjustability present in
    most stem quills was worth the many shortcomings of that system.

    Chalo Colina
     
  8. In article <[email protected]>, Bluto <[email protected]hotmail.com> wrote:
    >[email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote:
    >
    >> << Doesn't hurt that threadless is stiffer, stronger, simpler, and easier to work on, though
    >>
    >> Stiffer/stronger? balderdash..please cite the study that concluded this, please omit the ones
    >> from fork makers...
    >
    >I don't need a study to know that a 25.4 or 28.6mm steer tube is stiffer than a 22.2mm stem
    >quill, do you?
    >
    >And forgive me if I observe that any tube is stronger *without* threads cut into it! You do
    >remember back in the day, that forks used to break off?

    Or even more common, someone would burst the steerer at the keyway, which is cut even deeper than
    the threads. A dangerous problem if the person who overtightened it doesn't understand what happened
    and decides to go for a ride.

    I'm OK using quill stems (where appropriate) but threadless seems good to me as well.

    The designs I hate most are the proprietary ones which will become unservicable as soon as the
    manufacturer decides that it's obsolete and stops offering repair parts (eg, some of the integrated
    headsets). Or when the mfr goes out of business (eg, what would have happened to Headshok repairs if
    Cannondale went under).
     
  9. Brad Keeter

    Brad Keeter Guest

    Hell, I just happened to purchase a used Serotta CSI with the fabulous threaded F1 fork and needed a
    headset to go with it. I happen to have an unused Record threadless fork and just wanted to know if
    I could buy the parts to convert it. Maybe I should buy a new threadless fork instead. But then I
    would need a new 90 degree stem to elevate my bars enough to ride comfortable OR I could get a new
    Serotta frame with the new standard 1.5 cm headtube extension to make up for the lost stack height
    that the superior threadless design provides. But then I have added material to the frame and to the
    fork steerer, am I still saving weight. Come to think of it I like my bars higher in the winter
    (when I am watching TV riding on the trainer) and lower when I am in better condition. Does the
    threadless design allow for height adjustment more efficiently than the threaded version. Come to
    think of it I will just stay threaded. -Brad "Brad Keeter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Is it possible? It is a current model Campagnolo Record 1 inch threadless headset that I would
    > like to convert. Thanks
     
  10. Amit

    Amit Guest

    [email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > botfood-<< certainly possible, but why? I would think you want to stick with the lighter and
    > easier threadless setup???
    >
    > here we go again. Lighter?Not really if you take all into account including the extra steerer of
    > the fork. Easier? I wish people would stop mucking with their HS...with a 4 or 5mm allen, they
    > goon with it, and we see a lot of killed HS because of it.
    >

    You kill me! you're saying threadless HS are inferior because they're easier to work on and that
    encourages schmoes to mes with them and destroy them ?

    I guess the drivetrains should be sealed and the hoods of cars too so that only properly trained
    mechanics can work on them.

    How about all the damaged nuts on threaded headsets because schmoes don't have the right wrench or
    chronic loosening disease (which can sometimes be hard to rectify), which I'm sure is more common on
    threaded setups.

    -Amit
     
  11. Pete Biggs <pLime{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Donald Munro wrote:
    > > Pete Biggs wrote:
    > >> BTW, according to the specs, the new Shimanos have much less float than Look 396's 9 degree
    > >> setting. But I'd guess you might like that.
    > >
    > > With the PP396 you can set the amount of float to 0, 3, 6 or 9 degrees which is why I like them
    > > as I can set my problem right leg to 0 degrees and my left to 3 or 6.
    >
    > I posted the above as a warning in case the OP hadn't thought about the Shimanos having less
    > maximum float.
    >
    > ~PB
    >
    >

    Yes Pete I was aware of the reduced float, but I have my 396's set at 3 so that shouldn't cause a
    problem. What does concern me though is the lateral movement of the Shimano's, that has got to be a
    weird feeling? What's the advantage I wonder?

    Thanks for pointing that out though.

    --
    Mark
    ____________________________
    Practice does not make perfect... Perfect practice makes perfect

    ---
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  12. [email protected] (John Red-Horse) wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] wrote:
    >>
    >>Doesn't matter, threadless stuff is here to stay...but it wasn't started in the early 90s for
    >>performance.
    >>
    >
    > That may well be, but there are some clear advantages to threadless, as Jobst and others have
    > pointed out. Personally, I don't mind not having to carry around two 32mm HS wrenches like I used
    > to have to do.
    >
    You carried around two 32mm wrenches, on your rides, get real. Most people adjust their HS and don't
    have to touch it again for years, they are very reliable you know. By the way where did you keep
    them when you were riding?
     
  13. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] wrote:
    >
    >You carried around two 32mm wrenches, on your rides, get real.

    Yup. Two relatively short ones.

    > Most people adjust their HS and don't have to touch it again for years, they are very reliable
    > you know.

    Those "most people" must've been roadies---just as you're sounding like one. (I will admit that my
    Bontrager mtn bike, with a 1" threaded HS, doesn't suffer this problem nearly as much.)

    On my first mountain bike, which came with a 1-1/8" threaded HS, it was pretty common for it to
    loosen on a ride. I did end up putting a Gorilla HS Lock on it after a year or so of grief just to
    overcome the problem. The fact that those things even existed should serve as a clue for you that
    the problem with loosening headsets was not imaginary.

    Of course, not long after that threadless came along...

    > By the way where did you keep them when you were riding?

    In my Camelbak.

    john
     
  14. Mark Hickey

    Mark Hickey Guest

    [email protected] (Qui si parla Campagnolo) wrote:

    >John-<< Personally, I don't mind not having to carry around two 32mm HS wrenches like I used to
    >have to do.
    >
    >Why on earth did you do this? I have been riding threaded steerers for 17 years and never saw the
    >need to have a pair of HS wrenches with me...

    I'm with Peter on this one. Once a headset is adjusted properly, it should stay adjusted. I
    certainly never worry about taking a headset wrench along on any long ride (MTB or road).

    Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
     
  15. In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] wrote:
    >
    >I'm with Peter on this one. Once a headset is adjusted properly, it should stay adjusted. I
    >certainly never worry about taking a headset wrench along on any long ride (MTB or road).
    >

    I don't know guys, I'm just telling you something that was a fact for me. Apparently I'm not the
    only one, or there would've been no need for devices like the Gorilla HS lock nut. There were so
    there were.

    It wasn't every ride---or even somthing that occurred with any real regularity, but it occurred
    often enough that I just took the wrenches along. Being somewhere off-road, and having to stop to
    finger tighten a headset every little while is a bummer.

    I've already stated that I haven't had this kind of problem with my smaller headsets, but that
    1-1/8" threaded version simply would not hold itself.

    cheers, john
     
  16. Matt O'Toole

    Matt O'Toole Guest

    "John Red-Horse" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] wrote:
    > >
    > >I'm with Peter on this one. Once a headset is adjusted
    properly, it
    > >should stay adjusted. I certainly never worry about
    taking a headset
    > >wrench along on any long ride (MTB or road).
    > >
    >
    > I don't know guys, I'm just telling you something that was
    a fact for me.
    > Apparently I'm not the only one, or there would've been no
    need for
    > devices like the Gorilla HS lock nut. There were so there
    were.
    >
    > It wasn't every ride---or even somthing that occurred with
    any real
    > regularity, but it occurred often enough that I just took
    the wrenches
    > along. Being somewhere off-road, and having to stop to
    finger tighten a
    > headset every little while is a bummer.
    >
    > I've already stated that I haven't had this kind of
    problem with my
    > smaller headsets, but that 1-1/8" threaded version simply
    would not hold
    > itself.

    A lot of headsets don't hold because they're crap -- they're not made to tight enough specs, the
    threads are not cut properly, etc. Not to mention threads being mangled by clumsy mechanics. It's
    likely the forks being used with them are even worse, especially if the threads were cut by a bike
    shop. That's the real reason behind things like Gorilla headset nuts. People who used good headsets,
    like Shimano or Chris King, with factory threaded forks, never needed them.

    Matt O.
     
  17. Bluto

    Bluto Guest

    "Matt O'Toole" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > A lot of headsets don't hold because they're crap -- they're not made to tight enough specs, the
    > threads are not cut properly, etc. Not to mention threads being mangled by clumsy mechanics. It's
    > likely the forks being used with them are even worse, especially if the threads were cut by a bike
    > shop. That's the real reason behind things like Gorilla headset nuts. People who used good
    > headsets, like Shimano or Chris King, with factory threaded forks, never needed them.

    It's worth pointing out that the Chris King GripNut collet headset is itself an indictment of the
    shortcomings of the conventional threaded race + locknut mechanism.

    That said, my old 1" Tange Levin headsets rarely needed any attention once adjusted properly. I just
    went through so dang many *forks* that it seemed like I was constantly fiddling with them!

    Chalo Colina
     
  18. Bluto

    Bluto Guest

    Mike Latondresse <[email protected]> wrote:

    > [email protected] (John Red-Horse) wrote:
    >
    > > Personally, I don't mind not having to carry around two 32mm HS wrenches like I used to have
    > > to do.
    > >
    > You carried around two 32mm wrenches, on your rides, get real.

    I used to tote along a pair of the little pocket-sized headset wrenches that came included with some
    of my shop's new bikes. They helped me out a few times but were even more useful for applying a
    little therapy to others' less-frequently-maintained bikes. Add the fact that had a 15mm box end on
    the handle and that they stood in nicely for tire levers, and I never regretted the little space
    they took in my tool bag.

    Chalo Colina
     
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