Crash compensation - Any advice?

Discussion in 'UK and Europe' started by Daz, Dec 22, 2004.

  1. Daz

    Daz Guest

    Hi all,

    just thought I'd de-lurk to ask some advice.

    About a month ago I was involved in a crash whilst cycling to work.
    Basically, I was going round a roundabout, and a pickup truck entering
    the roundabout didn't see me and drove into the side of me, knocking
    me off my bike. Luckily I wasn't seriously injured (few bruises etc.)
    but the bike was written off (back wheel mangled, rear mech smashed
    and frame bent). I have claimed on the driver's insurance for
    compensation to replace the bike. The two quotes I acquired for the
    damage both came to about £700 and I sent these to the insurance co.

    I have today received a letter from the insurance company saying that
    whilst they do not think their client was fully at fault, they will
    offer me £500.

    Obviously, their client was fully at fault, so I'm a little puzzled
    how they think he's not. Is this just a tactic by them to get me to
    accept a lower offer? Should I accept the offer or hold out for the
    full amount? And if I hold out for the full amount would it be better
    to hire a solicitor to deal with them? I was hoping I could get it
    sorted without a solicitor and I do need it resolving pretty quickly
    so I'm unsure as to what to do.

    Any advice will be gratefully received,

    Darren.
     
    Tags:


  2. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    Daz wrote:

    > Obviously, their client was fully at fault, so I'm a little puzzled
    > how they think he's not. Is this just a tactic by them to get me to
    > accept a lower offer?


    IME of insurance companies, almost certainly. If there's any shred of
    possible doubt their client isn't at fault they'll go with that as a
    first try, and they'll also sit on things as long as they can and
    attempt to frustrate you into submission.

    > Should I accept the offer or hold out for the
    > full amount? And if I hold out for the full amount would it be better
    > to hire a solicitor to deal with them?


    If you've got a witness and/or their client has accepted liability then
    definitely go for the full amount, otherwise worth a ponder. Note that
    if you do employ a solicitor to deal with it and they do meet your claim
    they should meet your expenses too, so you shouldn't be out of pocket.

    > Any advice will be gratefully received,


    Might be worth asking the advice of a solicitor. Should be the case
    that in the first instance at least this needn't cost you anything, and
    if it isn't an ambulance chaser then you ought to get reasonably
    impartial advice concerning the whys and wherefores.

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  3. Tony Raven

    Tony Raven Guest

    Daz wrote:

    >
    > I have today received a letter from the insurance company saying that
    > whilst they do not think their client was fully at fault, they will
    > offer me £500.
    >


    Standard insurance company ploy. Just accept they are going to do
    anything they can to minimise their payout. If you want what's due, be
    prepared to slog it out. Are you a CTC member? If so they have a legal
    advice line for members. If not join.


    > Obviously, their client was fully at fault, so I'm a little puzzled
    > how they think he's not. Is this just a tactic by them to get me to
    > accept a lower offer? Should I accept the offer or hold out for the
    > full amount? And if I hold out for the full amount would it be better
    > to hire a solicitor to deal with them? I was hoping I could get it
    > sorted without a solicitor and I do need it resolving pretty quickly
    > so I'm unsure as to what to do.
    >


    Do you have any independent corroboration of his fault - witnesses,
    police report..... They will make life a lot easier for you. Given
    they have started with £500 I would suspect they know the position -
    they usually start with £0.

    Are you sure of your quotes - they are sometimes a bit inflated shall we
    say.

    Otherwise best bet is to start (or threaten to start a Small Claims
    Court action for recovery of your costs) against the driver. The beauty
    of this is it is designed as DIY without lawyers and except in
    exceptional circumstances you each carry your own costs other than the
    Court fees. The cost equation for them is do they concede the £200 or
    spend ten times that amount with their lawyers fighting.

    The last time I did that I had the satisfaction of not only recovering
    my full claim (they conceded a week before the case after months of
    every trick in the book delaying and threatening tactics) but it cost
    them at least ten times the amount in legal fees.

    You can file a claim on-line at
    https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/csmco2/index.jsp but I would try one round
    of letters first.
     
  4. Daz wrote:

    > About a month ago I was involved in a crash whilst cycling to work.
    > Basically, I was going round a roundabout, and a pickup truck entering
    > the roundabout didn't see me and drove into the side of me, knocking
    > me off my bike.


    > I have today received a letter from the insurance company saying that
    > whilst they do not think their client was fully at fault, they will
    > offer me £500.


    Standard tactics. A Fiesta once totally failed to take a corner and
    skidded across the road in front of me, clipping the front corner of the
    van I was driving and ending up in a ditch. Their insurance and
    solicitors then attempted to put some of the blame on me, despite me
    being virtually stationary on my own side of the road at the point of
    impact.

    > Obviously, their client was fully at fault, so I'm a little puzzled
    > how they think he's not. Is this just a tactic by them to get me to
    > accept a lower offer? Should I accept the offer or hold out for the
    > full amount? And if I hold out for the full amount would it be better
    > to hire a solicitor to deal with them? I was hoping I could get it
    > sorted without a solicitor and I do need it resolving pretty quickly
    > so I'm unsure as to what to do.


    I take it you are not a CTC member? They offer free legal aid for cases
    like this if you are a member.

    Maybe you should ask the insurance company to explain their reasoning.
    My guess is it will be something along the lines of your road
    positioning, clothing or lighting status, or having the suicidal
    audacity to ride a *pushbike* on the public roads!

    --
    Mark.
    http://tranchant.plus.com/
     
  5. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    Daz wrote:
    > Hi all,
    >
    > just thought I'd de-lurk to ask some advice.


    Welcome aboard Daz.

    > About a month ago I was involved in a crash whilst cycling to work.
    > Basically, I was going round a roundabout, and a pickup truck entering
    > the roundabout didn't see me and drove into the side of me, knocking
    > me off my bike. Luckily I wasn't seriously injured (few bruises etc.)
    > but the bike was written off (back wheel mangled, rear mech smashed
    > and frame bent). I have claimed on the driver's insurance for
    > compensation to replace the bike. The two quotes I acquired for the
    > damage both came to about £700 and I sent these to the insurance co.


    Despite regarding your injuries as "not serious", you are entitled to
    claim /something/ for your injuries as well (pain & suffering + loss of
    amenity). I know a cyclist who got £900 for bruising (albeit severe
    bruising). Evidence from doctor and photographs would help.

    > I have today received a letter from the insurance company saying that
    > whilst they do not think their client was fully at fault, they will
    > offer me £500.
    >
    > Obviously, their client was fully at fault, so I'm a little puzzled
    > how they think he's not. Is this just a tactic by them to get me to
    > accept a lower offer?


    Yes.

    > Should I accept the offer or hold out for the
    > full amount?


    You might be able to push them to £600 for the bike (in addition to any
    compensation for personal injury). It's old fashion negotiation: meet
    half way, etc.

    > And if I hold out for the full amount would it be better
    > to hire a solicitor to deal with them?


    Probably, as they can quote relevant case law, etc.

    > I was hoping I could get it
    > sorted without a solicitor and I do need it resolving pretty quickly
    > so I'm unsure as to what to do.


    Depends if you absolutely need some money now. Further negotiation might
    take a few extra weeks.

    ~PB
     
  6. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    I wrote:
    > Despite regarding your injuries as "not serious", you are entitled to
    > claim /something/ for your injuries as well (pain & suffering + loss
    > of amenity). I know a cyclist who got £900 for bruising (albeit
    > severe bruising). Evidence from doctor and photographs would help.


    ps. With the case I'm referring to, the amount received from the
    insurance company for both personal injury and bike damage was the full
    amount claimed after being offered a lower amount first. There were no
    witnesses, by the way. Letters from a barrister friend helped though, I
    suppose.

    ~PB
     
  7. David Martin

    David Martin Guest

    On 22/12/04 12:18 pm, in article [email protected], "Pete
    Biggs" <pwrinkledgrape{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:

    > I wrote:
    >> Despite regarding your injuries as "not serious", you are entitled to
    >> claim /something/ for your injuries as well (pain & suffering + loss
    >> of amenity). I know a cyclist who got £900 for bruising (albeit
    >> severe bruising). Evidence from doctor and photographs would help.

    >
    > ps. With the case I'm referring to, the amount received from the
    > insurance company for both personal injury and bike damage was the full
    > amount claimed after being offered a lower amount first. There were no
    > witnesses, by the way. Letters from a barrister friend helped though, I
    > suppose.


    Is it not the case that the claim is not against the insurance company but
    against the individual, who then claims on his insurance.

    A solicitor will be able to advise appropriately, but I would have thought
    that addressing letters of claim to the perpetrator (who will then pass them
    on to the company) would be the way to go. He will get fed up with the
    prevarication, and will really not like being taken to the small claims
    court (you have no calim against the insuracne company, but against the
    perpetrator).

    Ignore everything I say and get professional advice. And join the CTC to get
    good legal advice in the future.

    ...d
     
  8. Tony Raven

    Tony Raven Guest

    Mark Tranchant wrote:
    >
    > Maybe you should ask the insurance company to explain their reasoning.
    > My guess is it will be something along the lines of your road
    > positioning, clothing or lighting status, or having the suicidal
    > audacity to ride a *pushbike* on the public roads!
    >


    Its worth doing for the laughter value alone. We creased ourselves at
    the description of how I had jumped of my bike and thrown myself into a
    bush as their client was driving past.

    Tony
     
  9. Pete Biggs

    Pete Biggs Guest

    David Martin wrote:
    > On 22/12/04 12:18 pm, in article [email protected], "Pete
    > Biggs" <pwrinkledgrape{remove_fruit}@biggs.tc> wrote:
    >
    >> I wrote:
    >>> Despite regarding your injuries as "not serious", you are entitled
    >>> to claim /something/ for your injuries as well (pain & suffering +
    >>> loss
    >>> of amenity). I know a cyclist who got £900 for bruising (albeit
    >>> severe bruising). Evidence from doctor and photographs would help.

    >>
    >> ps. With the case I'm referring to, the amount received from the
    >> insurance company for both personal injury and bike damage was the
    >> full amount claimed after being offered a lower amount first. There
    >> were no witnesses, by the way. Letters from a barrister friend
    >> helped though, I suppose.

    >
    > Is it not the case that the claim is not against the insurance
    > company but against the individual, who then claims on his insurance.


    In the above case, negotiations were made between the victim and the
    insurance company, direct. There were no further dealings or
    communication with the driver at all after legal advice was taken.

    > A solicitor will be able to advise appropriately, but I would have
    > thought that addressing letters of claim to the perpetrator (who will
    > then pass them on to the company) would be the way to go.


    That may be much slower and less effective.

    - - - -
    Daz, you should also claim for all expenses: fares, letters, everything.

    ~PB
     
  10. James Annan

    James Annan Guest

    Daz wrote:

    > I have today received a letter from the insurance company saying that
    > whilst they do not think their client was fully at fault, they will
    > offer me £500.


    > Any advice will be gratefully received,



    Add 2 grand on for your pain and suffering.

    James
    --
    If I have seen further than others, it is
    by treading on the toes of giants.
    http://www.ne.jp/asahi/julesandjames/home/
     
  11. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    Tony Raven wrote:

    > Its worth doing for the laughter value alone. We creased ourselves at
    > the description of how I had jumped of my bike and thrown myself into a
    > bush as their client was driving past.


    My solicitor read me one of the opposition gambits in one of these cases
    a few years ago. Apparently I was doing between 40 and 50 miles an hour
    at the time, no mean feat for me on an old tourer, even if it was on a
    hill...

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  12. "Daz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Hi all,


    > About a month ago I was involved in a crash whilst cycling to work.
    > Basically, I was going round a roundabout, and a pickup truck entering
    > the roundabout didn't see me and drove into the side of me, knocking
    > me off my bike. Luckily I wasn't seriously injured (few bruises etc.)
    > but the bike was written off (back wheel mangled, rear mech smashed
    > and frame bent). I have claimed on the driver's insurance for
    > compensation to replace the bike. The two quotes I acquired for the
    > damage both came to about £700 and I sent these to the insurance co.


    <snip>

    You don't have any insurance or are required to have any and you think you
    can just go and claim against a motorist who is already paying through the
    nose for the "privilege" of driving on the roads. Some people want it all
    for nothing.

    > Any advice will be gratefully received,


    Stop riding through red lights, you will be killed. Learning how to "give
    way" might help.
     
  13. Lance Armstrong wrote:
    > "Daz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >
    >>Hi all,

    >
    >
    >>About a month ago I was involved in a crash whilst cycling to work.
    >>Basically, I was going round a roundabout, and a pickup truck entering
    >>the roundabout didn't see me and drove into the side of me, knocking
    >>me off my bike. Luckily I wasn't seriously injured (few bruises etc.)
    >>but the bike was written off (back wheel mangled, rear mech smashed
    >>and frame bent). I have claimed on the driver's insurance for
    >>compensation to replace the bike. The two quotes I acquired for the
    >>damage both came to about £700 and I sent these to the insurance co.

    >
    >
    > <snip>
    >
    > You don't have any insurance or are required to have any and you think you
    > can just go and claim against a motorist who is already paying through the
    > nose for the "privilege" of driving on the roads. Some people want it all
    > for nothing.


    It is a privilege to drive on the highway; a licence that can be
    withdrawn. Fortunately we all have a *right* to use public roads; on
    foot, by bike or by horse.

    Daz is obviously a bit more clued up than you. If someone's actions
    cause him damage he is perfectly within his rights to claim for this;
    whether the event took place on the public highway or elsewhere.

    >
    >>Any advice will be gratefully received,

    >
    >
    > Stop riding through red lights, you will be killed. Learning how to "give
    > way" might help.


    If you're going to come out from under the bridge, please take the time
    to read the post and make your attempt relevant. It was a roundabout.
     
  14. Tony Raven

    Tony Raven Guest

    Lance Armstrong wrote:
    >
    > <snip>
    >
    > You don't have any insurance or are required to have any and you think you
    > can just go and claim against a motorist who is already paying through the
    > nose for the "privilege" of driving on the roads. Some people want it all
    > for nothing.
    >


    ...and I'd always been prepared to believe Lance wasn't on drugs.

    Tony ;-)
     
  15. Paul - xxx

    Paul - xxx Guest

    Lance Armstrong composed the following ...

    > You don't have any insurance or are required to have any and you think you
    > can just go and claim against a motorist who is already paying through the
    > nose for the "privilege" of driving on the roads. Some people want it all
    > for nothing.


    Heheheh. Troll methinks. Albeit a troll of little wit who thinks that 'cos
    he has a car is just that little bit superior to other road suers. Makes me
    feel almost ashamed to also call myself a motorist and lover of all things
    motorised.

    > Stop riding through red lights, you will be killed. Learning how to "give
    > way" might help.


    Jealousy and bigotry all in one post, as well as a good dose of moving
    goalposts or simply being ignorant of what the OP actually posted.

    Nice one, 'Lance', almost a fell swoop.

    Almost ..

    --
    Paul ...
    http://www.4x4prejudice.org/index.php
    (8(!) Homer Rules ... ;)
    "A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."
     
  16. Al C-F

    Al C-F Guest

    On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 12:25:53 +0000, David Martin
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >(you have no calim against the insuracne company, but against the
    >perpetrator)


    I think that this is the sole exception - that you can claim against
    the insurers where a mandatory policy is in place (legal requirement
    to have third-party cover, in this case).
     
  17. Ian Smith

    Ian Smith Guest

    On 22 Dec 2004 05:04:21 -0800, dkahn400 <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Daz wrote:
    > > Hi all,

    >
    > > I have today received a letter from the insurance company saying
    > > that whilst they do not think their client was fully at fault,
    > > they will offer me £500.
    > >
    > > Obviously, their client was fully at fault, so I'm a little
    > > puzzled how they think he's not. Is this just a tactic by them
    > > to get me to accept a lower offer?


    > originally asked for. Tell them that if they do not immediately settle
    > for this amount you will seek legal advice and will be adding the cost
    > of this to your claim as well as other costs arising from the accident
    > that you had previously been prepared to overlook.


    I second this, with teh addition of some threats about your 'pain and
    suffering'. Make sure you highlight that you'll be claiming teh
    costs of alternate travel arrangements while teh claim is being
    resolved, and also of preparing letters to them (check what your bank
    would charge you to write to you, and use that figure).

    When I did this (similar circumstances) they paid up.

    regards, Ian SMith
    --
    |\ /| no .sig
    |o o|
    |/ \|
     
  18. Mike Causer

    Mike Causer Guest

    On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 16:22:06 +0000, Paul - xxx wrote:
    heh. Troll methinks. Albeit a troll of little wit who thinks that
    > 'cos he has a car is just that little bit superior to other road suers.


    He actually has a Vespa 200 scooter and a Yamaha XJ600 motorbike.

    Makes me feel ashamed to call myself a motorcyclist, etc.


    Mike
     
  19. Lee Garnett

    Lee Garnett Guest

    It's okay for Lance they stop all the traffic when he's on the road.

    ----------
    LeeG
    -----------
    "Lance Armstrong" <[email protected]_I.ko> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    "Daz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Hi all,


    > About a month ago I was involved in a crash whilst cycling to work.
    > Basically, I was going round a roundabout, and a pickup truck entering
    > the roundabout didn't see me and drove into the side of me, knocking
    > me off my bike. Luckily I wasn't seriously injured (few bruises etc.)
    > but the bike was written off (back wheel mangled, rear mech smashed
    > and frame bent). I have claimed on the driver's insurance for
    > compensation to replace the bike. The two quotes I acquired for the
    > damage both came to about £700 and I sent these to the insurance co.


    <snip>

    You don't have any insurance or are required to have any and you think you
    can just go and claim against a motorist who is already paying through the
    nose for the "privilege" of driving on the roads. Some people want it all
    for nothing.

    > Any advice will be gratefully received,


    Stop riding through red lights, you will be killed. Learning how to "give
    way" might help.
     
  20. Al C-F wrote:
    > On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 12:25:53 +0000, David Martin
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>(you have no calim against the insuracne company, but against the
    >>perpetrator)

    >
    >
    > I think that this is the sole exception - that you can claim against
    > the insurers where a mandatory policy is in place (legal requirement
    > to have third-party cover, in this case).


    No. The claim is against the individual who may/may not have an
    insurance policy to cover legal costs and/or damages.

    The proceedings paper I've just signed names me as claiment and the
    driver of the Clio as defendent.
     
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