CTL. How low should one go during tapering??

[BlueJersey]

My current CTL is 63. I am tapering right now until the 13th. Got a up hill TT on this Sat. Will be short (25 minutes??) and the effort would not tire me out. Roughly 10 days before the targeted event. It seems that once my CTL reaches to 50 I feel like I have lost some fitness. I seem to feel better at 50 to 55. I guess I should try to maintain my CTL above 50? If so, what kind of workout I should be doing??? I have already nailed total of 6 sessions of vo2max workout over the past 2 weeks. In order to prevent my CTL from dipping too low and yet not tiring myself, should I do threshold work twice in the week? After the up hill TT on Sat, on Monday an hour of threshold work? And another one on Friday? If I ride too easy and too little from Sat to the 13th, my CTL would reach to 45 with a TSB of 30+. Or I can just commute to work for couple of days. A single commuting day I can rack up 100TSS though.

 

[rmur17]

My current CTL is 63. I am tapering right now until the 13th. Got a up hill TT on this Sat. Will be short (25 minutes??) and the effort would not tire me out. Roughly 10 days before the targeted event. It seems that once my CTL reaches to 50 I feel like I have lost some fitness. I seem to feel better at 50 to 55. I guess I should try to maintain my CTL above 50? If so, what kind of workout I should be doing??? I have already nailed total of 6 sessions of vo2max workout over the past 2 weeks. In order to prevent my CTL from dipping too low and yet not tiring myself, should I do threshold work twice in the week? After the up hill TT on Sat, on Monday an hour of threshold work? And another one on Friday? If I ride too easy and too little from Sat to the 13th, my CTL would reach to 45 with a TSB of 30+. Or I can just commute to work for couple of days. A single commuting day I can rack up 100TSS though.

What does your historical data tell you about CTL and where you perform well and where you don't?

What events are coming up after this one? How much CTL are you willing to sacrifice in order to perform well on this day?

No answers but those are the questions I'd first ask.

 

[rr9876]

My current CTL is 63. I am tapering right now until the 13th. Got a up hill TT on this Sat. Will be short (25 minutes??) and the effort would not tire me out. Roughly 10 days before the targeted event. It seems that once my CTL reaches to 50 I feel like I have lost some fitness. I seem to feel better at 50 to 55. I guess I should try to maintain my CTL above 50? If so, what kind of workout I should be doing??? I have already nailed total of 6 sessions of vo2max workout over the past 2 weeks. In order to prevent my CTL from dipping too low and yet not tiring myself, should I do threshold work twice in the week? After the up hill TT on Sat, on Monday an hour of threshold work? And another one on Friday? If I ride too easy and too little from Sat to the 13th, my CTL would reach to 45 with a TSB of 30+. Or I can just commute to work for couple of days. A single commuting day I can rack up 100TSS though.

What type of event are you tapering for? Unless it's a short track event, I think you are probably best off not tapering very much with a CTL of 65. Maybe try to do enough work to keep CTL flat and then back off 2-3 days before to let TSB go positive. In retrospect I used to make this mistake a lot--I would taper for 1-2 weeks with a CTL of ~70, and then come time for the big race I felt like **** because I had lost too much fitness. IMO it's not until your CTL nears the 100 mark that you can afford to do a real taper. Obviously different people will vary but this is what I have noticed myself, and I've read/heard about others having similar experiences.

 

[Spunout]

I think the whole idea is to get to your race with a low CTL but high fitness: Know how to taper.

Reduce hours, no junk miles. High intensity with full recovery.

 

[rmur17]

I think the whole idea is to get to your race with a low CTL but high fitness: Know how to taper.

Reduce hours, no junk miles. High intensity with full recovery.

To be honest the bolded comment above sounds completely wrong.

Low CTL is not indicative of high fitness but exactly the opposite.

 

[BlueJersey]

Thanks. Looks like I should maintain my CTL in the 60s. So, I will do another week on 3 day block training, 2x20. Including the up hill TT. On Wed and Friday (free time in the morning), maybe some unstructured workouts. I think that should keep my CTL in th 60s or high 50s. My current CTL could have been higher (65+) if it wasn't for the expected events (massive, prolong rain and me getting lost driving to one of the 3 hour trip races).

Is a 60 miles road race with open road, windy, and a lot of rollers. Big, small, and steep ones. After that, there is nothing really long and challenging until 6/17, the Housatonic race in CT. In between I have couple of ITT and some sort local training races. After the race I would just continue to train onto my next training cycle.

Another question. This Sat I have registered for 2 events but would only decide to do one of them. One is the Jiminy Peak road race in MASS, 60 miles (3 laps) with one killer climb each lap. Would be more than 3 hours and 30 minutes drive. The second one is the NJ High Point Hill Climb. 22 minutes effort for 5.5 miles. 2 hours+ drive. I am thinking about skipping the Jiminy Peak race and in favor for more workout on higher intensity effort such as doing the Hill Climb TT. Day before and after that I would throw in some 2x20 minutes effort.

 

[grebletie]

As others have said, with a CTL in the 60s, I wouldn't sacrifice too much fitness for form. For comparison, I have a CTL in the low 90s, and even then I didn't let CTL drop too much for my target events last weekend.

 

[daveryanwyoming]

....I am thinking about skipping the Jiminy Peak race and in favor for more workout on higher intensity effort such as doing the Hill Climb TT.....
Day before and after that I would throw in some 2x20 minutes effort.....

Why would you pay the entry fee for a TT and then handicap yourself by sandwiching it between two days of L4 training? If you want a three day L4 block you don't need to drive 2.5 hours and pay an entry fee to get it. I'd personally opt for the 60 mile road race as you're still a week away from your target event of the same distance which is going to require a TSS of 250 or so on a CTL of 60 or less. I'd get the miles, intensity and pack riding of the longer RR.

I agree with the other posters who say you really don't need a formal taper from a CTL of 60, especially for a three plus hour event (I don't know your category or how fast they'll race but expect 250 to 300 TSS for the day by the time you include warmup and cooldown after a 60 mile race). I'd treat this one as a mini taper and stay with your normal weekly routine but back off duration about 20%. I'd also rearrange the week as necessary to make sure you have a complete day off two days before your event and a loosen up ride with some one and five minute hard efforts the day before your target event. But I'd limit that loosen up day to an hour or so.

IOW if your normal training week is 8 hours or so (guessing based on CTL = 60) then I'd back off to 5 to 6 hours. Early in the week is same intensity as usual but fewer or shorter efforts. Late in the week gets some additional rest and day before the event is shorter and easier than usual with a few efforts to wake the body up.

Good luck,
Dave

 

[Spunout]

To be honest the bolded comment above sounds completely wrong.

Low CTL is not indicative of high fitness but exactly the opposite.

...is the OPs goal to race at his peak fitness or to maintain some sort of statistic which might be indicative of potential performance?

 

[acoggan]

...is the OPs goal to race at his peak fitness or to maintain some sort of statistic which might be indicative of potential performance?

Do you think that reducing your training load somehow increases your fitness?

 

[BlueJersey]

Well, I really hate the driving part and the 3 hours 30 minutes trip time. That's why I want to do the up hill TT instead. I just want to do some sort of race with little trip time and won't tire me out as much. I just dread about the driving, that's all.

Since I have been blocking training in a 3 days cycle for couple of months, I don't think I would perform any worst if I block train this week with a up hill TT included. I am expecting I would set a PR on my 20 minutes power doing the up hill TT.

Why would you pay the entry fee for a TT and then handicap yourself by sandwiching it between two days of L4 training? If you want a three day L4 block you don't need to drive 2.5 hours and pay an entry fee to get it. I'd personally opt for the 60 mile road race as you're still a week away from your target event of the same distance which is going to require a TSS of 250 or so on a CTL of 60 or less. I'd get the miles, intensity and pack riding of the longer RR.

I agree with the other posters who say you really don't need a formal taper from a CTL of 60, especially for a three plus hour event (I don't know your category or how fast they'll race but expect 250 to 300 TSS for the day by the time you include warmup and cooldown after a 60 mile race). I'd treat this one as a mini taper and stay with your normal weekly routine but back off duration about 20%. I'd also rearrange the week as necessary to make sure you have a complete day off two days before your event and a loosen up ride with some one and five minute hard efforts the day before your target event. But I'd limit that loosen up day to an hour or so.

IOW if your normal training week is 8 hours or so (guessing based on CTL = 60) then I'd back off to 5 to 6 hours. Early in the week is same intensity as usual but fewer or shorter efforts. Late in the week gets some additional rest and day before the event is shorter and easier than usual with a few efforts to wake the body up.

Good luck,
Dave

 

[BlueJersey]

Thanks. I did the road race instead. It wasn't too hard. Finished with the field. The race only earned me 166 TSS. I do have the uncanny ability to hide myself in the pack. AP154w/NP212w. 2 hours and 18 minutes. 16 matches (50sec to 1 minutes+ at 300w / 5w/kg to 390w / 6w/kg).

Why would you pay the entry fee for a TT and then handicap yourself by sandwiching it between two days of L4 training? If you want a three day L4 block you don't need to drive 2.5 hours and pay an entry fee to get it. I'd personally opt for the 60 mile road race as you're still a week away from your target event of the same distance which is going to require a TSS of 250 or so on a CTL of 60 or less. I'd get the miles, intensity and pack riding of the longer RR.

I agree with the other posters who say you really don't need a formal taper from a CTL of 60, especially for a three plus hour event (I don't know your category or how fast they'll race but expect 250 to 300 TSS for the day by the time you include warmup and cooldown after a 60 mile race). I'd treat this one as a mini taper and stay with your normal weekly routine but back off duration about 20%. I'd also rearrange the week as necessary to make sure you have a complete day off two days before your event and a loosen up ride with some one and five minute hard efforts the day before your target event. But I'd limit that loosen up day to an hour or so.

IOW if your normal training week is 8 hours or so (guessing based on CTL = 60) then I'd back off to 5 to 6 hours. Early in the week is same intensity as usual but fewer or shorter efforts. Late in the week gets some additional rest and day before the event is shorter and easier than usual with a few efforts to wake the body up.

Good luck,
Dave

 

[daveryanwyoming]

Thanks. I did the road race instead. It wasn't too hard. Finished with the field. The race only earned me 166 TSS. I do have the uncanny ability to hide myself in the pack. AP154w/NP212w. 2 hours and 18 minutes. 16 matches (50sec to 1 minutes+ at 300w / 5w/kg to 390w / 6w/kg).

Awesome, well done! Get a bit of rest and then do a minitaper this week with normal intensity but backing off on the duration and you should be ready to rock next weekend. Let us know how it goes.
-Dave