Cyclists are Victims of the Law of the Jungle

[Mitch Haley]

"Scott en Aztlán" wrote:
> Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists ride with their bike
> tires directly ON the white stripe that separates the bike lane from
> the rightmost automobile lane. This places their little spandex-clad
> butts about six inches away from my passenger side mirror as I fly
> past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and his scrawny ass is in the
> weeds...

Legal question:
Is the above a confession to:

1. Improper passing

2. Reckless driving

3. Vehicular assault, or

4. All of the above?

 

[greggery peccary]

"Chuck Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike light
> ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the deranged
> spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
>
> .... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just can
> not resist that troll bait.
>
> Come on. Wise up.
>
> There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.
>
>

lol. i didnt see the auto groups. haha a-fish, a-fish, a-fish, a-fishy,
ooooh

 

[Zinc Toast]

"Mitch Haley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Scott en Aztlán" wrote:
> > Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists ride with their bike
> > tires directly ON the white stripe that separates the bike lane from
> > the rightmost automobile lane. This places their little spandex-clad
> > butts about six inches away from my passenger side mirror as I fly
> > past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and his scrawny ass is in the
> > weeds...
>
> Legal question:
> Is the above a confession to:
>
> 1. Improper passing
>
> 2. Reckless driving
>
> 3. Vehicular assault, or
>
> 4. All of the above?

If the Bicyclist is outside the bike lane, it is his fault. No loss to
mankind.

 

[Tim McNamara]

"donquijote1954" <[email protected]> writes:

> Tim McNamara wrote:
>> "donquijote1954" <[email protected]> writes:
>>
>> > Tim McNamara wrote:
>> >> "Chumly Fakra" <[email protected]> writes:
>> >>
>> >> > Bicycle lanes are just paint on the street. They do not
>> >> > improve safety at all. Deal with it.
>> >>
>> >> You're quite correct. The best thing for improving safety on
>> >> the streets is an improvement in driver competence, on one hand,
>> >> and an improvement in cyclist compliance with traffic laws.
>> >> Both cyclists and drivers have an equal right to use the
>> >> streets, roads and most highways. Deal with it.
>> >
>> > Both should be addressed. But expecting that someone--short of
>> > Armageddon--will change traffic laws is just wishful thinking.
>>
>> I wasn't talking about changing the traffic laws. Best if you read
>> a bit closer, eh?
>
> I'm talking about a whole package:
>
> 1-Driver education
>
> 2-Tougher licensing
>
> 3-Enforcement of traffic laws to include passing on the left and
> unsafe low speed
>
> 4-No phone talking
>
> In other words, get rid of the Law of the Jungle in our roads.

Yeah, like that's going to happen. You've chosen your handle well, as
you're about as well grounded in reality as your namesake was.

 

[Tim McNamara]

"Daniel J. Stern" <[email protected]> writes:

> On Sat, 5 Feb 2005, Tim McNamara wrote:
>
>> The best thing for improving safety on the streets is an
>> improvement in driver competence, on one hand, and an improvement
>> in cyclist compliance with traffic laws. Both cyclists and drivers
>> have an equal right to use the streets, roads and most highways.
>
> ...and an equal responsibility to do their part for everyone's
> safety.

Umm, yeah, that's what I said, eh?

 

[Tim McNamara]

Chuck Anderson <[email protected]> writes:

> Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike
> light ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the
> deranged spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
>
> .... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just
> can not resist that troll bait.
>
> Come on. Wise up.
>
> There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.

And generally the same old topic.

 

[Tim McNamara]

Scott en Aztlán <[email protected]> writes:

> On Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:09:37 -0800, "greggery peccary" <.@.> wrote:
>
>>> Bicycle lanes are just paint on the street. They do not improve
>>> safety at all. Deal with it.
>>
>>bike lanes are a wider street with an area designated for bikes (not
>>for parked cars), with little bikers painted on the street to tell
>>drivers that it's a bike lane. they help improve safety for
>>cyclists...a lot.
>
> Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists

Gee, no attitude there.

> ride with their bike tires directly ON the white stripe that
> separates the bike lane from the rightmost automobile lane. This
> places their little spandex-clad butts about six inches away from my
> passenger side mirror as I fly past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and
> his scrawny ass is in the weeds...

And yours is in jail.

 

[b_baka]

greggery peccary wrote:
> "Ted Bungle" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>"greggery peccary" <.@.> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>
>>>"Chumly Fakra" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
<snip>
>
> i see your point (i just hate that "deal with it"-end of discussion
> attitude-almost as bad as getting snipped out of context), the lanes put the
> cyclist where they may not be seen in an intersection where they would be
> seen if travelling out in the road; but in my commute i travel some bike
> lanes and some streets without. in town it isnt bad without bike lanes
> because i can keep up (and anyone who wants to pass me and make me sniff
> their exhaust waiting for the next light has to change lanes to do so); but
> on streets without the lane i can't do 40 mph so i keep right and motorists
> will always pass in the same lane.

As in not moving to the other lane even when there is no traffic
approaching? This happens to me more than I like and once had my elbow
hit by a right side rear view mirror. My elbow was badly bruised and as
far as I could tell the mirror was knocked loose but the driver never
slowed down. This road had zero clearance for bicycles and requires
serious attention from the rider. Some roads are best not ridden at all.

most roads around here there is barely
> room for two cars and i have seen many close calls (head-ons) when people
> must pass me-sometimes i even have to jump onto the sidewalk.

Funny, that, given the choice of slowing down or doing something
generally stupid, most motorists will choose the latter.

in the bike
> lanes i have had fewer close calls with moving vehicles but more close calls
> with doors. so it depends on where the lane is etc. i dont think they are
> inherently safer, but for me they are a much needed alternative to riding a
> narrow road where everyone drives way to fast. every route has it's unique
> hazards. i can cite specific examples here in seattle if you like...
> what i really cant stand are those ped/cycle multi use trails...those are
> the worst!
> -alan
>
>
A ped/cycle trail is better than no trail at all. Besides, look at the
bright side, if it was also an equestrian trail you might run into the
rear end of a horse. ;<)
Bill Baka

 

[Tim McNamara]

"Zinc Toast" <[email protected]> writes:

> "Mitch Haley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> "Scott en Aztlán" wrote:
>> > Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists ride with their
>> > bike tires directly ON the white stripe that separates the bike
>> > lane from the rightmost automobile lane. This places their little
>> > spandex-clad butts about six inches away from my passenger side
>> > mirror as I fly past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and his scrawny
>> > ass is in the weeds...
>>
>> Legal question: Is the above a confession to:
>>
>> 1. Improper passing
>>
>> 2. Reckless driving
>>
>> 3. Vehicular assault, or
>>
>> 4. All of the above?
>
> If the Bicyclist is outside the bike lane, it is his fault. No loss
> to mankind.

Another one who doesn't know the laws. Geez. How do you people get
driver's licenses?

 

[Tim McNamara]

Scott en Aztlán <[email protected]> writes:

> On Sat, 5 Feb 2005 22:32:18 -0600, "Ted Bungle"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>To a cyclist it may seem to, but Chumly is right, it is just paint
>>on the street. Even worse, it may also cause more accidents, as car
>>drivers expect bikes to always stay inside the bike lanes. So when
>>a bike swerves out of the bike lane, the car will hit him, and the
>>car driver can say it is the cyclists fault, as he wasn't in the
>>bike lane.
>
> Even if there is no marked bike lane, if a pedalcyclist swerves out
> in front of an oncoming car, it is the pedalcyclist's fault.

Again, check the laws instead of making assumptions. Under some
circumstances this will be true, under some circumstances it will not.

 

[Flaxman]

"Tim McNamara" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Scott en Aztlán <[email protected]> writes:
>
> > On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 10:10:54 -0600, Tim McNamara
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >>In my state, a cyclist may take the entire lane if that is necessary
> >>for their safety, and drivers just have to deal with it. Few
> >>drivers actually know the rules of the road, however
> >
> > Something just doesn't add up here.
> >
> > Pedalcyclists claim they are taking the lane "for safety," yet you
> > just admitted that they are aware that most drivers don't know the
> > rules of the road. Seems to me that taking the lane DECREASES the
> > pedalcyclist's safety, rather than INCREASING it.
> >
> > One might suspect that pedalcyclists don't take the lane "for
> > safety" at all, but rather to make some sort of Critical Mass-esque
> > statement about pedalcyclists' rights...
>
> You're overreaching here and perhaps you should read the laws for
> yourself. You can find them via Google for almost any state.
> Basically, the laws are similar in most states- cyclists are to ride
> to the right side of the road, but can take the entire lane if needed
> for their safety.
>
> An example would be a section of shoulder covered in broken glass from
> the vodka bottle someone thought was inadvisable to keep in their car.
> The cyclist can take the lane because it's unsafe to ride through
> broken glass. Poor road conditions such as potholes can also occasion
> the same type of thing. Another situation might be going through a
> construction zone where the road is too narrow for drivers to safely
> pass the cyclist. One the safety issue is no longer a problem, the
> cyclist should go back to riding to the right side of the road.
>

That is why bike lanes do *not* work.
The car driver expects the bike to stay in that lane.

If there was no line, the Car driver would watch out for the bike more.
However with a line, the car driver has the expectation that the bicycle
will always stay in the lane.

Cars therefore drive faster, and don't care about or look at the bike, cause
he is in the bike lane.
But if he has to swerve, as in your examples,..............

 

[b_baka]

donquijote1954 wrote:
> Tim McNamara wrote:
> <snip>
>>I wasn't talking about changing the traffic laws. Best if you read a
>>bit closer, eh?
>
>
> I'm talking about a whole package:
>
> 1-Driver education

How about having to pass a test with reflex testing on a prepared course
instead of just proving you can drive around the block with a motor
vehicle examiner?
>
> 2-Tougher licensing

See above.
>
> 3-Enforcement of traffic laws to include passing on the left and unsafe
> low speed

Sounds like the OP was in the UK. In the US I have been stopped for
unsafe low speed with a sick car so it is enforced, even if not as much
as for speeding.
>
> 4-No phone talking

Big, big agreement there. While biking I have almost been nailed by
soccer moms in SUVs coming out of parking lots many times.
>
> In other words, get rid of the Law of the Jungle in our roads.
>
A nice thought, but not likely, which is unfortunate.
Bill Baka

 

[Chuck Anderson]

Tim McNamara wrote:

>Chuck Anderson <[email protected]> writes:
>
>
>
>>Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike
>>light ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the
>>deranged spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
>>
>>.... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just
>>can not resist that troll bait.
>>
>>Come on. Wise up.
>>
>>There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.
>>
>>
>
>And generally the same old topic.
>
>
So why do you respond and litter five newsgroups with this ****?

Please don't feed the trolls.

--
*****************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO
http://www.CycleTourist.com
Integrity is obvious.
The lack of it is common.
*****************************

 

[FLATORG]

"Chuck Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Tim McNamara wrote:
>
> >Chuck Anderson <[email protected]> writes:
> >
> >
> >
> >>Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike
> >>light ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the
> >>deranged spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
> >>
> >>.... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just
> >>can not resist that troll bait.
> >>
> >>Come on. Wise up.
> >>
> >>There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >And generally the same old topic.
> >
> >
> So why do you respond and litter five newsgroups with this ****?
>

Are you afraid to answer the question?

Why don't you answer the Question?

 

[FLATORG]

"Scott en Aztlán" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 6 Feb 2005 18:58:55 -0600, "Flaxman" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >That is why bike lanes do *not* work.
> >The car driver expects the bike to stay in that lane.
> >
> >If there was no line, the Car driver would watch out for the bike more.
>
> Wrong. The car driver would assume the bike has no business being on
> the road AT ALL.
>

Right, so if the bike swerves out of the bike lane into the Road he is
toast, run-over, flattened, and it is his fault, just like a car swerving
into another lane. No line is Better!
Deal with it.

 

[FLATORG]

"Scott en Aztlán" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 15:38:13 -0500, Mitch Haley <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >> Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists ride with their bike
> >> tires directly ON the white stripe that separates the bike lane from
> >> the rightmost automobile lane. This places their little spandex-clad
> >> butts about six inches away from my passenger side mirror as I fly
> >> past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and his scrawny ass is in the
> >> weeds...
> >
> >Legal question:
> >Is the above a confession to:
> >
> >1. Improper passing
> >
> >2. Reckless driving
> >
> >3. Vehicular assault, or
> >
> >4. All of the above?
>
> 5. This is a pedalcyclist being arrogant and stupid - and possibly
> paying for it with his own safety.
>
> It may be your God-given right to "take the lane" on a 65 MPH rural
> road, but only a fool would actually do so.
>
Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists ride with their bike
tires directly ON the white stripe that separates the bike lane from
the rightmost automobile lane. This places their little spandex-clad
butts about six inches away from my passenger side mirror as I fly
past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and his scrawny ass is in the
weeds...

 

[FLATORG]

"Scott en Aztlán" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 18:54:40 -0600, Tim McNamara
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists
> >
> >Gee, no attitude there.
>
> The type of pedalcyclists I've been talking about are experts on
> "attitude."
>
> >> ride with their bike tires directly ON the white stripe that
> >> separates the bike lane from the rightmost automobile lane. This
> >> places their little spandex-clad butts about six inches away from my
> >> passenger side mirror as I fly past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and
> >> his scrawny ass is in the weeds...
> >
> >And yours is in jail.
>
> You think so? Assuming you even remain conscious long enough to get my
> license plate number, what crime, exactly, would I be charged with?
>
> If anyone gets a citation, it should be the pedalcyclist for improper
> lane usage, just as an automobile driver would get a ticket if he were
> caught straddling his vehicle ON TOP OF the lane separation line.
>
> --
Except when the arrogant little pedalcyclists ride with their bike
tires directly ON the white stripe that separates the bike lane from
the rightmost automobile lane. This places their little spandex-clad
butts about six inches away from my passenger side mirror as I fly
past them at 65 MPH. One mistake and his scrawny ass is in the
weeds...

 

[Chuck Anderson]

FLATORG wrote:

>"Chuck Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>
>
>>Tim McNamara wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Chuck Anderson <[email protected]> writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike
>>>>light ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the
>>>>deranged spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
>>>>
>>>>.... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just
>>>>can not resist that troll bait.
>>>>
>>>>Come on. Wise up.
>>>>
>>>>There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>And generally the same old topic.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>So why do you respond and litter five newsgroups with this ****?
>>
>>
>>
>
>Are you afraid to answer the question?
>
>Why don't you answer the Question?
>
>
>
>
What question? Do you mean, "why do people respond to such obvious and
repeated trolls?

I don't have an answer.

If it's about the post, I started ignoring this idiot a long time ago.
He's like an old record that keeps playing over and over and over again
- really annoying.

--
*****************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO
http://www.CycleTourist.com
Integrity is obvious.
The lack of it is common.
*****************************

 

[FLATORG]

"Chuck Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> FLATORG wrote:
>
> >"Chuck Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
> >
> >
> >>Tim McNamara wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>Chuck Anderson <[email protected]> writes:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike
> >>>>light ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the
> >>>>deranged spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
> >>>>
> >>>>.... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just
> >>>>can not resist that troll bait.
> >>>>
> >>>>Come on. Wise up.
> >>>>
> >>>>There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>And generally the same old topic.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>So why do you respond and litter five newsgroups with this ****?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Are you afraid to answer the question?
> >
> >Why don't you answer the Question?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> What question? Do you mean, "why do people respond to such obvious and
> repeated trolls?
>
> I don't have an answer.
>
> If it's about the post, I started ignoring this idiot a long time ago.
> He's like an old record that keeps playing over and over and over again
> - really annoying.
>

I agree I have seen the bike lane **** come up about every two
months.........

 

[donquijote1954]

Chuck Anderson wrote:
> Having smelled the scent of people feeding on troll bait ("bike light

> ticket" - cross-posted to bicycle and nascar groups), the deranged
> spaniard dangles his line in the waters and .......
>
> .... He gets a hit. What is it? The flashy lure? Some people just can

> not resist that troll bait.
>
> Come on. Wise up.
>
> There *is* a pattern here. About once a month. The same old thing.

I'm just after the big fish, not the little ones. Big fish eats little
fish. You also the get the Law of the Jungle in the sea.