Deciding on a cheap (approx $1200) touring bike.

[alienator]

It doesn't matter whether your on a track, riding gravel roads, or riding down stairs: the chain pulls the wheel forward. Besides, there is either going to be a quick release or a bolted skewer holding the wheel in place, and that whole chain thing is going to keep the wheel from flying out the back. There should be zero worries about the wheel out the back of dropout, unless you use a piston driven by an explosive charge to blow the wheel out the back.

You might be over-thinking this bike. Take at look at some of the bikes that have been used to ride all the way around the world: technically they're not that special; they've carried a lot of weight; and they've been down roads worse than you'll ever see. Bikes are amazingly tough and hardy.

 

[Strelok]

Originally Posted by alienator .

It doesn't matter whether your on a track, riding gravel roads, or riding down stairs: the chain pulls the wheel forward. Besides, there is either going to be a quick release or a bolted skewer holding the wheel in place, and that whole chain thing is going to keep the wheel from flying out the back. There should be zero worries about the wheel out the back of dropout, unless you use a piston driven by an explosive charge to blow the wheel out the back.

You might be over-thinking this bike. Take at look at some of the bikes that have been used to ride all the way around the world: technically they're not that special; they've carried a lot of weight; and they've been down roads worse than you'll ever see. Bikes are amazingly tough and hardy.

i guess i was thinking a rock or something could knock the wheel out the back at speed.

i guess the reason i'm so picky is that the first bike i bought was a $250 mtb which promptly fell apart on me after using it for commuting. reliability is a nice thing to have.

 

[Froze]

This is all getting a little too weird for me. Strelok, you wanted a touring bike for under $1200 but doesn't want a stock bike...just what the heck do you want? You can't get custom for that price. Buy a 20 year old or so custom used touring bike off of E-Bay, you might find something there that's not a "stock" bike. Or buy one of the stock bikes and get a set of custom wheels made by Peter White who specializes in touring wheels. Are you sure your not the troll?

 

[Strelok]

actually, i am willing to go up a bit. i'm finding that i could build something for about $1400 with one of these cheap aluminum frames and a rigid fork. this does include a phill wood bottom bracket.

i find it hard to view this as trolling.

 

[alienator]

With the $250 mtb, you got what you paid for. A $1200 new bike will be significantly better. A $1200 used bike could be great, too, possibly even better than a new bike at that price.

 

[64Paramount]

Originally Posted by alienator .

With the $250 mtb, you got what you paid for. A $1200 new bike will be significantly better. A $1200 used bike could be great, too, possibly even better than a new bike at that price.

+1 There will be a big difference when you compare bikes in the $250 price range to bikes in the $1200 range. And if you're willing to purchase a used bike, you could get something really nice for $1200.

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by Strelok .

actually, i am willing to go up a bit. i'm finding that i could build something for about $1400 with one of these cheap aluminum frames and a rigid fork. this does include a phill wood bottom bracket.

i find it hard to view this as trolling.

Sure seems like trolling because now your making even less sense! You would rather have a cheap frame but expensive wheels...where's the rational in that? It's far wiser to buy a good frame that will last with cheap wheels and or components because you can always upgrade to better wheels and components later, but once you have a frame it's more costly to up grade that later.

If you can afford to push the money you can get a Titanium Cross bike for under $1700 that comes with decent components, not the top of the line components but good enough to last, and the frame is TI which will last forever. http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/fantom_cross_pro_ti_xi.htm Then as components break, which will be awhile, you can upgrade to better stuff. This time of the year their stock is low so check the inventory for your size, but you if you can wait for the back order to be filled it will be worth it.

 

[Strelok]

I'd prefer to spend money on the components instead of the frame. i'll spend less by buying a cheap frame now and a better one later vs cheap parts now and better later as the parts tend to be more expensive overall. plus the fork i'm going to use should last and be one that i'll use with the new frame.

also, ti will break just as well as any other material. it's strength lies in its ability to resist corrosion. there were merlin frames several years back that had problems breaking.

and what's wrong with a $100 MTB frame? that sette rekken is probably of the same quality as most less than $1200 MTBs.

 

[alienator]

Originally Posted by Strelok .

I'd prefer to spend money on the components instead of the frame. i'll spend less by buying a cheap frame now and a better one later vs cheap parts now and better later as the parts tend to be more expensive overall. plus the fork i'm going to use should last and be one that i'll use with the new frame.

also, ti will break just as well as any other material. it's strength lies in its ability to resist corrosion. there were merlin frames several years back that had problems breaking.

and what's wrong with a $100 MTB frame? that sette rekken is probably of the same quality as most less than $1200 MTBs.

Wrong on pretty much every point.

That $100 MTB frame? It isn't even meant for riding off road. It uses the cheap quality tubing joined together with welds that are not necessarily top notch.

Titanium? It's main benefit is not its corrosion resistance but it's lack of a fatigue limit and its light weight and its strength at that weight compared to an otherwise identical steel tube.

Merlin frames? Every company can have manufacturing issues, but the good ones rarely have them. As a good company, Merlin rarely has manufacturing issues.

Buying quality components with a crappy frame is pretty much the exact opposite of what experience, knowledgeable cyclists do. If that's the way you want to go, have at it. When that **** frame craps out.....oh well. If it takes components with it.......oh well. You don't want to listen to others that obviously have much more experience than you, so why the hell are you even bothering to ask questions?

 

[Strelok]

whatever. i think i now have a pretty go idea of what i want to do though.

and ti does have a fatigue limit. it's just not as limited as that of aluminum or even steel. the fatigue limit isn't all that important if the frame is designed properly.

 

[alienator]

Originally Posted by Strelok .

whatever. i think i now have a pretty go idea of what i want to do though.

and ti does have a fatigue limit. it's just not as limited as that of aluminum or even steel. the fatigue limit isn't all that important if the frame is designed properly.

Truly, you have mastered everything needed to know to buy and assemble a bike. You surely have no need then to keep posting questions, questions which are quite often followed by you telling the people who respond to your questions that they don't know what they're talking about. I can't wait to read the blog you start wherein you'll give advice and morsels of your sagacity to people with bike related questions. There's no doubt that with your bottomless reservoir of experience and knowledge, you'll become the Yoda of the bike world. You'd think given your Yoda status that you wouldn't have to debase yourself and ask others whether a given Motobecane bike is any good. Interesting.

 

[swampy1970]

Originally Posted by Froze .


Of course there's more to a tubeset, but a poster was mentioning tubesets, so I was just mentioning they were the same.

Personally I don't think though that the Long Haul Trucker is any better then the Jamis or the Trek or the Fuji. In fact the Jamis Aurora Elite, and the Fuji Touring, and the Trek 520 all spec out better for the same or a little less money.

I have never ridden either, and you've ridden only the one you have, so to say which will be better for touring is absurd for either one of us to say!!

Personally I like my 1985 Schwinn Le Tour Luxe the best, it's lugged steel frame instead of welded, it has easy to repair and longer lasting older technology, it rides like a Cadillac...for a bike, it was made in America, it will outlast any new touring bike without question. Personally if I was putting my hard earned money being spent on a touring bike I would find a older 80's low miles vintage touring bike like mine or Schwinn Voyager series or the Passage; or Trek 720 or 620; Bridgestone T-700; Fuji American Touring Series; Panasonic Pro Touring; or the Miyata Grand Touring, or the 1000 touring bikes. All of those touring bikes are world renown for being the best touring bikes ever built and a lot of them are still used to tour on today. And the advantage with buying an older bike is you won't get hit hard on the depreciation, in fact they will probably appreciate. I just saw a used Long Haul Trucker for $350 on Craigslist that was 5 years old and was updated, so much for the appreciation. There are plenty of these bikes around that never saw more then a 1000 miles and never went touring and are in fantastic shape. The frames on the older bikes were built more stout then modern bikes too.

I bought my Schwinn about 9 months ago, the guy put 250 miles on it after he bought it brand new then injured his back at home, he stored it with layers of blankets on it. About 2 weeks before he sold it he took it down to an LBS to have it relubed and new tires and tubes put thinking he could ride it now that his back hadn't bothered him in a while. He rode it 5 miles and his back started to hurt so he sold. The bike looks like it came off the show room floor brand new in 85. This type of thing does happen and their out there, but you may have to search a bit. I gave you a list of the best vintage touring bikes so you know what to look for.

As usual your post is full of ****.

"it's lugged steel frame instead of welded, it has easy to repair and longer lasting older technology"... well, I know I can get all 3 tubes repaired by Calfee on my Cannondale Supersix Hi-Mod for the princely sum of $400 - good luck with getting your three main tubes repaired for that at your friendly frame builder for anywhere near that price. The "old technology" wild card is so old it's way past it's sell by date.

I had a ride on a LHT back when I was trying out a bunch of bikes. To be honest I really didn't know what I wanted, so I tried 'em all. As things went the LHT was far greater than the sum of it's parts - surprisingly lively for a touring bike and has nearly all the bits on it that you'd need for some serious touring - or carrying home 30 tins of baked beans, some eggs and a loaf of bread. It even has a rack mountings for the front forks you carry home some baguettes and a massive chocolate cake.

World renowned bikes? Really... Being a lad that lived over the other side of the pond for the best part of 30 years, spent a decade racing in England and rode around most of belguim, france and spain (and it's islands) I can say I've never, ever heard of any of those bikes that you mentioned.


LHT > Chocolate Cake > Froze.

 

[An old Guy]

Originally Posted by Strelok .

that and the chance of being stuck 40 miles from home with all those groceries is not appealing. I am of course going to want the bike a bit over built for that reason.

Regardless of what bike you purchase, at some time you will be stuck 40 miles form home with all those groceries.

---

But you are making this way too hard for those who are trying to respond. "over built" is a strange requirement. While I did an estimate of the weight I would carry, you have never said what you weigh or how much weight you will be carrying. No one knows how much load you will be putting on a bike. It is not even possible to determine what type of surfaces you will ride on.

Perhaps you would be better off buying a motorcycle.

 

[Strelok]

Originally Posted by An old Guy .

Regardless of what bike you purchase, at some time you will be stuck 40 miles form home with all those groceries.

---

But you are making this way too hard for those who are trying to respond. "over built" is a strange requirement. While I did an estimate of the weight I would carry, you have never said what you weigh or how much weight you will be carrying. No one knows how much load you will be putting on a bike. It is not even possible to determine what type of surfaces you will ride on.

Perhaps you would be better off buying a motorcycle.

thought of that. they cost too much and there aren't any studded tires for them. and i still don't get how y'all can justify these big manufacturers putting "aluminum" (is that a brand now?) hubs on +$1000 bike or formula or joytech or any of that junk. it's pretty sad when they won't even put LX hubs on a bike nowadays.

 

[swampy1970]

Personally, I can't see carrying 2 to 3 weeks worth of groceries 60 miles back from the store on a bicycle... or even on a motorbike. If you're doing a 120mile round trip to stock up on food then more power to ya... But you better pedal fast in 54x11 if you're gonna get home before the ice cream melts.

 

[An old Guy]

Originally Posted by swampy1970 .

Personally, I can't see carrying 2 to 3 weeks worth of groceries 60 miles back from the store on a bicycle... or even on a motorbike.
If you're doing a 120mile round trip to stock up on food then more power to ya... But you better pedal fast in 54x11 if you're gonna get home before the ice cream melts.

You misunderstand this type of life. He rides in in the early morning - 5am-9am. Eats his ice cream and other perishables. Bikes home late in the day - 3pm-8pm. Next day he returns for the toilet paper he forgot.

But double metric every couple weeks is not easy if you are not putting in a lot of miles between them.

Yes. It is a dumb idea.

 

[Froze]

Can someone tell me why we bothered with a person who has more knowledge then anyone in the cycling world today?

 

[davereo]

Originally Posted by Froze .

Can someone tell me why we bothered with a person who has more knowledge then anyone in the cycling world today?

The OP is a PITA who has no idea what he wants. All his threads amount to the same baloney.

 

[Froze]

Originally Posted by swampy1970 .


As usual your post is full of ****.

"it's lugged steel frame instead of welded, it has easy to repair and longer lasting older technology"... well, I know I can get all 3 tubes repaired by Calfee on my Cannondale Supersix Hi-Mod for the princely sum of $400 - good luck with getting your three main tubes repaired for that at your friendly frame builder for anywhere near that price. The "old technology" wild card is so old it's way past it's sell by date.

I had a ride on a LHT back when I was trying out a bunch of bikes. To be honest I really didn't know what I wanted, so I tried 'em all. As things went the LHT was far greater than the sum of it's parts - surprisingly lively for a touring bike and has nearly all the bits on it that you'd need for some serious touring - or carrying home 30 tins of baked beans, some eggs and a loaf of bread. It even has a rack mountings for the front forks you carry home some baguettes and a massive chocolate cake.

World renowned bikes? Really... Being a lad that lived over the other side of the pond for the best part of 30 years, spent a decade racing in England and rode around most of belguim, france and spain (and it's islands) I can say I've never, ever heard of any of those bikes that you mentioned.


LHT > Chocolate Cake > Froze.

As usual you respond in your childish way, because you are a child and that's the only way you know how to respond.

I keep this simple for the swampy child. Lugged and tig welded steel bikes are the easiest to repair, especially tig. and Carbon is even more difficult with only two places in the US that will repair CF but only if they charge for an inspection and they deemed it repairable...in other words not all damaged CF is repairable. Traveling around the US on a tour and you break a AL frame not too much of a big deal to get it repaired these days, but go to less developed countries and you got a problem, and you really have a major problem with CF, with steel, lugged or not, it can be fixed by a local yoko, it may not be the prettiest repair but you'll be up and riding.

Waterford can replace a tube in a lugged steel bike for $250. Your Cannondale CF repair price is only "IF" (and that's a big if) it can be repaired after you pay for the shipping there and back (same is true with Waterford though) and they you have to pay an additional non-refundable $50 inspection fee; then you have to pay for repainting, which is also true at Waterford. Waterford is expensive, there are places all over the US that will do it for less, with a carbon fiber bike you only have two places and they both charge a lot more then steel repair. And the price you quoted for $400 is just one tube and not for replacing but repairing damage greater then 6". I bet you thought I wouldn't check their website out did you?

So as always your talking though your childish swamp filled mouth.

And then you go on about your European racing exploits? Really? Your that good but you act like a child? I doubt that. All pro racers I ever knew acted like adults and talked professionally, you're no where near there. And you never heard of those bikes? Yet they were used in tours all over the world...amazing.

 

[kdelong]

strelok sounds a lot like jrstudman without the death threats. Makes ya wonder......