Deep-V Spoke Count

Discussion in 'Cycling Equipment' started by mykal, Jun 19, 2005.

  1. mykal

    mykal Guest

    I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count will be
    optimal under the circumstances.

    I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often with a
    rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with disc-brakes and Deep-V
    wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each, but the stock rear spokes came
    over-tensioned to a point of premature failure. Despite this, the Deep-V
    profile still impressed me with its durability after the damaged wheel was
    retensioned. One year later, I now plan to replace the damaged wheel with
    another Deep-V unit (and dump the rear disc brake in favor of a caliper rim
    brake) but I'm still mulling over a choice of spoke count that ranges from
    28 to 32 to 36.

    My parts-bin situation leads me to favor staying with 28-spoke wheels, but
    my body weight indicates a higher spoke count might be favorable. The wheels
    will be well-built with high-quality spokes, and maybe with especially
    strong spokes like the Sapim CX-Rays. The rim will be a Velocity Deep-V,
    which I notice is being used for some wheels of very low spoke count.
    Therefore, I wonder if any more than 28 spokes is really much of any
    advantage.

    Questions:

    Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke reliability?

    Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?

    In short, is there really much of a reason to use more than 28 spokes on the
    Deep-V rim, provided the spokes are high quality and the wheel is well
    built?

    /* mykal */
     
    Tags:


  2. A Muzi

    A Muzi Guest

    mykal wrote:

    > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count will be
    > optimal under the circumstances.
    >
    > I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often with a
    > rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with disc-brakes and Deep-V
    > wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each, but the stock rear spokes came
    > over-tensioned to a point of premature failure. Despite this, the Deep-V
    > profile still impressed me with its durability after the damaged wheel was
    > retensioned. One year later, I now plan to replace the damaged wheel with
    > another Deep-V unit (and dump the rear disc brake in favor of a caliper rim
    > brake) but I'm still mulling over a choice of spoke count that ranges from
    > 28 to 32 to 36.
    >
    > My parts-bin situation leads me to favor staying with 28-spoke wheels, but
    > my body weight indicates a higher spoke count might be favorable. The wheels
    > will be well-built with high-quality spokes, and maybe with especially
    > strong spokes like the Sapim CX-Rays. The rim will be a Velocity Deep-V,
    > which I notice is being used for some wheels of very low spoke count.
    > Therefore, I wonder if any more than 28 spokes is really much of any
    > advantage.
    >
    > Questions:
    >
    > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke reliability?
    >
    > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?
    >
    > In short, is there really much of a reason to use more than 28 spokes on the
    > Deep-V rim, provided the spokes are high quality and the wheel is well
    > built?


    36 spoke asymmetric rim with 14-16-14 (or possibly sub
    14-15-14 based on availability) brass nipples, well lubed,
    nice and tight, round and straight will give good long service.

    Plenty of wags will note that 28 is probably adequate.
    You've already found the limits of that.

    I talked with a customer today who had been plagued with rim
    and spoke failures for years until we built him ( 220lbs)
    exactly such a wheel 18 months ago. It has proven boringly
    dependable for a bit over 2500 miles. His question today?
    What did I think about a boutique wheel set with 28
    threads-on-both-ends spokes. It would save him 20 grams or
    so and cost $325 more than the wheels I built.

    I laughed out loud.

    --
    Andrew Muzi
    www.yellowjersey.org
    Open every day since 1 April, 1971
     
  3. daveornee

    daveornee New Member

    Joined:
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    Yes, more spokes will help increase reliability.
    Are you talking of 26" or 700C Deep V?
    C-Xrays are very durable, but quite expensive.
    Switching to rim brakes adds a wear factor to the rims that makes them less durable.
    I have built both 26" and 700C Deep V wheels. I would not consider a 28 spoke rear in either unless it were for a special event wheel where durability was not considered.
    What was the evidence/failure in the over tensioned wheel?

    David Ornee, Western Springs, IL
     
  4. mykal wrote:

    > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count will be
    > optimal under the circumstances.
    >
    > I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often with a
    > rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with disc-brakes and Deep-V
    > wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each, but the stock rear spokes came
    > over-tensioned to a point of premature failure. Despite this, the Deep-V
    > profile still impressed me with its durability after the damaged wheel was
    > retensioned. One year later, I now plan to replace the damaged wheel with
    > another Deep-V unit (and dump the rear disc brake in favor of a caliper rim
    > brake) but I'm still mulling over a choice of spoke count that ranges from
    > 28 to 32 to 36.
    >
    > My parts-bin situation leads me to favor staying with 28-spoke wheels, but
    > my body weight indicates a higher spoke count might be favorable. The wheels
    > will be well-built with high-quality spokes, and maybe with especially
    > strong spokes like the Sapim CX-Rays. The rim will be a Velocity Deep-V,
    > which I notice is being used for some wheels of very low spoke count.
    > Therefore, I wonder if any more than 28 spokes is really much of any
    > advantage.
    >
    > Questions:
    >
    > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke reliability?
    >
    > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?
    >
    > In short, is there really much of a reason to use more than 28 spokes on the
    > Deep-V rim, provided the spokes are high quality and the wheel is well
    > built?


    I'd go for Mavic CXP33 with 36 spokes at the rear (V-rims are stronger
    in th radial direction, you're correct). With a good build and no front
    panniers, you might get away with 28 at the front.
     
  5. mykal

    mykal Guest

    "daveornee" wrote...
    >
    > mykal Wrote:
    > > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count will
    > > be
    > > optimal under the circumstances.
    > >
    > > I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often with a
    > > rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with disc-brakes and
    > > Deep-V
    > > wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each, but the stock rear spokes came
    > > over-tensioned to a point of premature failure. Despite this, the
    > > Deep-V
    > > profile still impressed me with its durability after the damaged wheel
    > > was
    > > retensioned. One year later, I now plan to replace the damaged wheel
    > > with
    > > another Deep-V unit (and dump the rear disc brake in favor of a caliper
    > > rim
    > > brake) but I'm still mulling over a choice of spoke count that ranges
    > > from
    > > 28 to 32 to 36.
    > >
    > > My parts-bin situation leads me to favor staying with 28-spoke wheels,
    > > but
    > > my body weight indicates a higher spoke count might be favorable. The
    > > wheels
    > > will be well-built with high-quality spokes, and maybe with especially
    > > strong spokes like the Sapim CX-Rays. The rim will be a Velocity
    > > Deep-V,
    > > which I notice is being used for some wheels of very low spoke count.
    > > Therefore, I wonder if any more than 28 spokes is really much of any
    > > advantage.
    > >
    > > Questions:
    > >
    > > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke
    > > reliability?
    > >
    > > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?
    > >
    > > In short, is there really much of a reason to use more than 28 spokes
    > > on the
    > > Deep-V rim, provided the spokes are high quality and the wheel is well
    > > built?
    > >
    > > /* mykal */

    > Yes, more spokes will help increase reliability.
    > Are you talking of 26" or 700C Deep V?
    > C-Xrays are very durable, but quite expensive.
    > Switching to rim brakes adds a wear factor to the rims that makes them
    > less durable.
    > I have built both 26" and 700C Deep V wheels. I would not consider a
    > 28 spoke rear in either unless it were for a special event wheel where
    > durability was not considered.
    > What was the evidence/failure in the over tensioned wheel?
    >
    > David Ornee, Western Springs, IL
    >
    >
    > --
    > daveornee
    >

    I'm talking about a 700C Deep V; it's a road bike, although a somewhat
    unusual one by the specification of disc brakes mounted within conventional
    dropout spacing. (The bike is a 2004 Redline Disc-R, a version of the
    Redline Conquest Pro cyclocross bike, but with slightly different tubing,
    conventional road frame geometry, and Avid mechanical disc brakes on the 28H
    hubs which are laced 3x with Sapim Race spokes.)

    I'm plan to keep the front wheel as is, laced 3x to the compatible 28H
    disc-brake hub, but I'm thinking the cost of an increased wear factor
    imposed on the rear rim will be more than offset by the benefits of using a
    rim brake on that end of the bike, considering how I actually use the bike.

    The evidence of over-tension in the rear wheel first presented with a spoke
    that spontaneously snapped under the stress of thermal expansion induced by
    Seattle sunshine. During the liquid sunshine months, the wheel held up OK,
    but on one sunny Spring day, as the bike leaned at a standstill against a
    park bench in the sun, one spoke broke. The wheel potato-chipped on the
    spot.

    I wheeled the bike to a nearby LBS where a mechanic discovered with a
    tensiometer that the spoke tensioning was pretty much off the scale. He gave
    me no specific, objective values I can pass on, but he did say that he
    thought it quite unbelievable that the spokes hadn't pulled the nipples
    through the rims. I noticed that many spokes protruded through their
    respective nipples to protrude into the V cavity of the rim.

    From the LBS point of view, a likely explanation was that the bike owner
    (me) had tried an unskilled hand at wheel truing and wound up destroying the
    wheel by over-tensioning the spokes. The LBS mechanic eventually conceded
    that the wheel could have been poorly built as a cheap rush job by the
    manufacturer (no other party had adjusted the spoke tension prior to wheel
    failure), and he shared his opinion that a such a severely overtensioned
    wheel is prone to self-destruction when a spoke breaks.

    As it was, the LBS mechanic graciously provided a low-cost repair by
    replacing the broken spoke, reducing tension all around, and truing the
    wheel as best as practical by imposing an unbalanced tension to the rim to
    compensate for the damage. After this repair, the rim was measurably
    centered on the hub, laterally true, and permanently affected by a radial
    hop that was easy to see but not noticeable to my butt when riding the bike.

    Further evidence of over-tensioning presented after this initial repair:
    After adding about 1,500 miles to the wheel, I noticed the rim had skewed
    laterally about 3 mm. This offset accounted for the wheel being 6 mm closer
    to the left chain stay than it was to the right chain stay. Theoretically,
    the right (drive side) spokes were fatigued by the presumed initial
    over-tensioning to an extent where these spokes continued to stretch after
    the repair. The left spokes, having more elasticity still intact, took up
    the slack created by the stretching right spokes and the whole rim shifted
    to the left. Eventually, the ride got to where I was sitting slightly to the
    side of the saddle to compensate for the developing misalignment.

    An LBS was able to re-tension the spokes again to pull wheel back inline,
    the bike once again tracked well, but I expect spokes will start breaking
    any day now as the misalignment problem is coming back

    Hope the above answers your questions, and thank you for your suggestions
    regarding wheel selection.

    Mykal
     
  6. mykal wrote:
    > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count will be
    > optimal under the circumstances.
    >
    > I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often with a
    > rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with disc-brakes and Deep-V
    > wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each, but the stock rear spokes came
    > over-tensioned to a point of premature failure. Despite this, the Deep-V
    > profile still impressed me with its durability after the damaged wheel was
    > retensioned. One year later, I now plan to replace the damaged wheel with
    > another Deep-V unit (and dump the rear disc brake in favor of a caliper rim
    > brake) but I'm still mulling over a choice of spoke count that ranges from
    > 28 to 32 to 36.
    >
    > My parts-bin situation leads me to favor staying with 28-spoke wheels, but
    > my body weight indicates a higher spoke count might be favorable. The wheels
    > will be well-built with high-quality spokes, and maybe with especially
    > strong spokes like the Sapim CX-Rays. The rim will be a Velocity Deep-V,
    > which I notice is being used for some wheels of very low spoke count.
    > Therefore, I wonder if any more than 28 spokes is really much of any
    > advantage.
    >
    > Questions:
    >
    > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke reliability?


    arrrggg-more spokes, stronger wheel. 16 spokes weigh in at a mighty 55
    grams or so, but a 36h wheel is stonger. Look other places to save
    weight and why scimp on your wheels? For you, i woukd recommend 36
    spokes, period. People that make their wheels 'just strong enough'
    mystify me. They are there to get you there, not a goal in itself. Not
    fun being stranded with a broken wheel.

    >
    > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?
    >
    > In short, is there really much of a reason to use more than 28 spokes on the
    > Deep-V rim, provided the spokes are high quality and the wheel is well
    > built?


    Yes, big reason, make your wheels reliable.
    >
    > /* mykal */
     
  7. A Muzi wrote:

    >
    > 36 spoke asymmetric rim with 14-16-14 (or possibly sub
    > 14-15-14 based on availability) brass nipples, well lubed,
    > nice and tight, round and straight will give good long service.
    >
    > Plenty of wags will note that 28 is probably adequate.
    > You've already found the limits of that.
    >
    > I talked with a customer today who had been plagued with rim
    > and spoke failures for years until we built him ( 220lbs)
    > exactly such a wheel 18 months ago. It has proven boringly
    > dependable for a bit over 2500 miles. His question today?
    > What did I think about a boutique wheel set with 28
    > threads-on-both-ends spokes. It would save him 20 grams or
    > so and cost $325 more than the wheels I built.
    >
    > I laughed out loud.
    >
    > --
    > Andrew Muzi
    > www.yellowjersey.org
    > Open every day since 1 April, 1971


    Ain't it the truth. Why some believe a magazine or an ad in said
    magazine instead of those of us that see goods and others of bicycle
    equipment everyday
    mystifies me to no end. They buy, they break, they wonder why, they
    come in, we build, they are happy, then they wonder again....

    Makes the 'shut up and ride' sticker very meaningful.
     
  8. >> mykal Wrote:
    >> > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count will
    >> > be optimal under the circumstances.


    As many as reasonably possible, i.e. 36. Spokes are really light and
    greatly increase the durability of a wheel: an excellent trade of a few
    grams for extended life and lesser probability of destructive failure.

    >> > I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often
    >> > with a rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with
    >> > disc-brakes and Deep-V wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each,
    >> > but the stock rear spokes came over-tensioned to a point of
    >> > premature failure.


    I weigh 210 pounds and also frequently ride aggressively on
    city streets with a messenger bag of varied weight. My Kona
    Jake-the-Snake cross bike has custom wheels: 36h Deep-V rims, Sapim
    CX-Ray spokes and Shimano XT hubs. I'm very happy with the wheels
    and recommend the combination to you. Choose your own hubs. :)

    That Redline is a great bike. A friend has a Conquest model and
    loves it. I do wonder why you're moving away from the Avid mech disc
    brakes, though. I have rim brakes (V in front with adapter, canti
    in rear) and wish for discs instead. If my fork would support it I
    would get a wheel with disc hub, but the total changeover cost adds
    up to too much for now. What problems has the disc setup caused for
    you? Would you switch just the rear to a rim brake and leave the
    front disc? It seems like an odd setup, but I would do it too, but
    for the cost for a somewhat minimal gain on my side.

    >> > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke
    >> > reliability?


    I don't know--too many variables, especially the build.

    >> > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?


    Yes!

    Greg
    --
    Gregory S. Sutter "How do I read this file?"
    mailto:[email protected] "You uudecode it."
    http://zer0.org/~gsutter/ "I I I decode it?"
     
  9. mykal

    mykal Guest

    "Gregory Sutter" wrote:
    ..
    > >> mykal Wrote:
    > >> > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count

    will
    > >> > be optimal under the circumstances.

    >
    > As many as reasonably possible, i.e. 36. Spokes are really light and
    > greatly increase the durability of a wheel: an excellent trade of a few
    > grams for extended life and lesser probability of destructive failure.


    Makes sense, but I've been thinking that "as many as reasonably possible" in
    the case of my bike may be only 28 spokes... it's a road bike, and I'm not
    aware of what hubs I can find that will support both the disc brakes and a
    greater number of spokes, given that they would be going into a bike having
    roadbike dropout spacing...

    >
    > >> > I weigh 210 pounds and ride aggressively on city streets, often
    > >> > with a rucksack payload of school books. The bike came with
    > >> > disc-brakes and Deep-V wheels laced 3x with 28 spokes each,
    > >> > but the stock rear spokes came over-tensioned to a point of
    > >> > premature failure.

    >
    > I weigh 210 pounds and also frequently ride aggressively on
    > city streets with a messenger bag of varied weight. My Kona
    > Jake-the-Snake cross bike has custom wheels: 36h Deep-V rims, Sapim
    > CX-Ray spokes and Shimano XT hubs. I'm very happy with the wheels
    > and recommend the combination to you. Choose your own hubs. :)
    >
    >


    Interesting combo - very similar to what I've been thinking of! - I can see
    now that MTB hus may be an option -- but I'm wondering about the specs...
    Does the Jake-the-Snake have road dropout spacing? XT hubs use mountain
    bike spacing, correct? Have you squeezed a 135mm hub into a 130mm rear
    dropout?


    > That Redline is a great bike. A friend has a Conquest model and
    > loves it. I do wonder why you're moving away from the Avid mech disc
    > brakes, though. I have rim brakes (V in front with adapter, canti
    > in rear) and wish for discs instead. If my fork would support it I
    > would get a wheel with disc hub, but the total changeover cost adds
    > up to too much for now. What problems has the disc setup caused for
    > you? Would you switch just the rear to a rim brake and leave the
    > front disc? It seems like an odd setup, but I would do it too, but
    > for the cost for a somewhat minimal gain on my side.
    >


    Ummm... sounds like you and your friend with the Conquest (not sold stock
    with disc brakes) have yet to experience first hand the deployment of disc
    brakes on a road bike... I've come to learn that disc brakes on a road bike
    may have more utility as sales hype than it does for slowing the
    round-and-round of a wheel on pavement. That said, I like the disc brakes
    not only because they have good stopping power, but also because they allow
    for increased clearance between the wheel and the frame... that's more room
    for fenders or mud or whatever.

    But on the rear you can have the extra clearance, and adequate braking power
    (for road bike application), with a long reach caliper -- with a weight
    savings of about 1/2 pound -- and beneficially dispense of the maintenance
    quirks of a the disc brake. You still have the front disc brake to deal
    with, but that means you have only half the PITA quirks of disc brake
    mainentence.

    For those who don't relate to my pet peeve regarding disc brake maintenance,
    I can be more specific: In the experience I've had with my brakes on my
    bike, the discs are easily bumped out of alignment. To be sure, a force
    insufficient to damage any other part on the bicycle can still be a force
    poweful enough to bend a disc and cause it to scrape on the brake pads. This
    is a real PITA. Once the disc is bent (which can happen simply by someone
    bumping the bike when its locked to the rack at school or wherever), it's a
    real trick to tweak it back into proper shape on the bike, especially on the
    rear where its harder to eyeball the alignment. Oh, and backing off on the
    brake pads is no solution.

    Granted, when the discbrakes are dialed in, they work really well, as you'd
    expect. They are very consistent, rain or shine. As an added bonus, in the
    rain, these brakes make a noise on par with that of an advancing freight
    train, which clears the road ahead of pedestrians, dogs, and small cars.
    Despite this advantage, I'm thinking a new R-600 caliper (the brake bridge
    is already there on the frame and ready to use) with a nice set of orange
    Kool-Stop pads will be just hunky dory for a binder on the back end.

    Please lemmee know the specs on your hubs -- dropout spacing compatibility
    is something I need to know more about. I might go with exactly what your
    talking about. XT hubs. CX-Ray spokes. Deep-V rims (Velocity?).

    Mykal


    > >> > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase spoke
    > >> > reliability?

    >
    > I don't know--too many variables, especially the build.
    >
    > >> > Will an increased spoke count significantly increase rim reliability?

    >
    > Yes!
    >
    > Greg
    > --
    > Gregory S. Sutter "How do I read this file?"
    > mailto:[email protected] "You uudecode it."
    > http://zer0.org/~gsutter/ "I I I decode it?"
     
  10. > Makes sense, but I've been thinking that "as many as
    > reasonably possible" in the case of my bike may be only 28
    > spokes... it's a road bike, and I'm not aware of what hubs
    > I can find that will support both the disc brakes and a
    > greater number of spokes, given that they would be going
    > into a bike having roadbike dropout spacing...


    I'm liking my 28 spoke count deep V's.
    Try them.

    Bill
     
  11. On 2005-06-22, mykal <[email protected]> wrote:
    > "Gregory Sutter" wrote:
    >> >> mykal Wrote:
    >> >> > I'm considering a specific wheel build, and wonder what spoke count
    >> >> > will be optimal under the circumstances.

    >>
    >> As many as reasonably possible, i.e. 36. Spokes are really light and
    >> greatly increase the durability of a wheel: an excellent trade of a few
    >> grams for extended life and lesser probability of destructive failure.

    >
    > Makes sense, but I've been thinking that "as many as reasonably possible" in
    > the case of my bike may be only 28 spokes... it's a road bike, and I'm not
    > aware of what hubs I can find that will support both the disc brakes and a
    > greater number of spokes, given that they would be going into a bike having
    > roadbike dropout spacing...
    >
    > Interesting combo - very similar to what I've been thinking of! - I can see
    > now that MTB hus may be an option -- but I'm wondering about the specs...
    > Does the Jake-the-Snake have road dropout spacing? XT hubs use mountain
    > bike spacing, correct? Have you squeezed a 135mm hub into a 130mm rear
    > dropout?


    I had the axle of the 135mm XT hub cut down to 130mm to fit in my
    130mm rear dropout. Voids hub warranty (modification) but works
    fine. Check for disc clearance issues if you're considering that
    option; since I don't have discs I didn't think about it.

    > Please lemmee know the specs on your hubs -- dropout spacing compatibility
    > is something I need to know more about. I might go with exactly what your
    > talking about. XT hubs. CX-Ray spokes. Deep-V rims (Velocity?).


    Velocity Deep-Vs, yes. You could also consider Velocity Fusion.

    My wheels were custom built by Lyle at Spin Lite Cycling, from whom
    I would order again.
    http://spinlitecycling.com/road_wheels.htm

    Greg
    --
    Gregory S. Sutter "How do I read this file?"
    mailto:[email protected] "You uudecode it."
    http://zer0.org/~gsutter/ "I I I decode it?"
     
  12. mykal

    mykal Guest

    "Gregory Sutter" wrote:

    > I had the axle of the 135mm XT hub cut down to 130mm to fit in my
    > 130mm rear dropout. Voids hub warranty (modification) but works
    > fine. Check for disc clearance issues if you're considering that
    > option; since I don't have discs I didn't think about it.
    >
    > My wheels were custom built by Lyle at Spin Lite Cycling, from whom
    > I would order again.
    >
    > Greg
    > --


    I don't get it. How do you get a 130mm hub by shortening the axle on a
    135mm hub? Wouldn't you then have a 135mm hub with a short axle?

    Mykal
     
  13. In article <[email protected]>,
    "mykal" <[email protected]> wrote:


    [...]

    >
    > Hope the above answers your questions, and thank you for your suggestions
    > regarding wheel selection.
    >
    > Mykal


    Serious suggestion. Learn to true you wheels. Learn to build a
    wheel. _You_ can build a wheel that remains true until the brake
    pads wear the rim walls to foil.

    --
    Michael Press
     
  14. jim beam

    jim beam Guest

    mykal wrote:
    > "Gregory Sutter" wrote:
    >
    >
    >>I had the axle of the 135mm XT hub cut down to 130mm to fit in my
    >>130mm rear dropout. Voids hub warranty (modification) but works
    >>fine. Check for disc clearance issues if you're considering that
    >>option; since I don't have discs I didn't think about it.
    >>
    >>My wheels were custom built by Lyle at Spin Lite Cycling, from whom
    >>I would order again.
    >>
    >>Greg
    >>--

    >
    >
    > I don't get it. How do you get a 130mm hub by shortening the axle on a
    > 135mm hub? Wouldn't you then have a 135mm hub with a short axle?
    >
    > Mykal
    >
    >
    >

    hub body flange spacing on both is the same - it's just that the axle
    length is slightly different. but i'm surprised to see the claim that
    an xt was re-spaced to 130mm. that would require removal of the
    external seal and consequently seriously compromise bearing life.
     
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