Disk brakes and drop bars

[Richard Goodman]

Have been having a play with a colleagues new bike - hydraulic disk brakes. Very nice, very smooth
progressive feel with no trace of cable friction, excellent stopping power even in the wet. I'm
convinced I need this. I want this. Disk brakes are a Good Thing. It makes sense for ordinary road
bikes: commuters and tourers to have them. _But_: Nobody makes them, to work with drop bars. It
seems you can get drop levers for hydraulic rim brakes - Magura do them, or use cable actuated disks
with ordinary drop levers (Avid do them) - but not hydraulic disk brakes with drop levers. No, oh
no, not possible. Why on earth not? I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants such a thing!

Rich

 

[James Annan]

Richard Goodman wrote:

> not hydraulic disk brakes with drop levers. No, oh no, not possible. Why on earth not? I'm sure
> I'm not the only one who wants such a thing!

Not quite true - there's a drop bar lever (cable) to hydraulic conversion system for the Formula
disc brake used by Santana on some tandems. But I agree, it's a bit of a gap in the market. One
problem is that most high-end road bikes have combined shift/brake lever systems, so the replacement
would have to handle shifting too (I think that most potential customers wouldn't want to
'downgrade' to bar-ends).

James

 

[Marten Hoffmann]

[email protected] schreef ...
> Have been having a play with a colleagues new bike - hydraulic disk brakes. Very nice, very smooth
> progressive feel with no trace of cable friction, excellent stopping power even in the wet. I'm
> convinced I need this. I want this. Disk brakes are a Good Thing. It makes sense for ordinary road
> bikes: commuters and tourers to have them. _But_: Nobody makes them, to work with drop bars. It
> seems you can get drop levers for hydraulic rim brakes - Magura do them, or use cable actuated
> disks with ordinary drop levers (Avid do them) - but not hydraulic disk brakes with drop levers.
> No, oh no, not possible. Why on earth not? I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants such a thing!

Why not go for the Magura rim brakes? Progressive feel, no trace of cable friction, excellent
stopping power, it's all there. And no hassling with dragging brakes, endless replacements of brake
pads etcetera......

Just a suggestion.

--
Regards, Marten

 

[Richard Goodman]

"Marten Hoffmann" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> Why not go for the Magura rim brakes? Progressive feel, no trace of cable friction, excellent
> stopping power, it's all there. And no hassling with dragging brakes, endless replacements of
> brake pads etcetera......
>

I'd thought about that but tend to think it wouldn't be worth the expense of going to hydraulics
only to end up with a rim brake - surely they must still be affected by the wet - and rim wear? I
find the combination of road dirt and rain tends to act like grinding paste on ally rims.

Rich

Rich

 

[Colin]

"Richard Goodman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> Have been having a play with a colleagues new bike - hydraulic disk brakes. Very nice, very smooth
> progressive feel with no trace of cable friction, excellent stopping power even in the wet. I'm
> convinced I need this. I want this. Disk brakes are a Good Thing. It makes sense for ordinary road
> bikes: commuters and tourers to have them. _But_: Nobody makes them, to work with drop bars. It
> seems you can get drop levers for hydraulic rim brakes - Magura do them, or use cable actuated
> disks with ordinary drop levers (Avid do them) - but not hydraulic disk brakes with drop levers.
> No, oh no, not possible. Why on earth not? I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants such a thing!

I've been idly investigating disk brakes for my tourer (decided against for the moment - too much
money!) but I came across avid road disks, which work with normal drop bar levers or sti or ergo
shifters. They are obviously cable operated rather than hydraulic, but the reviews seem favourable.

Colin

 

[James Annan]

Richard Goodman wrote:
> "Marten Hoffmann" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
>>Why not go for the Magura rim brakes? Progressive feel, no trace of cable friction, excellent
>>stopping power, it's all there. And no hassling with dragging brakes, endless replacements of
>>brake pads etcetera......
>>
>
>
> I'd thought about that but tend to think it wouldn't be worth the
expense of
> going to hydraulics only to end up with a rim brake - surely they
must still
> be affected by the wet - and rim wear? I find the combination of
road dirt
> and rain tends to act like grinding paste on ally rims.

They may be affected by the wet and wear out your rims, but they are still better than all cable rim
brakes I've tried. Certainly a worthwhile upgrade IME.

James

 

[Tony Yates]

"Colin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> I've been idly investigating disk brakes for my tourer (decided against for the moment - too much
> money!) but I came across avid road disks, which work with normal drop bar levers or sti or ergo
> shifters. They are obviously cable operated rather than hydraulic, but the reviews seem
> favourable.
>
> Colin

If they're as good as their mtb counterparts (cable opperated too) then they'll prove to be
top stoppers.

FWIW, cable discs have now come a long way since the early days. My 1999 Marin Wolf Ridge came with
cable discs which proved to be very poor, so much so that an upgrade to Hope C2s was done at cost by
the shop. Just recently I have been using a Kona hardtail equipped with Hayes cable discs and
initially I was apprehensive about them based on my previous experience with cable discs (not hayes
mind you), but I have to say that I am very impressed with them. They lack, for me, the fine control
I get from hydraulics, but as for stopping they do just fine - oh and I've been using them at
Glentress a worthy proving ground I think.

Regards, Tony www.therush.uk.com

 

[Peter Clinch]

Colin wrote:

> I've been idly investigating disk brakes for my tourer (decided against for the moment - too much
> money!) but I came across avid road disks, which work with normal drop bar levers or sti or ergo
> shifters. They are obviously cable operated rather than hydraulic, but the reviews seem
> favourable.

Don't know what flavour they were, but trying various Kinetics test machines with cable discs,
though not quite as nice as hydraulics, were still mucho impressive. I can see my Streetmachine
ultimately going disc as well as going Rohloff.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email protected]
http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

 

[Richard Goodman]

"James Annan" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> They may be affected by the wet and wear out your rims, but they are still better than all cable
> rim brakes I've tried. Certainly a worthwhile upgrade IME.
>

Ah, that's interesting to know.

So, there seem to be three options for braking improvement with drop bars:
- hydraulic rim brakes
- cable actuated disk brakes
- hydraulic disks via cable-actuated remote reservoir

... which all have their pros and cons. The last option seems possibly to give the best of both
worlds, but I don't know if these remote reservoirs are even still available - there's no mention of
them on the Hope or Formula web sites.

And of course, for the latter two, that still leaves the problem of finding suitable forks with disk
mounts for a road bike....

Rich

 

[Adam Porter]

"Richard Goodman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
. It seems you can get drop levers for hydraulic rim
> brakes - Magura do them, or use cable actuated disks with ordinary drop levers (Avid do them) -
> but not hydraulic disk brakes with drop levers.
No,
> oh no, not possible. Why on earth not? I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants such a thing!
>
> Rich
>

Having used hydraulic disks on my mountain bike for 3 years or so now, I would never go back to any
rim brake. I realise the riding conditions, bike weight, terrain etc etc are quite different between
on and off road cycling, but surely there must be more than the odd person who relish the thought of
disks on their road bikes.

Have you tried contacting Hope directly? They are still quite a small company and can
modify/manufacture things that are not 'standard' within there range.

Don't know how much it would cost, but the phone call may stir them into action and get road riders
some proper brakes ;o)

UK Head Office Hope Mill, Skipton Road, Barnoldswick Lancashire, United Kingdom BB18 6EN Phone: +44
(0) 1282 851200 Facsimile +44 (0) 1282 851201 E-mail: [email protected]

Adam.

(I have no connections with Hope what-so-ever, other than using their brakes)

 

[Anonymous]

"Adam Porter" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...

> Have you tried contacting Hope directly? They are still quite a small company and can
> modify/manufacture things that are not 'standard' within there range.
>
> Don't know how much it would cost, but the phone call may stir them into action and get road
> riders some proper brakes ;o)

I believe they used to make a remote reservoir suitable for use with cable levers, but don't any
more. (could be wrong though)

Trouble is, making a hydraulic road lever with integrated gear shifting is unlikely to ever
be economic.

cheers, clive

 

[Spencer Bullen]

> Trouble is, making a hydraulic road lever with integrated gear shifting is unlikely to ever be
> economic.
>
> cheers, clive
>
>

Greetings,

re the above, the 2003 XTR group is a combined gear/hydraulic lever system. I think a road version
may well come about at some point, when a big company like Shimano thinks it is profitable, and
assuming the weight could be kept down enough to get major riders/teams on board to advertise it.
Until then, it will be rim brakes and the occasional cable disk for roadies.

T.T.F.N.

SPENNY

 

[Richard Goodman]

"Adam Porter" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
<snip>

> Have you tried contacting Hope directly? They are still quite a small company and can
> modify/manufacture things that are not 'standard' within there range.
>
> Don't know how much it would cost, but the phone call may stir them into action and get road
> riders some proper brakes ;o)
>

FWIW I emailed Hope to ask them what happened to their remote reservoir and whether they had any
plans to produce something else road bike riders could use. They said they stopped producing the
remote reservoir because "many customers were not setting the brakes correctly", and that their
Swiss distributor had modified one of their current brakes to work with a cable, which they might
produce sometime in the future, but no date for this .

Rich