Django/ Hepcat?

Discussion in 'Recumbent bicycles' started by Stratrider, Feb 18, 2003.

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  1. Stratrider

    Stratrider Guest

    Why so little discussion on the Django/Hepcat? These bikes look sweet! What's the word on
    these swb's?

    Jim Reilly Reading, PA
     
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  2. Bentbiker

    Bentbiker Guest

    great, quality frames. Nice fast bikes. Seat back is a little short IMO. the new django color is
    kind of funky looking. Burley has had some issues with seat slippage, which they may have a
    solution for.

    stratrider wrote:
    > Why so little discussion on the Django/Hepcat? These bikes look sweet! What's the word on
    > these swb's?
    >
    > Jim Reilly Reading, PA
     
  3. Derek Swift

    Derek Swift Guest

    > Why so little discussion on the Django/Hepcat? These bikes look sweet! What's the word on
    > these swb's?

    I would buy the Django and upgrade the components as you see fit. The color is no issue because it
    can be ordered in any color Burley has(see Burley's website for more info).

    The Hepcat is nice but not that much nicer in price. I have a Canto which is a convertible wheelbase
    (admittedly, I like the SWB for most applications). I could have bought the Taiko. But I upgraded
    the components instead and considering tax and everything, I saved $200.

    Derek
     
  4. Seth Jayson

    Seth Jayson Guest

    I tried these when shopping my first bike, and wasn't a big fan, at least not at the price
    and weight.

    Seat felt squishy, while pedaling. i didn't anticipate wanting leather touching me while riding
    in the summer. Handling didn't feel crisp as I liked. Felt too tillery to me, and I like a bit
    o' tiller.

    The rear suspended burleys felt like a boat on a smooth set of waves: boing boing boing boing. And I
    weight almost zilch.

    Finish and workmanship seemed about the prettiest I've seen, though.

    But different spokes for different folks.

    sj
     
  5. Thankschub

    Thankschub Guest

    Derek Swift <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > > Why so little discussion on the Django/Hepcat? These bikes look sweet! What's the word on these
    > > swb's?
    >
    > I would buy the Django and upgrade the components as you see fit. The color is no issue because it
    > can be ordered in any color Burley has(see Burley's website for more info).
    >
    > The Hepcat is nice but not that much nicer in price. I have a Canto which is a convertible
    > wheelbase (admittedly, I like the SWB for most applications). I could have bought the Taiko. But I
    > upgraded the components instead and considering tax and everything, I saved $200.
    >
    > Derek
    I have been riding a Django for a year and highly recommend. Steve
     
  6. Mike S

    Mike S Guest

    I agree with Seth. I found that they offerred nothing more than, and in some ways less than, my
    V-Rex. The frame is different looking but I didn't feel the bike was as fine tuned as the V-Rex.
    Shifting was a little clunky, handling not as nice, and the seat not as comfortable. And although
    the seat was adjustable I thought there would be problems with it being unsupported in a more
    extreme riding posture. I concluded that the V-Rex and the Giro offerred more. YMMV.
     
  7. La

    La Guest

    The seat is designed to absorb shock. There is an option to apply expensive but effective aluminum
    supports, they work very well. I've been very happy with my HepCat and bought my wife one. They are
    pricey, but they are very well designed and constructed. I have no complaints. My neighbor also has
    one. He keeps it pretty stripped down and races it. I add all kinds of extras and take long rides.
    If it were to be ripped off I'd buy another one.

    Lon HepCat
     
  8. David Bogie

    David Bogie Guest

    I think this is the same range of reactions and opinions that you would get asking about 90% of the
    recumbents in the mass marektplace, if you can call our niche such a thing. Some of us like the
    Burley bikes, others do not. I enjoyed test riding the Limbo and Django but ended up with a Tour
    Easy. The three people I know who have owned Burley recumbents had nothing but problems. Not the
    incidental little weirdnesses that we all expect in new bikes; no, disastrous and potentially REALLY
    seriously bad frame, swing arm, and seat failures. Could have just been a bad batch.

    david, Boise ID

    LA <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > The seat is designed to absorb shock. There is an option to apply expensive but effective aluminum
    > supports, they work very well. I've been very happy with my HepCat and bought my wife one. They
    > are pricey, but they are very well designed and constructed. I have no complaints. My neighbor
    > also has one. He keeps it pretty stripped down and races it. I add all kinds of extras and take
    > long rides. If it were to be ripped off I'd buy another one.
    >
    > Lon HepCat
     
  9. Gene Cosloy

    Gene Cosloy Guest

    [email protected] (David Bogie) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > I think this is the same range of reactions and opinions that you would get asking about 90% of
    > the recumbents in the mass marektplace, if you can call our niche such a thing. Some of us like
    > the Burley bikes, others do not. I enjoyed test riding the Limbo and Django but ended up with a
    > Tour Easy. The three people I know who have owned Burley recumbents had nothing but problems. Not
    > the incidental little weirdnesses that we all expect in new bikes; no, disastrous and potentially
    > REALLY seriously bad frame, swing arm, and seat failures. Could have just been a bad batch.
    >
    >
    > david, Boise ID
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > LA <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > > The seat is designed to absorb shock. There is an option to apply expensive but effective
    > > aluminum supports, they work very well. I've been very happy with my HepCat and bought my wife
    > > one. They are pricey, but they are very well designed and constructed. I have no complaints. My
    > > neighbor also has one. He keeps it pretty stripped down and races it. I add all kinds of extras
    > > and take long rides. If it were to be ripped off I'd buy another one.
    > >
    > > Lon HepCat
    I own a Burley Taiko which, while technically a LWB recumbent, has the capability to be converted
    into a SWB with similar handling characteristics of the Hepcat/Django. My experience has been
    wonderful. I judge a bike primarily and foremost on the way it handles, rides and how comfortable is
    it for extended rides. While the leather seat took a little while to get accustomed to, I'm now a
    fan. It is firm not squishy like the Rans seat. (Have you ever wondered why all serious racing DF
    bikes sport firm leather seats and most recumbent riders don't seem to be concerned about the amount
    of energy lost through body motion in a soft seat?) The rear stays of the Taiko are assigned to act
    as a passive suspension. Initially I thought this was just marketing hype but quickly became
    convinced after extende rides on rough roads with 110psi in the tires. I've since added the rear
    speed struts which stiffens up the back of the seat considerably but really does not interfere with
    the passive suspension at all.

    This bike has the best finish of any recumbent I've seen and most of the components work flawlessly.
    Seat slippage was initially a problem but now solved with Burley's 2003 aluminum seat sliders.
    Shimano brake pads were replaced with Koolstops almost immediately. Shimano pads eat aluminum rims
    for breakfast.

    I'm looking forward to converting to SWB in the Spring and might even try a more efficient tire than
    the stock fat primos. I would buy this bike again. Is it perfect, no. Every bike becomes a
    compromise between what you are personally looking for and what the manufacturer is emphasising. I
    have owned a Lightning Phantom and currently own a BikeE NX a road and hybrid. So far this is my
    favorite bike. Even this very cold N.E. winter where I have had to log too many hours on a fluid
    trainer rather than the road, I prefered the Burley.

    Gene Cosloy
     
  10. Seth Jayson

    Seth Jayson Guest

    While the
    > leather seat took a little while to get accustomed to, I'm now a fan. It is firm not squishy like
    > the Rans seat. (Have you ever wondered why all serious racing DF bikes sport firm leather seats
    > and most recumbent riders don't seem to be concerned about the amount of energy lost through body
    > motion in a soft seat?)

    You're not trying to claim that a soft seat perpendicular to the lines of force when pedaling a
    'bent (more or less parallel to the frame) is somehow going to sap power, are you? I think a lot of
    folks with a better tuned vocabulary of physics will find fault with that analysis.

    God only knows why DF seats are so hard sometimes, but the major loss of pedal power in a 'bent is
    not going to be out the bottom of the seat. If there's a loss of power, it's going to be into the
    squish of the seat's BACK. Mesh can absorb some of your push, as can, unfortunately, the very flexy
    back of those unstayed Burley seats.

    Sj
     
  11. Rod Dabe

    Rod Dabe Guest

    Hello Gene I too own a Taiko and am just tickled with it. I converted it to SWB after riding about
    2000 miles last year. I'm loving it even more in SWB. I have been considering switching the brake
    pads to KoolStops. Which ones did you go with?

    Rod Dabe
     
  12. Gene Cosloy

    Gene Cosloy Guest

    [email protected] (Rod Dabe) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > Hello Gene I too own a Taiko and am just tickled with it. I converted it to SWB after riding about
    > 2000 miles last year. I'm loving it even more in SWB. I have been considering switching the brake
    > pads to KoolStops. Which ones did you go with?
    >
    > Rod Dabe

    Hi Rod,

    After sanding down the rough surface left by the Shimano pads using wet/dry in dry form only grits
    of 200-320-400-600 in that order. I mounted Koolstops thinline (red). After a while I switched to
    Koolstop BMX (salmon). The BMX pads are designed to follow the curve of a 20" rim better than the
    standard pad which is probably a compromise for diameters between 26" to 700C. I even mounted BMX
    style on the rear and they seem to work fine. Front still squeals a bit though. The important point
    is that both are very friendly to the rim surface!

    As a response to Seth: Yes I agree that the flexing of the mesh back can rob energy expended.
    Fortunately the Burley speed struts mitigate this loss while avoiding the all too often
    correspondingly harsh ride that bikes with integrated seat stays terminating at the drop outs often
    introduce. My experience with this has been with Lightning, Vision and Bachetta, all of which ride
    too harshly for my taste. As for your analysis regarding the different postions of the seat to BB
    in DF's and recumbents respectively, you're probably right. As a final note, Burley for 2003
    updated the seat mesh to a product which feels firmer than the previous mesh. One advantage of the
    Burley seat bottom over the Rans type you will have to admit: in a rainstorm the Burley seat
    doesn't become a sponge.

    Regards, Gene
     
  13. John W

    John W Guest

    > I own a Burley Taiko which, while technically a LWB recumbent, has the capability to be converted
    > into a SWB with similar handling characteristics of the Hepcat/Django. My experience has been
    > wonderful. I judge a bike primarily and foremost on the way it handles, rides and how comfortable
    > is it for extended rides. While the leather seat took a little while to get accustomed to, I'm now
    > a fan. It is firm not squishy like the Rans seat. (Have you ever wondered why all serious racing
    > DF bikes sport firm leather seats and most recumbent riders don't seem to be concerned about the
    > amount of energy lost through body motion in a soft seat?)

    How can you even compare a DF seat to a 'bent seat? The reason DF seats are so small and hard is to
    reduce chaffing, it has nothing to do with power. The reason we ride bents is because of their
    comfortable seats. The bottom of a 'bent seat has nothing to do with power, its the back of the seat
    is where your power comes from. This is where power is lost on Burley's from the flexing seat back
    because of the lack of struts.

    >The rear stays of the Taiko are assigned to act as a passive suspension. Initially I thought this
    >was just marketing hype but quickly became convinced after extende rides on rough roads with
    >110psi in the tires. I've since added the rear speed struts which stiffens up the back of the seat
    >considerably but really does not interfere with the passive suspension at all.

    Why should Burley charge extra for seat struts when they come standard with all the other 'bents.
    Lack of struts has been a cause of seat failures on Burley's.
     
  14. Seth Jayson

    Seth Jayson Guest

    One advantage of the Burley seat bottom
    > over the Rans type you will have to admit: in a rainstorm the Burley seat doesn't become a sponge.

    You kidding!? There's nothing more refreshing than a few gallons of water sloshing up the old, well
    never mind... Yeah, after a rainstorm, that seat can be a bit of an enema bag...

    And the stiffness of those triangulated RANS frames is a lot more that the single-stick Burley's. I
    happened to prefer that. But that'd be a matter of taste. At least at my light weight. I don't think
    I'd put my Dad (who's shopping for a 'bent, and much bigger than I am) on any of the mono-sticks
    I've tried out.

    sj
     
  15. stratrider wrote:
    > Why so little discussion on the Django/Hepcat? These bikes look sweet! What's the word on
    > these swb's?
    >
    > Jim Reilly Reading, PA
    I've had a Burley Django since April of 2002. It's been a great bike. I've found it to be a stable
    ride with nimble handling. Good braking. And for me, at least, very comfortable. Aside from
    numerous short rides, I've ridden it on 3 centuries, including 1 double century over 2 days, and
    enjoyed every mile. Well, almost every mile. Cars, dogs, and weather somtimes detract from the
    riding experience. I would buy another. The only thing I don't care for is a feature common to
    most swb recumbents, different size wheels on the front and back. Means I have to carry two spare
    inner tubes.

    I've replaced a couple of things. First was the pedals. The original pedals were standard flat caged
    pedals. I replaced them with a pair of Shimano pedals, SPD on one side and flat on the other. I
    think model number PDM324. The next thing was the rear derailleur. While executing an emergency dog
    avoidance maneuver I went down, cracking the SRAM 5.0 derailleur that came with the Django. I was
    able to get a good price on an SRAM 9.0 from my lbs, so I upgraded to that. The dog that caused me
    to spill was so freaked out by the fall that it ran away.

    How's it climb? Well, I'm not a good person to ask. I've never been a good climber, on any bike. But
    I get to the top eventually. The Django has been able to climb anything I've wanted to go up. I've
    done several significant climbs in Oregon and Washington. The most significant was from the base of
    Mt. Hood to Timberline Lodge, a non-stop 4500' elevation gain. I regualarly ride the Django around
    the hills of south central New York. We don't have big mountains here, but there are a lot of steep
    climbs with vertical gains in the 300 to 500 foot range. I don't ride with a cyclocomputer, so I
    can't compare speeds. I quit using a cyclocomputer when I rode a df. I found I was always looking at
    my speed. Almost like watching the clock. Now I just ride, and don't worry how fast I'm going. I'll
    get there when I get there.

    For hydration I attach a Camelback Unbottle 70 to the back of the seat with a couple of clips and a
    velcro strap.

    I bought the bike at Coventry Cycle Works in Portland, Oregon. They have a large selection of bents
    to choose from. RANS, Burley, Easy Racer, Haluzak, Vision, and I think Bacchetta. The staff was
    really great to deal with. Knowledgable about bents and friendly. Good people to deal with. I have
    no affiliation with Coventry other than being a satisfied custormer.

    John Knezevich
     
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