Do I have long femurs?

[cyberlegend1994]

If your LBS doesn't do many of them (if any), you may have to spend some cash-ola on a third-party fitting. A lot of shops can fit a rider to a bike, but a really good, certified fitter can fit an existing bike to the rider. I speak from experience on this - I bought a used roadie from someone on Craigslist a few years ago using a basic calculation based on my height which worked out to me being around a 54 cm, but it didn't feel quite right no matter how much I played around with the different adjustments, I invested in a good fitting using a shop recommended by a former neighbor who races and it was like night and day. Well worth the investment.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by hansenator
Trek's Crossrip Elite looks nice. The LBS had a sale on them, I'm not sure if they still do. They didn't have one in my size but it's about what I'm looking for. Has anyone had any experience with this bike? Do you know of any other similar bikes that are in the same price range and are worth looking at?

I might go to the LBS tomorrow and see if they can get one my size for a test ride.

That might be the ticket. The virtual top tube on the 58 is long (59.3 cm), but it looks like they're meant to be fitted with short stems. You will like the new compact handlebar bends. You're barking up the right tree.

 

[hansenator]

I did try the Crossrip and it seemed nice except the reach was a little long. It comes with a pretty short stem so I'm not sure how much potential for adjusting there is. If the reach was a little shorter it would be a strong contender.

I also tried a Cross Check and, while I liked it, I still wanted to move the saddle back further. They wanted to try me on a larger frame but didn't have one in stock. I was told to check back in a few days.

I tried the Bianchi Volpe at another shop, the largest size frame. The seat position was good but I'm a little undecided about the overall feel. I might go take a second look at it since the seat position felt alright and I think the stem was long enough to allow for swapping a shorter one if needed. I was a little undecided on the reach but it wasn't too far off.

Is anyone familiar with the Space Horse fit as compared to the above models? It looked nice but they didn't have a large enough size in stock so I didn't get to try it.

Quick question about reach. How much of it is limited by anatomy and how much is your body getting used to it? I wondered if a longer reach might become more comfortable after a while but I didn't want to just assume that and get something with the plan of growing into it.

 

[danfoz]

What size Crossrip did you try? Those bikes seem to have VERY long top tubes btw. The 54 (my size) has a 56.9cm effective top tube. My ideal top tube length is 54-54.5.which is where many road bikes in a 54 fall (even their top level Madone has a 55cm top tube in a 54cm, 2cm shorter than the Crossrip of the same size!). 2cm of reach on a bike may as well be a country mile. Just to note, the Volpe which most closely corresponds to a 54 has a 55cm top tube (2cm shorter than the 54cm Crossrip).

The Crossrip certainly does not seem like the ideal model for someone who wants to shorten overall reach.

You mentioned you tried the Crosscheck, liked it but, wanted to move the saddle back. Do you remember what the size was, and was the saddle already as far back safely as it could go?

While our bodies can adapt slightly, if the bike is not relatively comfortable out the door it shouldn't even be considered imo. It doesn't matter what any fit kit, size chart or "expert" says, if you are not comfortable the bike will likely end up collecting dust.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by hansenator

Quick question about reach. How much of it is limited by anatomy and how much is your body getting used to it? I wondered if a longer reach might become more comfortable after a while but I didn't want to just assume that and get something with the plan of growing into it.

Some of it might be just getting used to it. The rule of thumb about reach is, after you get your saddle height and setback roughed in, with the hands over the lever hoods, the plane of the back and the line of the upper arm should form about a 90-degree angle. There's nothing magic about that angle, it just seems to work for most people.

Look at how you're reaching for the bar, too. If you bend from the hip, extend the neck, and flatten the back, it's like you just shortened the top tube by a centimeter or two. Many riders will end up using a longer stem after they've been riding for a couple years. They're not growing, it's just their hips, lower backs, and hamstrings getting more flexible.

Then when they get older they go the other way.

 

[hansenator]

I believe the Crossrip was one of the larger frames, and you're right about the reach. It seems like a nice bike too. The Cross Check was a 58 and they wanted to try me on a 60.

I guess I'm not sure what I look like on the bike. I'm pretty flexible in general though, I have no problem touching my toes or anything.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by hansenator
I believe the Crossrip was one of the larger frames, and you're right about the reach. It seems like a nice bike too. The Cross Check was a 58 and they wanted to try me on a 60.

I'm guessing a 58 Crossrip with a 9 or 10 cm stem would be about right for you. A 60 Cross Check would be too long, and the 58 Cross Check is to low in the front, from what you've been saying.

Here's my suggestion, a Specialized TriCross Elite (http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/road/tricross/tricross-elite-disc#geometry)--short-ish in the top tube, long-ish in the head tube, moderate stem length right out of the carton, and all the eyelets and clearance you'd need.

 

[hansenator]

Thanks for the suggestion. There's a Specialized dealer in my area, I might go out there today. Do you know what the ride quality is like? I've always had this (perhaps irrational) fear that a more performance looking bike would be less comfortable or ride more harshly.
I'm thinking of also taking a second look at the Volpe. Do you have any thoughts on how the geometry might compare to the Tricross?

 

[danfoz]

At first glance I'd tend to agree with OBC, The ride quality is probably fine. The chainstays look reasonably long, and the geometry looks "similar enough" to the Volpe - you may have 1cm longer reach on the Bianchi (the Bianchi comes in odd sizes, where many others come in even sizes), the Specialized has considerably longer chainstays (+2.5cm), similar head tube lengths, and the same seat tube angle. Hehe but I dunno if it looks any more or less performance than the other models you listed. Looks pretty upright and easy going to me

One thing to consider is that tires have a huge impact on ride quality i.e. their width, their relative suppleness (just as an example and not that I'd expect you'd be running them, but a 23c Vittoria Evo CX "feels" very different, that is more compliant, than a 23c Continental GP4000s even though both are the same width and both are designated "race" tires) and the pressure the rider runs them at. It seems many riders regardless of weight (especially racers) inflate their tires to max pressure which is not what the manufacturer had in mind when laying out the spec. Tire pressure should correspond to rider weight.

I believe many novice riders probably pass over very nice bikes simply because the stem (a $50 part), in conjunction with the top tube out of the box, was closest to that particular riders ideal size, and the bike they demo'd had properly inflated tires meaning not too high (harsh ride quality) or not too low (making the bike feel sluggish) relative to their respective weight.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by danfoz


I believe many novice riders probably pass over very nice bikes simply because the stem (a $50 part), in conjunction with the top tube out of the box, was closest to that particular riders ideal size, and the bike they demo'd had properly inflated tires meaning not too high (harsh ride quality) or not too low (making the bike feel sluggish) relative to their respective weight.

Good observation.

Two or three years ago Trek started shipping their road bikes with stems one size shorter than previously. Smart move. Inexperienced riders preferred the fit right out of the box, and experienced riders ended up swapping stems anyway.

Regarding the long top tube on the Crossrip, I think they did that to facilitate use of shorter stems for easier steering, and eliminate any trace of toe overlap. They may have overdone it.

Regarding the ride quality of the TriCross vs. the Volpe, you'll have to ride to decide. All-steel vs. aluminum with carbon fork, either will be something you will easily get used to. The 58 TriCross should fit a little shorter than a 59 Volpe and somewhat taller and longer than a 57 Volpe. I'll go out on a limb and say the 57 Volpe is too small. I'm a long-limbed whisker under 6', and 59 Bianchis, but especially the Oltre and Sempre Pro, fit me almost perfectly right of the carton.

 

[Timmbits]

Originally Posted by oldbobcat
I'm a long-limbed whisker under 6', and 59 Bianchis, but especially the Oltre and Sempre Pro, fit me almost perfectly right of the carton.

Let us be cautious, not to confound our personal life experiences, with others' needs.

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by oldbobcat

I'm a long-limbed whisker under 6', and 59 Bianchis, but especially the Oltre and Sempre Pro, fit me almost perfectly right of the carton.

Man, I'm just the opposite. The top tube on the 55cm Oltre is a tad too long and the head tube on the 53 a tad to short. My LBS had a Vacansoleil team issue with that sweet blue accent in a 53 that was hanging on the wall unsold which they were offering me at a steal. Unfortunately had to decline

 

[hansenator]

I think I solved the problem!. I swapped saddles between bikes and that changed the whole game. Now the saddle on the Schwinn is pretty far forward and the saddle on the Poprad is back far enough that I'll probably put the set-back seat post back on. Who knew there could be such a difference between saddles?

I set the Schwinn to KOPS on the stationary trainer and it felt pretty good. I'll do a few rides and see how it goes. I also started the Poprad with KOPS but felt like I was leaning too far forward so I actually moved it back a bit. It will still take some tweaking but now I can move both saddles farther than they need to go in either direction so it's just a matter of dialing it in.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by Timmbits

Let us be cautious, not to confound our personal life experiences, with others' needs.

Absolutely correct. I thought hard about this before bringing it up, and only did because the hansenator and I are similar in height and "long-femured."

But our posture on our bikes is very different.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by hansenator

I think I solved the problem!. I swapped saddles between bikes and that changed the whole game. Now the saddle on the Schwinn is pretty far forward and the saddle on the Poprad is back far enough that I'll probably put the set-back seat post back on. Who knew there could be such a difference between saddles?

This is very interesting. You know, right from the start I was having a hard time understanding why you were having such a hard time. The Poprad is a little low and long by the most current standards, but not that much. What gave you the idea to swap saddles?

 

[Timmbits]

Originally Posted by oldbobcat
Absolutely correct. I thought hard about this before bringing it up, and only did because the hansenator and I are similar in height and "long-femured."

But our posture on our bikes is very different.

Really? I thought you said you were under 6 feet, barely.
I'm 6ft2 like he is. I also have long legs for my height.
And I can tell you with absolute certainty, that the 23" frames what could fit you, have on average a different frame geometry than 24" and up.
Look at frame geometry table to see for yourself if you don't believe me, starting with the angles.

This thread is really counter-productive - I'll just leave you guys to it. I gave solutions but am being ignored, so I don't see my purpose here.

 

[hansenator]

Originally Posted by oldbobcat
What gave you the idea to swap saddles?

I spent some time taking measurements of the two frames and they weren't different enough to explain the issues. The saddles were the only thing left I could think of.

Incidentally, I went to look at that Tri Cross. They didn't have my size but they showed me the Secteur and it fit really well. The reach, saddle, handlebar height was all great. It's like a relaxed road bike that can fit wider tires which is pretty much what I'm interested in.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by hansenator
I spent some time taking measurements of the two frames and they weren't different enough to explain the issues. The saddles were the only thing left I could think of.

Incidentally, I went to look at that Tri Cross. They didn't have my size but they showed me the Secteur and it fit really well. The reach, saddle, handlebar height was all great. It's like a relaxed road bike that can fit wider tires which is pretty much what I'm interested in.

Aha, deductive reasoning. Well, enjoy your Poprad for a while before rushing off to buy a Secteur. By the way, for the record, what size did you test ride?

 

[hansenator]

Originally Posted by oldbobcat
Aha, deductive reasoning. Well, enjoy your Poprad for a while before rushing off to buy a Secteur. By the way, for the record, what size did you test ride?

I wish I could remember. It was either a 58 or a 61. He took some measurements and put it in a computer program and told me I could fit either one. It would have been cool to get a printout but he couldn't do that.

I'm thinking of spending the money on a professional fitting for the Poprad.

 

[oldbobcat]

Originally Posted by hansenator

I wish I could remember. It was either a 58 or a 61. He took some measurements and put it in a computer program and told me I could fit either one. It would have been cool to get a printout but he couldn't do that.

I'm thinking of spending the money on a professional fitting for the Poprad.

You have to take stuff like this down. It comes in handy.

Good luck fitting the Poprad. I think you'll be happy.