does anyone agree with paul sherwin

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Dwjones, Jul 18, 2003.

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  1. Dwjones

    Dwjones Guest

    when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become his allies in the pyrenees
     
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  2. Corey Green

    Corey Green Guest

    Since they aren't good at the TT, they will have to attack in the mountains. If they attack in the
    mountains Lance can use them to his advantage - he can climb with them, but typically Jan has not
    been able to. Lance can let them force the pace, not have to burn his team mates and hopefully put
    Jan into difficulty.

    This is my interpretation of what Paul said, which I think is pretty sound. Of course it assumes
    Lance can also climb with the Spanish mountaineers.

    "dwjones" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become
    his
    > allies in the pyrenees
     
  3. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

    "dwjones" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become
    his
    > allies in the pyrenees

    If you mean the (3) Spanish climber on his team, then yeah. If you mean Spanish climbers on other
    teams, no.
     
  4. Warren

    Warren Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, Nick Burns <[email protected]> wrote:

    > "dwjones" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become
    > his
    > > allies in the pyrenees
    >
    > If you mean the (3) Spanish climber on his team, then yeah. If you mean Spanish climbers on other
    > teams, no.

    The climbs in the Pyrenees tend to be steeper and his teammate Heras does better at that type of
    climb. Probably Euskatel rider Mayo too. I also think Lance is relatively better at them than Jan.

    -WG
     
  5. warren wrote:
    >
    > The climbs in the Pyrenees tend to be steeper and his teammate Heras does better at that type of
    > climb. Probably Euskatel rider Mayo too. I also think Lance is relatively better at them than Jan.
    >

    Since Ullrich has declared himself to be the "old" Ullrich, let's check 1997. Ullrich did fine in
    the Pyrenees, including the amazing stage 10 into Andorra.

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/results/archives/tour97/

    Pyrenees:

    Stage 9, Pau - Loudenvielle (Valle du Louron), 182 kms:
    1. Laurent Brochard (Fra) FES 5.24.57 (avs. 33.6 km/h)
    2. Richard Virenque (Fra) FES 0.14
    3. Marco Pantani (Ita) MER 0.14
    4. Jan Ullrich (Ger) TEL 0.14
    5. Jose Maria Jimenez (Spa) BAN 0.33

    Stage 10, Luchon-Andorre, 252.5 kms:
    6. Jan Ullrich (Ger) TEL 7.46.06 (avs: 32,503 km/h)
    7. Marco Pantani (Ita) MER 1.08
    8. Richard Virenque (Fra) FES 1.08
    9. Francesco Casagrande (Ita) SAE 2.01
    10. Bjarne Riis (Dan) TEL 3.23

    =========================
    Alpes:

    Stage 13, Saint Etienne - L'Alpe d'Huez, 203.5 kms:
    11. Marco Pantani (Ita) MER 5.02.42 (avs. 40,336 km/h )
    12. Jan Ullrich (Ger) TEL 0.47
    13. Richard Virenque (Fra) FES 1.27
    14. Francesco Casagrande (Ita) SAE 2.27
    15. Bjarne Riis (Dan) TEL 2.28

    Stage 14, Le Bourg d'Oisans - Courchevel, 180 kms:
    16. Richard Virenque (Fra) FES 4.34.16 (avs. 32,3 km/h)
    17. Jan Ullrich (Ger) TEL s.t.
    18. Fernando Escartin (Spa) KEL 0.47
    19. Laurent Dufaux (Swi) FES 1.19
    20. Bjarne Riis (Dan) TEL 1.24

    Stage 15, Courcheval - Morzine, 208.5 kms:
    21. Marco Pantani (Ita) MER 5.57.16 (avs. 35,015 km/h)
    22. Richard Virenque (Fra) FES 1.17
    23. Jan Ullrich (Ger) TEL 1.17
    24. Beat Zberg (Swi) MER 1.59
    25. Francesco Casagrande (Ita) SAE 1.59

    ===========================
     
  6. Warren

    Warren Guest

    In article <ru3Sa.5389$4%[email protected]>, Daniel Connelly
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > warren wrote:
    > >
    > > The climbs in the Pyrenees tend to be steeper and his teammate Heras does better at that type
    > > of climb. Probably Euskatel rider Mayo too. I also think Lance is relatively better at them
    > > than Jan.
    > >
    >
    > Since Ullrich has declared himself to be the "old" Ullrich, let's check 1997. Ullrich did fine in
    > the Pyrenees, including the amazing stage 10 into Andorra.

    Don't you think his performance in 2001 and this year is more relevant than 6(!) years ago?

    -WG
     
  7. Keith

    Keith Guest

    On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 02:06:47 GMT, "dwjones" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become his allies in the pyrenees

    He's probably basing his comment on the fact until he crashed Beloki behaved as a "special friend"
    to Lance when Heras got dropped...
     
  8. Keith

    Keith Guest

    >> Since Ullrich has declared himself to be the "old" Ullrich, let's check 1997. Ullrich did fine in
    >> the Pyrenees, including the amazing stage 10 into Andorra.
    >
    >Don't you think his performance in 2001 and this year is more relevant than 6(!) years ago?

    Looking at yesterday's results, no! He's closer to his 1997/1998 level. He would have won in 1998
    had it not been for that incredible panic in one of the stages when he got a flat tire and
    completely lost
    it.

    >
    >-WG
     
  9. "Nick Burns" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "dwjones" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become
    > his
    > > allies in the pyrenees
    >
    > If you mean the (3) Spanish climber on his team, then yeah. If you mean Spanish climbers on other
    > teams, no.

    In a breakaway he will cooperate in exchange for not contesting the stage win. Allies, albeit
    temporary.
     
  10. Keith <[email protected]> schreef in berichtnieuws [email protected]
    > >> Since Ullrich has declared himself to be the "old" Ullrich, let's check 1997. Ullrich did fine
    > >> in the Pyrenees, including the amazing stage 10 into Andorra.
    > >
    > >Don't you think his performance in 2001 and this year is more relevant than 6(!) years ago?
    >
    > Looking at yesterday's results, no! He's closer to his 1997/1998 level. He would have won in 1998
    > had it not been for that incredible panic in one of the stages when he got a flat tire and
    > completely lost
    > it.

    Don't think so. Pantani blew him away that stage. It reminded of Gaul, Bartali, Coppi or Bahamontes.

    >
    > >
    > >-WG
     
  11. David Ryan

    David Ryan Guest

    "Jonathan v.d. Sluis" wrote:
    >
    > Keith <[email protected]> schreef in berichtnieuws [email protected]
    > > >> Since Ullrich has declared himself to be the "old" Ullrich, let's check 1997. Ullrich did
    > > >> fine in the Pyrenees, including the amazing stage 10 into Andorra.
    > > >
    > > >Don't you think his performance in 2001 and this year is more relevant than 6(!) years ago?
    > >
    > > Looking at yesterday's results, no! He's closer to his 1997/1998 level. He would have won in
    > > 1998 had it not been for that incredible panic in one of the stages when he got a flat tire and
    > > completely lost
    > > it.
    >
    > Don't think so. Pantani blew him away that stage. It reminded of Gaul, Bartali, Coppi or
    > Bahamontes.

    And that was after waiting for him to recover from the wheel change.
     
  12. dwjones wrote:
    > when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become his allies in the pyrenees

    Not quite as good as the first "Look"...
     
  13. "Stewart Fleming" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    >
    > dwjones wrote:
    > > when he says that armstrong will look to the spanish climbers to become
    his
    > > allies in the pyrenees
    >
    > Not quite as good as the first "Look"...
    maybe he is talking about the Spanish riders on USPS
     
  14. Just a Cyclist wrote:

    > maybe he is talking about the Spanish riders on USPS

    Since when would your teammates "become" your allies?
     
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